SUPPORT for victims of sexual assault thread - mod warning post #1

Morag

bluewolf wrote: »

First I was shocked at the sheer number of stories.
Now I'm shocked at the number of stories where the other men who knew what was going on didn't give a damn or tried to blame her too or thought it was all fine.

Wow.

I'm not shocked one bit at the numbers.
From the age of about 15 I've had people confide in me about when stuff like this has happened to them. That is about 22 years of listening to stories, from friends, families, friends of friends, people I barely know to complete strangers.

I am pleased to see that this thread has happened, and people are sharing,
it's only by talking about these things we raise awareness, that this happens
and that it needs to change.

Ambersky

Im not shocked either Sharrow as I too have been listening to women tell their rape stories all of my life.
Women and men who have been raped, have often found it hard to talk about fearing they would be blamed, or not believed, or indeed blaming themselves. People dont realise how common rape is, as few cases reach the courts but its not like the statistics are not there, reports and studies are there for everyone to see on conviction rates and rape. Google it and see for yourself.
http://www.alliancesupport.org/news/archives/002769.html

FEWER than one in 10 reports of rape to gardai results in a criminal conviction, a groundbreaking new study has revealed....
The study of attrition rates -- where cases "fall out" of the criminal justice system, many before they reach court -- tracked 100 rape cases reported to gardai by adult female victims (96pc) and adult male victims (4pc) throughout the country. The main reason why rape cases fall out of the criminal justice system are victim withdrawal from the process and a decision by the DPP - in more than a third of cases - that there was insufficient evidence.....
Even though an alleged perpetrator was identified in 79 of the 100 cases, only 18 suspects were charged and 16 proceeded to court. Only half of those cases, eight out of the overall 100 reported cases, resulted in a criminal conviction attracting sentences between four and a half and fifteen years.
Dr Paul O'Mahony, the Trinity College Dublin criminologist who partnered the Irish study, said of the high dropout rates: "A great deal of attrition occurs at various points in the criminal justice process itself, and indeed these forms of attrition probably play a considerable role in discouraging victims from reporting in the first place."

Notice the above quote is only 1 in 10 reported cases. Read below for some idea what percentage of rapes are reported to the Gardai. That will give you some idea what a small percentage of rapes go forward for conviction.
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/alarm-at-rape-conviction-rate-1966140.html

Director of the RCNI, Fiona Neary, said survivors of rape often feel it is they who are on trial. "We know from victims that the criminal justice system is failing in rape cases. Ireland's conviction rate from reported incidents to conviction is amongst the lowest in Europe.
"Survivors in Rape Crisis Centres tell us of their fears about reporting. They talk of the lack of dignity and respect in how they are treated; how they feel it is they who are on trial, and how their voice is ignored by the system," she added.
Many victims who do report rape are left in limbo as they wait for the case to finally come to trial, sometimes several years later.
"For those who have a positive experience of reporting, they also feel isolated and lost, are not kept informed and have been unable to move on with their lives because of the years waiting for their case to come to court," explained Ms Neary.
In a recently published review of activities by the RCNI, it emerged that victims are more prepared to report rape and sexual violence to gardai. Around one in five people using the network in 2008 had reported it to gardai,

But thats all studies and statistics, its when you or someone you know and love is raped or sexually assaulted and nothing happens, no justice, no court case, nothing, that you start to care about the subject and see the unfairness of it all. Its the myths and lack of understanding from the ground up, from the ordinary person in the street right up to the judges that make it difficult to talk about, you begin to expect not to be heard or believed.
It has even been difficult to talk about women and sexual assault, or even women and the fear of sexual assault, previously in threads in the Ladies Lounge so you can imagine how hard it must be to tell your story elsewhere.
I think whats different here and whats stopping the usual derailing and silencing of the topic is the power of the personal story. Its almost like someone you know tellilng you what happened to them and for some of you it is someone you know.
I hope I am not scaring anyone with those statistics there is enough fear already.
Im trying to say how important it is to dispell the myths about rape and it seems that posters here telling their stories are playing a very important role in doing just that it is really moving people.

seenitall

Ambersky wrote: »

I think whats different here and whats stopping the usual derailing and silencing of the topic is the power of the personal story.

Unfortunately, I think it's mainly the power of mods that stopped/stops the derailing; at least that's what reading the thread bears witness to.

Ambersky

Sad but probably true. seenitall

Wibbs

Sappa your post was deleted. If you had bothered to actually read the thread, even the previous page you would have seen this;

For future reference any debate outside the support vibe will be deleted. If anyone wants to start a thread debating the ins and outs, then start it elsewhere, NOT on this thread. End of. Fin. Full stop and for our American influenced readers, Period. Thank you.

How may times do we have to state this? The next post of this nature will get the poster banned. If someone can't be bothered to read the thread on a serious subject like this then don't post. Thank you.

