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So, you're officially long term unemployed

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    #122
    decembersun77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭decembersun77


    christmas2012 wrote: »
    they cherrypick thats why they dont give them out to the ones who need it,or would tend to be more serious about doing a ce scheme.they shoudnt get away with it either,there should be a system in place where these ce schemes are allocated people instead of letting them do the picking,its an unfair system in place.these free labour schemes are joblockers and are a scam.


    So what you are saying is they are actively deceiving the vast majority of the long term unemployed who apply for CE schemes, alot of unemployed people are vulernable and the longer they arte unemployed the more they are losing their confidence and self esteem and the more harder it is getting for them to work.

    What is wrong with this country, can they not make one honest system in place for the vulnerable people of it's society i.e long term unemployed.

    There are a number of men from my town who took their lives, they were working mostly all their lifes and lost their job at start of recession and it seems they couldn't handle being unmployed so long. Unemployment is definintely a factor in suicide from what I have seen.


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    #123
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    decembersun77 wrote: »
    So what you are saying is they are actively deceiving the vast majority of the long term unemployed who apply for CE schemes, alot of unemployed people are vulernable and the longer they arte unemployed the more they are losing their confidence and self esteem and the more harder it is getting for them to work.

    What is wrong with this country, can they not make one honest system in place for the vulnerable people of it's society i.e long term unemployed.

    There are a number of men from my town who took their lives, they were working mostly all their lifes and lost their job at start of recession and it seems they couldn't handle being unmployed so long. Unemployment is definintely a factor in suicide from what I have seen.

    I don't know about actively decieving people , but CE schemes are obliged to have 10 % of thier vacancies for disabled , both intellectually and physical and employ a wide variety of people from different age groups, genders , nationalities and of different ability and skill. Which the CE I,m does.


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    #124
    decembersun77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭decembersun77


    mattjack wrote: »
    Each CE supervisor has funding to allocate for each participant to further their education.

    You either pick or a course is allocated to you if want.

    I started of as a maintenance op. for a charity, while there my supervisor asked me to pick something to do.

    I picked an MQI cert/dip ran in conjunction with the school of social science in UCD.

    I've just completed the first year with an exit option or I can continue to a further level.

    Fas have funded most of the first year , apart from one or two costs.

    Next year I,m hoping to continue at DIP level depending on funding and passing an interview.

    About 10 of 30 or so students in my class are CE.

    Would you of been picked for the CE scheme if you didn't have a FAS course or FETAC or much work experience in your life or skills?

    The CE scheme is dishonesty of the highest rank, it's suppose to help the long term unemployed. it's not helping unemployed people with no qualification and people from marginalised, disadvantage areas and situations with big gaps in CVs and not much work experience in life - they are the ones who need it most because they will be far longer on welfare.


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    #125
    decembersun77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭decembersun77


    mattjack wrote: »
    I don't know about actively decieving people , but CE schemes are obliged to have 10 % of thier vacancies for disabled , both intellectually and physical and employ a wide variety of people from different age groups, genders , nationalities and of different ability and skill. Which the CE I,m does.

    isnt that not what every employers does? That is basic.


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    #126
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    decembersun77 wrote: »
    Would you of been picked for the CE scheme if you didn't have a FAS course or FETAC or much work experience in your life or skills?

    The CE scheme is dishonesty of the highest rank, it's suppose to help the long term unemployed. it's not helping unemployed people with no qualification and people from marginalised, disadvantage areas and situations with big gaps in CVs and not much work experience in life - they are the ones who need it most because they will be far longer on welfare.

    I was long term unemployed and have a slight learning disability.And I didnt have any Fas or Fetac courses done.


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    #127
    Phat Cat
    Registered Users Posts: 618 ✭✭✭Phat Cat


    mattjack wrote: »
    I,m on a CE scheme at the moment, and I know they are extremely difficult to get on.The one I'm on has given me the chance to return to third level education.

    I ,ve also been offered two jobs on the basis of the CE scheme and I ,ve got to decide either to take the jobs or continue in college.

