Kenny sacks Bruton

johngalway

I can't see Enda having a front bench after Flanagan and O'Donnell have announced against him. Especially the latter, a fatal blow like has been said.

Nothing against Enda personally, but with the make up of the party when Bruton went against him he was pushed onto a slippery slope then and there given Brutons value to the party. I do hope he resigns before the vote and I also hope he will accept a prominent role within the party which reflect his talents.

It can be clean or it can be messy, it's up to one man now.

stumpypeeps

My guess is we will see someone else emerge as leader of FG.

If the split is pretty even then that makes Kenny's leadership untenable but does it not also make Brutons. If FG want to push forward as a party, elect Veradkor, Bruton remains as Finance minister and Kenny is kept from public view, limit his ability to alienate the public.

Judgement Day

stumpypeeps wrote: »

My guess is we will see someone else emerge as leader of FG.

If the split is pretty even then that makes Kenny's leadership untenable but does it not also make Brutons. If FG want to push forward as a party, elect Veradkor, Bruton remains as Finance minister and Kenny is kept from public view, limit his ability to alienate the public.

So the schoolboy Bruton and the right-wing twit Leo Varadkar won't alienate the public. :pac::pac::pac:

stumpypeeps

Judgement Day wrote: »

So the schoolboy Bruton and the right-wing twit Leo Varadkar won't alienate the public. :pac::pac::pac:

I've no allegiance to FG whatsoever but they might catch my vote should they allow some fresh blood lead a party as opposed to the same tired old faces.

I've been impressed with Veradkor.

Judgement Day

I would hardly call Bruton a fresh face as he has been a TD for 28 years and as for fresh thinking.............................:rolleyes:

johngalway

Judgement Day wrote: »

I would hardly call Bruton a fresh face as he has been a TD for 28 years and as for fresh thinking.............................:rolleyes:

Which FG TDs would not alienate you?

stumpypeeps

Judgement Day wrote: »

I would hardly call Bruton a fresh face as he has been a TD for 28 years and as for fresh thinking.............................:rolleyes:

I'm not suggesting a Bruton led FG would catch my vote. I'm saying a Veradkor or perhaps Coveney might. Fresh faces both.

eoinbn

stumpypeeps wrote: »

I'm not suggesting a Bruton led FG would catch my vote. I'm saying a Veradkor or perhaps Coveney might. Fresh faces both.

Both are a bit green in my opinion, as is Brian Hayes. They would need another ~5 years.

Right now it looks like Kenny probably has enough to avoid defeat but he can't win this. I know people that have voted for FG all their lives that won't go out and vote for the party if he is still the leader come the next election.

RonMexico

I have absolute faith in Enda Kenny to do the wrong thing.

Judgement Day

johngalway wrote: »

Which FG TDs would not alienate you?

Well John I am apolitical - a former Green voter who has sworn never to vote for them again after the current performance. I have no particular love for FG or indeed any other party but if you were to push me I would say Dr.James Reilly, Alan Shatter and Jimmy Deenihan and that's it. Jim "The Drunk Driver" McDaid, O'Dowd, Bruton and the rest of the disloyal gang make my stomach turn and as for Kieran O'Donnell.....

bijapos

Judgement Day wrote: »

Well John I am apolitical - a former Green voter who has sworn never to vote for them again after the current performance. I have no particular love for FG or indeed any other party but if you were to push me I would say Dr.James Reilly, Alan Shatter and Jimmy Deenihan and that's it. Jim "The Drunk Driver" McDaid, O'Dowd, Bruton and the rest of the disloyal gang make my stomach turn and as for Kieran O'Donnell.....

McDaid is FF

Judgement Day

bijapos wrote: »

McDaid is FF

Good point but is there a difference between FF and FG?

johngalway

Judgement Day wrote: »

Good point but is there a difference between FF and FG?

Yes - Drink driving

(Our lot just smoke where they're not supposed to - but that one belongs in FF anyway).

irishh_bob

Judgement Day wrote: »

So the schoolboy Bruton and the right-wing twit Leo Varadkar won't alienate the public. :pac::pac::pac:

why do people assume that its only right wingers who alienate the public , labour ( under gilmore ) have moved sharply to the left yet have surged in the polls , thier is no reason why fine gael ( under a conservative like leo ) would not see the same benefits , thier is bound to be a significant constituency out there who would relish a proper right wing leader considering how long its been since they had the choice of voting for one , the term right wing is not a dirty word to everyone despite what our media would have us believe

RonMexico

Why exactly is Veradker considered right wing.

