How many Irish would make a Lions Team/Squad right now?

cgpg5

thomond2006 wrote: »

The depth the Lions will have in the back 3 is incredible. Kearney, Halfpenny and Foden to choose from for fullback! Plus Hogg is a bolter but he might be converted to 13 (destroyed Munster a few weeks ago playing there).

A potential weakness is at scrumhalf, Phillips is annoyingly inconsistent. Hopefully Youngs can cut out his attitude problem and get back his old form, really talented player.

Care you mean? Rate him very highly. Got the recall for England too

thomond2006

cgpg5 wrote: »

Care you mean? Rate him very highly. Got the recall for England too

Meant Youngs but it applies to Care too!

thomond2006

Going by 2009, the breakdown of the orginal 37 man squad was:

3 Hookers
5 Props
5 Locks
8 Backrows

3 Scrumhalves
2 Flyhalves (subsequently became 3 when Hook was called up)
12 outside backs (in this case it was 5 centres, 5 wingers and 2 specialist fullbacks)

So going by that template, aside from taking a 3rd 10, this would be my pick based on right now.

(Underlined applies to a player that toured in 2009)

FORWARDS (20)

Hookers: Hartley, Best, Ford

Props: Healy, Jenkins, Jones, Cole, Ross

Locks: Gray, O'Connell, Wyn-Jones, Evans, Tuohy

Flankers: Ferris, Lydiate, O'Brien, Armitage, Warburton, (Tipuric will probably go but I can't leave out Armitage!)

Number 8s: Heaslip, Denton, Faletau

BACKS (17)

Scrumhalves: Phillips, Youngs, Murray/Reddan

Flyhalves: Sexton, Farrell, Biggar (Laidlaw could well sneek in here as he can also play 9)

Centres: Roberts, Hogg, Tuilagi, O'Driscoll, Davies (too many 13s, hopefully a 12 steps up in the next 12 months!)

Wingers: North, Bowe, Cuthbert, Ashton

Fullbacks: Kearney, Foden, Halfpenny

Team (assuming 23 man squads are implemented following the trial):
Healy, Best, Jones, Gray, POC, Ferris, Armitage*, Heaslip;
Phillips, Sexton, North, Roberts, BOD, Bowe, Kearney

Bench: Hartley, Jenkins, Cole, Wyn-Jones, Warburton, Youngs, Farrell, Foden

*Yes, I'm serious! He's my bolter 10 months or so from the announcement of the squad. He is playing ridiculously well for Toulon and running riot in the Top14. However he'll need to get back into the England picture to get recognised for this. With the RFU policy against picking non-England domicile players, Armitage mightn't get a look in. However he is playing so well, he has to get picked!

Tox56

Would love to see the BOD-Roberts partnership brought back together, hopefully they are both fit.

CatFromHue

Another thing that will work against Armitage is that the first Lions game is on 1 June in Hong Kong. If Toulon get in the play offs in the Top 14 will he get released for the tour at all!

Hype710

Kearney, Bowe, O’ Driscoll, Davies, North, Sexton, Philips, Healy, Best, Jones, Gray, O’ Connell, Ferris, Tipuric, O’ Brien.

Hartley, Jenkins, Cole, Jones, Warburton, Youngs, Farrell, Hogg.

totallegend

CatFromHue wrote: »

Another thing that will work against Armitage is that the first Lions game is on 1 June in Hong Kong. If Toulon get in the play offs in the Top 14 will he get released for the tour at all!

Nathan Hines walked out on Perpignan's playoffs to go on the 2009 tour so it is possible but not sure how welcome Armitage would be Chez Boujdellal the following season...

cgpg5

Armitage had some season that's unquestionable. However I couldn't leave out Warburton.

Kearney; North, BOD, Roberts, Cuthbert; Sexton, Phillipps; Jenkins, Best, A. Jones; Poc, Gray; Ferris, Warburton (c), Haven't my mind made up on 8 yet

twinytwo

thomond2006 wrote: »

Going by 2009, the breakdown of the orginal 37 man squad was:

3 Hookers
5 Props
5 Locks
8 Backrows

3 Scrumhalves
2 Flyhalves (subsequently became 3 when Hook was called up)
12 outside backs (in this case it was 5 centres, 5 wingers and 2 specialist fullbacks)

So going by that template, aside from taking a 3rd 10, this would be my pick based on right now.

(Underlined applies to a player that toured in 2009)

FORWARDS (20)

Hookers: Hartley, Best, Ford

Props: Healy, Jenkins, Jones, Cole, Ross

Locks: Gray, O'Connell, Wyn-Jones, Evans, Tuohy

Flankers: Ferris, Lydiate, O'Brien, Armitage, Warburton, (Tipuric will probably go but I can't leave out Armitage!)

