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Five arrests in 'slavery' raid at UK [travellers] site

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    #62
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    Does this not count as a crime against humanity or some such? like off to the hague with them to be strung up type job?


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    #63
    bernardo mac
    Registered Users Posts: 903 ✭✭✭bernardo mac


    This news report should prompt authorities here to investigate similar operations here where the labour employed is not just "family".Lots of shrewd lads are involved in tarmacadam,landscaping,scrap,site clearance,insulation etc.Of course much of it may be quite legitimate and a useful service but it would be hoped that the employed,sometimes of foreign origin are insured and receiving, at least, the legal minimum wage


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    #64
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,024 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    Would not expect any less


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    #65
    Gummy Panda
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,920 ✭✭✭✭Gummy Panda


    Fieldies Dreams wrote: »
    Travellers shouldnt be allowed keep dogs never mind slaves.

    But they like dags


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    #66
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    Gummy Panda wrote: »
    But they like dags

    Priests like kids, they still shouldn't be let within an asses roar of them


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    #67
    MajorMax
    Registered Users Posts: 865 ✭✭✭MajorMax


    If anyone thinks this is an isolates incident they are very naive. I guarantee this is going on at other traveller sites in the UK and in Ireland.

    Now that the heat is on and the coppers will be checking other sites there will be a lot of poor feckers getting their throats cut and dumped in unmarked graves


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    #68
    montec
    Registered Users Posts: 141 ✭✭montec


    Hats off then to everyone who voted for the knacker king on Celebrity BB.


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    #69
    charlemont
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    I explained in a previous thread about my fathers house been robbed by travellers, It was done in spite as I helped a guy get away from them, He was in fear so we got him out of Clonmel in the cab of a truck, These clowns even offered me money to say where he was but no can do, Id never sell out a friend, They robbed my house but I got them back where it hurts.


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    #70
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Montec, what does your bigotry have to do with any of this?


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    #71
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    charlemont wrote: »
    I explained in a previous thread about my fathers house been robbed by travellers, It was done in spite as I helped a guy get away from them, He was in fear so we got him out of Clonmel in the cab of a truck, These clowns even offered me money to say where he was but no can do, Id never sell out a friend, They robbed my house but I got them back where it hurts.
    ...and this has, what to do with this disgusting slavery incident exactly?


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    #72
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    charlemont wrote: »
    These clowns even offered me money to say

    Traaveller clowns? Thats the stuff of nightmares :eek:


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    #73
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,295 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    "But in fact some people did leave and told us what was going on and when we looked back since 2008 we were aware of 28 people who had made similar accusations."
    And yet the cops seemed to just leave them there. I know the English police have a bit of a bad rep, but this takes the biscuit!
    Biggins wrote: »
    Pavee Point ? :confused:
    A group that represents travellers. If they trespassed onto your land, Pavee Point would say it's their culture. Same is said when they break most of the laws...
    Billy86 wrote: »
    ...and this has, what to do with this disgusting slavery incident exactly?
    That they hunt anyone down who escapes, and f**ks with anyone who helps the escapees?

    =-=

    Most people in AH know what I think of the travellers. Apart from one group of 5 people that actually travelled, every other "traveller" that I have personally come across never travelled, and deserved to be shipped to a small uninhabited island and left to fend for themselves. The people in Pavee Point should be housed in a small building in the middle of a halting site. It'd be... interesting...


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    #74
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Apologies charlemont, I misread your initial post - the one before just set me off a bit. :o Apologies again, and fair play to you for doing what you did, must have taken some balls!

    EDIT:
    Seriously though, what you wrote below that is appalling though. I can understand you have had particularly bad run-ins with them, but to tar every traveller with the same brush like that is just not on, and will do nothing towards fixing any issues. Also, if I am right on this it is basically impossible for travellers to travel these days due to recent legislature.

    Those who give the travelling community a bad name should in my opinion should be dealt with very, very harshly such is the severity of circumstances that we have come to. But I have dealt with a good number of travellers in my time, and I would wager upwards of 80% of them were perfectly nice and friendly people, and were willing to help me out in isntances where I helped them out also. Which is more than I can say for a good few in the settled còmmunity.


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    #75
    markesmith
    Registered Users Posts: 1,752 ✭✭✭markesmith


    We're all biting our tongues and keeping our powder dry here. This is an atrocious story, and is real fuel for the anti-Traveller brigade. If this is widespread, then it certainly needs to be investigated, and not just in the UK but over here as well.


