So, you're officially long term unemployed

christmas2012

yore wrote: »

And it's not free labour.

You'll say that this should not be done because you think it's stealing someone's job. But it's not

I've met graduates from some of the best colleges in the world who are willing to go to "intern" for free for months at top companies. Top companies who are extremely wealthy.

Fas DO SUCK UP WHAT COULD BE A PAID JOB FROM THE COMMUNITY..Since FAS landed in our community,companies who CAN AFFORD TO HIRE - SIMPLY DONT - Instead they avail of FAS sponsorship and get subsidised by FAS.
AND...YOU DONT GET PAID..Why would the hire you after your ce term ends?They just end up hiring another freebie.. That is a fact ive seen it for myself..If you dont believe me go look at any fas website for jobs - all ce work,some from companies who can afford to hire!
FAS PERPETUATE POVERTY,WHILE THEIR THERE,NO COMPANIES WILL HAVE THE MOTIVATION TO HIRE PAID WORKERS,WHEN THEY CAN GET THEM FOR FREE..SEE THE LOGIC?

yore

christmas2012 wrote: »

Fas DO SUCK UP WHAT COULD BE A PAID JOB FROM THE COMMUNITY..Since FAS landed in our community,companies who CAN AFFORD TO HIRE - SIMPLY DONT - Instead they avail of FAS sponsorship and get subsidised by FAS.
AND...YOU DONT GET PAID..Why would the hire you after your ce term ends?They just end up hiring another freebie.. That is a fact ive seen it for myself..If you dont believe me go look at any fas website for jobs - all ce work,some from companies who can afford to hire!
FAS PERPETUATE POVERTY,WHILE THEIR THERE,NO COMPANIES WILL HAVE THE MOTIVATION TO HIRE PAID WORKERS,WHEN THEY CAN GET THEM FOR FREE..SEE THE LOGIC?

doesn't the dole that you get for the work you do effectively make it a PAID JOB FROM THE COMMUNITY. Dole money isn't magiced out of fresh air you know. It's provided as a social function by the greater community as a whole!!!

And honestly, .... if it's in a function where you can seemlessly be replaced after 2 years experience by someone walking in off the street, then it's not a long-term career path that you want to stay in anyway. That's not to say that the 2 years was a waste. But you've gotten as much out of it as you can

christmas2012

what i hate to see is people getting their hopes up about a ce scheme,making it out to be fantastic,when the reality its a joblocker,it takes what could have been a paid vacancy away from the community,people should be discussing this aspect of what fas are essentially all about..
AND ITS NOT A PAID JOB ITS PAID BY WELFARE COMPANIES GET YOUR WORK FOR FREE,THATS WHY THERE ARE NO ADVERTS FOR PAID JOBS FAS AND JOBRIDGE ARE IN THE WAY...

mattjack

christmas2012 wrote: »

what i hate to see is people getting their hopes up about a ce scheme,making it out to be fantastic,when the reality its a joblocker,it takes what could have been a paid vacancy away from the community,people should be discussing this aspect of what fas are essentially all about..
AND ITS NOT A PAID JOB ITS PAID BY WELFARE COMPANIES GET YOUR WORK FOR FREE,THATS WHY THERE ARE NO ADVERTS FOR PAID JOBS FAS AND JOBRIDGE ARE IN THE WAY...

CE are only employed by charitys and community groups, no charity or community group would have the financial ability to pay CE workers .

None are supposed to be profit making.

FAS for all its well documented failings has been very successful in other aspects, an example would be the many thousands of tradesmen and women trained by them , as far as I know every single apprentice has to registered at FAS.

Capt'n Midnight

mattjack wrote: »

CE are only employed by charitys and community groups, no charity or community group would have the financial ability to pay CE workers .

None are supposed to be profit making.

FAS for all its well documented failings has been very successful in other aspects, an example would be the many thousands of tradesmen and women trained by them , as far as I know every single apprentice has to registered at FAS.

Back in the day there was CERT, AnCO, Youth Employment Agency , Manpower
CERT did the catering / tourist industry training, AnCO did the apprentice training and both were well regarded.
When merged with FAS there was some dilution of the brands. Nothing to worry about if you are doing an apprenticeship or getting something like City & Guilds.

mattjack

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Back in the day there was CERT, AnCO, Youth Employment Agency , Manpower
CERT did the catering / tourist industry training, AnCO did the apprentice training and both were well regarded.
When merged with FAS there was some dilution of the brands. Nothing to worry about if you are doing an apprenticeship or getting something like City & Guilds.

True... I think FAS standardised the apprentice training and brought onboard the
National Craft Certificate.

