LED lighting General discussion, read here before posting a question.

Mr Digger

vibe666 wrote: »

i have 2 in the front room embedded into the mantelpiece above the fireplace uplighting onto a built in mirror on the wall (the landlord really likes his lights! ) which i'll definitely need to swap out like for like, but there's also about 8-10 of them downlighting under the kitchen units onto the work surfaces, so i was thinking of just replacing them with a roll of LED tape hidden along the underside of the units along the lines of this stuff: http://www.ledtape.co/ just to create a bit of uniform ambient light from under the units.

pricey at ~£5 per 30cm...... I wonder if they are the same as these which include the transformer. :rolleyes:

vibe666

Mr Digger wrote: »

pricey at ~£5 per 30cm...... I wonder if they are the same as these which include the transformer. :rolleyes:

i wasn't specifically meaning that one, just something like it. they were just the first google result.

Mr Digger

It is a good idea though, and effective, see my messy shelving above my desk..

vicwatson

vibe666 wrote: »

just bought 10 of the Phillips Master MV 4W GU10's at Eurosales in the Dublin business park near Glasnevin cemetery for €8.50 +VAT each (just as a member of the public, not trade), so i'm a happy bunny.

will try them this evening in the kitchen and dining room to see what they're like and how they compare to the exiting 50W halogens and post back.

I just found a usage calculator on the ESB website here: https://www.esb.ie/esbcustomersupply/residential-energy-services/reduce-your-costs/web-calculator.jsp

according to that, 10 50W Halogen bulbs running for an average of 40 hours a week will cost €25.62 per 2 monthly billing cycle to run. :eek:

i've got dozens of the feckers in the house! :mad:

I didn't see an option for LED bulbs, but I'm assuming 4W is the same regardless of what type of bulb you're talking about, so I changed the wattage on the calculator to 4W and the price for 40 hours usage per 2 months drops to just €2.05!

so assuming that usage is reasonably accurate, they will have more or less paid for themselves in about 8 months, not to mention i won't have to change them every few months like the halogens due to them overheating.

will try them this evening in the kitchen and dining room to see what they're like and how they compare to the exiting 50W halogens and post back.

Vibes, how did you get on with these?

Is the 4W close to/as good as the 50W halogen ?

Can you buy these in Warm White and Cool White ?

Had they many over in Eurosales?

Thanks in advance

freddyuk

Interestingly Phillips use the term "Luminous Intensity" to determine how much light their bulbs give off whereas most other manufacturers I have come across use "Luminous Flux". If you want to investigate be prepared to be confused as it is a very confusing subject and quite subjective as it relates to the light you can see as much as what light is given off.
As far as I can work out Phillips are playing a game using the "better" definition to sell their lamps.
17 Lumens per watt is the basic standard so a 100 watt incandescent bulb gives off 1700 lumens. A 3w LED at 320 lumens (flux) gives off equivalent 96 watts.
Check the lumens flux to compare apples and apples before you buy your LED's.
If you stand under a directional bulb it will look very bright and that - I think - is what Phillips use as a measure.
Lumens flux is the total light emitted not looking straight up the barrel as it were. Anyone?

Steve

OK crappy photo I know but it's hard to compare-- the outer two are Philips LED's, the inner two are halogen. There's feck all difference.

I'm delighted with them.

vibe666

vicwatson wrote: »

Vibes, how did you get on with these?

Is the 4W close to/as good as the 50W halogen ?

Can you buy these in Warm White and Cool White ?

Had they many over in Eurosales?

Thanks in advance

great so far, very happy with them.

they are definitely whiter than my halogens were, but it's still (imho) more of a warm white than cool white, as the halogens were pretty yellow, particularly when dimmed.

eurosales have heaps of them (afaik the guy said 700+ in stock when i asked).

output wise, i'd say they are a little less powerful than the halogens but i think the whiter light compensates for most of that and i can't even tell the difference now.

i fully intend to buy a box of 10 per month and gradually phase out all the halogens in the house completely.

Cushtie

paddy147 wrote: »

Voila.

paddy147 do you know if those ones from Eurosales at €8.50 + vat are:

MASTER LEDspotMV 4-35W GU10 2700K 25D

OR

MASTER LEDspotMV 4-35W GU10 2700K 40D

also have you any idea if Eurosales would post out a box of 10?

I was also looking at these. any one used them?

http://www.ledvista.ie/philips-consumer-led-lighting/led-light-bulbs-philips/led-gu10-spot-lamps-220-240v/myvision-led-spot-4w-35w-gu10?cPath=2_128_144


thanks

vibe666

i threw all my boxes out, but i'll check the bulbs themselves when i go downstairs.

paddy147

Cushtie wrote: »

paddy147 do you know if those ones from Eurosales at €8.50 + vat are:

MASTER LEDspotMV 4-35W GU10 2700K 25D

OR

MASTER LEDspotMV 4-35W GU10 2700K 40D

also have you any idea if Eurosales would post out a box of 10?