LegacyUser

Not sure how to word alot of this, sorry if it's rambling in parts. When reading this thread it got me thinking about my experiences, first I could only think of one main incident but then started thinking on things I'd completely forgotten about. Or simply choose to put away into the back of my brain. Sorry this seems to have turned out to be very long

I'll start with 2 of my fathers so called friends, will call them A and B. Both paid me alot of attention all my life, at first I just thought they were friendly as didn't know any better. Soon as I hit about 12 and was more "developed" Mister A started alot more flirty comments and staring with that look in his eyes. At an event in a local pub one night in his drunken state he pulled me over to sit beside him there was no one else in that area. He asked that the next time he called round to my house would I wear one of my little night dresses. Makes me sick thinking about it now.

Mister B was always flirting from around that same time then all through my teenage years hell he'd even try it now only I avoid contact with him. One time he landed into the house and asked my Mother if he could use the bathroom but instead of going there he came into my room. I hid under the blankets in time clutching them tightly, pretending to be asleep but I was absolutely terrified he was going to come over to the bed and it seemed like he was there forever watching me. He eventually left and went up to bathroom to flush the toilet to make it seem like that's where he had been.
Thankfully when my parents seperated those men stopped coming round the house. Mister A tried talking to me 2 years ago in a pub and came in really close to me perving and I pushed him away. He went mental screaming "I'm your Dad's friend you shouldn't do that. I'll tell him how you pushed me". Felt like screaming back "if my Dad had any clue of the things you've said to me over the years you'd be in a coffin!" but I didn't and someone else stepped in and moved him away.

Then when I was 14 started dating my first boyfriend. A person who never should have been my boyfriend as he was 22 and basically an alcoholic. But I was young,innocent and hadn't a clue about boys plus my Dad was an alcoholic so that side of things seemed normal to me. Worst of all he had been accused of rape a few years before but everyone in town sided with him so of course I also believed his version of events.

When it came to the night of losing my virginity he was drunk, thought it's what I wanted but as soon as we started I knew it wasn't and it hurt. So I asked him to stop, he didn't. Started to panic in my head, asked again to stop, he didn't. Started thinking what if everyone is wrong what if he did rape that girl and now this is happening to me because I was soo stupid. Mind was racing and I simply froze. Was afraid if I tried to push him off me he would pin me down and get violent and then it really would be "rape". So I just lay there telling myself over and over that he simply didn't hear me. He's my boyfriend, he loves me, he just didn't hear me. Afterwards he rolled over to his side of bed and said in a hateful tone "You lied that wasn't your first time" like I had hurt his feelings, then went to sleep. While I tried to clean the blood off the sheets even though moving hurt.

Now I realised what happened but then I was only 14 and thought rape only happens when a stranger drags you down an alleyway, boyfriends don't do that to girlfriends that simply makes no sense. Told my best friend, the only person I ever told. She didn't believe me, saw it in her eyes, she just went quiet and awkward. Never spoke of it again. Thought to myself I just got things wrong that night and was just worrying over nothing. I kept on seeing him for few months after that. Someone who is raped does not continue seeing that person so that meant I wasn't raped. He had drink in him and he just hadn't heard me and my best friend didn't think it was rape so that's how I made it ok in my head. The only way I could process it at the time.

When I was 17 kissed a guy in a pub(knew his brother well at the time) but he got very intense and was starting to creep me out going on and on about him coming back to my place. So managed to lose him in the crowd(so I thought) and sneaked out of the pub. Was barely down the steps when he came bounding after me and pinned me up against the wall trying to kiss me. The bouncers had shut the doors as soon as he was out and there was no one on the street not even a car in sight.
He would not take no for an answer no matter what I said, he was intent on coming back to mine and his full body weight had me up against the wall and his hands were round my wrists so tightly they hurt. He wasn't going to let me go until I said yes which is exactly what he said to me in this flirty creepy way. Absolutely terrified as I knew exactly what was going to happen when thankfully 2 lads I knew happened to drive by and braked when they saw what was going on. Soon as he heard the car he backed away from me and I ran for the car. He looked soo angry and he knew where I lived so was worried but the 2 lads stayed over night in the sitting room just in case he showed up.

When I was 22 had been seeing a lad and we were at his for a usual weekend party along with his cousin who he lived with. We had been drinking and had a row and he passed out in the kitchen on a mattress. I went to sleep on a seperate mattress crying because of the row, his cousin tried to comfort me. Went to sleep. Woke up and knew something was very wrong and realised his cousin had his hand up under my top and under my bra and was feeling me up. No idea how long he may have been touching me.
I pushed him away from me and tried to leave but he blocked the door. He kept saying how I was angry at my boyfriend and calling him names so obviously we were going to be broken up now. Guess he thought I was fair game. When he blocked the door I begged him to let me go but he wouldn't let me passed. So I just slumped onto the mattress crying couldn't believe this was happening. When he came towards me told him I needed the toilet and he let me go. When I came out of toilets I ran for the door, he tried to stop me but I screamed at him to F off and managed to get out. Ran/stumbled the long way home crying. He still thinks he did nothing wrong even tried it on with me another time. Try not to think of him as when I do it's like I can feel his hands on me and it makes me sick.

