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Gay Pride - Embarrassing or Empowering?

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    #182
    rochey84
    Registered Users Posts: 318 ✭✭rochey84


    Sharrow wrote: »
    Pride.

    What is the opposite of pride? Shame.

    For years people were "Gay"(LGBT) were told they should be ashamed of who and what they were, their sexuality, the people they loved. If they were public about their sexuality they faced jail, to shunning, to being attacked, burned out of their homes.

    Many people forget the grip the RCC had on society and dictated how people behaved and how they mistreated other people. Still to this day there are people who will say that they don't know a 'gay' person, to this day we have people beaten up due to being 'gay' and we have 'gay' couples who can't hold hands walking down the street or do any of the normal acts of affection which couples do in public due to ignorance and intolerance.

    It would be great some day that there was no longer a need for a Pride festival.
    That young people growing up would know that being 'gay' is not wrong or shameful.
    But we are not there yet.

    Yes it would be nice if the media would report the events over the whole week instead of 90 seconds of footage which picks out the most 'colourful' parade participants but that is not the parades fault or that of those in it.

    Anyone who says that Pride based on that 90secs does not represent them is just as ignorant. I suggest you go and have a look and see all the normal ordinary people who will be there taking part. The point of the Parade is to let people know there are a hell of a lot more LGBT people out there then they know.
    We are not the tiny minority people think and invisible people have invisible rights.

    +1 A great post and very well composed!


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    #183
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    rochey84 wrote: »
    Either way the argument is valid, it doesn't matter the size of the subset, it is still a celebration, would you object to it then? ask for a more subtle celebration or reminder?

    Jews celebrate Yom Kippur. Muslims celebrate Ramadhan. Yet we don't see anything on the scale of the LGBT pride parade.


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    #184
    Wompa1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,170 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    Sharrow wrote: »
    I am not going trawling for links, the law was on the books here and it was only removed in 1993 so not even 13 years ago. if you want to go digging for case law do it yourself.

    fair enough, I just asked. I don't give much of a toss anyway, was just asking for you to back up your statement. I've heard that volleyed around previously and there doesn't seem to be any evidence of the law being upheld in Ireland. I'd take on the whole point of the hold of the Catholic Church but statements about being imprisoned..I haven't actually seen any names, figures or facts for that in Ireland. So if anyone has it, post it.


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    #185
    Wompa1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,170 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    rochey84 wrote: »
    Well for me personally and most gay people I know it was something they were aware of from puberty. I'm sorry to hear about your ex leaving ya for a woman, however I would say bisexuality is fluid, maybe asexuality. And they may feel its a right but they are not repressed the same way LGBT people were, you're arguments are really weak man!

    she's not bi. She's lesbian according to herself. I got an education in Sexuality when I was with her as that was the study of her topic and right or wrong I help her with her study. I'm not coming out against gay people. You seem to have a very defensive manner about your posts. You are calling my arguments weak when they aren't weak and it's not really an argument. You are trying to stand up for your believes with weak proposals and ideas yourself that are open ended and up for debate. If that wasn't true, people wouldn't be posting in the way they are.

    It's not an attack on you, it's not an attack on LGBT. It's a statement of opinion, which is based on experiences and fact from other people. I've been to gay pride days, I don't agree with them based on my own experience. You are trying to champion a cause valiantly but there's things you say which I disagree with and I'm entitled too, so is everyone else. It doesn't make anybody weak, close minded or bigotted. You haven't thrown those terms around but from my experience a lot of gay people who are passionate about it, do throw the terms around for anyone who in anyway tries to counter argue.


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    #186
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    Oh, Happy Pride Everyone!!!


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    #187
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,282 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    gay pride brings out the worst elements of the gay community and just re-enforces the stereotype of over the top in your face queens.


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    #188
    Mike 1972
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    plein de force wrote: »
    I just find playing up to negative stereotypes that you try to banish is counterproductive at the very least.
    .
    par·o·dy   /ˈpærədi/
    [par-uh-dee]
    noun, plural -dies, verb, -died, -dy·ing.
    –noun
    1. a humorous or satirical imitation of a serious piece of literature or writing: his hilarious parody of Hamlet's soliloquy.
    2. the genre of literary composition represented by such imitations.
    3. a burlesque imitation of a musical composition.
    4. any humorous, satirical, or burlesque imitation, as of a person, event, etc.
    5. the use in the 16th century of borrowed material in a musical setting of the mass (parody Mass).
    6. a poor or feeble imitation or semblance; travesty: His acting is a parody of his past greatness.
    –verb (used with object)
    7. to imitate (a composition, author, etc.) for purposes of ridicule or satire.
    8. to imitate poorly or feebly; travesty.