CoalBucket

RonMexico wrote: »

Why exactly is Veradker considered right wing.

Because he has no left foot and can't play in midfield

Judgement Day

RonMexico wrote: »

Why exactly is Veradker considered right wing.

Well I would have thought that his views on emigration/repatriation would qualify him.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/northern_ireland/7599298.stm


Foreign jobless 'paid to go' call


Fine Gael's Leo Varadkar raised the possibility of paid repatriation
A Fine Gael TD has been criticised for raising the possibility of funding the repatriation of unemployed foreign nationals.
Leo Varadkar, spokesman on Enterprise, Trade and Employment, made the call at a sitting of the Oireachtas enterprise committee in Dublin on Thursday.
On Wednesday unemployment figures for the Republic reached a 10-year high.
Mr Varadkar suggested it might make sense to pay unemployed migrants to leave the country.
"Would there be a case at this stage for giving an offer to foreign nationals the opportunity to receive say three or four or six months of benefits, if they then agreed to repatriate to their country of origin and then forego benefits beyond that?" he said.
While Mr Varadkar stressed that such a move would be voluntary and was not a proposal, the idea was described as "a new low" by Fianna Fail TD Thomas Byrne.
"Politics in this country has reached a new low when Fine Gael are suggesting a voluntary repatriation scheme," said Mr Byrne.
"I think Deputy Varadkar should withdraw his proposal because it is in the dishonourable tradition of the British National Party."
It was also criticised by training agency FAS.
Its Director General Rody Molloy said that the system would be difficult to police and that EU nationals should enjoy the same rights Irish people elsewhere in Europe.
Similar moves are already being introduced this month by the Spanish government, which is planning to offer unemployed immigrants lump-sum benefit payments - typically worth around 18,000 euros (£14,200) - if they volunteer to go back to their home countries and not return to Spain for three years.

---

Incidentally, I would be to the right of Genghis Khan myself - on some issues - but I am not looking to be leader of FG so won't be alienating people which was the point I was making about the bold Leo.

Sleepy

TBH, the article makes it clear that it was some "outside the box" thinking at a brainstorming session rather than a "foridners out" proposal...

RonMexico

I don't see a problem with that proposal. If only we could pay a few of our own to leave too.

Anonymous1987

ongarite wrote: »

The guys in the know on politics.ie are saying Kenny has gone, to be announced this evening.

I'd be very sceptical, according to the Irish times website which was updated last at 17:45 there were 34 Kenny, 28 Bruton and 8 undecided meaning Bruton needs to get 7 of these to beat Kenny which suggest Kenny is significantly ahead. I presume this works as a simple majority wins? Don't know what happens if its split down the middle, anyone know?

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2010/0616/breaking6.html

Sponge Bob

Anonymous1987 wrote: »

Don't know what happens if its split down the middle, anyone know?

Pádraig McCormack votes again

hallelujajordan

Anonymous1987 wrote: »

I'd be very sceptical, according to the Irish times website which was updated last at 17:45 there were 34 Kenny, 28 Bruton and 8 undecided meaning Bruton needs to get 7 of these to beat Kenny which suggest Kenny is significantly ahead. I presume this works as a simple majority wins? Don't know what happens if its split down the middle, anyone know?

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2010/0616/breaking6.html

This isn't a leadership battle. . yet . . at the moment its a vote of confidence in Kenny as leader of FG . . and its not about just winning a majority. How can he continue to lead the party when he has lost the confidence of more than half of the most senior people (that he selected!!) I am amazed that he is allowing this to go to a vote and I will be equally amazed if he scrapes through the vote and continues to try to lead FG. .

nacho libre

yes, his postion seems to be untenable, he can't exactly attack FF on the basis they have no mandate, when he has no mandate from a lot of his own side and when only 20 per cent of people would like to see him as leader.
So Enda Kenny, i'm afraid, is a lame duck regardless of the outcome of the vote tomorrow, due to the fact most of his frontbench have lost confidence in him.

When he goes hopefully the main focus of the media goes back to the banking reports.