In between those incidents there have been countless gropes and ass grabbing/serious painful ass slapping from random strangers. There was one dude who took it took far and caused me serious pain one night. Feel like I'm forgetting another incident but don't want to even try and remember them anymore.

It's all definitely affected me I do know that but up until this thread I was blind to other ways it's affected me. For most of the time I hang out with my male friends more than female as with them I don't have to dress up for nights out, this means I get no attention from males in the pub/club. Plus people normally assume I'm going out with one of the lads so it's a safety net of sorts. The temper I have scares me sometimes as if any lad ever tried anything like any of the above, he would end up in hospital that's a guarantee. Talking does not seem to work with these types. Sorry again for this being soo long.

Emme

addsup, you've been very brave and I'm not surprised you get angry with men now. Take care of yourself and consider getting counselling.

edellc

addsup dont be sorry at all for the long post, I posted a good few pages back and it was only after I submitted my reply that I really began to think about incidents that have happened to me in the past too

Like you I have been pinned up to walls by men who think they can get away with it, I have had my crotch, ass and breasts grabbed on more than one occassion and I was pushed into a door way on a main public street at 10am when people where passing by a homeless man who then groped me everywhere I shouted for help and I remember this woman walking by, she looked at me and kept walking :eek: I mean really I was in my work uniform no more than 23 pinned up in the doorway of a shop on rathmines road by a homeless man grabbing at me and everyone walked by, I did go to the guards who knew the man I was talking about but said they couldnt do anything

I had a turkish creep with a limp follow me to the point I was terrified of him he stayed in the shop I worked in until closing and tried to get in the taxi with me more than once and every time I was out with friends he just seemed to be there all the time again guards said they couldnt do anything as he had done nothing...my bf was brought down an alley way by him and his three mates who thought they would beat my bf up however it was the three of them that ended up getting the hiding, and next time I seen this short limping turkish creep walking down the road my bf told him to cross it and never ever walk on the same side of the road as me again, ever, which seemed to work even now when I see him in town he just stares at me but Im not scared of him anymore...im not condoning violence but i have never been bothered by this guy again

I was on the bus home one day and this chinese man got on the bus, it was packed and eveyone was standing, he was behind me next thing I know he has an erect penis and its sticking in my ass, I moved away as far as I could but he just moved up behind me and kept pressing himself into me ON A PACKED BUS, I should have shouted but at that stage there had been a number of gropings and grabbings close together and I just felt defeated as if all men do this, so I got off at the next stop and walked home feeling so angry

I would class all these as some sort of sexual assault not on the serious side but they where mentally serious to me as a young woman as it all happened between the ages of 19 and about 25 so I did develop a view of men that was right and although I am with my current partner since I was 21, men still thought they could do this to me when I was out with girlfriends or even my bf but when he wasnt beside me ie going to the toilets, getting a drink at the bar whatever I seemed to be fair game to randomers

The reason I put an age limit on my experiences is that around the age of 25 I just stopped going out to nightclubs/bars and pubs and when I did go out it was to the old man local and I would be dressed like a nun, I also started to walk home from work every day and never got on a packed bus if I could avoid it, I never actually though about how my experiences effected me but I now realise how much they did

superblu

edellc wrote: »

addsup dont be sorry at all for the long post, I posted a good few pages back and it was only after I submitted my reply that I really began to think about incidents that have happened to me in the past too

Like you I have been pinned up to walls by men who think they can get away with it, I have had my crotch, ass and breasts grabbed on more than one occassion and I was pushed into a door way on a main public street at 10am when people where passing by a homeless man who then groped me everywhere I shouted for help and I remember this woman walking by, she looked at me and kept walking :eek: I mean really I was in my work uniform no more than 23 pinned up in the doorway of a shop on rathmines road by a homeless man grabbing at me and everyone walked by, I did go to the guards who knew the man I was talking about but said they couldnt do anything

I had a turkish creep with a limp follow me to the point I was terrified of him he stayed in the shop I worked in until closing and tried to get in the taxi with me more than once and every time I was out with friends he just seemed to be there all the time again guards said they couldnt do anything as he had done nothing...my bf was brought down an alley way by him and his three mates who thought they would beat my bf up however it was the three of them that ended up getting the hiding, and next time I seen this short limping turkish creep walking down the road my bf told him to cross it and never ever walk on the same side of the road as me again, ever, which seemed to work even now when I see him in town he just stares at me but Im not scared of him anymore...im not condoning violence but i have never been bothered by this guy again

I was on the bus home one day and this chinese man got on the bus, it was packed and eveyone was standing, he was behind me next thing I know he has an erect penis and its sticking in my ass, I moved away as far as I could but he just moved up behind me and kept pressing himself into me ON A PACKED BUS, I should have shouted but at that stage there had been a number of gropings and grabbings close together and I just felt defeated as if all men do this, so I got off at the next stop and walked home feeling so angry

