Why do people even smoke cigarettes?

--Kaiser--

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

Typical self-important attitude - smokers wouldn't appreciate it if I decide to spit all the time while walking down the street, but hey - it's my freedom to do so, isn't it? And if you get caught in the way of my spit and phlegm, well tough titties to you.

Ridiculous analogy is ridiculous.

I hope you don't live in a city or town with any automobile traffic. Breathing exhaust fumes is much worse than any brief wisp of second hand smoke than might find it's way up your nose.

Jimmy Bottlehead

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

Ridiculous analogy is ridiculous.

I hope you don't live in a city or town with any automobile traffic. Breathing exhaust fumes is much worse than any brief wisp of second hand smoke than might find it's way up your nose.

I live in Dublin, exhaust fumes never bother me. Cigarette smoke bothers me. Funny to see how defensive smokers get... and as for the spit anology being ridiculous? Pfftt. Just because you're at ease with your disgusting smoke doesn't mean the rest of us are. It's ****ing filthy.

liah

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

Typical self-important attitude - smokers wouldn't appreciate it if I decide to spit all the time while walking down the street, but hey - it's my freedom to do so, isn't it? And if you get caught in the way of my spit and phlegm, well tough titties to you.

I don't care if you spit on the street. Hell, my ex used to do it-- I didn't love it, but ultimately there's far more important things in life to be worried about.

If you don't like smokers, don't:
a) go to the smoking area of pubs,
b) stand around outside where the smokers are,
c) hang out with smokers while they're smoking.

They're surprisingly easy to avoid since they tend to cluster together in groups. A bit of cop-on and they're not a bother at all.

I can't believe I'm still arguing this, I can't remember the last fag I smoked :pac:

Jimmy Bottlehead

liah wrote: »

I don't care if you spit on the street. Hell, my ex used to do it-- I didn't love it, but ultimately there's far more important things in life to be worried about.

If you don't like smokers, don't:
a) go to the smoking area of pubs,
b) stand around outside where the smokers are,
c) hang out with smokers while they're smoking.

They're surprisingly easy to avoid since they tend to cluster together in groups. A bit of cop-on and they're not a bother at all.

I can't believe I'm still arguing this, I can't remember the last fag I smoked :pac:

My point was, don't get offended if I spit ON you. Sure it's only for a moment, you shouldn't be any more offended than if someone puffs smoke in your face.

And I do avoid those places - what gets me is how smokers think it's fine to spark up next to a group of people at a bus-stop, etc. It's so inconsiderate.

ScumLord

positron wrote: »

How cheap is your lungs though?

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_EvZPNndO0AU/S8gu2t3FH5I/AAAAAAAAAOk/5zGZqimmp8Q/s400/11257767.JPG

I got mine for free.

Promac wrote: »

You can say what you like to justify killing yourself but it's not just you.

The average smoker goes through 20+ a day and it's not just their own health they're messing with. There's an article in the Irish Times today about it: http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2010/1126/breaking9.html

"Passive smoking claims more than 600,000 lives each year around the world — an estimated 1 per cent of all deaths, a study by the Word Health Organistation (WHO) has found."

1 out of every 100 deaths around the world is caused by passive smoking - not even smoking itself, just being around other people who smoke. And most of them are children.




Live and let live is a great concept but you aren't doing it. As long as people smoke kids will keep on picking up the addiction and people will keep getting killed by it. It's not a bad habit we're talking about here, it's not like leaving the toilet-seat up or drinking out of the milk bottle. It's a very serious addiction that is killing over 5 million people a year.

Lets just take a look at how useless the information in your post is in relation to this thread. Now I'm not going to argue that a child stuck in a room with a smoking parent for 2 decades isn't going to be at risk, they are but that's outside of the states responsibility and has nothing to do with the argument that someone smoking outside in the open air can have an effect on a non smoker that walks through their 2nd hand smoke briefly.

As the article itself says,

Dr Annette Pruss-Ustun, from the WHO in Geneva, Switzerland, and her fellow authors wrote: “Exposure to second-hand smoke is still one of the most common indoor pollutants worldwide.

