Gerry and Kate Mcann promoting Book on Late Late next week

starryeye

There are so many disturbing cases of missing people and never knowing what happened to them must be torture for all families. What a desperate situation to be in day in day out for years and some go to their graves never knowing what became of their loved ones. If all this publicity achieves the result of finding Madeleine McCann then it will be wonderful.
I don't like to make too much analysis of the McCann's because I don't know them at all and they could be completely innocent of this disappearance of their daughter. I watch and wait with interest and hope and pray for a joyful end to this mystery.

cosmicfart

danmoz wrote: »

More productive to the discussion? For about the last 30 pages there has been intelligent discussion with regards to all the witness statements and contradictions, inconsistencies and discretions within, the so called evidence, the witnesses, the findings of the British and Portugese police, etc. Then you came along with your content lacking posts that added nothing sensible to the discussion calling people 'SICKOS' and ignoring the pages of constructive debate.

.

More productive, as being able to state your own opinions (if you have any) about the case and not being sucked into the media hyperboyle. The MaCanns have not being charged with ANYTHING except the fact they are the only ones, REALLY, STILL, looking for thier daughter.

El Weirdo

cosmicfart wrote: »

What would you have said???......... "Shes out having a party!?" grow up and lets have a discussion about it otherwise F off

Hmmmm.

cosmicfart wrote: »

No I dont read rags, probualy shouldnt be bothering with AH! So are you gonna continue having a go at me or be more productive to the discussion, seeing as you are well informed and know all the angles in said case...

You've done nothing but have a go at anyone that disagrees with your viewpoint ever since you started posting on this thread.

Go back, read the thread.

DublinWriter

WindSock wrote: »

22 yoyos? That's hardly a steal.

Give it a month or two and it'll be available in your local charity shop for a Euro.

danmoz

starryeye wrote: »

There are so many disturbing cases of missing people and never knowing what happened to them must be torture for all families. What a desperate situation to be in day in day out for years and some go to their graves never knowing what became of their loved ones. If all this publicity achieves the result of finding Madeleine McCann then it will be wonderful.
I don't like to make too much analysis of the McCann's because I don't know them at all and they could be completely innocent of this disappearance of their daughter. I watch and wait with interest and hope and pray for a joyful end to this mystery.

If one of your relatives was missing, and after a 14month investigation by British and Portugese police that inolved over a hundred people came to the conclusion that your relative was dead and they suspected such a person but didn't have enough evidence to charge them, you'd just say "Okay, no worries, better luck next time chaps"? Or would you start screaming at the injustice?

maebee

cosmicfart wrote: »

More productive, as being able to state your own opinions (if you have any) about the case and not being sucked into the media hyperboyle. The MaCanns have not being charged with ANYTHING except the fact they are the only ones, REALLY, STILL, looking for thier daughter.

In a BBC radio 4 interview, Kate McCann admitted that they had not physically searched for Madeleine. She said they were working really really hard but hadn't physically searched.

Link to follow.

danmoz

cosmicfart wrote: »

More productive, as being able to state your own opinions (if you have any) about the case and not being sucked into the media hyperboyle. The MaCanns have not being charged with ANYTHING except the fact they are the only ones, REALLY, STILL, looking for thier daughter.

*sigh*

Looking for her despite THERE BEING NO EVIDENCE OF AN ABDUCTION. NONE AT ALL. Nothing, that was the conclusion of British and Portugese police.

The Mccanns haven't been charged with anything because the evidence against them is only circumstantial. There is no hard evidence. That doesn't mean they didn't do it, as has been proven earlier in this thread. Mitchell Quy claimed his wife had disappeared, he started an 18month media campaign. The police turned their attention to him, then called his bluff and charged him DESPITE THERE BEING NO EVIDENCE OR EVEN A BODY. After a lengthy interview he confessed to chopping his wife up and discarding her remains in various locations.

