How many Irish would make a Lions Team/Squad right now?

Swiwi

GerM wrote: »

Shanklin was a very competent player. Bit of a poor man's Conrad Smith. Not flashy but very effective. Did it simple, hit hard, ran straight and made very few errors. When BOD was off the boil in 2007 and 2008 and the world and its mother was writing him off, Shanklin was probably a better option.

Not saying Shanklin wasn't decent, but as the Lions tour showed, the combination of Roberts/BOD was world-class.

Swiwi

Blackheath wrote: »

There are 3 or 4 No.7's that are better than Robshaw

O'Brien
Warbutton
Tupiric
Rennie

He won't even travel

I think Robshaw's a bit under-rated. Not saying he will or should be selected, but he had a good first test in SA.

Swiwi

cgpg5 wrote: »

I'd have Haskell/Wood ahead of him for England alone even though neither is a natural o/s. Oh and ARmitage

Don't rate Haskell, he wasn't an automatic starting choice for Highlanders, and he usually gives away a stupid penalty or knock-on at a crucial moment.

cgpg5

Swiwi wrote: »

Don't rate Haskell, he wasn't an automatic starting choice for Highlanders, and he usually gives away a stupid penalty or knock-on at a crucial moment.

Had a good world cup though and defended brilliantly on Sat. Essentially has been very good in his last few English performances. I do agree though can be very ill-disciplined and mistake prone. I'd have Hask 3rd in pecking order for 7 though, Robshaw 4th. Don't rate him one bit, he's not even Quins' best back-rower

.ak

I really like the look of the Dellagio squad... except Healy for Jenkins..

Swiwi

cgpg5 wrote: »

Had a good world cup though and defended brilliantly on Sat. Essentially has been very good in his last few English performances. I do agree though can be very ill-disciplined and mistake prone. I'd have Hask 3rd in pecking order for 7 though, Robshaw 4th. Don't rate him one bit, he's not even Quins' best back-rower

You're probably right - if he can get thru the 6N error-free and not get yellow-carded at crucial moments, then he probably will deserve a look. He probably covers 6&7, so that could be useful.

GerM

Swiwi wrote: »

You're probably right - if he can get thru the 6N error-free and not get yellow-carded at crucial moments, then he probably will deserve a look. He probably covers 6&7, so that could be useful.

Can do a job at 8 too. 9 of his 43 caps have come there.

cgpg5

Would love see Johnson/Croft, Armitage and Waldron back row for England in 6n but won't happen...

Swiwi

matthew8 wrote: »

Well I doubt it damages Heaslip's, Ferris', Bowe's and POC's credentials, while SOB and Healy played awesomely in the first 2 test so this tour is a positive for their credentials. Kearney is the best attacking and fielding FB in the NH but the defensive doubts remain. I still think he's the best option. The only player who I would say is seriously damaged is BOD. For Sexton, there really is little quality elsewhere so today's poor performance will be a very distant memory next year. Best is immense. My only worry is that Gatland could have an anti-Irish bias after being fired. A sleeper pick could be D'Arcy. I like what I've been seeing lately, and I think Gatland liked D'Arcy from the beginning. The Lions team will be decided on next season, not this tour. If we're going by this tour, the team should be made up mostly of English/Scottish players, even though I would just have 2 English/Scottish players in my team.

BOD had an awful test match. But he had a super HC final, and he has credit in the bank, so if he picks it up in 6N he will be in with a good chance. As many said, he seemed to be trying too hard. Number 10 is potentially problematic for the Lions. Sexton is good with a dominant forward pack, but I have doubts about his ability to change a game when the team is on the backfoot. Not that Australia have a settled choice. Barnes is solid but not spectacular, Cooper is a defensive liability, and JOC/Beale have not been properly tried. Darcy is not for me. I was pleasantly surprised by his defence in Chch, but he really offers nothing in attack. Could be an option if the Lions want to play 10-man football, but with players like George North, why would you?

.ak

Swiwi wrote: »

Sexton is good with a dominant forward pack, but I have doubts about his ability to change a game when the team is on the backfoot.