The article clearly states the majority of these deaths are occurring in poor countries where children are treated as work slaves. Where employees have no rights and there's no such thing as health and safety.

The only reason the smoking ban was brought in here was to protect the staff that worked in pubs not the customers who went to the pub. It takes long term exposure to 2nd hand smoke to cause any damage. Any one who complains about being in smoke for any less than a minute is just being sensitive and argumentative from on top their high horse. They've nothing to complain about other than a smell they don't like.

positron wrote: »

Can we all agree that addictions are not accidents?

If so, I know this is going to sound very fascist, but I am going to say it anyway - the state should NOT pay for the various illnesses and deceases that one brings on themselves by smoking.

The state should spend money saved there on providing facilities to encourage people to quit smoking instead. And if someone decides that they want to continue smoking, why should the tax payer pay for their health issues?

I agree that hospitals should act more like health centres that try to prevent problems rather than play catch up but health care must always be universal, I think it's disgusting to deny someone health care because you don't like their lifestyle. I don't want to live in a country where we are expected to step over the sick and dying and it's something I'll never do.

There's no point in having a health service if your going to deny people access to it.

Pace2008

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

My point was, don't get offended if I spit ON you. Sure it's only for a moment, you shouldn't be any more offended than if someone puffs smoke in your face.

I would be as the former is intentionally malicious whereas the latter is, as you say, inconsiderate.

ScumLord

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

My point was, don't get offended if I spit ON you. Sure it's only for a moment, you shouldn't be any more offended than if someone puffs smoke in your face.

And I do avoid those places - what gets me is how smokers think it's fine to spark up next to a group of people at a bus-stop, etc. It's so inconsiderate.

It's completely different, spitting on someone is a mark of disrespect and invitation to get your head boxed in. Doing that carries bad meanings in every culture because the human mouth is very dangerous when it comes to spreading disease.

The only reason smoke bothers you so much is because you've got a bee in your bonett about it. Your fine with fumes just as toxic like car fumes in much greater volume which shows your able to become accustomed to bad smells and fumes you've just been psychologically preped to hate cigarette smoke.

RobbieTheRobber

I smoke because im cool!

Imagine this scene there are two identical young baby boys identical except in one way.
One of these boys has a cigerrete the other doesnt, which baby is the cool baby?

Canis Lupus

One of my best friends has gone back on them after being off for months and months. I'm so ****ing annoyed at her right now.... bleh, stupid tobacco.

Anyway **** em. When they're in hospital with their own bodies growing tumours in their lungs I'll be willing to say 2 things will be safe bets:
1: They'll have given up cigs instantly and oddly they'll no longer need tobacco to concentrate/calm themselves/give themselves something to do etc

2:They'll wish fervently they never started or tried harder to give them up before.

Son Of A Vidic

I love these hypocrites who attack smokers, these same people might enjoy a drink or ten perhaps. So therefore - Why do they drink? Why would anyone ask such stupid questions? People drink/smoke for their own pleasure/reasons, reasons which are no business of mine nor anyone else. So personal freedom Nazi Police, please fcuk off! We already have enough Nazi's from the IMF and the ECB influencing our lives as it is.


(I'm a non-smoker btw)

--Kaiser--

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

I live in Dublin, exhaust fumes never bother me. Cigarette smoke bothers me. Funny to see how defensive smokers get... and as for the spit anology being ridiculous? Pfftt. Just because you're at ease with your disgusting smoke doesn't mean the rest of us are. It's ****ing filthy.

Who says I'm a smoker BTW? It's possible to be a non-smoker and not throw a hissy fit whenever someone smokes in your general vicinity.

Jimmy Bottlehead

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

Who says I'm a smoker BTW? It's possible to be a non-smoker and not throw a hissy fit whenever someone smokes in your general vicinity.

Of course. But a lot of smokers ASSUME everyone is ok with it, like you are. Lies.

And to me, lighting up in a group of strangers is as disrespectful as spitting on someone. It's rude, inconsiderate, and prickish.

If people wanna smoke, I've no problem with that, but kindly bugger off somewhere where you won't bother the rest of us.

