The Pub trade is dying - Minimum price for Alcohol?

SeanW

obriendj wrote: »

If FF were in power they probably would do the same.
It seems to be the solution for all governments. w

We have a small number of people who abuse alcohol and cause mayhem on the streets. Lets punish everyone.

Disturbingly, this seems to be trend - very radical policies that are agreed by all parties :mad:

RoboRat

Another bull**** move to look after the publicans in the same way as closing the off licence at 10pm which did absolutely nothing. Personally has no bearing on myself as I rarely drink but it stinks of cronyism again.

Publicans have had a long time to get their house in order and most haven't bothered. There are still places charging for entry, then charging crazy prices for drinks. Rather than looking at the success of Weatherspoons and the likes to see what could be done better, they would rather just rid themselves of the competition.

This is not just targeted at supermarkets, its also a thinly veiled attack on Weatherspoons too as this will affect their pricing.

LordNorbury

matrim wrote: »

I disagree with this move too but The vast majority of people buying a few craft beers or a bottle of wine won't see any change because of this because the vast majority of craft beers and wine are above the proposed limits

It's the principle of it, I might spend 10 Euro on a bottle of red wine for a Friday night as a single guy, someone else might only have 6 Euro to spend on the same product, because this gov have (1) taxed the absolute shít out of them and (2) they could be parents with two young kids and are getting absolutely saddled on childcare costs and the general costs of having a family and the generally excessive cost of running a family home in this country.

It could be argued that a couple in their mid 30's with 2 young kids would typically be more socially responsible than a single guy like myself of the same age with no kids, but this new pricing framework will most probably hit them every Friday or Saturday night and not me because they are on a tighter budget than me as they have a family to support whereas I don't, what sort of stupidity is that???

Muahahaha

seamus wrote: »

Please don't vote if you don't understand the purpose of a referendum.

I'll vote whatever way I want and I'll gladly vote it down because Leo is a hyprocrite.

On one hand Leo wants to treat the vast vast majority of people like children by introducing minimum alcohol pricing on us when all we do is enjoy five or six beers at home on a Friday night. Then why not behave like children and vote down his gay marriage referendum? With minimum pricing he is treating adults like children yet he expects us to be 'mature' and vote through gay marriage as some sort of liberal policy? So he is liberal when an issue effects him personally but when an issue effects everyone below his salary of €150k+ pension he sells the rest of us up the swanny.

As I said I know well that the two aren't linked but fcuk it, this country has gotten to be a joke to live in at this stage. 99% of people enjoy alcohol responsibly and cause no trouble to A&E services so why is Leo legislating for the 1% that do? Because he is indebted to vested interests. This is not a democracy where the will of the majority of citizens is carried out, that much is obvious. So when people feel disenfranchised (as I and many other do) then they'll use referendums to give the govt a kicking.

jobbridge4life

Muahahaha wrote: »

I'll vote whatever way I want and I'll gladly vote it down because Leo is a hyprocrite.

On one hand Leo wants to treat the vast vast majority of people like children by introducing minimum alcohol pricing on us when all we do is enjoy five or six beers at home on a Friday night. Then why not behave like children and vote down his gay marriage referendum? With minimum pricing he is treating adults like children yet he expects us to be 'mature' and vote through gay marriage as some sort of liberal policy? So he is liberal when an issue effects him personally but when an issue effects everyone below his salary of €150k+ pension he sells the rest of us up the swanny.

As I said I know well that the two aren't linked but fcuk it, this country has gotten to be a joke to live in at this stage. 99% of people enjoy alcohol responsibly and cause no trouble to A&E services so why is Leo legislating for the 1% that do? Because he is indebted to vested interests. This is not a democracy where the will of the majority of citizens is carried out, that much is obvious. So when people feel disenfranchised (as I and many other do) then they'll use referendums to give the govt a kicking.

So you are going to punish innocent strangers to achieve absolutely nothing in relation to the source of your irritation.

animaal

matrim wrote: »

I disagree with this move too but The vast majority of people buying a few craft beers or a bottle of wine won't see any change because of this. The vast majority of craft beers and wine are above the proposed limits

It would be quite typical for a red wine to contain 13% alcohol. This bottle would have about 10 units. If the minimum price turns out to be €1.10 per unit, that bottle couldn't be sold for less than €11.

There are plenty of wines costing more than €11, but the bottles I see most people buying would cost less than that.

LordNorbury

Muahahaha wrote: »

I'll vote whatever way I want and I'll gladly vote it down because Leo is a hyprocrite.

On one hand Leo wants to treat the vast vast majority of people like children by introducing minimum alcohol pricing on us when all we do is enjoy five or six beers at home on a Friday night. Then why not behave like children and vote down his gay marriage referendum? With minimum pricing he is treating adults like children yet he expects us to be 'mature' and vote through gay marriage as some sort of liberal policy? So he is liberal when an issue effects him personally but when an issue effects everyone below his salary of €150k+ pension he sells the rest of us up the swanny.

