Kenny sacks Bruton

Wide Road

yahoo_moe wrote: »

Well given your opinion, it's basically just one two-part question. Answered already anyway so at least we're done with that...

I've no idea, though he's just said something similar again on Prime Time. And to be honest, I don't see how you'll get a reliable answer on this from an online forum that isn't (to my knowledge) used openly by Enda Kenny.

Thanks for clearing that up..... Not

dusty207

wispy kinda thread really
no killa blows that the FF type of thread would have
as i said earlier in this thread "the meek will inherit the earth, as long as nobody else minds" = FG policy,
no matter what ensues after all the dust subsides, no matter what minister drives around in his/her car, no matter who gets interviewed by Sean ORourke, we, as private taxpayers, are all going to be screwed. Waiting for Godot? No, wanting to live in his bin will be the ambition, social housing, howareya!

CoalBucket

Wide Road wrote: »

I've asked why Enda sacked Richard Bruton. I've asked why Enda didn't sack the front bench rebels, (both moves can't be right IMO). I've also asked if Dr O'Reilly was right when he said that Enda would have Richard in his front bench after Enda won the confidence vote, (no way judging by tv last night).I can't see how this is the same question.

Bruton has been sacked as he expressed his no confidence in Enda Kenny directly at meetings over the weekend.

At the front bench meeting of FG this morning Enda Kenny pre-empted any expressions of confidence or lack thereof by not allowing any discussion of the leadership issue and moving it to a meeting of the parliamentary party on Thursday.

In a further statement Enda Kenny has said that a re-shuffle will take place on Monday obviously post the parliamentary meeting on Thursday when official declarations will be made.

Assuming Enda Kenny wins the vote (IMO, he has to win by a large margin to remain as leader of FG) he will then reshuffle his front bench and therefore sack the remaining "rebels".

As for Kenny hypothetically having Bruton on his front bench again, It is difficult to see that happening however Bruton is clearly the brains behind FG economic policy and Kenny will find it impossible to replace him.

IMO Kenny will probably win the parliamentary party vote but not by enough to have a credible mandate and he will end up stepping aside.

CoalBucket

Wide Road wrote: »

I've asked why Enda sacked Richard Bruton. I've asked why Enda didn't sack the front bench rebels, (both moves can't be right IMO). I've also asked if Dr O'Reilly was right when he said that Enda would have Richard in his front bench after Enda won the confidence vote, (no way judging by tv last night).I can't see how this is the same question.

Bruton has been sacked as he expressed his no confidence in Enda Kenny directly at meetings over the weekend.

At the front bench meeting of FG this morning Enda Kenny pre-empted any expressions of confidence or lack thereof by not allowing any discussion of the leadership issue and moving it to a meeting of the parliamentary party on Thursday.

In a further statement Enda Kenny has said that a re-shuffle will take place on Monday obviously post the parliamentary meeting on Thursday when official declarations will be made.

Assuming Enda Kenny wins the vote (IMO, he has to win by a large margin to remain as leader of FG) he will then reshuffle his front bench and therefore sack the remaining "rebels".

As for Kenny hypothetically having Bruton on his front bench again, It is difficult to see that happening however Bruton is clearly the brains behind FG economic policy and Kenny will find it impossible to replace him.

IMO Kenny will probably win the parliamentary party vote but not by enough to have a credible mandate and he will end up stepping aside.

Deep Easterly

nacho libre wrote: »

actually Kenny is known to be quite entertaining company(a good story teller), with a good sense of humour if you meet him in a social setting.

He strikes me as being a bit of a cute hoor to be honest, but having said that, I agree with you, the timing of deliberate upheaval of the party by the front bench is appalling. Whatever their internal differences are, they could have shown a bit of solidarity with the man that stitched their decaying party back together over the last few years, at least for the public's sake.

I don't think FG's interests are what lies behind this coo, but personal opportunity.

RonMexico

A gpod storyteller is known in other terms as a bull****ter.

Deep Easterly

snow ghost wrote: »

Bruton is an absolute disgrace.

I agree with you Snow, although I have to say I am a little disappointed in Leo Varadkar, as I warmed to him, quite considerably, after his infamous 'Garret' goof a few weeks back:

He comes across as a straight talker and personally I wouldn't mind seeing him as the next FG leader, but his conduct regarding this latest mutiny shows him to be a follower, not a leader.

Sponge Bob

Veradkar disappointed me greatly. He was the one who could have emerged as a ( possibly inevitable) alternative to the old dogs had he 'called for unity' blah blah and stood off the clash of the two old dogs and let them bite themselves into a stupor. He did not realise that a generational shift would follow had they stalemated.

But he took sides. Big mistake. He may well become leader in time but not for at least 10 years now. Veradkar willingly took a pistol loaded by the meeja and fired it.

Idiot

Colpriz

RATM wrote: »

On another note George Lee must be kicking himself right about now- if he had of stayed then he could be sitting pretty for the Finance portfolio right about now.