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    #189
    Morag
    Registered Users Posts: 8,423 ✭✭✭Morag


    Eric Cartman wrote: »
    gay pride brings out the worst elements of the gay community and just re-enforces the stereotype of over the top in your face queens.

    Bullshít.

    People who don't take part in any of the events running the full week and only look at what rte show on the news for 90secs think/say that.


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    #190
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,282 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    Sharrow wrote: »
    Bullshít.

    People who don't take part in any of the events running the full week and only look at what rte show on the news for 90secs think/say that.

    but your not trying to stop people who take part discriminating , your trying to stop the antos and decos sitting on walls from kicking the sh*t out of some gay lad on his way home from the george and trying to get all the old fogie politicians to recognise the right to marry etc....

    these people will be the ones watching the 90 second clip on the news or seeing the photos in the papers, and all theyll see is another f*cking queen running round in rainbows and hotpants

    I have no problem with gay people, I f*cking hate queens, you can be born gay, nobody is born a fagg*t


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    #191
    PHB
    Registered Users Posts: 20,617 ✭✭✭✭PHB


    man.about.town wrote: »
    why cant we have a straight pride parade???

    i dont see why they must have a gay pride parade, there is not much anti homosexuality left in ireland anymore as far as i can, we are a very accepting bunch.

    Tell that to Norris


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    #192
    holystungun9
    Registered Users Posts: 2,933 ✭✭✭holystungun9


    PHB wrote: »
    Tell that to Norris

    Chuck Norris is gay???


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    #193
    Spread
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,876 ✭✭✭Spread


    holystungun9 wrote: »
    Chuck Norris is gay???
    images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGaZiKnY-w9s87V6MhAcViry-AylECZ1HjWDaMExBoqPy-rD6exA


    This little doggie asked him the same question :eek:


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    #194
    Morag
    Registered Users Posts: 8,423 ✭✭✭Morag


    Eric Cartman wrote: »
    but your not trying to stop people who take part discriminating , your trying to stop the antos and decos sitting on walls from kicking the sh*t out of some gay lad on his way home from the george and trying to get all the old fogie politicians to recognise the right to marry etc....

    It's also about the people who will on the jury putting anto or deco down for comitting a hate crime.

    Eric Cartman wrote: »
    these people will be the ones watching the 90 second clip on the news or seeing the photos in the papers, and all theyll see is another f*cking queen running round in rainbows and hotpants

    If the ignorant which to remain so then nothing can be done about them.
    Eric Cartman wrote: »
    I have no problem with gay people, I f*cking hate queens, you can be born gay, nobody is born a fagg*t

    Charming, so you have issues with effeminate men. Ever stop to ask yourself why?


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    #195
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,282 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    Sharrow wrote: »
    Charming, so you have issues with effeminate men. Ever stop to ask yourself why?

    yes , for the same reason that you mightnt be friends with a drug addict, or like hanging around with racists

    its not some bull**** underlying homosexual tendancies or any of that crap , its my personal preference and I believe that men parading round in hotpants or wearing bondage gear to a parade etc... is unacceptable, its something i disagree with and dont want to associate with people like that or be friends with anyone who makes those choices


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    #196
    Morag
    Registered Users Posts: 8,423 ✭✭✭Morag


    Eric Cartman wrote: »
    yes , for the same reason that you mightnt be friends with a drug addict, or like hanging around with racists

    its not some bull**** underlying homosexual tendancies or any of that crap , its my personal preference and I believe that men parading round in hotpants or wearing bondage gear to a parade etc... is unacceptable, its something i disagree with and dont want to associate with people like that or be friends with anyone who makes those choices

    I never infered you were a closet case, I just asked why you had issues with those who are not gender 'norm'.

    I have never seen anyone in bondage gear at the dublin pride parade.
    Thats not how the kink community rolls and it's a matter of consideration and consent.


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    #197
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    I don't get were the pride comes in? Why would you be proud of your sexual orientation? Considering it is supposed to be something you are born with how is it different from a brunette pride day or a tall person pride day?