    The CE funded most of my third level.

    I call b.s. on that! My wife did a CE scheme for 2 years back in 2004/2005 and the training allowance was capped at €500 per participant back then.

    There is no way on earth that they shelled out a couple a grand per year for your third level education.


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    #128
    decembersun77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭decembersun77


    mattjack wrote: »
    I was long term unemployed and have a slight learning disability.And I didnt have any Fas or Fetac courses done.

    You must of had work experience then...a learning disability doesn't mean you are less or more likely to get a job, you are the same as everyone else and should be treated equally.

    People with a mental illness as a disability are the most likely to be not treated equally in terms of work and career.


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    #129
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    Maybe I,m imagining my last year.Maybe I wasnt in UCD.Maybe I have no results from this year, maybe I had no lecture today.


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    #130
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    decembersun77 wrote: »
    You must of had work experience then...a learning disability doesn't mean you are less or more likely to get a job, you are the same as everyone else and should be treated equally.

    People with a mental illness as a disability are the most likely to be not treated equally in terms of work and career.

    I have work experience,... depends very much on the mental illness.


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    #131
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    Phat Cat wrote: »
    I call b.s. on that! My wife did a CE scheme for 2 years back in 2004/2005 and the training allowance was capped at €500 per participant back then.

    There is no way on earth that they shelled out a couple a grand per year for your third level education.

    Call what you want .


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    #132
    christmas2012
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,827 ✭✭✭christmas2012


    mattjack wrote: »
    Next year I,m hoping to continue at DIP level depending on funding and passing an interview.

    About 10 of 30 or so students in my class are CE.


    As i have stated before they don't fund diploma/degree courses,i have checked for myself,they fund nothing past fetac course,if you do a follow up course its off your own bat(your own funding).
    Most ce courses like ECDL,are fetac courses over ten years out of date,thats a fact.

    As for the cherrypicking it still goes on,i know a few people who started a ce course just as i finished up,none of them had gaps in their CV,they are looking for people with experience,yet say no experience is nessecary,it should be there for people who need it,when i was there,some people were just there on ce schemes to top up their dole by a few euros,while others never had a gap in their cv jumped from being employed let go and straight to a ce scheme,yet they say there there for the long term unemployed who are looking for work,its an unfair system.
    Thats what happens when these people are allowed to pick the ce workers,the government should step in and allocate the ce workers to the job that way the system cannot be abused.
    Ive seen instances where when a ce workers term is finished they are discarded,while they just hire the next freebie.
    Thats perpetuating unemployment,a lot these employers can afford to hire yet dont cos fas and jobridge are in the way joblocking.
    Millions is spent on these quangos,jobs for joan burtons cronies,as far as im concerned joan burton and her cronies are robbing jobs from the poor and those who are long term unemployed.
    http://politico.ie/social-issues/8313-pathways-to-work-or-pathways-to-poverty.html


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    #133
    decembersun77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭decembersun77


    mattjack wrote: »
    I have work experience,... depends very much on the mental illness.

    Yea that is what I am saying you probably had work experience that is one main reason why you got the CE schme. Because I know they woulsnt give it to some who had little work experience with no courses and no formal education.

    Well, it shouldn't depend on what disability a person has whether they have a mental illness, whether they have a hearing impairment or whether they have an intellecual disability.


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    #134
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    decembersun77 wrote: »
    Yea that is what I am saying you probably had work experience that is one main reason why you got the CE schme. Because I know they woulsnt give it to some who had little work experience with no courses and no formal education.

    Well, it shouldn't depend on what disability a person has whether they have a mental illness, whether they have a hearing impairment or whether they have an intellecual disability.

    I work on a CE scheme between charities. Both have employed people directly with no work experience.

    The first one employed me because of a skill I have.
    The second one employed me without any skill/qualification on the basis of a placement.