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    #76
    Elmidena
    Registered Users Posts: 2,570 ✭✭✭Elmidena


    Gypsie refers to when the itinerants were known for being foreign (from Egyptian)
    Tinkers refers to when they were known for being a dab hand at crafting/repairing pots&pans etc.
    The K-word refers to when they were known for being where to send your exhausted farm animals for meat and glue.
    Travellers refers to when they were known for travelling.

    Just because they don't do it so much anymore doesn't stop people using the previous terms to describe them. The slavery is appalling, but I find people's attitudes in here to be worse to a degree. Whatever the current PC term for them are, they're still humans. They're still good people, or bad people. Yeah they had a group of slaves, but a lot of "normal" people have been found guilty of imprisonment or worse over the last number of years. Culture has nothing to do with it. These people are just bad; travellers as a whole are not.


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    #77
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    Twenty-four men suspected of being held against their will have been found during a raid at a travellers' site.
    ...
    but they were told they could not leave and if they did they would be beaten up and attacked.

    You'd think 24 men would say "fcuk this" and fight back.


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    #78
    who the fug
    Registered Users Posts: 4,041 ✭✭✭who the fug


    Billy86 wrote: »
    Apologies charlemont, I misread your initial post - the one before just set me off a bit. :o Apologies again, and fair play to you for doing what you did, must have taken some balls!

    EDIT:
    Seriously though, what you wrote below that is appalling though. I can understand you have had particularly bad run-ins with them, but to tar every traveller with the same brush like that is just not on, and will do nothing towards fixing any issues. Also, if I am right on this it is basically impossible for travellers to travel these days due to recent legislature.

    Those who give the travelling community a bad name should in my opinion should be dealt with very, very harshly such is the severity of circumstances that we have come to. But I have dealt with a good number of travellers in my time, and I would wager upwards of 80% of them were perfectly nice and friendly people, and were willing to help me out in isntances where I helped them out also. Which is more than I can say for a good few in the settled còmmunity.


    Would they have reported these travellers to the cops


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    #79
    ejmaztec
    Registered Users Posts: 23,974 ✭✭✭✭ejmaztec


    smash wrote: »
    You'd think 24 men would say "fcuk this" and fight back.

    Not when there are more people keeping tabs on them with guns.:eek:


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    #80
    LordSutch
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,078 ✭✭✭✭LordSutch


    hondasam wrote: »
    I'm sure the media will make an Irish connection somewhere along the line.

    I'd be amazed if there wasn't an Irish connection.


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    #81
    bernardo mac
    Registered Users Posts: 903 ✭✭✭bernardo mac


    LordSutch wrote: »
    I'd be amazed if there wasn't an Irish connection.
    Indeed,and amazing the number of UK registered top-of-the-range 4 wheel drives etc.that regularly visit here for funerals,weddings....


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    #82
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Sunshine! wrote: »
    Just because they don't do it so much anymore doesn't stop people using the previous terms to describe them. The slavery is appalling, but I find people's attitudes in here to be worse to a degree. Whatever the current PC term for them are, they're still humans. They're still good people, or bad people. Yeah they had a group of slaves, but a lot of "normal" people have been found guilty of imprisonment or worse over the last number of years. Culture has nothing to do with it. These people are just bad; travellers as a whole are not.
    Exactly... where was the moral outrage against all of Austria, and calls for all of Austria to be imprisoned or simply exterminated over what Fritzl did? Because this is a very, very similar scenario.

    Or Americans for that matter, as with Jaycee Lee Duggard? I assume those calling for action against all travellers, expect similar actions to be taken against all Americans (or at least Texans) and all Austrians also, yes?
    who the fug wrote: »
    Would they have reported these travellers to the cops
    Who am I, and who are you, to say? I can tell you that when I was working in a Statoil/Topaz right after the economy (and thus my job in sales) went splat, that we did have a case where five families from a settled community down the road marched down a traveller in his late-teens down to the shop, because he had done a drive-off worth over €50 in a white van. Nearly all of our issues with theft occurred when the local secondary schools were on lunch, and from local (settled) teenagers in general. So you can use that as an indicator, if you want one.

    The likely reason they did that being that we were always good to them (didn't hawk over them when they were in the shop, gave them the sandwiches/muffins/donuts/etc at the end of the day rather than throwing them in the bin, small stuff like that). My manager once even kicked a particularly snooty, middle-aged, quite posh woman out of the shop for being abusive towards three girls (about 7-8 years old) for no reason, who were just hanging about waiting for their mam to pick them up from the school they went to across the road.

    Obviously you don't get that with every settled community, but you also don't get every settled community being treated equally as people, either. Like I said in an earlier post, and of course this doesn't count for every traveller and is something to be cautious about, and we were to an extent 'lucky' with the travellers in the settled community near us, but if you help them out, they may well help you out in return. It was very useful too, because they would always let us know if a 'bad family' were visiting or passing through (such as the one who did the drive-off above).