2011 HEC final disagrees with you.

Swiwi

.ak wrote: »

2011 HEC final disagrees with you.

Test match in the weekend doesn't

Tox56

Robshaw isn't a bad player and he gets through a mountain of work, but his tackling isn't as powerful as Haskell.

He makes dozens of tackles but against SA he rarely if ever stopped his man in his tracks, Haskell went low and hard and that made a difference.

For the Lions he has too many backrowers ahead of him.

Swiwi

Swiwi wrote: »

Test match in the weekend doesn't

from what it sounds like, we could've had Carter at 10 and still been whalloped.

Swiwi

Podge_irl wrote: »

Pretty sure this was at the start of the tour Ger, If not during it. It was pure trolling. It was during one of the round table things, the others even called him out on his stupidity (particularly Guscott if I remember correctly).

This is my point - why does he get invited to these round table things? I mean you get genuine English legends like Guscott, Dallagio etc, and then a Welsh journalist?! I think journalists and experts should be kept apart. Just like it's ridiculous when a current, but injured, player gets on the TV commentary panel - he will hardly be objective about his team-mates.

rero

Swiwi wrote: »

Not out of the reckoning, but not an automatic starting choice. Halfpenny is a very reliable player, and his ability to consistently kick long-distance penalties is a huge asset.
.

...and foden is clearly better in defense and attacking with ball in hand than both of them.

dtpc191991

Surley wrote: »

my outsider choice for the back row is Dom Ryan. Think he'll crack on next season after the injury affected season he just had.

He'll find it very difficult to start in big games for Leinster with the way SOB's been playing.

profitius

Is it good for Irish rugby to hve many players away with the Lions? Personally I'd prefer them to have a summer off.

mar-z

profitius wrote: »

Is it good for Irish rugby to hve many players away with the Lions? Personally I'd prefer them to have a summer off.

If they have the summer off, they will probably tour with Ireland resulting in even less looking at new players than we already see.

Although if actually given a rest for the summer it would be good for fitness and some of the players but might dent one or two players confidence (alternatively could encourage them to perform better).

thomond2006

profitius wrote: »

Is it good for Irish rugby to hve many players away with the Lions? Personally I'd prefer them to have a summer off.

No way, Lions Tours are awesome and the players make plenty €€€s too.

GerM

Whilst I love the Lions tours and they’re a great spectacle, I think there is a strong argument for them taking a lot out of the players. I always want to see Irish players on it but those that have the summer off would benefit far more. It’s no coincidence that all the provinces ended the 2009/10 season empty handed after supplying a large number of Lions. Yes, Leinster and Munster reached the semi finals of the HEC but neither did in very impressive fashion. Leinster looked very jaded losing at home and drawing away to LI. Munster were hit and miss in their group too before going out to Biarritz and looking completely shattered.

The way the WC and three match tour of NZ has panned out means the players on the Lions tour are going to have a serious run of rugby from last August to next August with a few weeks off this summer only. I realise the players are excellently looked after and don’t play many games but that doesn’t take into account mental fatigue and motivation which becomes harder and harder as the months go on. The more mundance and repetitive these trips become, the harder it becomes to deliver. These guys have already spent 2 of the last 9 months in NZ, living in hotels along with long HEC campaigns and the 6N. If we’ve a significant contingent in Australia next year, I can see the following season being another lean one.

pickarooney

thomond2006 wrote: »

Stephen Jones picking Monye... I lol'd. I think he needs to watch the 2009 1st test again. Then again it's not his typical bias given that he's left out Ashton.

Otherwise not much to complain about, a lot of quality players didn't get a mention there like Tipuric.

It's interesting that Barnes put Halfpenny on the wing in his team, his long range kicking would be very useful so it might make sense to have him on the field somewhere.

With Jenkins going to Toulon next year, he'll be seriously tested scrummaging wise in the Top14. The battle for the number 1 shirt between himself and Healy will be interesting, I wouldn't be against Jenkins starting ahead of Healy tbh, top class player.

Of the 3 pundits' teams, the players that got into all of the teams were Gray, Sexton, North and Kearney. At the moment I think that all of them would start alright.

I'm pretty sure Halfpenny was all of these pundits' first-choice at full-back at the end of the six nations. Were they swayed by Kearney's performances in the last games of the H Cup or did they let his player of the year award change their minds?