Duggy747

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

Of course. But a lot of smokers assholes ASSUME everyone is ok with it, like you are. Lies.

Don't tar smokers with assholes who have no respect. The average smoker knows not to spark up in a house that's not his unless he's allowed, even so I don't feel right and if I have to smoke I go outside. We also know people's attitude towards us which you've been clearly stressing in this thread.

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote:

And to me, lighting up in a group of strangers is as disrespectful as spitting on someone. It's rude, inconsiderate, and prickish.

If anyone spat on me I would smash their head in. If someone sparked a fag near me, even when I was off them, it wouldn't bother me. ESPECIALLY if it's in public space, no different if someone had loud headphones or if they were eating a greasy, smelly piece of food. I've never come across a smoker sparking up a fag in a stranger's house, nobody except ingorant fùckers do that...........even then it's extremely rare.

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote:

If people wanna smoke, I've no problem with that, but kindly bugger off somewhere where you won't bother the rest of us.

We have smoking areas and, in the case of pubs and clubs, that's where the best craíc is had. We don't go there so we won't bother you but so we don't have to look at your sour, joyless face :pac:

Canis Lupus

medicman2009 wrote: »

I love these hypocrites who attack smokers, these same people might enjoy a drink or ten perhaps. So therefore - Why do they drink? Why would anyone ask such stupid questions? People drink/smoke for their own pleasure/reasons, reasons which are no business of mine nor anyone else. So personal freedom Nazi Police, please fcuk off! We already have enough Nazi's from the IMF and the ECB influencing our lives as it is.


(I'm a non-smoker btw)

I'm an ex smoker and I drink to get drunk and merry which is what alcohol facilitates and the tradeoff is the potential damage to your liver. If you drink in moderation serious liver damage is unlikely AND there's no impact on others around you.

As an exsmoker I can safely assure you that the reasons people give to smoke are simply just in their head but they'll never realise that till they quit and stay off them for a while until their bodies remember what it was like to live without tobacco. The tradeoff for these imaginary reasons to smoke is a vastly increased chance of dying horribly and prematurely and not only will smoking harm you but also others around you although this impact has been greatly reduced in public places like bars etc.

But ultimately it's their choice.

ScumLord

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

If people wanna smoke, I've no problem with that, but kindly bugger off somewhere where you won't bother the rest of us.

We already do, once we're in the great outdoors you have no argument against smoking other than you don't like it.

Pace2008

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

And to me, lighting up in a group of strangers is as disrespectful as spitting on someone. It's rude, inconsiderate, and prickish.

If people wanna smoke, I've no problem with that, but kindly bugger off somewhere where you won't bother the rest of us.

It’s already been explained that a universal act of aggression is not the same as a lack of respect for others. Spitting on someone would be analogous to squaring up with them and blowing smoke in their face.

Personally, I’d always keep my distance from the crowd when smoking in a busy spot like a bus stop, I’d always go outside for a smoke if I was in someone else’s house (and my own, for that matter), and I wouldn’t light in a car if there were other smokers with me. Some smokers may not even realise they’re bothering others by smoking in close proximity. If someone’s smoking right beside you, say it to them, politely, that it’s bothering you. Smokers aren’t some entirely different species; they’re normal people, and most people are reasonable if you’re reasonable with them.

Jimmy Bottlehead

Pace2008 wrote: »

Personally, I’d always keep my distance from the crowd when smoking in a busy spot like a bus stop, I’d always go outside for a smoke if I was in someone else’s house (and my own, for that matter), and I wouldn’t light in a car if there were other smokers with me. Some smokers may not even realise they’re bothering others by smoking in close proximity. If someone’s smoking right beside you, say it to them, politely, that it’s bothering you. Smokers aren’t some entirely different species; they’re normal people, and most people are reasonable if you’re reasonable with them.

Actually did this to some old biddy at a bus-stop and she got thick over it. The comforting thing is that, sooner than should be, she'll be six feet under.

Pace2008

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

Actually did this to some old biddy at a bus-stop and she got thick over it. The comforting thing is that, sooner than should be, she'll be six feet under. [IMG]file:///C:/Users/dubacpxe/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/IMG]

Some people are knobends, that'll never change.

