Waterford/Rosslare Strand Railway reaches the buffer stops (again)!

Hungerford

DWCommuter wrote: »

Exactly.

In actual fact, here's a rare picture from preparations for the IRRS South Wexford lifting train special due for later this year. As you may know, the IRRS are extremely concerned about the closure, particularly how they are going to transport the Barrow Bridge to Heuston.:D

DWCommuter

Judgement Day wrote: »

And they wouldn't give a damn about the line closing as long as Tarquin OBE from Tunbridge Wells could give a lecture to them about his experiences manning the catering poison trolley on the Up Mail in 1931. Afterwards they could all sit down for a chicken dinner with Dick Fearn and his chums.

One only has to read IRRS journals to garner an accurate opinion on them. To a person who cares about rail transport in this country, they are an irrelevence.

foggy_lad

Mother of God they were like a swarm of mutant ants with their cameras and packed lunches! i have never seen such a sight as seen at waterford station this afternoon just before i boarded the 16:15 to limerick junction,

an old wreck relic of an engine pulling an even older line of carriages which afaik were outlawed by the state after buttevant/cherryville incidents due to them offering no protection to passengers in the event of accident/crash pulled into waterford and the doors opened!

what happened next will stay with me forever, i have never seen so many glassey-eyed people swarm off a train like worker ants all looking around feverishly searching for the best vantage point to take some snaps from!

they were taking pictures of anything and everything and most were normal everyday people like myself except they happen to have a love of all things train related, nothing wrong with that!

the problems lie in their enthusism being hijacked by others who have their own private agendas and who use the spirt of these trainspotters for their own ends:(

Our man in Havana

The Mark 2 coaches are still approved for use on the network.

lord lucan

foggy_lad wrote: »

an old wreck relic of an engine pulling an even older line of carriages which afaik were outlawed by the state after buttevant/cherryville incidents due to them offering no protection to passengers in the event of accident/crash pulled into waterford and the doors opened!

The RPSI MKII coaches are all metal construction and are cleared for mainline use. The RPSI's Heritage set has a lot of wooden framed coaches which are banned from most lines and restricted to 40mph. It was the wooden body coaches that splintered to bits at Buttevant.

Great day out,the sound of an 071 pounding up the Rathdrum bank was music to my ears.:)

quern_good

foggy_lad wrote: »

Mother of God they were like a swarm of mutant ants with their cameras and packed lunches! i have never seen such a sight as seen at waterford station this afternoon just before i boarded the 16:15 to limerick junction,

an old wreck relic of an engine pulling an even older line of carriages which afaik were outlawed by the state after buttevant/cherryville incidents due to them offering no protection to passengers in the event of accident/crash pulled into waterford and the doors opened!

No, mkII coaches were never banned.

foggy_lad wrote: »

the problems lie in their enthusism being hijacked by others who have their own private agendas and who use the spirt of these trainspotters for their own ends:(

Not sure what you mean. Who is using their spirit for their own ends?

Our man in Havana

It was 071 powered? I thought they were going to use a small GM?

lord lucan

Bond-007 wrote: »

It was 071 powered? I thought they were going to use a small GM?

Nope,was due to be an 071(081 done the tour). I assume it was to do with the nature of the terrain and length of journey. Plus,the baby GM's are only allowed pilot duty around Inchicore at the moment. One of the RPSI's baby GM's(142) has already gone north to Whitehead.

DWCommuter

Ah well at least the enthusiasts got their jant on the line before its mothballed. Any of you bring a headstone.:D

GM071class

foggy_lad wrote: »

Mother of God they were like a swarm of mutant ants with their cameras and packed lunches! i have never seen such a sight as seen at waterford station this afternoon just before i boarded the 16:15 to limerick junction,

an old wreck relic of an engine pulling an even older line of carriages which afaik were outlawed by the state after buttevant/cherryville incidents due to them offering no protection to passengers in the event of accident/crash pulled into waterford and the doors opened!

what happened next will stay with me forever, i have never seen so many glassey-eyed people swarm off a train like worker ants all looking around feverishly searching for the best vantage point to take some snaps from!

they were taking pictures of anything and everything and most were normal everyday people like myself except they happen to have a love of all things train related, nothing wrong with that!

the problems lie in their enthusism being hijacked by others who have their own private agendas and who use the spirt of these trainspotters for their own ends:(

A bit heavy there.....:rolleyes:

First off, the vehicles used in yesterday's tour all come up to code in terms of safety.
In fact the MK.2's used on the tour offer the same protection as any railway carriage. All integral steel frame contruction, anti-collision gangways, Knuckle-couplers, emergency lighting, and even central locking (RPSI fitted that themselves).