Wide Road

hallelujajordan wrote: »

This isn't a leadership battle. . yet . . at the moment its a vote of confidence in Kenny as leader of FG . . and its not about just winning a majority. How can he continue to lead the party when he has lost the confidence of more than half of the most senior people (that he selected!!) I am amazed that he is allowing this to go to a vote and I will be equally amazed if he scrapes through the vote and continues to try to lead FG. .

I am surprised by your amazement. Are you amazed by the timing of the confidence motion. Do you think R Bruton was correct in trying to bring down a govt during his confidence motion while Enda was trying to save his own skin. How low can one go?

sesna

Whatever happens, fair play to Kenny for fighting this to the end. The fair-haired boy from Clongowes Wood expected an easy bloodless coup to be over and done with by Tuesday and underestimated Kenny's excellent tactics. It wont be long before the media start attacking him too, as they do with every Fine Gael leader. I see a piece in the Irish Times already today to this effect http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2010/0616/1224272613247.html which hones in on Brutons lack of interpersonal skills and how he giggles like a schoolgirl when nervous (happened several times on VB on Tuesday night). There never was a good FG leader until they gained office, or a poor FF leader until they left power.

Bruton has also damaged himself further by stating he will not serve under Kenny, regardless of the outcome of todays result. For throwing his toys out of the pram in this manner, we can add impetulence and disloyalty to his list of great leadership qualities.

RB's support from EK's front bench looked pathetic standing outside Dail Eireann on Tuesday, with Leo Varadkar hiding by no accident alongside Simon Coveney at the back. (Leo had afterall expressed confidence in EK on Friday while Coveney cynically called for party unity in a vague party statement released on Saturday). Then we read of the sneaks meeting in secret in the Green Isle hotel on Tuesday morning before dispersing in panic when a journalist was spotted. This on the back of Leo the night before on Primetime almost crying when speaking of how good a taoiseach Enda Kenny would have been, and looking down avoiding eye contact with M'OC on any difficult questions of him feeling any guilt.

I have become extremely disillusioned by how FG has imploded over the past week, thanks to baby Brutes awful timing and horrible political judgement, in a week when FF were on the ropes and Biffo facing a no-confidence motion. I am actually starting to see the merits in FF, who at least show loyalty to each other . FG under baby Brute or amateur nobody's Simon Coveney/Brian Hayes certainly has lost my vote.

And lastly, what worries me most is how much peoples opinions are echoed and influenced by what they read in the media/Sindo. Where were the media during the past decade only fawning over corrupt Bertie and his daughters, enjoying huge income from property supplements and then the coming of Biffo, "the annointed one" and extremely intelligent master of his brief. It wasn't long before we realised the emperor had no clothes. And as for the medias intepretation of what charisma is.... :pac:

Scuba Ste

I'd disagree with pretty much everything above. There is a simple reason for Bruton's no confidence vote and it has nothing to do with Kenny's abilities, personality or leadership. Voters simply don't want him, Bertie brought in huge numbers of voters, Kenny alienates swing voters. FG should have won in 2007, they didn't. If Kenny is leader in 2012, while FG will probably win, they could win a lot more seats with a different leader.

Panrich

I think Kenny realises the game is up for him personally at this stage. He is fighting to ensure that he brings Bruton down with him. The party will be divided after this vote so a compromise candidate will have to emerge.

Scuba Ste

Panrich wrote: »

I think Kenny realises the game is up for him personally at this stage. He is fighting to ensure that he brings Bruton down with him. The party will be divided after this vote so a compromise candidate will have to emerge.

So the man who brought the party back together is now intent on tearing it apart. Don't buy that, he thinks he has the support imo. He really should step aside though if he has the party interest at heart.

Judgement Day

Judgement Day wrote: »

Who cares about the Irish Times Poll - it's what the FG parliamentary party decide and they know that Enda Kenny will guide them safely into power whereas Brutal is an incompetent fool.

God it's good to back the right horse from time to time!

dusty207

Well, Fine Gael is rightly crippled now. It'll be interesting to see how many of the "rebels" return to the front bench and what credibility they'll have. None, imho. If any do then it'll prove that FG has no backbone and that this whole episode was handbags at 20 paces. Personally, if Kenny lasts another 6 months I'd be amazed. This is one of the few times recently that hardened FF'ers will be feeling chuffed and fair play to them.