Dramatik

What's the point in working a job that you have no interest in what so ever? How does it help develope your real skills/tallents?

yore

Dramatik wrote: »

What's the point in working a job that you have no interest in what so ever? How does it help develope your real skills/tallents?

In the real world, I think it's very rare for a person to have a job where they like every single aspect of that job and never have to do a task that they have no interest in.....

You may perhaps learn to work as a team and show responsibility. You may be able to show reliability or organisational skills, even though it might not be in an area you want to work

And I'mm sure that lots of people do jobs that they aren't really interested in but do the job because it's a good steady job or the best one they could get in order to meet their responsibilities.

If a recently graduated and relatively talented drama student finds themselves on the dole for the year, and they get offered a position doing filing in an office, are they justified in not doing it because it's not their dream job of a walk-on part in Fair City :rolleyes:

yore

christmas2012 wrote: »

what i hate to see is people getting their hopes up about a ce scheme,making it out to be fantastic,when the reality its a joblocker,it takes what could have been a paid vacancy away from the community,people should be discussing this aspect of what fas are essentially all about..
AND ITS NOT A PAID JOB ITS PAID BY WELFARE COMPANIES GET YOUR WORK FOR FREE,THATS WHY THERE ARE NO ADVERTS FOR PAID JOBS FAS AND JOBRIDGE ARE IN THE WAY...

So you think that the reason you might find it difficult to find a job is because the evil government are somehow exploiting and forcing some poor person to work as a caretaker for the local GAA club for 20 hours a week.....

Would you take the job as the caretaker if the CE scheme was scrapped and the club could somehow manage to pay the minimum wage to fund that position?

CE scheme is not jobsbridge. But you started off giving out about CE schemes and have only just mentioned jobsbridge now

MistyCheese

So the OP does not live in Ireland. Em, why then is s/he so interested in the activities of the long-term unemployed in Ireland?

yore

MistyCheese wrote: »

So the OP does not live in Ireland. Em, why then is s/he so interested in the activities of the long-term unemployed in Ireland?

So should I have burned my passport and refused to have any interest in the country that I grew up in. All my family are still there. I would like to come back at some stage if that's ok with you........

The thread is not a simple one. It's purpose is to understand the feelings and beliefs towards certain things. Ireland is still a far far wealthier place than I remember it when I was a kid. perhaps my view on that Ireland is skewed by the fact that my family were a fair bit less well off then even relative to the average Irish family. That wealth unfortunately brought a large amount of inflated egos along with other material bullsh1t. Not to everyone, and not necessarily even to a majority. But to a sizesble proportion of people who are now too good for manual work or labour.

I don't ever remember hearing of anybody (i.e of working age) when I was young who refused a job if they were out of work. Regardless of what the job was.

I watch Irish TV online. I listen to RTE online too. I pay very little attention to the local news here. I am sorry if that somehow upsets or confuses you.

I heard a very good documentary on RTE Radio 1. In fact it was repeated a number of times. It was about a hotel. They interviewed one of the workers. A girl who was in the country only literally a week or two and had already found a job and was working . if I remember the name of the doc, I'll find it and post a link

yore

MistyCheese wrote: »

So the OP does not live in Ireland. Em, why then is s/he so interested in the activities of the long-term unemployed in Ireland?

Edit: Problem with internet connection so it posted twice instead of editing.


Here's the link
http://www.rte.ie/radio1/doconone/player.html?feedUrl=/radio1/doconone/atom/3243352.xml&play=true&position=0&volume=-1

It's a short segment. The time count's down on this player so go to about 23:35 or so. (It starts at 31:30 and finishes at zero). It's literally 15 seconds. There's another bit around 22 mins where the manager says they have 12 different nationalities.

And no, before someone tries to insinuate something, I am not giving out about foreign people working in Ireland. I'm delighted that that girl chose to come to Ireland to give us the gift of her services.

IrishAm

yore wrote: »

It's a short segment. The time count's down on this player so go to about 23:35 or so. (It starts at 31:30 and finishes at zero). It's literally 15 seconds. There's another bit around 22 mins where the manager says they have 12 different nationalities.

And no, before someone tries to insinuate something, I am not giving out about foreign people working in Ireland. I'm delighted that that girl chose to come to Ireland to give us the gift of her services.

She would have got the job through friends/acquaintances already working there. I doubt it would have even been advertised. The accommodation manager would have just asked the girls working in her department if they have any friends or family at home looking for work.

Common practice in hotels across Ireland.

MistyCheese

yore wrote: »

So should I have burned my passport and refused to have any interest in the country that I grew up in. All my family are still there. I would like to come back at some stage if that's ok with you........