Number 8s: Heaslip, Denton, Faletau

BACKS (17)

Scrumhalves: Phillips, Youngs, Murray/Reddan

Flyhalves: Sexton, Farrell, Biggar (Laidlaw could well sneek in here as he can also play 9)

Centres: Roberts, Hogg, Tuilagi, O'Driscoll, Davies (too many 13s, hopefully a 12 steps up in the next 12 months!)

Wingers: North, Bowe, Cuthbert, Ashton

Fullbacks: Kearney, Foden, Halfpenny

Team (assuming 23 man squads are implemented following the trial):
Healy, Best, Jones, Gray, POC, Ferris, Armitage*, Heaslip;
Phillips, Sexton, North, Roberts, BOD, Bowe, Kearney

Bench: Hartley, Jenkins, Cole, Wyn-Jones, Warburton, Youngs, Farrell, Foden

*Yes, I'm serious! He's my bolter 10 months or so from the announcement of the squad. He is playing ridiculously well for Toulon and running riot in the Top14. However he'll need to get back into the England picture to get recognised for this. With the RFU policy against picking non-England domicile players, Armitage mightn't get a look in. However he is playing so well, he has to get picked!

While i like the team, there will be at least 1 english player starting or there will be untold war. Even though its comical, i could see them picking ashton instead of bowe just to have him there.

Fishooks12

I wouldn't have Ashton anywhere near the squad

Cuthbert, North, Bowe, Earls, Visser, Bowe, Luke Fitz all better wingers IMO

matthew8

twinytwo wrote: »

While i like the team, there will be at least 1 english player starting or there will be untold war. Even though its comical, i could see them picking ashton instead of bowe just to have him there.

I think the English props are making a good case for themselves,

ambid

twinytwo wrote: »

While i like the team, there will be at least 1 english player starting or there will be untold war. Even though its comical, i could see them picking ashton instead of bowe just to have him there.

Is Armitage not English? You're right that he's not a current international.

[Jackass]

Irish Lions (imo) will be:

Healy, Best, O'Connell, O'Brien, Heaslip, Ferris, Sexton, Kearney

Possibles: Ross, Ryan, O'Driscoll, Earls, Bowe

Really depends on what size sqaud he wants to bring though.

Benny Cake

thomond2006 wrote: »

Scrumhalves: Phillips, Youngs, Murray/Reddan

Come on Thomond, get off the fence.... Murray or Reddan??

Murray for me FYI...

cgpg5

Ashton is a decent finisher but his all round game pales in comparison to North/Bowe/Cuthbert/Fitz. Wouldn't have him on the plane.

I think if Morgan has a good 6n next year he's in with a great shout for 8.

thomond2006

Benny Cake wrote: »

Come on Thomond, get off the fence.... Murray or Reddan??

Murray for me FYI...

depends who is starting for Ireland at the time, I've no preference really since neither will start ahead of Phillips

Hype710

I doubt there'll be an Irish scrum half on the plane.

sock puppet

Hype710 wrote: »

I doubt there'll be an Irish scrum half on the plane.

I hope not. Very much doubt Ross will make it too. Corbisiero can cover tighthead if needed.

Fishooks12

sock puppet wrote: »

I hope not. Very much doubt Ross will make it too. Corbisiero can cover tighthead if needed.

Why not?

sock puppet

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Why not?

They're not very good. Dickson, Williams and Webb are far better.

Fishooks12

Fair enough, bit unfair to Reddan maybe


Any thoughts on how the test series will go? I think at the minute we'd tear that Oz team apart physically

cgpg5

sock puppet wrote: »

They're not very good. Dickson, Williams and Webb are far better.

He'll be Eng third choice I'd imagine come that time

Hype710

The Aussies will have pretty poor depth; we saw what happened when they lost key men in the World Cup against us. The Lions will have quality replacements in nearly every position around the park so I'd predict an overall Lions test victory.

sock puppet

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Fair enough, bit unfair to Reddan maybe


Any thoughts on how the test series will go? I think at the minute we'd tear that Oz team apart physically

Maybe. To be honest I don't watch much English club rugby so mainly going on what I've seen of Dickson for in the Six Nations.

I'd be hopeful enough for a series win. I'd wait to see how Palmer, Pyle and Timani develop before writing them off. With a fit Horwill and Robinson (unlikely) they could have a good tight five.

thomond2006

Hype710 wrote: »

The Aussies will have pretty poor depth; we saw what happened when they lost key men in the World Cup against us. The Lions will have quality replacements in nearly every position around the park so I'd predict an overall Lions test victory.

this

Normally the Lions meet a team in form (1997: SA were RWC champions, 2001: Oz were RWC champions, 2005: ABs were simply awesome, 2009: SA were RWC champions), this may not be the case this time.