I would class all these as some sort of sexual assault not on the serious side but they where mentally serious to me as a young woman as it all happened between the ages of 19 and about 25 so I did develop a view of men that was right and although I am with my current partner since I was 21, men still thought they could do this to me when I was out with girlfriends or even my bf but when he wasnt beside me ie going to the toilets, getting a drink at the bar whatever I seemed to be fair game to randomers

The reason I put an age limit on my experiences is that around the age of 25 I just stopped going out to nightclubs/bars and pubs and when I did go out it was to the old man local and I would be dressed like a nun, I also started to walk home from work every day and never got on a packed bus if I could avoid it, I never actually though about how my experiences effected me but I now realise how much they did

All men do not do this. I apologise on behalf of all the decent men out there for what's happened to you.

rainbow kirby

Sappa wrote: »

Alcohol seems to be a huge factor in a lot of your incidents,you seem to be vulnerable in this environment and you need to be careful when you around pubs or house parties as this is when these predators will strike.

Do NOT victim-blame in tLL, particularly on this thread.

LegacyUser

I've posted earlier in the thread but I'm going anon for this one as I'm still mortified by this.

The worst part of what happened to me that was my attacker pinned me down while I was stuggling and ejaculated into my face.

I still think about it all the time. It shook me to the core. You know it was so shocking, who does that?

It made me feel like such dirt. I had post traumatic stress after it. It was so awful and dehumanizing.

I felt like how worthless must I be that he could treat me with such utmost contempt.

I still struggle with it.

LegacyUser

addsup here. Couldn't go under my username before or even now, just too personal-but glad I did write about those incidents. Have remembered another one since not as extreme but disturbed me at the time. Was at a wedding with a friend and staying at his home house. We had kissed in the past but that was long time ago and figured he knew that. But guess when I agreed to go to the wedding with him he thought we would hook up. Had to share a bed with him but dressed in PJs and massive jumper and curled up on my side with duvet wrapped round me. Thinking that would indicate I didn't want anything to happen as well! He was drunk though and the WHOLE night his hand kept creeping over to rub my arm or leg, suppose trying to "kickstart" me or whatever. Told him repeatedly to go to sleep and stop it, in his words "well we happened before so why can't we happen again". Seriously damaged our friendship.

There was another thing it didn't happen to me but it all makes sense now. All through the years my mother hated and still hates my Fathers brother-my uncle. Never figured out why I thought he was cool and he was always nice to me, paid me compliments all my life etc. She flipped out many times about him and never left me alone with him but never explained why. Esp went mad when I planned a trip to the country he lives in to visit some friends and I said I would stay with him a few nights. Finally explained that he raped my cousin many years ago when she was young. His own sisters daughter-his niece for god sake!

He's always been into women like exceptionally so. Never married but was never without a girlfriend or a few girlfriends, flirted with any age of female even if they were in their 20s or teenagers. That did embarrass me as I got older but he was only home about maybe twice a year. Turns out when I was 9 my aunt warned my Mother about what had happened as she didn't want the same thing to happen to me. In turn my Mother tried to explain to me when I became a teenager but I wouldn't believe her. My uncle was a god guy just because he really likes alot of women doesn't make him a rapist. He has never touched a drop of drink in his life(that to me was an amazing thing as the majority of men I knew back then were alcoholics) as a result he must be a good guy. Plus anyone who gets raped goes to the guards right? So they never went-so you are just making this all up because you hate him! My young mind just wouldn't believe it. I forgot about it until recent years when my Mother brought it up again around the time of my aunts death.

When at her wake my uncle arrived and I saw my cousins reactions change completely. She held on tightly to her husbands hand while trying to hold back the emotions of her Mother being dead and also seeing him there. The hatred in her face, she wouldn't look at him neither did the husband and he didn't go near her. My uncle is a rapist. That is so hard to even type down. I've gone through a mix of emotions from anger to betrayal and for some reason feeling dirty, there is a rapist in my family. Why didn't my aunt go to the guards? Why didn't my cousin? Why did my aunt still tolerate him coming back home? Why did my Mother allow him into our house even though she knew the truth? Does my Father even know about it? Would he even believe that his beloved brother could do that?

Families try and deal with these things themselves quietly and it all just rips everything apart. Now how the hell do I act when he comes home when I know the truth? It's easy for someone to say you should call him on it and tell him what you think. But is it my place to go dragging this all up again when maybe that's the last thing my cousin wants. Do I ever bring it up with her, how could I when it will hurt her to even think about it. It's soo confusing that all that's left is silence.

Emme- Did go to counselling when I was 17, she was great up until I told her about the encounter when I was 14 and she pushed too much for me to do something about it like go to guards. Freaked me out so left, but definitely will return to counselling in the near future. Soo much other crap happened too(bad break ups, deaths, usual life stuff) in between these incidents that counselling is needed to help me process it all. Won't have time or money for it now but will work on it in the coming years as I know I need it. Hate crying in front of professionals even though I know they have seen it many times it.

Edellc- Sorry to hear about what you went through. It's insane how common it is and you do end up accepting it as just something that happens in life, that alot of men will just feel you up esp when you are distracted and they try to get your attention. You do feel defeated.