As I said I know well that the two aren't linked but fcuk it, this country has gotten to be a joke to live in at this stage. 99% of people enjoy alcohol responsibly and cause no trouble to A&E services so why is Leo legislating for the 1% that do? Because he is indebted to vested interests. This is not a democracy where the will of the majority of citizens is carried out, that much is obvious. So when people feel disenfranchised (as I and many other do) then they'll use referendums to give the govt a kicking.

Couldn't agree more, I'll be joining you in voting no. People who think that these sort of issues should not be generally connected and that a voter does not have the right to punish the government by way of a referendum, if they feel they have been lied to for the purposes of getting a government elected, that back tracks on every single promise and commitment it made before an election, these people do not understand how democracy works, and that a voter has a right to vote a particular way for any particular reason.

My right to vote as I see fit is not a qualified right, it is an absolute right to vote as I see fit, for any reason or for no particular reason at all and I will vote accordingly and this government can get fúcked if it thinks it can treat me like a child and can expect me to cooperate with it on one policy area as it fúcks me over at the same time in another area.

jobbridge4life

LordNorbury wrote: »

Couldn't agree more, I'll be joining you in voting no. People who think that these sort of issues should not be generally connected and that a voter does not have the right to punish the government by way of a referendum, if they feel they have been lied to for the purposes of getting a government elected, that back tracks on every single promise and commitment it made before an election, these people do not understand how democracy works, and that a voter has a right to vote a particular way for any particular reason.

My right to vote as I see fit is not a qualified right, it is an absolute right to vote as I see fit, for any reason or for no particular reason at all and I will vote accordingly and this government can get fúcked if it thinks it can treat me like a child and can expect me to cooperate with it on one policy area as it fúcks me over at the same time in another area.

That has to be the most selfish and nasty thing I have ever read. This isn't like any other referendum, its people, ordinary people just like yourself and their families that you will be punishing. Do you honestly think Enda and Co give a shirra about LGBT people?

matrim

jobbridge4life wrote: »

So you are going to punish innocent strangers to achieve absolutely nothing in relation to the source of your irritation.

I'm pretty sure someone who uses this as an excuse to vote no to marriage equality was never going to vote yes. This is just the excuse they will use to justify it

Daith

LordNorbury wrote: »

I'll be joining you in voting no. People who think that these sort of issues should not be generally connected and that a voter does not have the right to punish the government by way of a referendum

You're not punishing the Government.

You punish the Government in a General Election.

The_Captain

The_Captain wrote: »

It was, but we've moved on from that. Ironically enough, gouging from publicans has helped speed up the process of people finding better things to do than go to pubs.

Most of my socialising is done outside of pubs now, whereas a few years ago it would have been at least 90% pub/nightclub.

Pub is still king among both my friends from home and my work friends (all late 20's, early 30's). I would be in pubs basically every week and more than once a lot of weeks. City pubs are still packed at weekends, mid week they are quieter but always a few around.

Good local pubs in rural area always have a reasonable crowd too especially at weekend.

I see for both my younger sisters friends also pubs are still where they go.

People are at home everyday of the week sitting at home in the same seat is boring. It doesn't suit groups of people meeting up coming from different places (how to they get home?), you cant have loud music, you cant get proper Guinness on top, you cant change venue, you don't bump into other people etc etc etc.

I'm happy enough paying 4 to 5 euro a pint to be honest (i'd obviously rather if it was less), I'm doing it week in week out and I'm so used to it at this stage I don't take notice. I still hate this minimum pricing though as I like to be able to get cheap cans for the house or someones house if I am staying in for a cheap weekend.

jobbridge4life

matrim wrote: »

I'm pretty sure someone who uses this as an excuse to vote no to marriage equality was never going to vote yes. This is just the excuse they will use to justify it

Perhaps but that there are people out there that feel comfortable talking about capriciously denying other people their rights so as to make some sort of 'protest' against Government policy on alcohol is frightening to me.

Cantona's Collars

Xenji wrote: »

Gonna have to start homebrewing my own beer now.

Honestly though if they are gonna have a set price in supermarkets and off-licences, then pubs should no longer be allowed to sell pints at €3 or less as this also encourages binge drinking.

That's why they brought in IW,can't have you using that valuable water for making beer.

Magico Gonzalez

jobbridge4life wrote: »

Perhaps but that there are people out there that feel comfortable talking about capriciously denying other people their rights so as to make some sort of 'protest' against Government policy on alcohol is frightening to me.

The spitefulness of it is quite breathtaking.

LordNorbury

jobbridge4life wrote: »

That has to be the most selfish and nasty thing I have ever read. This isn't like any other referendum, its people, ordinary people just like yourself and their families that you will be punishing. Do you honestly think Enda and Co give a shirra about LGBT people?

It's very simple really, don't expect to be able to lie to me, and fúck me over for 3-4 years and then expect my cooperation on other matters, that is my right and I will connect these kind of concerns as I see fit.

fran oconnor

obriendj wrote: »

Also People want to stay fitter and healthy get up early go for a run or cycle. There is more things to do these days than go to a pub.

