Speed camera mega-thread ***Read first post before posting***

dr.fuzzenstein

I'm all for cameras to catch people breaking red lights, in Ireland we treat red as advisory, no more than 3-4 cars after the lights change, sure, be grand, like.
Trust me, in Germany you'd stop on yellow, because getting caught going through a red is simply not worth it.
https://www.bussgeldkatalog.org/rote-ampel/
€90 if you've just missed the yellow and €200 or more with points and a month off the road if you endanger someone or it has been red for more than a second. Seems fair to me.

ironclaw

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I'm all for cameras to catch people breaking red lights, in Ireland we treat red as advisory, no more than 3-4 cars after the lights change, sure, be grand, like.
Trust me, in Germany you'd stop on yellow, because getting caught going through a red is simply not worth it.
https://www.bussgeldkatalog.org/rote-ampel/
€90 if you've just missed the yellow and €200 or more with points and a month off the road if you endanger someone or it has been red for more than a second. Seems fair to me.

The problem is, speaking from an American context, is that is too cut and dry. For instance, you go to cross a junction and the person ahead jams on or unknown to you, you just get caught out and can't clear the junction. As often happens in traffic, then snap and your done. Same in the wet, if you are coming at the limit and its just too dangerous to stop e.g. Artic lorry up your rear and the lights go orange.

In that instance its unfair as there is no leiency. Unlike speed where you are speeding, end of, in the case of lights and junctions there has to be some human decision making.

dr.fuzzenstein

ironclaw wrote: »

The problem is, speaking from an American context, is that is too cut and dry. For instance, you go to cross a junction and the person ahead jams on or unknown to you, you just get caught out and can't clear the junction. As often happens in traffic, then snap and your done. Same in the wet, if you are coming at the limit and its just too dangerous to stop e.g. Artic lorry up your rear and the lights go orange.

In that instance its unfair as there is no leiency. Unlike speed where you are speeding, end of, in the case of lights and junctions there has to be some human decision making.

It's very cut and dry. It's easy to approach a junction at the appropriate speed to stop in time, this should be second nature after a handful of driving lessons.
I do break the red light in Ireland, because I don't want to wait an extra five minutes and o know I can get away with it.
I wouldn't pull that sh*t in Germany I can tell you now.
I do however see one difficulty. If there is a camera and an ambulance behind me.

ironclaw

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I do however see one difficulty. If there is a camera and an ambulance behind me.

So its not cut and dry. Do you sit there? Or do you move and take the points?

From my experience in America, sitting at a few junctions, I'd call 7/10 flashes I observed as unfair. They have their uses, no question, but it would want to record a much larger field of view, 10s either side of the offence and it would want to be manually reviewed or at least give the defendant due process if they wanted to challenge it. All of which would be hopelessly badly implemented in Ireland.

runawaybishop

ironclaw wrote: »

So its not cut and dry. Do you sit there? Or do you move and take the points?

From my experience in America, sitting at a few junctions, I'd call 7/10 flashes I observed as unfair. They have their uses, no question, but it would want to record a much larger field of view, 10s either side of the offence and it would want to be manually reviewed or at least give the defendant due process if they wanted to challenge it. All of which would be hopelessly badly implemented in Ireland.

Option C: You move and don't get points once you clarify that there was an ambulance approaching and its verified by the system.

ironclaw

runawaybishop wrote: »

Option C: You move and don't get points once you clarify that there was an ambulance approaching and its verified by the system.

Do you honestly believe they would allow that? Or better yet, have the know how to put together a system that would allow that type of recourse? C'mon now, we can barely implement a country wide speed camera network. Lets not get ahead of ourselves. Cynical, yes but we are completely inept in this country when it comes to any form of enforcement or embracement of technology. ANPR was touted as cutting edge, we were doing that in the early 90s. Tetra the same story, AirWave was in the UK a good 5 years before hand and its a far superior system.

List is endless as are the fiasco's.

runawaybishop

ironclaw wrote: »

Do you honestly believe they would allow that? Or better yet, have the know how to put together a system that would allow that type of recourse? C'mon now, we can barely implement a country wide speed camera network. Lets not get ahead of ourselves. Cynical, yes but we are completely inept in this country when it comes to any form of enforcement or embracement of technology. ANPR was touted as cutting edge, we were doing that in the early 90s. Tetra the same story, AirWave was in the UK a good 5 years before hand and its a far superior system.

List is endless as are the fiasco's.

If the camera can spot you breaking the red light it can spot the ambulance doing the same.

dr.fuzzenstein

ironclaw wrote: »

So its not cut and dry. Do you sit there? Or do you move and take the points?