Honestly...I think the guy quit while he was ahead, he saw the state of FG and the state of general politics in Ireland. He got a good inside view. People diss him [Lee] for his lack of endurance, but I wreckron it will all come out in a book by him someday, feasting him a fortune too.

Yes this is a bad move by Kenny, does he want a totalitarianism run of things?? Labour are looking favourable...the working class of Ireland want their rights/say back in this country..its high time on the cards.

Wide Road

Colpriz wrote: »

Honestly...I think the guy quit while he was ahead, he saw the state of FG and the state of general politics in Ireland. He got a good inside view. People diss him [Lee] for his lack of endurance, but I wreckron it will all come out in a book by him someday, feasting him a fortune too.

Yes this is a bad move by Kenny, does he want a totalitarianism run of things?? Labour are looking favourable...the working class of Ireland want their rights/say back in this country..its high time on the cards.

I think Richard is the reason why George Lee quit. He was a threat to Richard and a coup for Enda.

To be honest I think the Kenny stitched FG back together and built it up is being massively overplayed.
A child of 4 could have done the same thing lets be honest.

Scuba Ste

Deleted User wrote: »

To be honest I think the Kenny stitched FG back together and built it up is being massively overplayed.
A child of 4 could have done the same thing lets be honest.

Doesn't matter what he's done tbh. Voters won't ever warm to him so he's holding the party back. FG would probably be in government now if he wasn't leader in 2007.

Liam Byrne

Deleted User wrote: »

To be honest I think the Kenny stitched FG back together and built it up is being massively overplayed.
A child of 4 could have done the same thing lets be honest.

Please do explain how a child of 4 could have pulled a fractured party back together.

If I came on here and said that "a child of 4" could have run the economy better than FF have, then you'd be complaining that it was a ridiculous snide comment that had no place on a discussion board.

Re the topic itself, I had an interesting thought last night.......whatever happens with FG (and I do agree that it is a mess in terms of timing) at least they can hold their head high afterwards and say "well here's what we do when we have an objectionable leader".

It's not enough to excuse this week's mistimed fiasco, but at least it's some light at the end of the tunnel.

I was using hyperbole.
Any sane person should know that anyone could have done and should have done what he did.
It would have mostly happened by default.

People that think otherwise are caught up in a personality cult.

~Fact is people in FG are finally reacting to the vibe thats out there and it's a we'll vote FG if theres anybody leading it but EK.

My 2 local td's have came out in support of Bruton.

Tinker13

Re. the child of 4 thing, I think that he was certainly starting from a low base and should now adopt the " I did the state party some service, they know it, no more of that..." attitude... as someone else did when they knew that their number was up.

In relation to the timing, I agree with the posters who said that the Greens, given the job situation out there, are going nowhere anyhow - thus making the call for B Cowen's head a waste of time. An 18 month run in to the next General Election may be good timing for a new FG Leader to make his/her mark.

johngalway

I bet the phones are hopping today.

As for the child of four thing. I don't agree, it takes someone with the ability to organise to do the job correctly, not everyone has that ability.

jmayo

johngalway wrote: »

If George Lee had been what people thought he was, it would have been great to have Bruton as leader, Kenny as organiser in chief, and Lee for Finance.

Unfortunately that's the view from a somewhat perfect world!

in a perfect world trhe country would not be in this mess because people would not be eejits enough to vote for bertie teflon and biffo clowen.

Scuba Ste wrote: »

Doesn't matter what he's done tbh. Voters won't ever warm to him so he's holding the party back. FG would probably be in government now if he wasn't leader in 2007.

So maybe you could say he saved the party ?
Imagine how ff would be jumping up and down claiming that FG and Labour had ruined their magnificent economy. :rolleyes:

Liam Byrne

johngalway wrote: »

As for the child of four thing. I don't agree, it takes someone with the ability to organise to do the job correctly, not everyone has that ability.

Ah, John......he explained that it was just hyperbole.....it's an FF trait like "we've turned the corner" and "I have full confidence in him" and "we're unpopular because we are taking the necessary decisions"....

....not to mention the Bart Simpson inspired "I didn't do it, nobody saw me do it, you can't prove anything".

Scuba Ste

jmayo wrote: »

So maybe you could say he saved the party ?
Imagine how ff would be jumping up and down claiming that FG and Labour had ruined their magnificent economy. :rolleyes:

I was thinking that myself. Maybe he knew what he was doing all along.

Its bad timing by Bruton all right, but when would be the right time. If the polls keep going down for Kenny it's only a matter of time before someone challenges. Like someone said it gives Bruton 18 months to get ready for the next election, had to be now or never.

Stupid move sacking Bruton too, Kenny's gone from having a very promising front bench to possibly a poor inexperienced one.

joseph brand

yahoo_moe wrote: »

Varadkar has just said on Prime Time that he's "absolutely certain" the Bruton faction have the numbers.