I'd say you'd generally have less luck trying this with older people. They come from a generation where there seemed to be some social hierarchy based on age, and young people were expected to defer to their elders.

Promac

ScumLord wrote: »

... once we're in the great outdoors you have no argument against smoking other than you don't like it.

Try walking down Henry street this christmas without having to breathe in some f*ckers smoke or count how many bins have a pile of smouldering butts in the ashtray on top causing a huge cloud of smoke in the area so that you have to hold your breath for a good 30% of the time. How would you react if someone was walking along beside you with a big plate of fresh turd and wafting the scent in your direction? And not just one person either - say every 5th or so person was walking along with a big pile of steaming sh*te and wafting it all directions. I doubt you'd see it the same way then - but cig smoke smells just as bad to a non-smoker.

Standing in a smoking area outside a bar is all well and good but when you're walking through a crowd of people while smoking you're being a nuisance and a menace. Smokers don't realise how toxic and putrid cigarette smoke is because they all think it's lovely but it really is rancid if you don't smoke.

elekid

I think the problem is that cigarette smoke affects some people more than others (like 3D movies!). I know people who don't smoke and have no problem being around smokers, but I have always found the smell of the smoke makes me quite nauseous and I can't endure it for long. Even a whiff on the street can turn my stomach but I can usually avoid it by holding my breath and speeding up for a few seconds to get past. Car fumes are disgusting too but they don't have that immediate effect on me so they don't bother me near as much.

All the smokers I know are very considerate about it (there are so many ridiculous generalisations from both sides on this thread) but it's not fair to say that the smell isn't that bad or anyone who complains is just being too sensitive, because that's not true for everyone.

Promac

liah wrote: »

You are not going to die from second-hand smoke just from passing for a few seconds it on the streets (again, just can't picture anyone being dumb enough to stand around smokers if they're non-smokers). The majority of those cases are family cases where people have been smoking in the home. That seems to be decreasing lately. I don't know anyone, really, who smokes inside their houses if there's non-smokers present.

It occurs, but lesser than it did, and education is the key to minimizing the effect of smoke on people who choose not to smoke. Banning never solves anything, it will always be available (much cheaper, btw) on the black market. Educate people, don't nanny them.

I believe people should have the right to choose what they put into their own bodies. If that means some people are going to be assholes about it, that's unfortunate, but that's life. Drink-driving kills millions a year all over the world, alcoholism destroys families and escalated violence in millions of homes, no one's banning drink even though it has potential to cause serious harm to others. I don't want it banned.

I believe in freedom, and that's all there is to it.

This thread is nothing to do with freedom - the guy asked why people smoke.

Tell us this though - do you think you should be free to do heroin whenever you want? How about walking along a street smoking a crack-pipe or snortin a bag of glue?

Those kinds of drugs are illegal because they're so dangerous but cigarettes are as bad, if not worse because of them being legal.

Why do kids take up smoking? A large part of the reason is that they see older kids and adults walkin around enjoying a fag. Do you have any kids of your own? Would you be happy if they started smoking? Shouldn't they be free to smoke too?

liah

Promac wrote: »

Try walking down Henry street this christmas without having to breathe in some f*ckers smoke or count how many bins have a pile of smouldering butts in the ashtray on top causing a huge cloud of smoke in the area so that you have to hold your breath for a good 30% of the time. How would you react if someone was walking along beside you with a big plate of fresh turd and wafting the scent in your direction? And not just one person either - say every 5th or so person was walking along with a big pile of steaming sh*te and wafting it all directions. I doubt you'd see it the same way then - but cig smoke smells just as bad to a non-smoker.

Standing in a smoking area outside a bar is all well and good but when you're walking through a crowd of people while smoking you're being a nuisance and a menace. Smokers don't realise how toxic and putrid cigarette smoke is because they all think it's lovely but it really is rancid if you don't smoke.