From my experience in America, sitting at a few junctions, I'd call 7/10 flashes I observed as unfair. They have their uses, no question, but it would want to record a much larger field of view, 10s either side of the offence and it would want to be manually reviewed or at least give the defendant due process if they wanted to challenge it. All of which would be hopelessly badly implemented in Ireland.

Ok, it is almost cut and dry.
But I have been in that situation maybe twice in my life and in Germany never.
It really is easy, green, go, yellow, caution, red, duh, stop.
Anyone who now says "there was another car, the sun was blinding me, I was having my period" or any other lame excuse, sorry, points.
Lemme check on the ambulance thing.

dr.fuzzenstein

Besides, we need a bit of fascistic enforcement of the rules of the road, just to hammer it into peoples heads that rules, lights and street signs are not just there for a joke.
There will be the usual pissing and moaning on Joe Duffy to the tune of "I was only in the shop for a minute, 'tis a disgrace, I pay may taxes, I have a right to drive how I want", yeah, yeah, pay up and shut up.

dr.fuzzenstein

Ok, checked it.
I sometimes forget that I come from a country that is not completely obsessed by rules and allows for common sense, unlike Ireland.
If you move over the line and get flashed because of an emergence vehicle, you merely notify the authorities, who shouldn't have bothered you in the first place, because the ambulance would also be in the picture, or at any rate, the next one.

edit
In fact you are legally obliged to move for an emergency vehicle. You could find yourself in trouble if you don't.

ironclaw

runawaybishop wrote: »

If the camera can spot you breaking the red light it can spot the ambulance doing the same.

Its a photo, probably two still photos is the usual from Gatso and similar, so no. It will only show you breaking the light. It may also catch the ambulance but you are assuming someone see's the sequence and puts two and two together, which is unlikely.

I'm just wary of stuff like this in Ireland because our track records with technology is patchy at best.

cadaliac

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

...
I sometimes forget that I come from a country that is not completely obsessed by rules and allows for common sense, unlike Ireland.
...........

Really ???
When you memory returns to you and you realize that Germany is built on rules and that they can be anal about rules and regulations, you might also realize that your statement above isn't true.
Ireland is not devoid of common sense- or are you referring to the Irish people in general?
In fact I would go so far as to say the opposite and that Ireland lacks obsession to rules and regulations.

dr.fuzzenstein

cadaliac wrote: »

Really ???
When you memory returns to you and you realize that Germany is built on rules and that they can be anal about rules and regulations, you might also realize that your statement above isn't true.
Ireland is not devoid of common sense- or are you referring to the Irish people in general?
In fact I would go so far as to say the opposite and that Ireland lacks obsession to rules and regulations.

Maybe I put his wrong. In Germany you get a feeling that the rules are there to make sure everyone knows what they're at, the purpose is to give everyone a clear indication as to what the process is and to make sure it all works in a clear and precise manner.
Here it's more like someone said "Oh jaysus we need rules, quick, do a Google search and copy and paste everything"and in the end you get nothing useful out of it.
My favorite example is continuous white lines. In Germany there is an exception for tractors and other slow moving machinery, so the common sense item that you shouldn't have to follow a tractor for 5 miles is built in.
It isn't in Ireland, but everyone overtakes the tractor anyway, because it's the sensible thing to do (so normal people in Ireland DO have sense, except the ones that won't overtake the tractor). The nonsensical issue is, if a Gard felt like screwing you, he absolutely can. Because in Ireland, the rules say there's a white line, if there was a tree in the way, you would, by law, have to sit there till it goes away.
I am with Ironclaw on this one, you never get the sense that whoever works out the regulations cares about them in any way, understands them or considers the impact they may have, as long as they then get to knock off for an early lunch.

runawaybishop

ironclaw wrote: »

Its a photo, probably two still photos is the usual from Gatso and similar, so no. It will only show you breaking the light. It may also catch the ambulance but you are assuming someone see's the sequence and puts two and two together, which is unlikely.

I'm just wary of stuff like this in Ireland because our track records with technology is patchy at best.

No one needs to put two and two together off their own bat, you direct them to it.

dr.fuzzenstein

runawaybishop wrote: »

No one needs to put two and two together off their own bat, you direct them to it.

Just to drag the ambulance thing up again.
You would definitely move for am ambulance in Germany, fine, points and potential liability if you holding up the ambulance has contributed to the condition of the patient getting worse.
So, getting points and fine for breaking red light to let ambulance by, very unlikely.
Sitting there and saying "well, I'm not moving", fine and points guaranteed.
And one thing they should bring in here:
Blocking the hard shoulder and holding up ambulance, €2180.
Nice.

