Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread

jolley123

SOB would probably fill in at 8 if Jamie was injured. Most 6s and 8s will tell you that they find both positions similar with 8 offering more chances to carry off the base of the scrum. SOB actually played some of his best rugby at 8 this year. Actually both Brent Pope and Costello think SOB should be 8 for the WC, and Heaslip should be 6. It's an interesting idea, but pretty pointless. Although I guess SOB and Jamie could vary it up in the scrums throughout a game, like they did against Clermont.

Either way, I can't see Wilson or Coughlan getting a call-up. Kidney would put SOB and Leamy ahead of both of them.

roycon

dont think coughlan can feel to aggrieved.id be more upset if i was
roger wilson, jamie hagan or john muldoon

Podge_irl

I guess I just have a think for specialist no.8s. I don't think it's as interchangeable with 6 as others seem to think (though I could quite easily be woefully wrong :P ). SOB looked great at 8 making barrelling runs but Jamie has a bit more nous and I'd sooner have a specialist 8 there is your pack is struggling.

ambid

Jeez quite a lot of cockiness on here about the US & Russia games. Remember Namibia & Georgia anybody...?

ambid

ambid wrote: »

Jeez quite a lot of cockiness on here about the US & Russia games. Remember Namibia & Georgia anybody...?

Still trying my hardest to forget to be honest!

But you're dead right, USA and Russia are there to make up the numbers, their tournament won't go beyond the group stages. They have nothing to lose, and everything to gain. They're playing "their final" in each game, as they'll only really be expected to turn up, and they'll be doing their best to prove everyone wrong.

Frankly though, I don't think their best is good enough, USA were pulverised by the England Saxons a couple of weeks ago, though I don't think that the US team that was put out that day will be too close to the test side at WC time, it was an indicator of the chasm between the US and the Euro teams.

Essentially, the USA and Russia games are the hot potatoes, try to get through them with as little hassle, injuries etc as possible. We shouldn't (famous last words - but not arrogant @Aidric) have to play a full strength side to dispatch either of them, but we shouldn't treat them like gimmes either.

profitius

ambid wrote: »

Jeez quite a lot of cockiness on here about the US & Russia games. Remember Namibia & Georgia anybody...?

The team will be properly prepared for this world cup. And if we're worried about USA and Russia we might as well not turn up for the world cup.

porterbelly

Could Leamy have done any more not to be selected ?

Yet he's still in the squad ? Says alot for the conservatism and blinded loyalty of Kidney. Harder to get in than out. Muldoon over Leamy any day.

thomond2006

porterbelly wrote: »

Could Leamy have done any more not to be selected ?

Yet he's still in the squad ? Says alot for the conservatism and blinded loyalty of Kidney. Harder to get in than out. Muldoon over Leamy any day.

Has Muldoon been playing a lot this season though?

JustinDee

ambid wrote: »

Jeez quite a lot of cockiness on here about the US & Russia games. Remember Namibia & Georgia anybody...?

Yep, well said. All different on the day and each game prepared and played on its merits. When finished, one review then on to the next.

porterbelly

thomond2006 wrote: »

Has Muldoon been playing a lot this season though?

No injured for alot of it but finished the season well. Still though, his form last year should warrant some of respect. When he's got his chance last year he took it, unbelievable v Ba baas, unfortunate to break his arm early v NZ. Leamy's stock has fallen dramatically since then and he's still picked. With respect to Ryan and Coughlan, Ryan is a 2nd row and Coughlan was AIL up to recently and Leamy can't get in the team.

conf101

profitius wrote: »

And if we're worried about USA and Russia we might as well not turn up for the world cup.

Exactly. It's not being cocky. We'll give them total respect and won't treat the game like a formality but Ireland's WC ambitions lie far beyond USA and Russia

wixfjord

conf101 wrote: »

Exactly. It's not being cocky. We'll give them total respect and won't treat the game like a formality but Ireland's WC ambitions lie far beyond USA and Russia

Exactly, and we should be going out with "manic aggression" to smash them in every ruck, make every pass stick, and win by 50+.
As we saw last WC, these games have a big bearing on team morale and conficence, and NZ for eg would go 80 mins and look to beat them by a massive margin. The robot winning mentality is something we've lacked in this country, but with Leinster and Munster's success, and heroes and leaders like BOD, POC and ROG all near the top of their powers, we should be looking to really play every game as if it's a WC final.

PhatPiggins

porterbelly wrote: »

No injured for alot of it but finished the season well. Still though, his form last year should warrant some of respect. When he's got his chance last year he took it, unbelievable v Ba baas, unfortunate to break his arm early v NZ. Leamy's stock has fallen dramatically since then and he's still picked. With respect to Ryan and Coughlan, Ryan is a 2nd row and Coughlan was AIL up to recently and Leamy can't get in the team.

