Knock Airport

Locker10a

Jayop wrote: »

All the ils talk is miles over my head but the rest of the announcement is great. I agree that the apron seems really small especially if they're going to have 3 sets of covered boarding stairs (I'm imaging these as the wee tunnel from the gate to the plane?) the place is great generally but the arrival area is pig ugly now. In my experience that's generally the ugliest part of every airport though.

You’re imagining jet bridges, that’s not what’s proposed. Basically they will have the same type of steps they currently do, only with roof over them !! A very minor thing really.

Neworder79

Locker10a wrote: »

All sounds fantastic, I'm surprised they aren't also expanding the apron slightly which I think will be useful in the future

RE Apron and stands

This is a bigger project than it sounds and I think it's on the long finger since cutbacks / EU tightened capital investment rules. The airport commissioned a study as part of a masterplan before the downturn which looked at all the options for extending or moving of the apron. It recommended doubling existing apron area north and in future extending east in 3 phases as growth allowed.

Current A apron has 3 "Cat C" parking stands (737/A320)
- Restricting handling more than 4 concurrent movements (aircraft queuing on the runway/holding on B apron and delays in Summer months).
- Restricted larger aircraft slots (Cat D/E taking up 2 stands).
- Restricted push-back maneuvering area for larger aircraft.
- Restricted handling services areas.

Plan was to provide additional 6 Cat C/D stands, developed in phases.
Arranged around a central modular pier extending from the terminal.
Allowed for Air-bridges in the future.
Allowed for second 'looping' taxi-way to 28 turnpad in the future

However this requires:
Moving the Fuel Farm and Water reservoir.
Moving the Car Hire compound elsewhere, which itself requires new carpark and road reconfiguration.
Extensive earthworks due to sloping terrain.
New handling compounds and equipment etc.

Probably talking additional €15-20m to complete. Hopefully the 2018 investment along with new SDZ status will lay the ground.

JCX BXC

Surprised it wasn't mentioned on here, BCY353 inbound from Kittila on a flight back from Lapland, Sukhoi Superjet 100, first commercial flight of that type from NOC?

eastmayo

JCX BXC wrote: »

Surprised it wasn't mentioned on here, BCY353 inbound from Kittila on a flight back from Lapland, Sukhoi Superjet 100, first commercial flight of that type from NOC?

They did fly to Lapland few years ago...dont think there was any last year.

JCX BXC

eastmayo wrote: »

They did fly to Lapland few years ago...dont think there was any last year.

Yes, however that type only came into service last year.

eastmayo

JCX BXC wrote: »

Yes, however that type only came into service last year.

Sorry I tought ya ment did knock fly to Lapland befour....

Masala

Kerry had a Lapland charter today for an overnight to Finland as well operated by Cityjet for Sunway Travel. And using the Sukhoi SSJ as well. Full flight I believe

JCX BXC

All Flybe routes increasing to daily next year, extra 16,000 seats according to the press release.

JCX BXC

Palma Majorca announced with TUI for next year.

munchkin_utd

Knock seems to be ticking along nicely

Success of UK routes lifts Knock to passenger record
January 9 2018 2:30 AM

Ireland West Airport - commonly known as Knock Airport - handled a record 750,000 passengers last year, beating its previous record, set in 2016, when it handled 734,000.

The 2pc increase in passenger numbers last year at the airport came as it experienced an uplift in the amount of traffic to the UK.

Aer Lingus recorded the highest number of passengers using its Ireland West Airport-Gatwick service last year since it was launched in 2009.

Flybe, the UK regional carrier, also saw record passenger numbers on its services to Birmingham and Edinburgh from the Irish airport.

Services to mainland Europe saw more than 100,000 passengers use services to destinations including Lanzarote, Malaga, Tenerife and Alicante.

https://www.independent.ie/business/irish/success-of-uk-routes-lifts-knock-to-passenger-record-36470801.html

lotusm

Any news when will there be US flights from Knock. The demand is there without doubt. It was a shame Norwegian air did not come in. I thought there was a secondary airport in New York which was linking up to provide a new route.

JCX BXC

lotusm wrote: »

Any news when will there be US flights from Knock.

Nope, should there be some?

The demand is there without doubt.

I disagree.

It was a shame Norwegian air did not come in. I thought there was a secondary airport in New York which was linking up to provide a new route.