So they do offer protection in the event of collision. With regards the locomotive, Despite them being built in 1976 are just as viable (and safe) as when new.
General Motors design their locomotives in such a way as to allow major overhaul (including mid-life) to allow the locomotives to be like new again.

Also your description of the 'people' that got off the train is very distasteful. I do hate to say that sometimes stereotypes are true;).......

DW - I really enjoyed getting my 'jaunt', You've probably never seen that part of the country by rail, so here you go: http://IrishMotivePower.fotopic.net

I know how much you love locomotives.........:D

DWCommuter

GM071class wrote: »

DW - I really enjoyed getting my 'jaunt', You've probably never seen that part of the country by rail, so here you go: http://IrishMotivePower.fotopic.net

I know how much you love locomotives.........:D

I've been on the route many many times and all by scheduled services. I like to pay my way.
As for pics of locos, eh no thanks. But if you have any of beer swilling enthusiasts hanging out windows, I'd love to seem them.:D

Transportuser09

Hungerford wrote: »

In actual fact, here's a rare picture from preparations for the IRRS South Wexford lifting train special due for later this year. As you may know, the IRRS are extremely concerned about the closure, particularly how they are going to transport the Barrow Bridge to Heuston.:D

I'm sure there are IRRS members concerned. But its not like the IRRS can do anything about it. They are there to record (hint is in their name) Irish railway events. Not to critique them. They have no say in the closure or opening of lines whatsoever. Its more lobby groups like rail users that do this sort of thing. So for God's sake leave the IRRS out of it. I'm sick of reading this childish bickering about IRRS or some other group on this site. Its as much in their remit to stop it as it is in Wexford GAA, shall we get on to them as well.

Southsider1

From The Nationalist:

The proposed closure of the Rosslare to Waterford rail line should be opposed, because it is an important piece of regional infrastructure, members of South Tipperary County Council have argued.
At the May meeting of the county council, two councillors proposed motions in defence of the line, Cllrs Pat English and Joe Brennan.

Cllr English called on the Minister for Transport to ensure that the line remain open to the public. Cllr BrennanADVERTISEMENT

called on the council to oppose any downgrading of the line as it is an important piece of the regional infrastructure.

Cllr English said everyone should be concerned and Irish Rail should reverse its decision. He said the line had never been marketed to its full potential. Rail services all over Europe are seen as essential services, not profit-making businesses, he added.

Cllr Brennan said that Irish Rail put on trains at times people don't want them.

Cllr Seamus Healy, supporting his colleagues, said the Waterford to Rosslare line was an important social and economic line. He said he feared the closure of the Waterford to Limerick line would follow if this line is allowed to close.

Cllr Joe Donovan pointed out that a lot money had been pumped in to the Waterford to Rosslare line in recent years.

Cllr Sean McCarthy observed there seemed to be some problems with usage of the line.

westtip

They should all write a strongly worded letter to west on track - they shouted loudest and got their line - and in hte process got this line closed down.

Transportuser09

westtip wrote: »

They should all write a strongly worded letter to west on track - they shouted loudest and got their line - and in hte process got this line closed down.

I don't think there is any point in that, it comes across as mudslingling. The WRC is here to stay like it or not. Complaining to west on track isn't going to solve a thing. If the Rosslare-Waterford route is to remain, IÉ need to be persuaded that there is a demand for an increased service on the line (I personally believe there may be with a better service pattern). Whether or not this can be done aside, there is no use in writing letters to west on track, it just comes across a begrudgery.

purplepanda

So it's alright to spend a hundred million Euro's reopening a railway that is still in fact slower than the local road / bus journey. Whilst at the same time closing a line which has a major advantage over the same journey by road????? This after millions have been spent upgrading the line??