The thread is not a simple one. It's purpose is to understand the feelings and beliefs towards certain things. Ireland is still a far far wealthier place than I remember it when I was a kid. perhaps my view on that Ireland is skewed by the fact that my family were a fair bit less well off then even relative to the average Irish family. That wealth unfortunately brought a large amount of inflated egos along with other material bullsh1t. Not to everyone, and not necessarily even to a majority. But to a sizesble proportion of people who are now too good for manual work or labour.

I don't ever remember hearing of anybody (i.e of working age) when I was young who refused a job if they were out of work. Regardless of what the job was.

I watch Irish TV online. I listen to RTE online too. I pay very little attention to the local news here. I am sorry if that somehow upsets or confuses you.

I heard a very good documentary on RTE Radio 1. In fact it was repeated a number of times. It was about a hotel. They interviewed one of the workers. A girl who was in the country only literally a week or two and had already found a job and was working . if I remember the name of the doc, I'll find it and post a link

yore wrote: »

Edit: Problem with internet connection so it posted twice instead of editing.


Here's the link
http://www.rte.ie/radio1/doconone/player.html?feedUrl=/radio1/doconone/atom/3243352.xml&play=true&position=0&volume=-1

It's a short segment. The time count's down on this player so go to about 23:35 or so. (It starts at 31:30 and finishes at zero). It's literally 15 seconds. There's another bit around 22 mins where the manager says they have 12 different nationalities.

And no, before someone tries to insinuate something, I am not giving out about foreign people working in Ireland. I'm delighted that that girl chose to come to Ireland to give us the gift of her services.

Great. Now could you possibly concise that into a far less verbose version that would in simple fact answer a simple question with an a simple answer rather than extorting an ultra complicated syntax in order to scare a simple question and drown it in words of four or more syllable?

Thank you.

yore

IrishAm wrote: »

I worked for the group that owns The Central Hotel. She would have got the job through friends/acquaintances already working there. I doubt it would have even been advertised. The accommodation manager would have just asked the girls working in her department if they have any friends or family at home looking for work.

Common practice in hotels across Ireland.

and of course, there were loads of locals who wanted and were willing to do it. Sure the hotel owners are evil ba$tards. Perhaps they know that the pesky tourists really want the authentic Irish experience by being looked after by a myriad of nationalities... (I'm being sarcastic.....I'm not into hotel management, but I'm sure they'd prefer to have plenty of Irish staff. Travel around the world and you'll find lots of Irish pubs. And the owners really love having Irish people behind the bar. It's common sense. Obviously the foreign workers make up for that in other areas such as dilligence and hard work)

I'm not saying she didn't find it through a friend, but there were also plenty of Irish people who were interviewed. I think most of them seemed to be in management. surely they had friends, or knew of friends of friends looking for work. If Patrick the manager from Galway has a friend looking for a start and Pavlo from Poland has a friend in Warsaw looking to come to Ireland for a job, which one is more likely to get it?

MistyCheese

yore wrote: »

and of course, there were loads of locals who wanted and were willing to do it. Sure the hotel owners are evil ba$tards. Perhaps they know that the pesky tourists really want the authentic Irish experience by being looked after by a myriad of nationalities... (I'm being sarcastic.....I'm not into hotel management, but I'm sure they'd prefer to have plenty of Irish staff. Travel around the world and you'll find lots of Irish pubs. And the owners really love having Irish people behind the bar. It's common sense. Obviously the foreign workers make up for that in other areas such as dilligence and hard work)

I'm not saying she didn't find it through a friend, but there were also plenty of Irish people who were interviewed. I think most of them seemed to be in management. surely they had friends, or knew of friends of friends looking for work. If Patrick the manager from Galway has a friend looking for a start and Pavlo from Poland has a friend in Warsaw looking to come to Ireland for a job, which one is more likely to get it?

Pavlo, as they can pay him less.

IrishAm

yore wrote: »

Sure the hotel owners are evil ba$tards.

A lot are, friend. An awful lot of them are.

yore

MistyCheese wrote: »

Great. Now could you possibly concise that into a far less verbose version that would in simple fact answer a simple question with an a simple answer rather than extorting an ultra complicated syntax in order to scare a simple question and drown it in words of four or more syllable?

Thank you.

Ok. I'll "concise" it for you.

You asked why I was interested in things happening in Ireland because I am working abroad.

The answer is that I am Irish. I like Ireland. I was born there. I have a great interest in all things Irish. My friends and family are there so If things get very bad for Ireland then it is bad for my friends and family. I hope to go home sometime. Because of all of this, I am interested in Irish current affairs.