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    #198
    celj
    Registered Users Posts: 409 ✭✭celj


    Embarrassing.

    Was in Cork few weeks ago when they were being proud.
    Didn't do themselves a lot of favours with the old stereotype thing.


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    #199
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    Seanbeag1 wrote: »
    I don't get were the pride comes in? Why would you be proud of your sexual orientation? Considering it is supposed to be something you are born with how is it different from a brunette pride day or a tall person pride day?

    Were proud because before it was something that we were told was wrong and to ashamed of.


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    #200
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    efb wrote: »
    Were proud because before it was something that we were told was wrong and to ashamed of.

    Like being ginger?


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    #201
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    efb wrote: »
    Were proud because before it was something that we were told was wrong and to ashamed of.

    People are entitled to whatever opinion they like on the subject as to the morality of same-sex sexual activity / family units etc. I still don't get how the pride parade is constructive to society at large. How does it argue for your position?


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    #202
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    philologos wrote: »
    People are entitled to whatever opinion they like on the subject as to the morality of same-sex sexual activity / family units etc. I still don't get how the pride parade is constructive to society at large. How does it argue for your position?

    It gives us a voice, Im not repeated what I said earlier read the thread.

    It all began at Stonewall.


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    #203
    rocco.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 73 ✭✭rocco.


    I have friends who are gay, they are really looking forward to it! Let them enjoy it! No harm being done..


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    #204
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    efb wrote: »
    It gives us a voice, Im not repeated what I said earlier read the thread.

    It all began at Stonewall.

    That's a fair point I think. It does give LGBT people a voice but what is that voice saying taking into account some of the responses given on this thread. That's what I get confused at, what is that voice saying to me as an individual during Pride Week.

    Edit: Surely if this is being funded by Dublin City Corporation presumably with tax €'s I can expect some benefit from it? That's fair right?


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    #205
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    philologos wrote: »
    That's a fair point I think. It does give LGBT people a voice but what is that voice saying taking into account some of the responses given on this thread. That's what I get confused at, what is that voice saying to me as an individual during Pride Week.

    Im sure whatever the voice said you would still find it morally reprehensible.

    But to me it says, we are here and we deserve the same rights as everyone else.


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    #206
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    efb wrote: »
    Im sure whatever the voice said you would still find it morally reprehensible.

    I find which morally reprehensible? Pride Week or?
    efb wrote: »
    But to me it says, we are here and we deserve the same rights as everyone else.

    OK. I can understand that much I think. I'm not sure if in terms of the family unit that LGBT relationships should be regarded as the same as relationships that can provide a mother and a father to a child. That said however I do welcome LGBT voices to the discussion on that.

    I don't think the Pride Parade in particular achieves what you think it does, but perhaps I'm just wrong.


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    #207
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    philologos wrote: »
    That's a fair point I think. It does give LGBT people a voice but what is that voice saying taking into account some of the responses given on this thread. That's what I get confused at, what is that voice saying to me as an individual during Pride Week.

    Edit: Surely if this is being funded by Dublin City Corporation presumably with tax €'s I can expect some benefit from it? That's fair right?

    Feel morally superior those marching perhaps?


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    #208
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    efb wrote: »
    Feel morally superior those marching perhaps?

    Let's retrace this a little. Who feels morally superior to whom?


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    #209
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    efb wrote: »
    Feel morally superior those marching perhaps?

    What have morals got to do with it? The whole thing is one big contradiction. On the one hand you have the fact that a person has no choice in their sexuality while on the other you have people taking pride in something which would indicate it's something they chose.


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    #210
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    philologos wrote: »
    People are entitled to whatever opinion they like on the subject as to the morality of same-sex sexual activity / family units etc. I still don't get how the pride parade is constructive to society at large. How does it argue for your position?

    You, your benefit would be you feeling that same sex sexual relationships are morally deviant and that would make you iyo morally superior.


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    #211
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    Seanbeag1 wrote: »
    What have morals got to do with it? The whole thing is one big contradiction. On the one hand you have the fact that a person has no choice in their sexuality while on the other you have people taking pride in something which would indicate it's something they chose.


    I was addressing philogos point on what benefit he may get from pride. He may get to feel morally superior. I dont feel superior to anyone, I do believe I am, and we all are equal.


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