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    #135
    stupidusername
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,762 ✭✭✭✭stupidusername


    I think it could be a good idea for the government to place the people into the ce schemes and internships. two companies i interviewed for (for JobBridge internships) are still advertising the positions, after interviewing a few people. one of them flat out told me that they're only doing it because they can't afford to pay someone, but need to get the work done. they obviously just signed up so that they can get someone with experience to sit straight into the job. it's not what the scheme is designed for.

    I had some hope that i could get a ce scheme job, but now i'm not sure...


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    #136
    decembersun77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭decembersun77


    christmas2012 wrote: »
    As i have stated before they don't fund diploma/degree courses,i have checked for myself,they fund nothing past fetac course,if you do a follow up course its off your own bat(your own funding).
    Most ce courses like ECDL,are fetac courses over ten years out of date,thats a fact.

    As for the cherrypicking it still goes on,i know a few people who started a ce course just as i finished up,none of them had gaps in their CV,they are looking for people with experience,yet say no experience is nessecary,it should be there for people who need it,when i was there,some people were just there on ce schemes to top up their dole by a few euros,while others never had a gap in their cv jumped from being employed let go and straight to a ce scheme,yet they say there there for the long term unemployed who are looking for work,its an unfair system.
    Thats what happens when these people are allowed to pick the ce workers,the government should step in and allocate the ce workers to the job that way the system cannot be abused.
    Ive seen instances where when a ce workers term is finished they are discarded,while they just hire the next freebie.
    Thats perpetuating unemployment,a lot these employers can afford to hire yet dont cos fas and jobridge are in the way joblocking.
    Millions is spent on these quangos,jobs for joan burtons cronies,as far as im concerned joan burton and her cronies are robbing jobs from the poor and those who are long term unemployed.
    http://politico.ie/social-issues/8313-pathways-to-work-or-pathways-to-poverty.html


    Yes , the CE schmes are dishonesty of the highest rank. There are telling bare faced lies to vulerable unemployed people. Very deceptive system. I do not know how some people sleep at night.
    There is very little help in this country for vulerable people who genuinely want to make themselves and their life better, the more vulerable you are, the more obscales there is for you here.


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    #137
    Dead Kennedys
    Registered Users Posts: 87 ✭✭Dead Kennedys


    mattjack wrote: »
    In the Valley of Twitching Curtains, there lived a Watcher who spent every moment Watching his neighbours (across the Green)....



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    #138
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    christmas2012 wrote: »
    As i have stated before they don't fund diploma/degree courses,i have checked for myself,they fund nothing past fetac course,if you do a follow up course its off your own bat(your own funding).
    Most ce courses like ECDL,are fetac courses over ten years out of date,thats a fact.

    My Fas supervisors will fund to the best of thier ability a course one it makes sense to do it and depending on the funding available.


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    #139
    decembersun77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭decembersun77


    mattjack wrote: »
    I work on a CE scheme between charities. Both have employed people directly with no work experience.

    The first one employed me because of a skill I have.
    The second one employed me without any skill/qualification on the basis of a placement.

    That is very very rare. Maybe those people are from rathfarnham or there must to some factors there because they got accepted maybe their age, etc.


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    #140
    christmas2012
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,827 ✭✭✭christmas2012


    a lot of these companies hired have been found out that they can afford to hire but dont when they get the fas/jobridge freebies..


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    #141
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    stupidusername wrote: »
    I think it could be a good idea for the government to place the people into the ce schemes and internships. two companies i interviewed for (for JobBridge internships) are still advertising the positions, after interviewing a few people. one of them flat out told me that they're only doing it because they can't afford to pay someone, but need to get the work done. they obviously just signed up so that they can get someone with experience to sit straight into the job. it's not what the scheme is designed for.

    I had some hope that i could get a ce scheme job, but now i'm not sure...

    CE schemes are very difficult to access at the moment.

    Keep trying.


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    #142
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    decembersun77 wrote: »
    That is very very rare. Maybe those people are from rathfarnham or there must to some factors there because they got accepted maybe their age, etc.

    WTF ?


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    #143
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    christmas2012 wrote: »
    a lot of these companies hired have been found out that they can afford to hire but dont when they get the fas/jobridge freebies..