My previous post may have come across as man hating but I honestly don't hate men. There are amazing guys out there and my male friends are proof of that. It's only the ones who perv or touch you inappropriately that I have an instant hate for. I'm not talking about someone briefly checking you out that's ok, that's normal behaviour. But the pervy ones always have this different look in their eyes and I recognise it now.

Not going to let this or other general life crap take over anymore. I want to be able to dress up girlie all the time, wear a damn dress or skirt and top. Wear clothes that show off my figure not hide it away and not worry about someone touching me. If they do I'll deal with it with sharp words and/or a sharp slap across the face. They can call me frigid or a b*tch I don't care maybe they will think twice about touching girls without their consent. Fed up of hiding away, not dressing up and fed up of accepting the groping as a way of life. I'm not dirty, they are the dirty ones!

We have every right to enjoy a night out in a pub/club/anywhere. We have every right to enjoy our lives!! So quite frankly- F*CK the pervs. They are not controlling my life any longer. I know the attention I'll get when I start dressing like a girl but I don't care, let them look all they want. I'll soon tell them were to go if they cross any line. Taking back my life no matter how difficult at times it will be and will sort out counselling for the future. Will not run and hide anymore I'm tired of it.

This thread is to thank for my new strength.
I hope the rest of you will get to that stage soon.

beks101

dehumanised wrote: »

I felt like how worthless must I be that he could treat me with such utmost contempt.

I still struggle with it.

Oh God, this makes me so sad.

What he did to you, he would have done to anyone unfortunate enough to have been in your position.

What he did is a reflection on what a disgusting, sadistic animal he is. What an utter piece of worthless shit he is. I'm not a hateful person, but I hear stories like this and I think that men like this should be castrated and left to rot in a dark cell.

You were just in the wrong place at the wrong time and I'm certain that with time and therapy you will come to see that.

Be kind to yourself. You deserve so much love and compassion xx

edellc

I wasnt going to share this as I havent really spoken a lot about it but here goes.....I hate my father he is a sh*t

When I was a teenager my older sister became pregnant and long story short she was asked to leave the family home, I never like my sister she was a bully and beat me every day, but when she left the social workers arrived...turns out she alleged that my father groped her one evening while cutting her hair in the kitchen - he used to be a hairdresser many moons ago

we didnt believe her as she was a liar, she would leave the house and turn right but tell you she was going left, it was all stupid things she lied about but it was every day and about everything, so we felt she was being malicious due to his disappointment in her and asking her to leave

Fast forward to 11 years ago my other sister who is a couple of years younger than me, ended up going to spain with my father, just her and him....when they got back she wasnt the same and ended up telling my man that one night when he was drunk he made a pass at her...I was never told in detail what went on but it was obvious as when mam confronted him he didnt deny it and left within the week, it broke my mother and she was never the same person.....I have never had anymore to do with him

Strangely he went to live with my older sister, who has a daughter I always felt uncomfortable about this set up but she wont talk to me about it - we have never been close, she defends him even when I am not attacking him

He also has a weirdly strange bond with my younger sister and plays happy families with her and her son again I find this uncomfortable and again I have spoken to her about it, as he is the only godparent left in her sons life (his father is long gone and fathers family not good people, my mam died last year) she feels that her son should have a grandparent even if it is him, again I find this hard to believe or get my head around

I also have another younger sister, who has never claimed anything again my father, I do find it strange that he has this weird relationship with two daughters who both claimed sexual assault, whereas he has nothing to do with me and my other sister who he never touched - thankfully

I dont call him my father anymore as my dad in my eyes died a long time ago I just call him by his first name, I have no respect for him nor love and I am very aware of keeping my distance

Neither of my sisters reported this to the guards, the social services at the time said my sister lied but as I said she was a good liar so who knows the truth, and my other sister did go and get counselling in the rape crisis centre

I keep my distance from my older sister also as she tells all to my father about my life if I divulge anything, but have a bond with my other two sisters and we are close especially since loosing mam...but it is a very strange set up and nobody in the extended family knows this apart from us and my mams sisters, but his family think the sun shines out of his *ss, and believe my mam was the bad guy who broke up the marriage

regged for this

Been thinking about posting a reply here for some time but on reading other people's harrowing accounts of their experiences it felt that anything I had gone through wasn't so serious, or was pretty run of the mill for many women (sadly).

I have had the standard ass/breast grabbing and countless vile inappropariate comments of what random strangers (or 'friends' or work colleagues) would like to do to me, or intimate comments about my body when the drink is in (always a fine excuse). It seems the female body is open for public discussion and debate as though there isn't a living breathing human individual occupying it horrified at what is being bandied about by some drunk bloke in the pub.