Right or wrong, he's certainly a better performer than Reilly who just stumbled through an attempted point on the unreliability of these kinds of polls. There was a point there to be made but he fluffed it.

Oh, and now Reilly has said he's certain of their numbers too... OH AND HE HAS A LIST!

Hahahahaha. Did you see him pull his little crumpled list from his sweet pocket, only to be thanked for his time, and show ends. He put his little list back in his pocket as nobody cared. As 'cool' as Cowen.

yahoo_moe

Deleted User wrote: »

My 2 local td's have came out in support of Bruton.

My local FG TD seems to be supporting Bruton also... though I am in Dublin North Central

hallelujajordan

Scuba Ste wrote: »

I was thinking that myself. Maybe he knew what he was doing all along.

Its bad timing by Bruton all right, but when would be the right time. If the polls keep going down for Kenny it's only a matter of time before someone challenges. Like someone said it gives Bruton 18 months to get ready for the next election, had to be now or never.

Stupid move sacking Bruton too, Kenny's gone from having a very promising front bench to possibly a poor inexperienced one.

I keep hearing this 'bad timing' accusation . . Why is it so ? In my view, the only thing bad about it is that he didn't do it earlier . . Now, assuming Bruton is successful he has some time to rebuild and to mount a challenge for the next election . .

BTW, I'm also amazed that Kenny is so arrogant as to take this to a parliamentary party vote tomorrow. . He clearly has lost the confidence of all of the key people that he had chosen to play senior roles in the next government.. Is it really his contention that he could replace all of those people in a short space of time ? And still compete with Labour ? A clear case of Enda putting himself before the party and another good reason why he absolutely has to go.

johngalway

johngalway wrote: »

I bet the phones are hopping today.

As for the child of four thing. I don't agree, it takes someone with the ability to organise to do the job correctly, not everyone has that ability.

Somebody would have been the honest broker if it wasn't Enda.
The party wouldn't have died.
Ironically it might actually have just done a little bit better in '07 without Enda's smirk at the helm..
Enough better to cross the line.

I don't buy all this palava that it wouldn't have been good that FG and Lab were in power in '08 when the earth shattered.
You'd still have banking reports and an FF legacy to blame and credit for picking up the pieces etc etc.

However we are where we are.Lets look forward to real opposition when Kenny goes.
I'll bet FF aren't.

SB-08

Realistically how can people in FG seriously think voting for Enda is the best option? A vote for Enda not only means an divided party that will most likely continue slipping in polls, but also that the vast majority of FG's best front benchers will no longer serve - they will be without their most impressive media performers and the man who gives them much needed credibility on the economy - Richard Bruton. The team of Kenny and Bruton will no longer exist. Whereas a vote for Bruton means all the main players will remain, they will almost certainly rise in the polls and get a majority in the next election (as oppose to having to go in with Labour under Kenny) AND Enda Kenny is likely to be on the front bench and probably a future Minister Of Forieign Affairs. It's surely a no brainer? Kenny has had 8 years as the leader and at a time where the Govt simply could not get any more unpopular is at an all time low in personal rating - when he sould be twice if not three times as popular. Enda accused Cowen of putting himself ahead of the country but surely Enda is putting himself ahead of the party? How can he seriously suggest he will give those frontbechers who have expressed no confidence in him their jobs back? Does he think if he wins the vote by a couple of votes mainly due to loyalty, that these same people will all of a sudden on Friday have confidence in his leadership? The whole thing is just highlighting his incompetence and if he remains it will effect the party hugely. If he had any sence he would step down before the vote tomorrow to protect his own personal reputation and more importantly the party's.

dillodaffs

The acting Finance spokesman for Fine Gael appointed by Enda Kenny less than 48 hours ago is thought to be on the brink of announcing that he supports Richard Bruton.
Kieran O’Donnell is one of 14 TDs and Senators who have so far refused to declare where their loyalties lie and who will decide whether Enda Kenny survives as Fine Gael leader tomorrow.


http://www.newstalk.ie/news/news-headlines/both-fine-gael-camps-claim-close-to-victory/


not looking good for kenny now...my money is on him resigning before the vote...

RonMexico

Ouch a fatal blow to Kenny there, not to mention the embarrassment. Tick tock tick tock....

ongarite

The guys in the know on politics.ie are saying Kenny has gone, to be announced this evening.

Laminations

ongarite wrote: »

The guys in the know on politics.ie are saying Kenny has gone, to be announced this evening.

link please?

They usually are on the money on these things

ah found one
http://www.politics.ie/fine-gael/131746-kenny-step-down-evening.html

ongarite

Laminations wrote: »

link please?

They usually are on the money on these things

ah found one
http://www.politics.ie/fine-gael/131746-kenny-step-down-evening.html

http://www.politics.ie/fine-gael/131544-richard-bruton-mount-challenge-against-enda-kenny-fine-gael-leadership-107.html

Page 107 and on..

Byron85

Also here.

http://www.politics.ie/fine-gael/131746-kenny-step-down-evening.html