DATABOY

My test team:

1. Cian Healy (Ire)
2. Rory Best (Ire)
3. Dan Cole (Eng)
4. Richie Gray (Sco)
5. Ian Henderson (Ire)
6. Stephen Ferris (Ire)
7. Sam Warburton (Wal) (c)
8. Sean O'Brien (Ire)

9. Ben Youngs (Eng)
10. Jonathon Sexton (Ire)
12. Manu Tuilagi (Eng)
13. BOD (Ire)
11. George North (Wal)
14. Stuart Hogg (Sco)
15. Rob Kearney (Ire)

Ciaran-Irl

DATABOY wrote: »

My test team:

1. Cian Healy (Ire)
2. Rory Best (Ire)
3. Dan Cole (Eng)
4. Richie Gray (Sco)
5. Ian Henderson (Ire)
6. Stephen Ferris (Ire)
7. Sam Warburton (Wal) (c)
8. Sean O'Brien (Ire)

9. Ben Youngs (Eng)
10. Jonathon Sexton (Ire)
12. Manu Tuilagi (Eng)
13. BOD (Ire)
11. George North (Wal)
14. Stuart Hogg (Sco)
15. Rob Kearney (Ire)

Nice selection Ian.

WeeBushy

DATABOY wrote: »

My test team:

1. Cian Healy (Ire)
2. Rory Best (Ire)
3. Dan Cole (Eng)
4. Richie Gray (Sco)
5. Ian Henderson (Ire)
6. Stephen Ferris (Ire)
7. Sam Warburton (Wal) (c)
8. Sean O'Brien (Ire)

9. Ben Youngs (Eng)
10. Jonathon Sexton (Ire)
12. Manu Tuilagi (Eng)
13. BOD (Ire)
11. George North (Wal)
14. Stuart Hogg (Sco)
15. Rob Kearney (Ire)

Henderson won't be starting for Ulster next season, let alone Ireland, let alone the Lions.

Taco Corp

WeeBushy wrote: »

DATABOY wrote: »

My test team:

1. Cian Healy (Ire)
2. Rory Best (Ire)
3. Dan Cole (Eng)
4. Richie Gray (Sco)
5. Ian Henderson (Ire)
6. Stephen Ferris (Ire)
7. Sam Warburton (Wal) (c)
8. Sean O'Brien (Ire)

9. Ben Youngs (Eng)
10. Jonathon Sexton (Ire)
12. Manu Tuilagi (Eng)
13. BOD (Ire)
11. George North (Wal)
14. Stuart Hogg (Sco)
15. Rob Kearney (Ire)

Henderson won't be starting for Ulster next season, let alone Ireland, let alone the Lions.

Never know. How many caps did Earls have when he got the call in 2009?

Tox56

Captain_Hindsight wrote: »

Never know. How many caps did Earls have when he got the call in 2009?

More than Henderson who, barring the most incredible injury crisis in the history of the world, will not have played for Ireland all.

Earls was playing winger (or at least in the backline), where his age and size was less important. In the second row it is vital, and it will take him a few years to become comfortable at that level.

He was struggling with the pace and physicality in a Rabo game v Munster, he will be doing well to get some HEC gametime nevermind international gametime.

cgpg5

Henderson won't even be in the top 20 in the pecking order for 2nd row! It is a help to start for your club team

matthew8

Tox56 wrote: »

More than Henderson who, barring the most incredible injury crisis in the history of the world, will not have played for Ireland all.

"Henderson called up as bizarre over 20 second-row party bus crashes".

cgpg5

matthew8 wrote: »

"Henderson called up as bizarre over 20 second-row party bus crashes".

Rob Henderson has a better chance of making the test team

desertcircus

Captain_Hindsight wrote: »

Never know. How many caps did Earls have when he got the call in 2009?

The fact that player A managed something very rare tells you absolutely nothing about whether player B will manage the same. Especially when player B is behind Muller and Tuohy at provincial level, Tuohy, Ryan, POC, McCarthy, Toner, and possibly Caldwell at national level, and the likes of Lawes, Gray and Charteris at Lions level.