Muldoon isn't an international though. Widely tipped on here to get a beating on the last summer tour and low and behold injured immediately. Great player for Connacht but isn't anywhere near powerful enough. I'd honestly be concerned for his safety against any of the top 6 teams.

Picking Leamy is really taking the piss alright.

porterbelly

PhatPiggins wrote: »

Muldoon isn't an international though. Widely tipped on here to get a beating on the last summer tour and low and behold injured immediately. Great player for Connacht but isn't anywhere near powerful enough. I'd honestly be concerned for his safety against any of the top 6 teams.

Picking Leamy is really taking the piss alright.

Not powerful enough ?

He's one of the most abrasive back row forwards around. He mightn't have the gas of a Ferris or the ball carrying of O'Brien but he's certainly the man you'd want in the trenches with you. He's not one for the flashy stuff ie. offloading and popping up on the wing for tries but he's pure cute, really good at the breakdown, disrupts alot of play, huge workrate and tackle count and a very good lineout operator.

Yes he got injured early in the NZ match. He broke his arm making a tackle but what did he do when he knew he had broken it ? He was straight up on his feet and standing in the defensive line with one arm riddled. That's the kind of man I want putting on the green jersey.

Quint2010

Riskymove wrote: »

because he can cover OH and centre so you save a spot in the squad

So hang on? He can cover OH? So you would propose to have him on the bench as well as O'Gara-in order to cover O'Gara? How is that saving a place in the squad if you are not going to put that extra place on the bench? Wallace hardly saw any game time in the 6N simply because he was there, as you say, to cover our sub OH. But our sub OH didnt get injured so it was a complete waste of a bench spot. Our bench should be 2 props, a hooker, a second and back row, a SH, an OH and a player that can play wing/centre, not a player who can play OH and centre.

durkadurka

By squad he means the 30 man squad not the 22. I agree it's pointless having him on the bench if ROG is also there. The likes of McFadden or fitz are much better options for the 22 shirt.

Quint2010

ambid wrote: »

Jeez quite a lot of cockiness on here about the US & Russia games. Remember Namibia & Georgia anybody...?

Ah come on now lads. We are a miles better team than we were in 2007-even though we nearly won the GS in 2007 I think we were just as close to winning it this year. Robbed against Wales (playinging poorly) and lost narrowly to France out scoring them 3 tries to 1. We have far more depth to our squad this time around. We had 2 world class players in 2007 BOD and POC. ROG was one too but his head went. This time around we have Bowe, BOD, Sexton, POC, SOB and Heaslip. I would add Ferris and Kearney to that as well if they is fit. Our scrum is miles better. 2007 the team was stale and hadnt had proper preperation. I expect us to hammer USA and Russia.

Podge_irl

Quint2010 wrote: »

Ah come on now lads. We are a miles better team than we were in 2007

If you're talking about the comparative 6N then it's not even close. The 07 6N team played the best rugby of any Irish team in the last decade.

I do, however, highly doubt that Kidney would ever lead a team as ill-prepared as the 07 RWC one. He's too canny and intelligent for that so I expect the RWC team to be a lot better then 4 years ago. We're not going into it on the back of good form though.

That said, Georgia are better then Russia and the USA are a poor team. Even the Ireland of the 07 RWC would beat them. It's not cocky, it's being realistic.

I expect us to hammer USA and Russia.

When's the last time Ireland hammered anyone?

Cpt_Blackbeard

porterbelly wrote: »

He's one of the most abrasive back row forwards around. He mightn't have the gas of a Ferris or the ball carrying of O'Brien but he's certainly the man you'd want in the trenches with you. He's not one for the flashy stuff ie. offloading and popping up on the wing for tries but he's pure cute, really good at the breakdown, disrupts alot of play, huge workrate and tackle count and a very good lineout operator.

You just basically described Leamy...

Leamy is one of the most abrasive back row forwards around. He doesn't have the gas of a Ferris or the ball carrying of O'Brien (anymore) but he's certainly the man you'd want in the trenches with you. He's not one for the flashy stuff but, he's pure cute, really good at the breakdown, disrupts alot of play, huge workrate and tackle count.

The differences between Leamy and Muldoon from that analysis are that Leamy is good at offloading, whilst Muldoon offers a lineout option. Leamy is often claimed to have terrible discipline, which isn't backed up by facts (I couldn't be bothered writing them down ). SOB has, by far, the worst discipline of our backrows.