My attempt at using smaller words for you.
Ireland good. I like very much. It is my favourite place. Me leave to work. Me a bit sad. Me hope to come home. Me hope Ireland do good and get better and big and strong.

yore

Pavlo, as he will work harder and be more appreciative of the job.

sorry I think you had a typo there so I fixed it for you.

I'm fairly sure there are minimum industry rates, and if not, minimum wage at least.

What do you think should be done instead, pay Patrick's Irish friend more to take the job? What a fair wage? 50k a year?

IrishAm

yore wrote: »

..I'm not into hotel management, but I'm sure they'd prefer to have plenty of Irish staff.

Hotel managers despise unions. Whilst Irish staff, especially old school hotel staff know their rights and are card carrying union member. Great workers, but know their rights and wont be fucked around. Many non Irish nationals were, and are, unaware of the various employment rights afforded to them under legislation. Hotel managers love them. Or more, their lack of knowledge of legislation afforded to them.

MistyCheese

yore wrote: »

Ok. I'll "concise" it for you.

You asked why I was interested in things happening in Ireland because I am working abroad.

The answer is that I am Irish. I like Ireland. I was born there. I have a great interest in all things Irish. My friends and family are there so If things get very bad for Ireland then it is bad for my friends and family. I hope to go home sometime. Because of all of this, I am interested in Irish current affairs.

My attempt at using smaller words for you.
Ireland good. I like very much. It is my favourite place. Me leave to work. Me a bit sad. Me hope to come home. Me hope Ireland do good and get better and big and strong.

Wow, that's great. Good job champ. However, despite English being my second language I do not require you to "use smaller words". Certainly I do not require you to forgo the syntax of the entire language and utilise only unconjugated words similiar to: "Me yore, me like words. Words good. You bad. You not like Yore's words. Grr."

yore

IrishAm wrote: »

Hotel managers despise unions. Whilst Irish staff, especially old school hotel staff know their rights and are card carrying union member. Great workers, but know their rights and wont be fucked around. Many non Irish nationals were, and are, unaware of the various employment rights afforded to them under legislation. Hotel managers love them. Or more, their lack of knowledge of legislation afforded to them.

Ok,I'll rephrase the question, we'll go all the way down to the minimum wage. Do you think that an Irish person should not have to work for 8.65 an hour under any circumstances?

If you are saying that the hotels are paying below minimum, please report them.

IrishAm

yore wrote: »

My attempt at using smaller words for you.
Ireland good. I like very much. It is my favourite place. Me leave to work. Me a bit sad. Me hope to come home. Me hope Ireland do good and get better and big and strong.

Please never ever return here you pompous and arrogant little man.

yore

MistyCheese wrote: »

Wow, that's great. Good job champ. However, despite English being my second language I do not require you to "use smaller words". Certainly I do not require you to forgo the syntax of the entire language and utilise only unconjugated words similiar to: "Me yore, me like words. Words good. You bad. You not like Yore's words. Grr."

MistyCheese wrote: »

Great. Now could you possibly concise that into a far less verbose version that would in simple fact answer a simple question with an a simple answer rather than extorting an ultra complicated syntax in order to scare a simple question and drown it in words of four or more syllable?

Thank you.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/syllable

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/drown

MistyCheese

yore wrote: »

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/syllable

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/drown

I'm sorry, what do you think you're proving there?

yore

IrishAm wrote: »

Please never ever return here you pompous and arrogant little man.

I'm arrogant :rolleyes:

I can reasonably, and fairly, infer from your posts that you think people are too good to do certain jobs for certain wages. All I'm saying is that they are not. I am not talking about, or targetting, specific people. i am talking about people in general. My last job in Ireland before leaving was working as a labourer for a relative for 50 Euro a week.

yore

MistyCheese wrote: »

I'm sorry, what do you think you're proving there?

I'm not proving anything. Apparently the poster thought I drowned some post with four-syllable words. I may have used a handful in the course of the post. But in no way did I drown it. The logical conclusion is that they were unsure of the definition of either the word "drown" or "syllable". I am not saying that they can't count.

MistyCheese

yore wrote: »

I'm arrogant :rolleyes:

yore wrote: »

I'm arrogant :rolleyes:

yore wrote: »

I'm arrogant :rolleyes:

:D:D:D:D

yore

MistyCheese wrote: »

:D:D:D:D

It doesn't take much to amuse you. I'm glad I made you smile. It's my good deed for the day before I log off. It's always nice to be able to give something back to the "special" people in the community. You deserve to be happy too

MistyCheese

yore wrote: »

It doesn't take much to amuse you. I'm glad I made you smile. It's my good deed for the day before I log off. It's always nice to be able to give something back to the "special" people in the community. You deserve to be happy too

Yes. I do. As you have deemed me "special". Wow! Off I go to redeem my trophy!