Now go back to about page 60 and start reading, because you're just causing us to cover old ground now, although I suspect that is your intention.

starryeye

danmoz wrote: »

If one of your relatives was missing, and after a 14month investigation by British and Portugese police that inolved over a hundred people came to the conclusion that your relative was dead and they suspected such a person but didn't have enough evidence to charge them, you'd just say "Okay, no worries, better luck next time chaps"? Or would you start screaming at the injustice?

Innocent until proven guilty would be my only guide. That is the way justice should be achieved. I leave it to the experts who will now reopen the case to decide and I hope who ever is guilty is brought to justice in this case.

AskMyChocolate

cosmicfart wrote: »

I dont have one either, I am a godfather to two and I feel very protective of them. However, you cant take into account that someone is out to kidnap you child, its quite impossible to defend against if someone is determined to do it. Whoever took Madeline is god knows what.....

What the hell has kidnapping got to do with anything? You don't leave three children under the age of three alone or out of earshot for over two hours while you go gallivanting unless you're either a negligent parnt or a retard. In this case it's gross negligence, and the night in question was not a one-off incidence. What if the child fell and split their head open? What if Madeleine decided to give the twins a bath? What if she decided to have a bath herself? Jesus! How can you possibly defend their behaviour?

Snake Plisken wrote: »

Cosmicfart I'm afraid you'll never win with the Internet Detective mob on here, they fail to realise that
1) They are releasing the book and appearing on chat shows to keep their missing child in the public eye so that when the general public go abroad this summer they will keep an eye out for Madeline.
2) They are running low on funds to keep the search going for their missing daughter.

The only thing they are guilty of is leaving their kids alone and that is where I would hold them accountable for. If they had killed her do you think they would still be highlighting their missing daughter and bringing the focus back on themselves?

People don't like the couple as Kate comes across as cold and Gerry as nervous during media appearances, that doesn't mean they have done anything wrong.

Do you really think that the UK Prime Minister would look to get police rescources involved without looking into the case and if there was any doubt about the McCann's innocence?

These parent's that recognise their mistake and you can see the toll that it has taken by the strain on their faces and the guilt of leaving their children alone on that night, not of anything more sinister.

Perhaps if they used the fund money for looking for their daughter, instead of spending 87% of it on lawyers, media consultants, PR people, taking libel lawsuits, mortgage payments and globetrotting, they wouldn't be as low on funds.

mydearwatson wrote: »

The same trained dog smelled cadavers in a car which was rented by the McCanns weeks after Madeleine disappeared.

Scenario One:
The McCanns killed Madeleine (or disposed of her "accidental" body) on the night of her disappearance. They had the presence of mind to hide her in a location which would remain undetected for the next few weeks ... before they went for a drive, picked her up, and moved the body elsewhere. Where it hasn't yet been found. Despite the constant scrutinty of the media/police as at that time.

Hard to swallow.

Scenario Two:
The Portoguese police placed cadaver scents at locations which would suit themselves in their conviction of the McCann's liability.

Scenario Three: They disposed of the body and the cadaver scent in the boot of the car came from contaminated clothing or cuddly toys.

Scenario four: Perhaps the cadaver scents came from Kate McCann's clothing due to her work and had nothing to do with Madeleine at all.

fulhamfanincork

Why not have a lie detector test or waterboarding?

danmoz

starryeye wrote: »

Innocent until proven guilty would be my only guide. That is the way justice should be achieved. I leave it to the experts who will now reopen the case to decide and I hope who ever is guilty is brought to justice in this case.

Innocent until proven guilty is fine so long as you accept that applies to people who are guilty of crimes they've committed but yet to be convicted of.

And, like an earlier poster said, if you judge people simply on what they're convicted of, then Al Capone was just a normal guy who got sloppy with his tax returns.

The world isn't black and white.

maebee

starryeye wrote: »

Innocent until proven guilty would be my only guide. That is the way justice should be achieved. I leave it to the experts who will now reopen the case to decide and I hope who ever is guilty is brought to justice in this case.