I was also looking at these. any one used them?

http://www.ledvista.ie/philips-consumer-led-lighting/led-light-bulbs-philips/led-gu10-spot-lamps-220-240v/myvision-led-spot-4w-35w-gu10?cPath=2_128_144


thanks

I bought the 40D...which is a wider beam angle.:)

I dont know if Eurosales would post items out.

Ring them in the morning and ask them.

Cushtie

paddy147 wrote: »

I bought the 40D...which is a wider beam angle.:)

I dont know if Eurosales would post items out.

Ring them in the morning and ask them.

thank you sir!! will give them a shout tomorrow and see if they will post me out a box of 10.

vicwatson

they are definitely whiter than my halogens were, but it's still (imho) more of a warm white than cool white, as the halogens were pretty yellow, particularly when dimmed.

Did you buy them in Warm White or Cool White ?

vibe666

vicwatson wrote: »

Did you buy them in Warm White or Cool White ?

warm white i think. not 100% sure if they gave me a choice (the old grey matter isn't what it used to be), but if they did give me one i'd have gone for the warm ones.

vicwatson

Cushtie wrote: »

thank you sir!! will give them a shout tomorrow and see if they will post me out a box of 10.

How'd ya get on Cushtie?, mate of mine says Eurosales haven't got any for a few more weeks, they should just buy truck loads in !!

vibe666

vicwatson wrote: »

How'd ya get on Cushtie?, mate of mine says Eurosales haven't got any for a few more weeks, they should just buy truck loads in !!

I went to the one in Glasnevin a few weeks back to get mine and at the time they said they had over 700 in stock, so they must be going through a rake of them if there's none left now.

paddy147

vibe666 wrote: »

I went to the one in Glasnevin a few weeks back to get mine and at the time they said they had over 700 in stock, so they must be going through a rake of them if there's none left now.

Electricians are buying up loads of them.;)

vicwatson

paddy147 wrote: »

Electricians are buying up loads of them.;)

Jaysus.. demand for a product....in Ireland, quick phone the Taoiseach's office :D

Eurosales really should order a massive big heap of these if they keep selling out...

Cushtie

vicwatson wrote: »

How'd ya get on Cushtie?, mate of mine says Eurosales haven't got any for a few more weeks, they should just buy truck loads in !!

sorry just saw this now.

I never got around to giving them a shout last week, will try them this week now.

garbanzo

Great thread folks, thanks a mill. I have these halogen bulbs all over my house too. There's 12 of the 50w GU10's in the kitchen ceiling alone. Originally I started changing to the Phillips ones which Tesco sell for €7.99 thinking I was doing well. They are 50W but use 35W.

I happened to be near a local electric shop and they recommended me a Greenlamp 3W LED which is equivalent to 50W. It cost me €9. I have started to change over to these as the bulbs go, By my reckoning I will have brought 600w down to 420W and eventually down to 36w which is a real no brainer. Not dimmable but that's not an issue for me. Website below. No affiliation with them.

http://www.greenlamp.ie/

vicwatson

Cushtie wrote: »

sorry just saw this now.

I never got around to giving them a shout last week, will try them this week now.

Sure lets know if you don't mind

vibe666

garbanzo wrote: »

Great thread folks, thanks a mill. I have these halogen bulbs all over my house too. There's 12 of the 50w GU10's in the kitchen ceiling alone. Originally I started changing to the Phillips ones which Tesco sell for €7.99 thinking I was doing well. They are 50W but use 35W.

I happened to be near a local electric shop and they recommended me a Greenlamp 3W LED which is equivalent to 50W. It cost me €9. I have started to change over to these as the bulbs go, By my reckoning I will have brought 600w down to 420W and eventually down to 36w which is a real no brainer. Not dimmable but that's not an issue for me. Website below. No affiliation with them.

http://www.greenlamp.ie/

its not just the watts you use either, the halogens produce a lot of heat which can rise to dangerous levels if the ceiling above them isn't properly protected, but even if it is, the heat will then build up and most likely reduce the life of the halogens so it's a catch 22.

by contrast, the phillips master bulbs i'm using now are still only slightly warmer than the ambient temp, even after several hours use so you know that almost all of the small amount of electricity you put into them is generating light rather than heat, unlike the halogens were.

fair enough, the LED ones cost probably double what a decent halogen would, but after the 1st halogen has blown and you've replaced it with a new one, that's the price of an LED bulb right there.

unfortunately, my LED bulb budget has disappeared as my wife is going to take extended unpaid maternity leave now as our baby hasn't been well, AND there's a freeze on overtime at my work for the next couple of months (bloody typical, just when i need it most!) so the purse strings have been tightened considerably until she's back working in june or july.

hunglikeaflee

garbanzo wrote: »

Great thread folks, thanks a mill. I have these halogen bulbs all over my house too. There's 12 of the 50w GU10's in the kitchen ceiling alone. Originally I started changing to the Phillips ones which Tesco sell for €7.99 thinking I was doing well. They are 50W but use 35W.