WeeBushy

Benny Cake wrote: »

Come on Thomond, get off the fence.... Murray or Reddan??

Murray for me FYI...

Phillips is almost certainly going to be first choice. Having Youngs or Reddan to come off the bench offer much more variety than Murray to Phillips but not as good.

thomond2006 wrote: »

this

Normally the Lions meet a team in form (1997: SA were RWC champions, 2001: Oz were RWC champions, 2005: ABs were simply awesome, 2009: SA were RWC champions), this may not be the case this time.

Incredible how its worked out that way. Looks like our best chance in a long while

Fireball07

thomond2006 wrote: »

Going by 2009, the breakdown of the orginal 37 man squad was:

3 Hookers
5 Props
5 Locks
8 Backrows

3 Scrumhalves
2 Flyhalves (subsequently became 3 when Hook was called up)
12 outside backs (in this case it was 5 centres, 5 wingers and 2 specialist fullbacks)

So going by that template, aside from taking a 3rd 10, this would be my pick based on right now.

(Underlined applies to a player that toured in 2009)

FORWARDS (20)

Hookers: Hartley, Best, Ford

Props: Healy, Jenkins, Jones, Cole, Ross

Locks: Gray, O'Connell, Wyn-Jones, Evans, Tuohy

Flankers: Ferris, Lydiate, O'Brien, Armitage, Warburton, (Tipuric will probably go but I can't leave out Armitage!)

Number 8s: Heaslip, Denton, Faletau

BACKS (17)

Scrumhalves: Phillips, Youngs, Murray/Reddan

Flyhalves: Sexton, Farrell, Biggar (Laidlaw could well sneek in here as he can also play 9)

Centres: Roberts, Hogg, Tuilagi, O'Driscoll, Davies (too many 13s, hopefully a 12 steps up in the next 12 months!)

Wingers: North, Bowe, Cuthbert, Ashton

Fullbacks: Kearney, Foden, Halfpenny

Team (assuming 23 man squads are implemented following the trial):
Healy, Best, Jones, Gray, POC, Ferris, Armitage*, Heaslip;
Phillips, Sexton, North, Roberts, BOD, Bowe, Kearney

Bench: Hartley, Jenkins, Cole, Wyn-Jones, Warburton, Youngs, Farrell, Foden

*Yes, I'm serious! He's my bolter 10 months or so from the announcement of the squad. He is playing ridiculously well for Toulon and running riot in the Top14. However he'll need to get back into the England picture to get recognised for this. With the RFU policy against picking non-England domicile players, Armitage mightn't get a look in. However he is playing so well, he has to get picked!

You forgot ROG


But no, I'd say it's very unlikely that Ross will go. He's decent but not class, I'd expect someone like Corbisiero to go ahead of him. Personally, I'd take Ryan over Tuohy/Evans aswell.

And is there really a need for 3 No. 8's?? Especially when you've got SOB. Denton is good but Rennie is the real star in that Scottish backrow imo, and Tipuric is class too.

Scrum-half is obviously the weak area, I really hope Murray steps up his game in the next year or someone does.

And I'd also take Earls over Ashton, his versatility aswell as his obvious skill makes him a better option too. Of the players you named, only Hogg offers the same versatility as Earls really, although Halfpenny/Bowe would be a good bench option too.


And tbqh, I don't think Bowe is a nailed-on starter at all.

WeeBushy wrote: »

Phillips is almost certainly going to be first choice. Having Youngs or Reddan to come off the bench offer much more variety than Murray to Phillips but not as good.

If Phillips starts at 9 for the Lions, I'll cry.

Most overrated player in Europe atm, he's been poor at international level for a couple of years now.

Podge_irl

Fireball07 wrote: »

If Phillips starts at 9 for the Lions, I'll cry.

1. He will, not least because Gatland is in charge

2. Who is better? There is an appalling lack of good scrum halves in Europe at the moment.

All of the options have obvious problems, be that Youngs, Care, Reddan or Phillips. I have no idea what has happened to Blair.

Fishooks12

Considering the back line talent we have I'd prefer someone like Reddan or Youngs

We'll have enough physical presence without Phillips

WinnyThePoo

I think Phillips will be first choice at scrum half
other options:
Blair
Care
Youngs
Williams/Webb
Reddan
Murray

?

Not sure ..Youngs if he improves, had a fairly normal/poor/indifferent season(could be wrong, only saw him play 5 or 6 times for leicester) , still I think he can surpass Phillips.

The Reddan situation disgusts me,clearly he should be ahead of Murray..CLEARLY for Ireland , actually makes me so angry ..nothing against Murray, but Reddan is better and should be starting for Ireland at mo..and that wont happen in NZ this summer:(.,
Pretty drunk.