The case is not being re-opened. It cannot be unless the McCanns request a re-opening or new evidence comes to light. Note they keep asking for a re-view and not a re-opening.

http://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/t14976-downing-st-denies-giving-orders-to-police-on-madeleine

up for anything

Why when someone dies, has something awful happen to them or disappears do they suddenly turn into a loved one!

I'm hope I'm still referred to as the one we always forget ormy pain in the arse if something like that ever happened to me. If I was kidnapped and heard my mother pleading for the kidnappers to release her darling, the light of her life, her happy daughter who always had a smile on her lips or speaking about me to others as her loved one I'd know she'd been on the beer and given up hope of finding me, whereas if she told the kidnappers that she hoped I'd give them as hard a time as I'd given her and she was expecting them to drop me on the side of the road, any road, at any minute just to be rid of me I'd know that everything was going to be ok.

sonnky

They probably lost the original of the book already!:p

fulhamfanincork

maebee wrote: »

The case is not being re-opened. It cannot be unless the McCanns request a re-opening or new evidence comes to light. Note they keep asking for a re-view and not a re-opening.

http://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/t14976-downing-st-denies-giving-orders-to-police-on-madeleine

Surely that indicates that they are guilty?

danmoz

fulhamfanincork wrote: »

Why not have a lie detector test or waterboarding?

Funny you mention that, they offered to take a lie detector, then one of the papers offered to pay for it. THe Mcanns then refused.

And here's a breakdown of the costs from the Fund accounts for 2007-2008;

Donations of £1,846,178

£26,113 for 'Media Monitoring'.

£123,573 for 'Campaign Management' - other subsidiary stuff is accounted for elsewhere, so this is presumably just the wages for the 'team'.

£111.522 on 'Legal fees and expenses'

£68,799 on 'Fund legal fees'.

£37,071 for 'Website'.

£250,000 'Search fees'

Jesus Wept

Would like to know more about the reported sexual comments about Madeline from Gerry & Gerry's friend, also about the friends daughter.

danmoz

Search Google for the Gaspar statements

maebee

fulhamfanincork wrote: »

Surely that indicates that they are guilty?

You can read the Offical Police Files here and decide for yourself.

http://www.mccannfiles.com/

maebee

danmoz wrote: »

Funny you mention that, they offered to take a lie detector, then one of the papers offered to pay for it. THe Mcanns then refused.

And here's a breakdown of the costs from the Fund accounts for 2007-2008;

Donations of £1,846,178

£26,113 for 'Media Monitoring'.

£123,573 for 'Campaign Management' - other subsidiary stuff is accounted for elsewhere, so this is presumably just the wages for the 'team'.

£111.522 on 'Legal fees and expenses'

£68,799 on 'Fund legal fees'.

£37,071 for 'Website'.

£250,000 'Search fees'

13% was spent on searching.

maebee

The-Rigger wrote: »

Would like to know more about the reported sexual comments about Madeline from Gerry & Gerry's friend, also about the friends daughter.

http://themaddiecasefiles.com/topic50.html

My name is URL

I wonder if Tubridy will ask any hard-hitting questions

lol

danmoz

maebee wrote: »

13% was spent on searching.

What do you expect?

The Mccanns admitted on the BBC they never searched for Madeleine.

We know from the police statements that the Tapas group simply went to bed that night.

If a friends daughter had gone missing, you can bet I'd be out day and night looking for her and it'd be days before I slept. I wouldn't just go to bed. Their behaviour suggests they didn't bother because they knew it was a waste of tiem

Donkey Oaty

My name is URL wrote: »

I wonder if Tubridy will ask any hard-hitting questions

lol

Will he ask them to sing greetings to Madeline, or don't they do that on the Late Late Show anymore?

AskMyChocolate

The-Rigger wrote: »

Would like to know more about the reported sexual comments about Madeline from Gerry & Gerry's friend, also about the friends daughter.