    It's all about getting to know them in situations like that, and knowing who top trust and who to watch out for. You know, like people do with people in general - judging them for who they are and not what they are.


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    #83
    charlemont
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    Bambi wrote: »
    Traaveller clowns? Thats the stuff of nightmares :eek:

    Ha, The man involved looks like Dastardly from the cartoon.


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    #84
    Paparazzo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,398 ✭✭✭Paparazzo


    Queen-Mise wrote: »
    I hope to fcuk there is no Irish connection. That is a vile nasty thing to do or be involved in (slavery that is).


    http://paveepoint.ie/

    Interesting that their site is in solidarity with the travellers illegally settled on the Dale Farm site but there's not a mention of this.


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    #85
    Ken.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,898 ✭✭✭✭Ken.


    But in fact some people did leave and told us what was going on and when we looked back since 2008 we were aware of 28 people who had made similar accusations."

    Taken from the news story in the op. Why did it take 3 years to actually do something about it?.


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    #86
    charlemont
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    Billy86 wrote: »
    Apologies charlemont, I misread your initial post - the one before just set me off a bit. :o Apologies again, and fair play to you for doing what you did, must have taken some balls!

    I got friendly with the bloke as he stayed in as caravan very close to my family home, Sound bloke, I'd describe him as an English ragamuffin if that's the correct word, Like a gypsy out of a Famous Five book, Lovable rogue, He had nothing the poor chap, He was terrified of the family although this family are tough but not the worse, most of them are settled and well known in Clonmel, They have money too but they didn't get rich by being generous, He had enough of it and his girlfriends dad got him a lift out of town in a truck bound for England.


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    #87
    EGAR
    Registered Users Posts: 2,874 ✭✭✭EGAR


    Billy86 wrote: »
    Exactly... where was the moral outrage against all of Austria, and calls for all of Austria to be imprisoned or simply exterminated over what Fritzl did? Because this is a very, very similar scenario. Or Americans for that matter, as with Jaycee Lee Duggard? I assume those calling for action against all travellers, expect similar actions to be taken against all Americans (or at least Texans) and all Austrians also, yes?

    Ahm, no? I fail to see the connection as both were sex crimes committed by rapists.

    What we are talking about here are abductions and incarcerations for financial gain, committed by a group of people, not individuals.


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    #88
    Captain Darling
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,542 ✭✭✭Captain Darling


    4leto wrote: »
    Slavery is alive and well in this 21st century and it is not only the traveller community engaged in it. Probably more now then there has ever been, numbers wise.

    Its called indentured service now, just a modern term the same thing.

    We're all a slave to fcuking banks now anyways. Every tax payer in the country is getting fcuking screwed. And its refreshing to know, thats the way we'll be for the rest of our lives. Modern day fcuking feudalism!

    Whats going on with those travellers harkens back to times in the not too distant past and is something that i wouldnt believe is widespread within that community.


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    #89
    thegreengoblin
    Registered Users Posts: 2,091 ✭✭✭thegreengoblin


    Should be interesting to hear Pavee Point's views on this story. Of course, they should totally and unreservedly condemn these kind of actions and be appalled by the story, like everyone else...


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    #90
    Palmach
    Registered Users Posts: 974 ✭✭✭Palmach


    Sunshine! wrote: »
    The slavery is appalling, but I find people's attitudes in here to be worse to a degree. Whatever the current PC term for them are, they're still humans. .

    Right people's atitude is worse than slavery? And the slavers are still human beings? These people are lowlifes of the worst sort and I am sorry to say it typifies the Tinker attitude to law and order. Laws are for others and if you apply it us we'll call you racist. If you coddle a group and teach them that wahtever happens it is not their fault then morality goes out the window.


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    #91
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    EGAR wrote: »
    Ahm, no? I fail to see the connection as both were sex crimes committed by rapists.

    What we are talking about here are abductions and incarcerations for financial gain, committed by a group of people, not individuals.
    The connection should be obvious, and it them I am drawing the connection to, but rather us and how quite a few are labelling the whole for the appalling misdeeds of the very few in this situation. Surely then this standard should apply across the board, otherwise it is just blatant discrimination and jumping at any opportunity to demonise an entire community.

    Again to re-iterate, I would have no issues with those who did this (and others who may also be doing it) being strung up to a tree in the middle of the Sahara/Arizona/Australian/whichever really hot desert to die a slow a painful death.

    lucyfu09, apparently it had something to do with legal red tape that they only got lifted recently (June, I think?) so hopefully we see a lot of raids on others suspected of doing the same.


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