I may find the stench of alcohol horrible but it's pretty impossible to avoid after a certain time of day on a saturday night. I don't judge the people who drink it, though.
I loathe the smell of a lot of deodorants/perfumes people wear, but just because I don't like the smell of it doesn't mean I expect everyone to stop wearing it.
I hate the smell of exhaust and pollution, which are far more damaging than cigs for non-smokers, but I don't expect people to stop driving just because I may be put out.
I hate the smell of a lot of things but not once have I ever assumed that just because I don't like it that it somehow means everyone who does like it is a horrible, disgusting person, or that the thing I don't like the smell of should be banned or removed from society. I just think about something else and move on.

Unless you're indoors the second-hand smoke will have no lasting effect on you as you're only in it for milliseconds at a time. You are literally complaining about just the smell. Do you have any idea how ridiculous that sounds?

You don't like something and expect everyone else in the world to bend to your will, even though we already are designated to only using smoking areas (where a non-smoker has no business being) or the outdoors (where second-hand smoke is ineffective). There are no public places in Ireland (that I'm aware of) that allow smoking indoors. We've already bent enough. You don't have the right to tell people what to do if they are not affecting you directly. And a smell does not count, either; everyone has to deal with arbitrary scents they personally don't like on a daily basis. You get over it.

Promac

liah wrote: »

I may find the stench of alcohol horrible but it's pretty impossible to avoid after a certain time of day on a saturday night. I don't judge the people who drink it, though.
I loathe the smell of a lot of deodorants/perfumes people wear, but just because I don't like the smell of it doesn't mean I expect everyone to stop wearing it.
I hate the smell of exhaust and pollution, which are far more damaging than cigs for non-smokers, but I don't expect people to stop driving just because I may be put out.
I hate the smell of a lot of things but not once have I ever assumed that just because I don't like it that it somehow means everyone who does like it is a horrible, disgusting person, or that the thing I don't like the smell of should be banned or removed from society. I just think about something else and move on.

Unless you're indoors the second-hand smoke will have no lasting effect on you as you're only in it for milliseconds at a time. You are literally complaining about just the smell. Do you have any idea how ridiculous that sounds?

You don't like something and expect everyone else in the world to bend to your will, even though we already are designated to only using smoking areas (where a non-smoker has no business being) or the outdoors (where second-hand smoke is ineffective). There are no public places in Ireland (that I'm aware of) that allow smoking indoors. We've already bent enough. You don't have the right to tell people what to do if they are not affecting you directly. And a smell does not count, either; everyone has to deal with arbitrary scents they personally don't like on a daily basis. You get over it.

Who's telling you what to do? I'm not. I already said I'm an ex-smoker so I've obviously run around doing the same things and would be a massive hypocrite if I expected others to do otherwise.

Now that I realise it though I can see what an utter wanker I was for doing it and I enjoy pointing it out to people who still smoke. I find it extremely entertaining to watch people justifying why they smoke and moan about how they've been kicked out into the cold. The logical gymnastics of some people on here (you're one of the better ones, just so you know) is astounding. Keep 'er lit, as the saying goes. You'll have a very entertaining life and a spectacularly ugly death.

liah

Promac wrote: »

This thread is nothing to do with freedom - the guy asked why people smoke.

Tell us this though - do you think you should be free to do heroin whenever you want? How about walking along a street smoking a crack-pipe or snortin a bag of glue?

Those kinds of drugs are illegal because they're so dangerous but cigarettes are as bad, if not worse because of them being legal.

Why do kids take up smoking? A large part of the reason is that they see older kids and adults walkin around enjoying a fag. Do you have any kids of your own? Would you be happy if they started smoking? Shouldn't they be free to smoke too?

Are you seriously comparing cigs to heroin?

Smokers can live long, happy lives and contribute to society in the exact same way as non-smokers can. Heroin addicts, on the other hand, do not live happy lives, nor can contribute to, or even interact properly with, society. They are a slave to their drug and think of or consider nothing else. The destruction of the body does not take long, and it destroys the lives of not only the user, but their families, friends and community it inevitably spreads to.

You're being utterly hysterical if that is seriously the argument you're going to use.

I believe people should be able to smoke marijuana as well as partake in the use of other low-level drugs, such as pure E. It's hypocritical to have fags and alcohol legal and not those which are far less harmful (and in the case of marijuana, even beneficial).