I happened to be near a local electric shop and they recommended me a Greenlamp 3W LED which is equivalent to 50W. It cost me €9. I have started to change over to these as the bulbs go, By my reckoning I will have brought 600w down to 420W and eventually down to 36w which is a real no brainer. Not dimmable but that's not an issue for me. Website below. No affiliation with them.

http://www.greenlamp.ie/

It is all about being happy with something but be aware, we have tested a lot of lamps and none of the cluster lamps (the cheep 3W LEDs) that we have tested so far including the greenlamp one, have given any more than about 20w compared to 12v MR16 lamps.

These companies get away with saying they are equivalent to a 50w watt because they fit the same fitting not the light output. (I was told this by SEAI) Also be aware our tests have shown that after 1000 hours the output from these lamps has dropped by at least 30%.

As I said it is all about being happy with what you have and for me none of these 3W lamps hit the spot.

Edthehead

I've been involved in LED installations for the last 12 years, (colour changing in Nightclubs and Pubs) about 6 years ago I partnered up with a couple of other guys and started up a Led distribution company. I made three trips out to China to try and source led suppliers. Some of these so called manufacturers were literally a table in a shed with people sitting around it soldering. One of the better ones actually made led's on site, they had a large machine that sorted the white leds by colour temperature, the leds that did not pass the test were dumped into a large bucket. These inferior leds were then sold to the companies with the tables and sheds. Like most of you I have loads of GU10 fittings in my Kitchen, I've tried lots of different led bulbs over the years, and now I have CFL's. (I'm not very happy with these either) My advice is to stay away from clustered led lamps, heat is a led's biggest enemy, and there is a magic temperature figure the led must stay under to ensure long life. The better made led lamps use an aluminium case in order to dissipate heat, this is a good indication that at least an effort is being made to keep the led temp down. The best we supplied were lamps loaded with American made Cree Led's. We supplied and fitted these into shops and Mcdonalds Restaurant's and are still working three years later. (Only problem was these were €18 each at the time, so were hard to sell.)
Its getting close to having to replace the Cfl's in the kitchen again, maybe I'll try out the Philips Led lamps next.

Stoner

+1
Cluster LEDs are not great, the only ones i ever saw to last a decent amount of time were installed outside (against wiring regulations) in a canopy exposed to cold air.
The individual LEDs blow with the heat build up, that's why they stopped putting a glass front on the LED cluster lamps.

I've been running some small home tests for the past 3 months on Aurora and Philips Lamps.
Both are 4Watt , only the Philips can be dimmed. I have a few running at the moment, I heard that the Aurora lamps are not lasting, but so far so good for me, they are slightly less intense (measured) but for me they are less yellow than the Philips, it's a matter of taste I guess. I'm not dimming them, this is a huge advantage for the Philips lamp IMO and in most cases a winning feature.

I also have one Philips and one Aurora running on a PIR in a small circulation area. I understand that this is a small sample size and should not be counted, but for the record anyway both new lamps, on the same PIR and triggered the same amount of times, the Philips lamp only lasted 3 weeks under these conditions. I have not really looked into it beyond this but I just thought I'd share that one.

I think that to match an 11Watt CFL you'd have to go for the 7Watt Philips LED IMHO, very expensive though.

Vote 4 Pedro

Philips Master 4w GU10 Bulbs.
Did any find out if Eurosales do post things out,
The best price i can get so far in Galway is €11.50 Plus vat

vibe666

Vote 4 Pedro wrote: »

Philips Master 4w GU10 Bulbs.
Did any find out if Eurosales do post things out,
The best price i can get so far in Galway is €11.50 Plus vat

ring them and find out.

http://www.eurosales.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=17&Itemid=62

garbanzo

I went into Eurosales down in Ringsend to get a few of these Philips LED bulbs on Friday but..... the €8.50 plus VAT ones are only 35 watt. I wanted to get a few 50 watt ones. They have them but they were something like €16 plus VAT. That's fairly saucy, particularly whenyou have about 32 of the yokes in the house

Vote 4 Pedro

vibe666 wrote: »

ring them and find out.

http://www.eurosales.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=17&Itemid=62

I no to do that but i wanted to know if any one had done it,
eg the postage costs etc.

Steve

Last I heard, Eurosales were waiting for more stock on those, at least another week but they'll still be 8.50 + vat.
Ring them and ask about postage - if you happen to be on a regular delivery route then there may be no charge there.

vibe666

garbanzo wrote: »

I went into Eurosales down in Ringsend to get a few of these Philips LED bulbs on Friday but..... the €8.50 plus VAT ones are only 35 watt. I wanted to get a few 50 watt ones. They have them but they were something like €16 plus VAT. That's fairly saucy, particularly whenyou have about 32 of the yokes in the house

i'd be very surprised if you find that you need more than the 35w ones, unless you have them a long way apart and need the extra power.

i found (in our place at least) that the 4w ones were plenty enough to replace the old 50w halogens in the house.

i've only got 10 so far, but i'm only using them in the kitchen and dining room at the moment (probably the brightest most well lit rooms in the house) and i find that they are still plenty good enough and rarely need to have the dimmer all the way up to full power.

my advice would be to try a few of the 4w ones out before you make up your mind they're not bright enough, i'm sure that even if you do find that they're not up to your needs that there will be other areas of your house that doesn't need to be quite as brightly lit where they will still be sufficient.