Neither Leamy or Muldoon should travel though. By bringing either of them, we will be repeating the mistakes of 2007, ie. bringing too many 6's.

durkadurka wrote: »

By squad he means the 30 man squad not the 22. I agree it's pointless having him on the bench if ROG is also there. The likes of McFadden or fitz are much better options for the 22 shirt.

I honestly think that Fitz should consider himself very lucky if he makes the plane. He is currently out third best 11 behind Earls and Trimble, and ~5th best 15.

durkadurka

Fitz is probably 50 /50 to go. My point was about a player who can cover a lot of the backline which he and McFadden can and Wallace cannot.

Earls is my preferred 11 at the moment, and he can also cover a few positions.

Quint2010

Podge_irl wrote: »

If you're talking about the comparative 6N then it's not even close. The 07 6N team played the best rugby of any Irish team in the last decade.



Arguably our performance against England this year was just as good as any performance by any irish team this decade. Its the blueprint for the WC for sure. Our preperation this time will be much better. I would be hopeful of reaching the semis this time. We have a very strong squad.

porterbelly

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

You just basically described Leamy...

Leamy is one of the most abrasive back row forwards around. He doesn't have the gas of a Ferris or the ball carrying of O'Brien (anymore) but he's certainly the man you'd want in the trenches with you. He's not one for the flashy stuff but, he's pure cute, really good at the breakdown, disrupts alot of play, huge workrate and tackle count.

The differences between Leamy and Muldoon from that analysis are that Leamy is good at offloading, whilst Muldoon offers a lineout option. Leamy is often claimed to have terrible discipline, which isn't backed up by facts (I couldn't be bothered writing them down ). SOB has, by far, the worst discipline of our backrows.

Neither Leamy or Muldoon should travel though. By bringing either of them, we will be repeating the mistakes of 2007, ie. bringing too many 6's.



I honestly think that Fitz should consider himself very lucky if he makes the plane. He is currently out third best 11 behind Earls and Trimble, and ~5th best 15.

Leamy isn't cute. He doesn't use his brain enough and is prone to some stupid decisions. He doesn't offload much either. Muldoon over Leamy hands down for me

Leamy has feet for hands, and a time bomb for a brain. I wouldn't have him mending socks in the trenches with me until he sorts his head out.

Cpt_Blackbeard

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

The differences between Leamy and Muldoon from that analysis are that Leamy is good at offloading, whilst Muldoon offers a lineout option. Leamy is often claimed to have terrible discipline, which isn't backed up by facts (I couldn't be bothered writing them down ). SOB has, by far, the worst discipline of our backrows.

The simple fact that Dennis Leamy in a moment of pure stupidity managed to walk his own team back 10m this season after the referee asked him did he want the penalty increased hastens mine and many others' beliefs that the guy has lost the plot.

He's not international class at all these days. Unfortunate, because he's been an outrageously good 6 when he's been given a chance to play there frequently. But even having a player in the panel capable of scoring "own goals" from any position as he showed with that moment of madness, is bizarre and counter intuitive when you consider we're trying to play a clever game.

GerM

I'm not cocky in relation to the USA and Russia games, I'm realistic. We shouldn't be complacent in our performances and we should have absolute respect for any opponent but if we're not going out ready to put in a performance that racks up a good score against them then I would think we're in trouble. The likes of Georgia and Canada are better sides than them. I'm not going to pretend that I believe either Russia or the USA may beat us. It's not going to happen and if we're worried they're going to cause us problems we're in trouble already.

JustinDee

Deleted User wrote: »

Leamy has feet for hands, and a time bomb for a brain. I wouldn't have him mending socks in the trenches with me until he sorts his head out.

He actually has great handling skills. One of the best out of the Irish forwards in fact.

Quint2010

JustinDee wrote: »

He actually has great handling skills. One of the best out of the Irish forwards in fact.

He certainly has got shovels for hands-but great handling skills? Any time I have seen him he simply just barrells into contact. He is a very physical player and immensly strong but he just doesnt the pace or off loading ability to be a top class back row. I mean-he wasnt even first pick for Munsters back row for the ML final?

Podge_irl

JustinDee wrote: »

He actually has great handling skills. One of the best out of the Irish forwards in fact.

He hides them well

JustinDee

JustinDee wrote: »

He actually has great handling skills. One of the best out of the Irish forwards in fact.

I quite respectfully disagree completely

thomond2006

JustinDee wrote: »

He actually has great handling skills. One of the best out of the Irish forwards in fact.

Woah, that's quite a proclamation. Tbh I've seen no evidence of this all season. Even in his prime Leamy's handling wasn't brilliant.