I have had a sex-text stalker who texted me off and on over several years asking for sexual responses (it only backed off for a time when my boyfriend rang him and yelled down the phone). I was followed into a phone booth many moons ago by a drunken young guy while I was waiting for my cab home. He was very persistently and inappropriately trying to get lucky and I did fear it was going to get out of hand. Thankfully it didn't go beyond the physical and verbal intimidation (all within the confined space of a god damn phone booth - disgusting). I have been dry-humped by someone guy's raging semi while in the crowds at a festival. I have had several (married) men, of minimum 10-15 years older than me try to kiss/grope me despite the fact they were my work colleagues. I talk my way out of these situations, usually through appealing to their familial responsibilities and how embarassed they will be in work the next day. I've finally learned I need to respond to it by yelling GET YOUR ****ING HANDS OFF ME as loudly as I can.....

I was approached by a young guy when I was a teenager in school who was trying to show off to his mates by saying 'watch this' and then attempted to slide his hand up to my crotch (under my school skirt) - thankfully he wasn't very successful as I had braced myself and he didn't feel much more than my knee. But I had to go home for lunch like nothing had happened while I was shook to the core and paranoid for days that I might run into them again. I was chatted to every single day for over a year on the same lunchtime walk home from school when I was about 15 by a well known local. He was later convicted of grooming and abusing an unfortunate young girl who was, I guess, more vulnerable than me

Finally - I was essentially orally raped by a vile individual who I was casually seeing on the rebound from my ex. I didn't even like him much, but was feeling low and had been lucky enough, up to that point in my life to have only encountered respectful men who cared for me and had warm joyful sexual relations with! It was somewhat forceful, they was no opportunity for consent/choice in the matter. I guess my choice was taken away which makes it assault. The confusing thing about it being how you rationalise such an incident away in terms of 'well we were fooling around anyway' or the fact I wasn't much truck in the oral sex stakes and here, this guy had gotten off through it....but, it was assault. And I have since learned I can please a guy I like orally when I choose to, in the manner I want to and with great success! I have not allowed this incident to have much hold over me beyond the initial few weeks of shock and discomfort. He is unworthy of having such an impact on my life and who I am. I confronted him about it at the time. We went our separate ways. He knows what he did and still retains a healthy level of fear of me...or the possiblity of me speaking out about it (or so I've been told; he's intimidated by me).

However - from thinking it over I have realised I haven't had a full loving relationship with someone I cared deeply about since this and it was a number of years ago - but other factors may be more to blame! Although I am aware of my inability to be vulnerable with or dependent on a man anymore. I'm a firm believer this will change when the right one comes along - the friendship that will develop into a deep mutual trust, love and understanding as per all of my previous relationships which I look back on fondly!

I count myself lucky not to have faced the dreadful situations of others who have been so brave as to share their stories here.

I haven't mentioned the times where nothing actually happened as such but I felt threatened, such as times I have been followed, or had a suggested taxi-ride on my own with a creepy driver etc and the fight of flight instinct kicks in.

Not sure what more to say really other than guys need to be held accountable for their behaviour - by the women who are subjected to but survive and thrive after such offences but also by their better male contemporaries. All those good guys who are out there!

Apologies for the length, and thank you to those who have contributed so far and warm wishes of support to those who are reading and cannot but may yet contribute - but are hopefully garnering some therapuetic effect from feeling they are not alone!

LegacyUser

Hi, I'm going anon for this as I posted earlier in the thread and I am a fairly regular user of Boards. What was written by two posters recently about the reactions that members of their families have to assaulters, and how confusing it is, really struck a chord.

My sister was raped by my brother's friend a few years ago, and I am one of the very few people that know about it (my brother knows but he lives abroad now). I cannot claim that it has had anything like the effect that it has had on my sister on me, of course. But it is still hard to know that your sister was raped by a man that lives nearby and never to be able to do anything about it. There are so many times that I have wanted to kill him, and to shout out what he did, to let everyone know that he's not the good family man and decent guy they all think he is, but that he's a horrible man who thinks that when a woman says no she means yes (he has said this to his friends, although not specifically about my sister). After it happened, he even told my brother that he had 'been up' on my sister, so my brother first thought it was consensual. When he found out that it wasn't, he was so shocked and went mad but my poor sister persuaded him not to say anything because she was so afraid of what he would do. Now he never mentions it, and we never do either.

It's hard to explain and feels mean to think about myself when the rape happened to my sister. But the fact of not being able to talk about it even to my husband sometimes eats me up inside. I can't talk to my sister about it, as naturally she never wants to talk about it, and we never ever mention it now. If anyone brings up sexual assault or rape in conversation, she gets such a funny look on her face, and a look passes between us. We have this secret that we keep from the rest of our family, and that is the way that it will always be. We even keep it secret from each other because we never mention it. It is just blocked out, and the only place I know that it goes around and around is in my head. Well, I say my head, but it must be in my sister's head too, and even more likely to pop up in her thoughts. I think about what happened to her so regularly, that it must haunt her. But it's taboo now.

Another thing about it is that before this happened I thought that this guy was sexy. That makes it worse. I thought he was sexy, and then he raped my sister. What does that say about my judgement?

lazygal

Guest for this wrote: »

Another thing about it is that before this happened I thought that this guy was sexy. That makes it worse. I thought he was sexy, and then he raped my sister. What does that say about my judgement?