The airports linked, means sweet f** all in reality, just a PR stunt.

marno21

lotusm wrote: »

Any news when will there be US flights from Knock. The demand is there without doubt. It was a shame Norwegian air did not come in. I thought there was a secondary airport in New York which was linking up to provide a new route.

Is there demand for transatlantic services from Knock? Probably to a certain degree. Would it be a good idea to launch direct transatlantic services from Knock? Probably not.

People within Knock's catchment area have the following options for flying to the US:

1. Fly from Knock via a connecting airline (Flybe/Aer Lingus).
2. Drive 90 minutes to Shannon and fly from there (90 minutes since the M17/M18 opened)
3. Drive to Dublin or get the train to Dublin and fly direct to 10+ destinations from Dublin via the upgraded N5 with further upgrades on the way.

Ireland is a small island and has 4 transatlantic airports (DUB, ORK, SNN & BFS). It's debatable how sustainable this is especially Cork and Shannon and Belfast being reasonably close to Dublin which has a myriad of direct routes.

People in Knock's catchment area have all those options so they are not being deprived of transatlantic services at very good prices. If Norwegian/AN Other launched direct services from Knock, you would simply be splitting the demand with other airports, in particular Shannon which is thin enough to begin with and is sufficiently close to a lot of Knock's catchment area to serve them effectively.

Masala

lotusm wrote: »

Any news when will there be US flights from Knock. The demand is there without doubt. It was a shame Norwegian air did not come in. I thought there was a secondary airport in New York which was linking up to provide a new route.

I can't understand the fascination of wanting Regional Airports to put on flights to the USA. I see posters on Kerry social media also pushing for USA flights.

There are plenty of UK & European markets that should be cracked before wanting to pick a flight with a Shannon or a Dublin. Leave the big boys to the USA market ..

lotusm

marno21 wrote: »

Is there demand for transatlantic services from Knock? Probably to a certain degree. Would it be a good idea to launch direct transatlantic services from Knock? Probably not.

People within Knock's catchment area have the following options for flying to the US:

1. Fly from Knock via a connecting airline (Flybe/Aer Lingus).
2. Drive 90 minutes to Shannon and fly from there (90 minutes since the M17/M18 opened)
3. Drive to Dublin or get the train to Dublin and fly direct to 10+ destinations from Dublin via the upgraded N5 with further upgrades on the way.

Ireland is a small island and has 4 transatlantic airports (DUB, ORK, SNN & BFS). It's debatable how sustainable this is especially Cork and Shannon and Belfast being reasonably close to Dublin which has a myriad of direct routes.

People in Knock's catchment area have all those options so they are not being deprived of transatlantic services at very good prices. If Norwegian/AN Other launched direct services from Knock, you would simply be splitting the demand with other airports, in particular Shannon which is thin enough to begin with and is sufficiently close to a lot of Knock's catchment area to serve them effectively.

sure if a carrier decides to take a punt and fly from Knock what have other airports to fear. ( I realise there is not a queue of carriers lining up at the moment) does it not give more competition and value to the customer if it did happen. Saw the below article Knock linking to Stewart airport in New York. So something must be happening in the next year or so.

http://www.con-telegraph.ie/news/roundup/articles/2017/07/23/4143441-ireland-west-airport-signs-sister-airport-agreement-with-ny-airport/

JCX BXC

lotusm wrote: »

sure if a carrier decides to take a punt and fly from Knock what have other airports to fear. ( I realise there is not a queue of carriers lining up at the moment) does it not give more competition and value to the customer if it did happen.

Agreed, however I disagree that there's a market and cannot ever see anything happening in regards transatlantic flights from Knock ever in the future. With better connectivity to the rest of Ireland arriving, especially with the M17, regional's markets are getting smaller, and hubs like Dublin are getting bigger, just look at the massive drops that Cork and Shannon faced with the opening of the M7 and M8, and Waterford + Galway airports have no commercial flights whatsoever, mainly due to the M6/M9 opening.

Saw the below article Knock linking to Stewart airport in New York. So something must be happening in the next year or so.

http://www.con-telegraph.ie/news/roundup/articles/2017/07/23/4143441-ireland-west-airport-signs-sister-airport-agreement-with-ny-airport/

As I've already said, its a completely meaningless PR venture. Has absolutely no bearing on anything really. Note Norwegian had no mention in that article. You can pair any airport with any other airport, doesn't mean they'll get a service! The fact that Belfast services are struggling immensely and Cork's numbers have started to shudder outside the peak season only further drive away Knock's chances of getting such a service.