Gazzmonkey

cadaliac wrote: »

Really ???
When you memory returns to you and you realize that Germany is built on rules and that they can be anal about rules and regulations, you might also realize that your statement above isn't true.
Ireland is not devoid of common sense- or are you referring to the Irish people in general?
In fact I would go so far as to say the opposite and that Ireland lacks obsession to rules and regulations.

He's always condescending towards Ireland, ignore his silly delusions.

fmccarthy

Is it not illegal for speed camera vans to park on the hard shoulder. It is illegal for cars to park there unless broken down so surely the same law applies. Would that not make any offences detected while illegally parked inadmissible ?

pa990

fmccarthy wrote: »

Is it not illegal for speed camera vans to park on the hard shoulder. It is illegal for cars to park there unless broken down so surely the same law applies. Would that not make any offences detected while illegally parked inadmissible ?

Its not illegal to park on a hard shoulder of a road (except for a motorway)

mufc1993

Well lads. Just wondering do you know what sort of range the GoSafe vans can reach? I overtook a slow moving vehicle today but in doing so built up speed and was doing 110 I'd say, maybe 115 worst case scenario. Spotted the van less than 100 metres away and broke then to get to 100 straight away. What do ye think ?

Reg'stoy

mufc1993 wrote: »

Well lads. Just wondering do you know what sort of range the GoSafe vans can reach? I overtook a slow moving vehicle today but in doing so built up speed and was doing 110 I'd say, maybe 115 worst case scenario. Spotted the van less than 100 metres away and broke then to get to 100 straight away. What do ye think ?

ironclaw

mufc1993 wrote: »

Spotted the van less than 100 metres away and broke then to get to 100 straight away. What do ye think ?

:rolleyes:

To answer your question, the range of the van is roughly twice the width of the road away.

Esel

ironclaw wrote: »

:rolleyes:

To answer your question, the range of the van is roughly twice the width of the road away.

:rolleyes:

Nino Brown

Here's one from tonight, I was doing 80kmph in an 80kmph zone where there's usually a speed van. The speed van wasn't there tonight so I sped up and was doing 100kmph a few hundred meters before I left the 80 zone and entered the 100 zone, that's at about 4 secs into the clip.
Then about 100 or so meters into the 100 zone, there's a speed van which flashes as I go past, small white flash, must be IR, but looks white. Speed van is in the 100 zone, I'm doing 100 but it still flashes. So did this thing catch me doing 100 in the 80 zone, and take the pic as I pass the van, or does it just flash everybody that passes regardless? Or is it possible that they are trying to catch people just outside the 80kmph zone in the hope that they don't have dash cam footage including GPS co-ordinates to prove they were outside.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DdMhh26q4U

mikeecho

for the last two or three years, they seem to take a pic of every car that passes.

joujoujou

mikeecho wrote: »

[...] they seem to take a pic of every car that passes.

True.

eringobragh

Back in the usual spot on Wednesday - must have been my 10th sighting of them here:




Later that night - just past connolly station - nice and reflective (unlike gosafes * fake * reflectors)

FiReStOrM xIx

I was driving through abbeyleix tonight and a go safe van was in the 50kph zone... didn't see him till i was about 2 metres away! But he was outside the van with what looked like a tripod with a light on top of it setup and the doors open... i was going around 55kph at the time as i took my eyes off the speedometer. ... does this mean I'll get done for speeding or what does it mean when he's outside the van with the doors open?! Could i challenge any potential fine/points or should i just accept it?

Mervyn Skidmore

FiReStOrM xIx wrote: »

I was driving through abbeyleix tonight and a go safe van was in the 50kph zone... didn't see him till i was about 2 metres away! But he was outside the van with what looked like a tripod with a light on top of it setup and the doors open... i was going around 55kph at the time as i took my eyes off the speedometer. ... does this mean I'll get done for speeding or what does it mean when he's outside the van with the doors open?! Could i challenge any potential fine/points or should i just accept it?

You should be grand. Remember, your car will be over-reading by a few kmph anyway.

ironclaw

@FiReStOrM xIx, what you saw was the driving setting up. Its part of the calibration and set up procedure. Camera and system would not even be running at this stage.

TL;DR: You're grand

FiReStOrM xIx

Jesus i hope your right! I'm sick about it all day.... i wouldn't mind only i never go over the speed limit and to get points and a fine over 4 or 5kph would be fairly bad! They 100% don't record until they're inside the van with the door's closed? I can't deny I'll be worried until a few weeks pass