Haven't had a drink since Christmas, I'm planning om calling over to friends this weekend for a beer or three. I have joined a gym and have started to get fitter over this time losing 15lbs in the process. I think at this stage I'm entitled to a reasonably priced jar. After all I and many others pay to keep myself in a healthy state.

Daith

LordNorbury wrote: »

It's very simple really, don't expect to be able to lie to me, and fúck me over for 3-4 years and then expect my cooperation on other matters, that is my right and I will connect these kind of concerns as I see fit.

It's nice to have rights isn't?

Standman

Yes, I'm sure this new legislation is all to do with concern for our health and nothing whatsoever to do with lobbying from the Vintners Association.

LordNorbury

To anyone who thinks I'm being spiteful, the gloves have come off as far as I'm concerned with this government, all goodwill is gone so be careful how you treat people because you never know what opportunity they will use to kick you in the face if an opportunity comes along.

VinLieger

LordNorbury wrote: »

It's very simple really, don't expect to be able to lie to me, and fúck me over for 3-4 years and then expect my cooperation on other matters, that is my right and I will connect these kind of concerns as I see fit.

The two issues are completely seperate and no matter how much your tiny brain thinks it will the reality is voting no to marriage equality as a protest vote will have zero impact on any other government policies

Daith

LordNorbury wrote: »

To anyone who thinks I'm being spiteful, the gloves have come off as far as I'm concerned with this government, all goodwill is gone so be careful how you treat people because you never know what opportunity they will use to kick you in the face if an opportunity comes along.

So your answer to being treated badly is to treat LGBT people badly?

jobbridge4life

LordNorbury wrote: »

It's very simple really, don't expect to be able to lie to me, and fúck me over for 3-4 years and then expect my cooperation on other matters, that is my right and I will connect these kind of concerns as I see fit.

Go ahead as you said its your right but do so knowing... a. your 'protest' is utterly pointless and doomed to irrelevance b. you won't piss off the Government (any more than a bad poll rating would anyway) c. you will have deliberately targeted a vulnerable minority and contributed to their continuing marginalization, d. there are plenty of LGBT people who both want to marry and have some cheap ****ing booze!

mikom

"Dad, why can I not marry my same sex partner?"

"Well you see, son/daughter, there's this thing called spite"

fran oconnor

mikom wrote: »

I await a maximum price ruling on fruit and veg gyms, soccer balls........

Next they will do away with the cycle to work allowance on tax. Anything that involves enjoyment will be taxed.

jobbridge4life

mikom wrote: »

"Dad, why can I not marry my same sex partner?"

"Well you see, son/daughter, there's this thing called spite"

'ah the old spite and vodka, my old favourite, not that I can afford it anymore'

jackofalltrades

matrim wrote: »

I disagree with this move too but The vast majority of people buying a few craft beers or a bottle of wine won't see any change because of this. The vast majority of craft beers and wine are above the proposed limits

It's hard to find the average cost of a bottle of wine. But according to this:

According to the report 22 litres is the average wine consumption per adult and 75% of the wine purchased in Ireland costs between €7 and €10.99 a bottle.

Considering they're looking at a minimum price for wine in the region of about €8.80, that's going to affect the vast majority.

fran oconnor

jobbridge4life wrote: »

That has to be the most selfish and nasty thing I have ever read. This isn't like any other referendum, its people, ordinary people just like yourself and their families that you will be punishing. Do you honestly think Enda and Co give a shirra about LGBT people?

This shouldn't be an attack on his sexuality, If you want to hurt him and the present government vote them out, but don't punish a large amount of the public because of who they are.

Timmyctc

I dont think ive seen a political party actively take as many steps as possible to ensure they wont be in power come the next general election

fran oconnor

Daith wrote: »

It's nice to have rights isn't?

Well said.

Eutow

LordNorbury wrote: »

It's very simple really, don't expect to be able to lie to me, and fúck me over for 3-4 years and then expect my cooperation on other matters, that is my right and I will connect these kind of concerns as I see fit.

LordNorbury wrote: »

To anyone who thinks I'm being spiteful, the gloves have come off as far as I'm concerned with this government, all goodwill is gone so be careful how you treat people because you never know what opportunity they will use to kick you in the face if an opportunity comes along.

This is why Ireland continually gets the same type of stupid gombeen politican. Voting on a referendum is not about cooperating or not cooperating with a governement. It should be about your beliefes and how a new law will impact your life and greater society.

Do you think FG give a sh!t if this upcoming referendum passes or not? They are still going to be there, and they will still try and pass stupid laws such as this minimum pricing, hopefully, the EU tells them where to go.

Also, plenty of gay and trans-gender people are probably pissed off about this minimum pricing policy as well, so you are punishing these people who agree with you. You are not punishing the government.

These people have as much right to be unhappy as married straight people.