Despite this the airport is still gaining, with more seats to the UK and a new route to PMI this year I think this is where focus should be, not on a fantasy US service that will be extremely difficult to ever get. Look at the resources Cork has put into the service, simply for a 3pw/2pw service, and they'd be much higher up the list for a service in my opinion.

I'd love to be wrong, but sadly I doubt I will be.

TopTec

JCX BXC wrote: »

Note Norwegian had no mention in that article. You can pair any airport with any other airport, doesn't mean they'll get a service!

Hmmmm. Norwegian has agreed to make Stewart a terminal for visitors to New York City, 60 miles away. However, Stewart's biggest impediment is the poor access to/from the airport. Only a local bus service is available.

Whether Norwegian commit to Knock-Stewart is another matter of course.

I would use the route if it became available instead of a traipse down to Shannon.

TT

Noccy_Mondy

What's the story with the area down near the fuel area and the top end of the runway? The old Road brings you up around there, are the public allowed up there? Nothing to stop them

yew_tree

I can do Dublin Airport in 2 hrs 45mims from my home in south Mayo using the M17/M6.

I can’t see scheduled US flights from Knock but Knock is a a very important piece of infrastructure for Connacht and Donegal in terms of connectivity to the UK and European destinations.

Shannon is a also regional airport by international standards in terms of size and of how many people use it...anyone know what capacity the terminal at Shannon is operating at?

It’s worth noting the distance and time someone in London or NYC for example will travel to an airport.

As for the fuel farm in Knock...I’ve heard there are plans to move it if the apron is to be increased to take more aircraft.

Great year for Knock and looks like 2018 will see the number of passengers steadily increase.

Shn99

1.7m using SNN per year. Terminal capacity is 4.5m

highlydebased

yew_tree wrote:

It’s worth noting the distance and time someone in London or NYC for example will travel to an airport.

Not as long as 2h 45min anyway, I live 2 miles from Central London and can be at Heathrow in around 40 min or Gatwick in around an hour, door to door!

JCX BXC

highlydebased wrote: »

Not as long as 2h 45min anyway, I live 2 miles from Central London and can be at Heathrow in around 40 min or Gatwick in around an hour, door to door!

Not as long as 2hrs 45mins, however how far is Stansted/Luton from you? You'd be surprised how far people travel to them!

6541

Just wondering, will Brexit have an impact on Knock airport. A lot of the flights are very UK based.
Also I don't think they should try and go after the North American market instead Knock management should go after regular flights to hub / one world European airports.

Knock really should try and get regular flights into London Heathrow and Amsterdam Schiphol, I understand this is not easy as these slots are actually sold to airlines. It would take major convincing to get an airline to commit to giving one of these slots to Knock.

Other then doing that Knock will always be a regional airport. BTW, I am a huge supporter of knock airport.

Jayop

Is Heathrow really viable?

highlydebased

JCX BXC wrote:

Not as long as 2hrs 45mins, however how far is Stansted/Luton from you? You'd be surprised how far people travel to them!

Luton is also about 40 min door to door but made slow by an awful shuttle bus from the train station and an awful airport experience too!

Stansted is the only airport that is truly far away, but anecdotally very few people I know tend to use it.

lotusm

Shn99 wrote: »

1.7m using SNN per year. Terminal capacity is 4.5m

That's only 38% capacity. Did they make any profit last year ? What's the capacity for Dublin cork Kerry knock?

yew_tree

lotusm wrote: »

That's only 38% capacity. Did they make any profit last year ? What's the capacity for Dublin cork Kerry knock?

Not sure on Knock but the terminal can get very cramped at peak times with four gates practically side by side. I believe there are plans to expand

JCX BXC

yew_tree wrote: »

Not sure on Knock but the terminal can get very cramped at peak times with four gates practically side by side. I believe there are plans to expand

Problem with Knock is it's very peaky, there could be 4 aircraft at 11am and then none until again that evening.

Shn99

lotusm wrote: »

That's only 38% capacity. Did they make any profit last year ? What's the capacity for Dublin cork Kerry knock?

Shannon group made a turnover of 68.7m in 2016, up 2% on 2015(no 2017 stats yet). Corks capacity is around 5m per year. Dublin is pretty much at capacity.

lotusm

Shn99 wrote: »

Shannon group made a turnover of 68.7m in 2016, up 2% on 2015(no 2017 stats yet). Corks capacity is around 5m per year. Dublin is pretty much at capacity.

Thanks for that but what was the actual profit for 2016