It says NOTHING. Rapists aren't all trolls. When I was with the man who I feel assaulted me i thought he was HOT and SEXY, sure why would I have been going out with someone I didn't fancy the pants off?

Rapists aren't ugly mingers who have to grab sex when they get the chance. They are our friends, lovers, celebrities, models, sex symbols. They are the men we see around us. I'm not in any way saying every man is a rapist, just that they are 'normal' guys, they don't come with a 666 sign on their forehead.

edellc

@ guestforthis You where not to know that this guy was a sc*mbag so dont beat yourself up by what you thought of him before hand

I understand your anger and the secrecry, I have that too with my with my sister about my father,it is never spoken about as she doesnt want to, and yet I am so angry with him...I also hate the way his family think he is the best brother/son ever when I know he is a sick pervert and it annoys me and I just want to shout at them what he did....He is self employed and all the people he works for think he is great too and I want to ring them and tell them he is not

I know that I have not spoken to my father since this incident, but I find it really hard to get my head around the fact she still has a relationship with him, he has been accused of inappropriate behaviour to two of my sisters yet has a relationship with them where as he has never ever attempted to to anything to me and my baby sis and neither of us has a relationship with him now....I find this strange and messed up....thankfully your sister didnt pretend like nothing has happened and keep in contact with this creep and thankfully your brother followed suit, I can only imagine what she goes through daily and my heart goes out to her

LegacyUser

lazygal wrote: »

It says NOTHING. Rapists aren't all trolls. When I was with the man who I feel assaulted me i thought he was HOT and SEXY, sure why would I have been going out with someone I didn't fancy the pants off?

Rapists aren't ugly mingers who have to grab sex when they get the chance. They are our friends, lovers, celebrities, models, sex symbols. They are the men we see around us. I'm not in any way saying every man is a rapist, just that they are 'normal' guys, they don't come with a 666 sign on their forehead.

Well, you are right, I know this -- in theory and logically, and it's the first thing I would say to someone else. But I can't get rid of the feeling that somehow I betrayed my sister by thinking that he was sexy. And even said it to her the morning that she told me that he raped her. In fact, it was what prompted her to tell me that he did it. I think that's why I have this feeling of shame about this part of the whole thing. Almost like I contributed to her pain.

LegacyUser

edellc wrote: »

@ guestforthis You where not to know that this guy was a sc*mbag so dont beat yourself up by what you thought of him before hand

I understand your anger and the secrecry, I have that too with my with my sister about my father,it is never spoken about as she doesnt want to, and yet I am so angry with him...I also hate the way his family think he is the best brother/son ever when I know he is a sick pervert and it annoys me and I just want to shout at them what he did....He is self employed and all the people he works for think he is great too and I want to ring them and tell them he is not

I know that I have not spoken to my father since this incident, but I find it really hard to get my head around the fact she still has a relationship with him, he has been accused of inappropriate behaviour to two of my sisters yet has a relationship with them where as he has never ever attempted to to anything to me and my baby sis and neither of us has a relationship with him now....I find this strange and messed up....thankfully your sister didnt pretend like nothing has happened and keep in contact with this creep and thankfully your brother followed suit, I can only imagine what she goes through daily and my heart goes out to her

Thank you. I have often thought about the 'messed up' way that we have dealt with it all, and wish that we had done some things differently. But we would never have to deal with it if that ass**** hadn't done what he did. And you're right, my sister deals with it every single day. Although we never talk about it, I can see the effects all the time.

Ormus

I find it interesting that people on this thread seem to be very confused about what rape is.

Rape occurs where one person has sex with another person in circumstances where the other person does not (or cannot) consent and the first person either:
1. Knows that they do not consent; or
2. Ought to know that they do not consent.

Ormus

Ormus wrote: »

I find it interesting that people on this thread seem to be very confused about what rape is.

Rape occurs where one person has sex with another person in circumstances where the other person does not (or cannot) consent and the first person either:
1. Knows that they do not consent; or
2. Ought to know that they do not consent.

Firstly this thread isn't soley about rape
Secondly I don't think there is much cofusion the majority of posters are quite clear about the experiences they have so bravely shared .
I dont share your view at all I don't get confusion from anything that has been shared here just a world of pain .
My heart goes out to all of you who have posted x

LittleBook

Ormus wrote: »

I find it interesting that people on this thread seem to be very confused about what rape is.

Rape occurs where one person has sex with another person in circumstances where the other person does not (or cannot) consent and the first person either:
1. Knows that they do not consent; or
2. Ought to know that they do not consent.

Mods, perhaps you could put a moderator note in the thread title/OP since people who claim to have read the thread obviously can't see the multiple posts concerning it being a support thread.

Moomoo1

bluewolf wrote: »

First I was shocked at the sheer number of stories.
Now I'm shocked at the number of stories where the other men who knew what was going on didn't give a damn or tried to blame her too or thought it was all fine.