Yep. And I'd like to know more about how everybody knew each other/came to be friends and the general inter-relationship between the Tapas 9. I know it was David Payne who organised the holiday. I would like to know more about what the British police did to follow up the social services woman's feeling that she knew him from somewhere before, and why the McCanns refused her help (after David Payne advised them not to speak to her). Did David Payne invite all the other couples on the holiday or did they all know each other prior to Portugal. Hopefully Scotland Yard may go into these things in more detail now.

danmoz wrote: »

What do you expect?

The Mccanns admitted on the BBC they never searched for Madeleine.

We know from the police statements that the Tapas group simply went to bed that night.

If a friends daughter had gone missing, you can bet I'd be out day and night looking for her and it'd be days before I slept. I wouldn't just go to bed. Their behaviour suggests they didn't bother because they knew it was a waste of tiem

Yep. What exactly was everyone doing between 22.00 and 23.50 when the police were finally called? And even if I wasn't out searching after that time, as it might be an abduction,(could destroy the crime scene) I certainly wouldn't be going to bed. I'd be up waiting for news, contacting local hospitals, hassling the police to make sure all roads had been blocked and airports notified, hassling other guests to see if anybody saw anything,making sammiches and trying to get people to eat something, and being on standby in case anything was needed. Just going to bed seems somewhat callous IMO.

Turtyturd

My name is URL wrote: »

I wonder if Tubridy will ask any hard-hitting questions

lol

'So is someone minding the kids tonight?'

AskMyChocolate

My name is URL wrote: »

I wonder if Tubridy will ask any hard-hitting questions

lol

Will they be taking questions from the audience? That used to be the format in the past. John Stalker etc. (I haven't watched the Late Late in years.:o)

My name is URL

AskMyChocolate wrote: »

Will they be taking questions from the audience? That used to be the format in the past. John Stalker etc. (I haven't watched the Late Late in years.:o)

Jaysus no.. it's like communist China now! A few weeks ago Tubridy scolded the audience for booing Jedward

Dan I Am

endabob1 wrote: »

It’s important to have an open mind for sure, but it’s also important to take the facts as facts and the only piece of “evidence” that supports an abduction theory, is Jane Tanners sighting which has a couple of pretty big flaws
1- It contradicts, Gerry McCann’s statement & the chap he was talking to.
2- It was also changed from her initial statement, the description of the abductor changed and
3- In her second statement she remembers much more about the child, colour & detailing of pyjamas etc.. This flies in the face of all known logic that you lose recollection over time.
My theory for what it’s worth is that the most likely scenario is the sedation one, since they admitted to using it in the past;
The statement from the neighbour of crying in the prior evenings
The statement of Madeliene’s questioning of Kate about where her Mummy & Daddy were when the twins were crying;
The twins not waking on the night of the disappearance despite all the commotion;
Maybe they upped the dose a little to make sure the kids didn’t wake and it went horribly wrong, after that and the body disposal etc, I’m not sure but there is more evidence imho to support a sedation gone wrong theory than the very flimsy abduction.
It reeks of cover up, the initial shutter story (staged by Kate), the farcical changing statements, the refusal to co-operate, the involvement of media, to the point of hiring press officers within hours.

(BBC Radio 4 interview of Kate McCann yesterday, first item on programme - http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/console/b01115hc

'The initial shutter story' - If the kid was abducted, and the kidnapper came and went via the door, then it would be logical to open a window before leaving, in order to buy valuable seconds to escape if the abduction was discovered very soon after the fact.

'The farcical changing statements' -They have just gone from chilled out holiday mode to oh **** oh **** oh **** what's hapenning. Their minds are going to be totally scrambled. There would be loads of confusion anyway, and then on top of that you have a language problem.