    I know nothing about Job bridge or TUS


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    #144
    decembersun77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭decembersun77


    stupidusername wrote: »
    I think it could be a good idea for the government to place the people into the ce schemes and internships. two companies i interviewed for (for JobBridge internships) are still advertising the positions, after interviewing a few people. one of them flat out told me that they're only doing it because they can't afford to pay someone, but need to get the work done. they obviously just signed up so that they can get someone with experience to sit straight into the job. it's not what the scheme is designed for.

    I had some hope that i could get a ce scheme job, but now i'm not sure...

    It's all a mess and they wonder why Ireland has the 5th highest Youth suicide rate in Europe. They do not do much to help the people who need help and pretend that they do but when it's actually all lies behind it.


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    #145
    stupidusername
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,762 ✭✭✭✭stupidusername


    mattjack wrote: »
    CE schemes are very difficult to access at the moment.

    Keep trying.

    I will, but it seems I just can't get anything.


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    #146
    christmas2012
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,827 ✭✭✭christmas2012


    My Fas supervisors will fund to the best of thier ability a course one it makes sense to do it and depending on the funding available.


    You jump from saying that now they fund to the best of their ability,first you were saying they fund diploma courses?

    it boggles the mind how anybody would defend a free labour exploitation scheme,which is responsible for robbing what could be a paid job from the community.


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    #147
    decembersun77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭decembersun77


    mattjack wrote: »
    CE schemes are very difficult to access at the moment.

    Keep trying.

    They should not be difficult at all. They are difficult because they are deceiving people. Are they going to give a CE scheme to a homeless man and a former addict who has been one the streets for 2 years and now is back on the right road and has a house but unemployed for one year, the answer is highly likely to be no.


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    #148
    decembersun77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭decembersun77


    mattjack wrote: »
    WTF ?

    Well there has to be some reasons, if your over 30 female, unemployed with little to no qualifications, work experience and skills and if your from ballynum or a social disadvantaged area or in a socially disadvantaged situation i.e if you don't have family in Ireland, if your english or scottish or your family are dead and if you are a former drug addict or have been in prison then then it's highly likely you will not be considered for the CE scheme. Can you not see that? it's plain to be see. one or more of these factors are accurate for them to refuse you.


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    #149
    Phat Cat
    Registered Users Posts: 618 ✭✭✭Phat Cat


    mattjack wrote: »
    Call what you want .

    I just did and you didn't deny it.

    The cap on training allowances for participants on CE schemes was €500 per year 6 years ago. With all of the recent budget cuts do you seriously want people to believe that you are getting the guts of €3k+ per year for a third level course through a CE scheme?


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    #150
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    decembersun77 wrote: »
    They should not be difficult at all. They are difficult because they are deceiving people. Are they going to give a CE scheme to a homeless man and a former addict who has been one the streets for 2 years and now is back on the right road and has a house but unemployed for one year, the answer is highly likely to be no.
    decembersun77 wrote: »
    Well there has to be some reasons, if your over 30 female, unemployed with little to no qualifications, work experience and skills and if your from ballynum or a social disadvantaged area or in a socially disadvantaged situation i.e if you don't have family in Ireland, if your english or scottish or your family are dead and if you are a former drug addict or have been in prison then then it's highly likely you will not be considered for the CE scheme. Can you not see that? it's plain to be see. one or more of these factors are accurate for them to refuse you.

    Some of the participants on the CE scheme I'm on are ex addicts/alcoholics, a number are former prisoners in my class. Don't know about homeless

    I know quite a few who meet all those criteria.


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    #151
    mattjack
    Registered Users Posts: 5,389 ✭✭✭mattjack


    Phat Cat wrote: »
    I just did and you didn't deny it.

    The cap on training allowances for participants on CE schemes was €500 per year 6 years ago. With all of the recent budget cuts do you seriously want people to believe that you are getting the guts of €3k+ per year for a third level course through a CE scheme?

    My course wasnt 3k plus.Fas funded most of it.I funded a little bit myself.


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