Wow.

probably not just men... women buy into this too

To me, as many others pointed out (and some of the stories illustrate this), it's all about the perpetrator's social standing and personal charm to make sure his word is taken over the victim's.

rainbow kirby

Ormus wrote: »

I find it interesting that people on this thread seem to be very confused about what rape is.

Rape occurs where one person has sex with another person in circumstances where the other person does not (or cannot) consent and the first person either:
1. Knows that they do not consent; or
2. Ought to know that they do not consent.

We're all aware of the legal definition. Was it really necessary to repost it for the sake of trying to derail the thread?

Ormus

Devon Scarce Treble wrote: »

Firstly this thread isn't soley about rape
Secondly I don't think there is much cofusion the majority of posters are quite clear about the experiences they have so bravely shared .
I dont share your view at all I don't get confusion from anything that has been shared here just a world of pain .
My heart goes out to all of you who have posted x

I think thats very unfair. I have read all of this thread. It may not be solely about rape, but rape has been spoken about as much as sexual assault, if not more. There has been very little evidence that people understand the definition of consent. It's a very important distinction to make.

The stories on this thread are heartbreaking and it's very admirable the bravery of the people who have come to talk about them.

I was trying to be helpful. Don't people want to understand what it is that they're talking about? How does that derail the thread?

rainbow kirby

Ormus wrote: »

Don't people want to understand what it is that they're talking about?

They do understand, only too well, what they're talking about.

Ickle Magoo

Ormus, the Ladies Lounge is discussion forum aimed at the ladies of boards.

Please don't drop by just to give obvious dictionary definitions that anyone can google. The thread has had a plethora of mod warning spelling out what the purpose of the thread is.

If you with to retain posting rights then please respect what the posters of this forum and what the moderators have stated the purpose of this thread is.

Final warning.

If you wish to debate this warning do so via PM - DO NOT drag this thread any further off topic

miec

I am hoping that by sharing my thoughts / experiences of 1) rape / sexual abuse in a family and 2) the odd behaviours that some people take 3) the enormity of confronting things and 4) societial responses to rape / sexual abuse may help others and clarify understanding.

When I was sexually abused and later raped by my half brother I had no words for my experience, the first time I read what people do in actual sex I remember gasping and going X did that to me and then I very quickly shut it down and did not remember it for over ten years or so. I read it in a magazine and around the same time the whole abuse / incest thing was coming out I allowed myself to briefly acknowledge what happened and then I shut it down. Looking back I am deeply grateful to those brave people who opened up first.

The thing is I pretended and played the whole happy family thing, I was friendly with my brother, etc. I continued this until 2001 and then brought it out in the open because another half brother was inappropriate in a situation (for legal reasons I need to be careful what I say here) so I came out with it then. My mother / father / sisters wanted to me to be quiet, I was even assaulted for talking about it and confronting the situation. I then went back to eventually playing happy families until my sister committed suicide. At first I had hoped someone in the family would talk but they didn't. After an incident about two years later I knew I had to report my half brother to the social services. I did it knowing I would lose my entire family. That is the reality that faces many, many people who do this. It is why so many people who are abused by family members don't report things and don't rock the boat and play the let's pretend to play happy families. The horror of the situation is too much and my God the loneliness can be crippling.

I know from an outside perspective it is very hard to understand why people are friendly / loving to their abusers, IMHO its because they are in denial but also because in a weird way they love that person. I deeply love my family, despite all the dysfunction, the ugliness and what happened. They are my family and I keep away for my help and my child's health but I miss them and I feel lost without them. It is a terrible price to pay for doing the right thing so go easy on those who don't.

It is for the same reason that reporting is so hard, again, you are reporting against your own. Anger can help you but you also need huge amounts of energy and yet most people surviving abuse struggle with day to day stuff let alone something like this. I know I could only do it because of help via counselling but this is a massive undertaking. I do get frustrated with the black and white thinking of 'just report them'. It is not that straight forward plus in my experience I have had an uphill struggle with social services, the guards and one in four, I had to keep pushing them which is crazy. I would like to see the same support offered to those raped / abused by family or friends as there is for those abused by the church. I would also like to see the same public outrage too.

Finally societal views, there is beautiful support in this thread and it appears to me that it is the first time people can really talk. The times I have brought up my past both men and women have either not wanted to hear by saying 'ah you'll be alright' or 'your grand now, don't let it bother you' ffs as if!!!! Occasionally some people are hostile, they do not want to think about it or discuss, especially those people we like and love as mentioned in this thread. One female 'friend' who knew what my half brother did told me she fancied him and thought he was good looking. I could go on about the shocking responses I have received but things are getting better nowadays thankfully.

LegacyUser

I would like to sincerely thank each and every one of you who has contributed to this thread.

I recently had an incident, and while it is no where near as serious as most of the stories told here, it has affected me in a bad way.I cant stop thinking about it and I feel completely disgusted by my so called "friend" who was inappropriate to me.

The funny thing is I had been reading this thread before it happened and had I not read the stories here I wouldn't have considered it sexual assault. At most, I would have been like ugh its a bit weird, but I now realise that it is more than that.