I would agree with mushrooms, acid, salvia and other hallucinogens being legal if they were sold and used only in controlled environments, like ibogaine clinics in North America. For now I think they're a bit much to be selling to the general population, but they'll never go off the black market.

I will never agree with heroin or meth being made legal. They're too debilitating, as a rule.

Regardless, I believe this nanny business is just turning adults into children. I think more people need to experience things and realize that most things aren't really as bad as they're made out to be. There also needs to be far less scaremongering in regards to drugs and more actual education on the side effects, pros, cons, actual contents, and histories of the drug.

Same argument can be used against abstinence-only education, if this clarifies my point at all: Teach them about sex and they do it responsibly, tell them not to do it at all and they do it anyway and come away with a baby or ridden with STDs at the age of 13.

The same applies to drugs, and pretty much everything else.

EDIT: And yep, if my kid turned 18 and honestly wanted a pack of cigs, I'd buy them their first pack. It's their decision as an adult. I will, of course, have armed them with the facts beforehand, but it's not my job to control other people's lives.

liah

Promac wrote: »

Who's telling you what to do? I'm not. I already said I'm an ex-smoker so I've obviously run around doing the same things and would be a massive hypocrite if I expected others to do otherwise.

Now that I realise it though I can see what an utter wanker I was for doing it and I enjoy pointing it out to people who still smoke. I find it extremely entertaining to watch people justifying why they smoke and moan about how they've been kicked out into the cold. The logical gymnastics of some people on here (you're one of the better ones, just so you know) is astounding. Keep 'er lit, as the saying goes. You'll have a very entertaining life and a spectacularly ugly death.

So wait, you realised you were being a wanker before, so now you're acting like even more of a wanker by preaching at people, calling them (roughly a quarter of the entire population of Ireland) disgusting and stupid?

Makes sense. :pac:

dark crystal

Promac wrote: »

Now that I realise it though I can see what an utter wanker I was for doing it and I enjoy pointing it out to people who still smoke. I find it extremely entertaining to watch people justifying why they smoke and moan about how they've been kicked out into the cold. The logical gymnastics of some people on here (you're one of the better ones, just so you know) is astounding. Keep 'er lit, as the saying goes. You'll have a very entertaining life and a spectacularly ugly death.

So we know you're an ex smoker (gotta love 'em...), does that mean you're an ex wanker too?

Between you being entertained by watching and listening to smokers and the smokers having a very entertaining life, I suspect we all win here, eh?

Promac

liah wrote: »

So wait, you realised you were being a wanker before, so now you're acting like even more of a wanker by preaching at people, calling them (roughly a quarter of the entire population of Ireland) disgusting and stupid?

Makes sense. :pac:

I'm just joining in on a thread about smoking on AH - if you think I'm a wanker for it, good for you.

And what I actually said in a previous post was that anyone who smokes is stupid, foolish a coward or all three. Even when I was smoking I couldn't think of a single good reason for doing it. I knew well the only enjoyment I got out of it was due to the addiction.

I don't think all smokers are disgusting - I think the smell of cigarette smoke is disgusting. That's a massive difference.

Promac

dark crystal wrote: »

So we know you're an ex smoker (gotta love 'em...), does that mean you're an ex wanker too?

I wouldn't say so, no. I can be a total twat when I want to be and the best part is that it's fun.

Jimmy Bottlehead

Promac wrote: »

I don't think all smokers are disgusting - I think the smell of cigarette smoke is disgusting. That's a massive difference.

I, on the other hand, find it repulsive. Fact is, I'd **** someone who smoked (as long as they got rid of the smell and never did it near me) but I'd never ever consider being in a relationship with them. It's muck.

liah

You say the only enjoyment you got out of it was because of addiction. What, then, do you think the reason was I smoke? I'm not addicted, have never experienced withdrawal and cravings, have smoked for a week then none for months with no problems.

Clearly I'm not the only smoker like this, but you still choose to label me as stupid because the only reason must be addiction.

I find branding a quarter of the population as "stupid" because of a bad habit stupid, to be frank. Everybody has their flaws, but it's no reason at all to write them all off and insult them in one sweeping blow.