'The refusal to co-operate' - Anyone with the slighted understanding of the law knows that you should never co-operate with the police when you are being treated as a suspect. This is especially true in high profile cases. History is full of miscarriages of justice in such cases, where non-specialist police who were out of their depth built a case and gained a conviction (and promotion) on nothing more than a 'hunch' and 'evidence' extracted in suspect interviews. Search Youtube for 'Don't talk to Police' for a very good lecture on why you shouldn't. It is specifically about American law, but many of the points are universal.
If they are innocent, it must have been infuriating knowing the police were focusing on them rather than the abductor. It must have crossed the McCanns mind that the police had decided the abductor was away in the wind and unlikely to be caught. Implying that the parents did it would obviously not have been as good for the police as a culprit behind bars, but it would still have gone a long way towards restoring faith and security in Portugal's tourist industry, and allowed Portuguese parents to sleep safer at night again. If the Chief of Police was looking to profit from it in terms of reputation as well as financially, he could even write a book about that:rolleyes:. (and then of course he gets to keep the profits, instead of spending them on keeping Madelaine in the press. It's not like he has a good job/salery as a Doctor/Surgeon that he could be doing instead)

'The involvement of media, to the point of hiring press officers within hours' - Once again, I thought everyone and their Gran new that both media coverage and acting as fast as possible increased the chances of a happy ending in cases of child abduction? As to when the McCanns first called the police? Presumably they called the local police station? Seems possible to me that such a call was never logged??

'Lack of “evidence” that supports an abduction' - But isn't that exactly the same as pretty much every other high profile abduction case I can think of in the last 20 or so years? It is like the one common defining factor of such cases - these kids just seem to vanish with no witnesses at all, or at least no solid witnesses.

'crying in previous evening and twins not waking' - Kate McCann was talking about that yesterday on BBC Radio 4 ( http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/console/b01115hc ) She said that, with hindsight, she thought there may have been an aborted abduction attempt the night before, causing the children's crying, and that the abductor then drugged them the next night and successfully abducted Madeleine. That sounds at least as believable as any other scenario, and more believable than the idea that they heavily sedated their kids in the first place, and that they were then such inept doctors that they then got the dosage so drastically wrong that they killed one of their children, and that they were then such callous psychopaths that they treated their just dead loved one with such an unimaginable lack of respect to any parent, and that they were then so exceptionally good at operating under stress that they co-ordinated such a complex cover up, and that they then pointlessly carried on the intensive charade for several years, even when the case was closed and Joe Blog just wanted them to shut up. It's not like they needed the fund money, or appear to like the limelight. These are Two Doctors we are talking about, not a couple of brain dead junkies sedating their kids.

'They admitted to sedating kids in past' - I thought they admitted to sometimes giving their kids Calpol to help them get to sleep in the past?? If so that is a very different thing. Calpol is a mild painkiller that only helps your kid get to sleep by minimising mild pain or discomfort, and I would guess that almost all parents in recent times have done that. It is a very different thing to a sedative.

Sniffer Dogs - I guess there's a good reason why sniffer dogs alone are not admissible in court without any corroborating evidence (such as in this case). The Guardian UK claim a success rate for sniffer dogs of about 30%(based on the very limited available independent information). Drug sniffer dogs generally produce more than 2 false positives for every one accurate positive. Of course the police claim that these aren't false positives, but rather such small trace amounts that they can't be found. If they really believed that though, you'd think they'd allow independent verifiable testing to prove it. I guess they must be worried about the lid being lifted on the 'sniffer dog accuracy scam', and people subsequently objecting to being searched on such flimsy evidence.

OK, So I'm glad we've cleared that up (your welcome:p). Now we can all get on with our own lives, and stop spitting hate down the fibre optics at these poor people, who have been charged with nothing. I don't mind your average internet crazy who devotes their life to 9/11, 2012, aliens, or whatever, but this one I find offencive

Degsy

My name is URL wrote: »

I wonder if Tubridy will ask any hard-hitting questions

lol

"So what do you threaten your other kids with when they misbehave?"