Then we can also close the Limerick Nenagh / Limerick Waterford lines to pay towards the costs of the West on Tracks demands for further obsolete railways to be reopened up!!! Why not close all railways in Wexford southwards of Gorey & give another subsidy to the west?:mad:


Why should the people of the South East have railways shut down so that the constantly subsidised West of Ireland can always have their own way?

Time for fair treatment in transport, infastructure & job creation / help for new business for all regions of Ireland by goverment & the EU:D

Judgement Day

The reopening of the 'so called' Western Rail Corridor has nothing to do with the impending closure of the Waterford/Rosslare which has been on the CIE hit list for decades.

invinciblePRSTV

Judgement Day wrote: »

The reopening of the 'so called' Western Rail Corridor has nothing to do with the impending closure of the Waterford/Rosslare which has been on the CIE hit list for decades.

Course it does, IE can only run so many loss making rural lines with the subvention they receive each year.

Our man in Havana

Goes to show that the chained officials in the west are better than those in the south east.

Judgement Day

invinciblePRSTV wrote: »

Course it does, IE can only run so many loss making rural lines with the subvention they receive each year.

The paltry savings that will be made from the closure of the Waterford/Rosslare line will make little difference to the CIE/IE deficit and it suits them very nicely to be able to use it as an excuse for the closure. Incidentally, as CIE/IE now appear to be claiming that passengers numbers on the WRC are double their expectations it follows that they need to save less on other loss making routes.

wild handlin

Judgement Day wrote: »

The reopening of the 'so called' Western Rail Corridor has nothing to do with the impending closure of the Waterford/Rosslare which has been on the CIE hit list for decades.

For once I actually agree with Judgment Day!!

The Wexford - Rosslare - Waterford - Limerick Junction line has been on the books for closure since the mid-70's. The only thing stopping CIE/IE from shutting the line was the serious amount of railfreight operated across the line (Sugar beet, Bulk + Bag cement, Container traffic, pulp wood traffic). Once these flows were "lost" to road (more like given...:rolleyes:) IE became more desperate to close the entire line.

Not many on here seem to remember the fact that not so long ago IR wanted to close Longford - Sligo, Killonan Jctn - Ballybrophy, Limerick Junction - Waterford - Arklow.
Face the facts for the tiny minority of you who continue to slag off the WRC - IT HAS VERY, VERY, VERY LITTLE TO DO WITH THE CLOSURE OF WATERFORD - ROSSLARE.

Stop moaning winging about the WRC, it was getting tyring 10 months ago. Phase 1 is built. FACT.

IE are about to commition a study to try and solve the flooding problem at Ballycar on what can be done to prevent the likes of the flooding from happening again.

Does Atherny - Claremorris need to be built? (In my opinion - Yes.)

Why? Look at what will open up as regards a freight line (will then pay it's way for Claremorris - Limerick) and will stop the moaners from saying "ohh, this line is unprofitable". It will also provide the People of Tuam a green and viable alternative to using road transport for commuting into Galway. Have any of the "WRC slaggers" travelled/driven from Tuam - Galway - Tuam by road at rush hour?
Is it necessary to be built immediatly? In my opinion yes, as soon as there is sufficent finance availible to do so.

Oh, PS: before you all start saying "HE'S FROM THE WRC!! BURN HIM!!" I have no connection with the WRC - or any rail campaign group for that matter

Our man in Havana

Phase 1 is built. FACT.

And will most likely be closed again within 5 to 10 years.

rainbowdash

Haddockman wrote: »

And will most likely be closed again within 5 to 10 years.

Theres no chance of that.

As mention above the Wexford line is in trouble because freight is gone.

Its upto the local population to rally around and put a proposal to Irish rail on what the timetable should be.

Then they need to lobby their politicians to implement their proposed timetable.

Then they need to use it or lose it.

Blaming WOT will not advance their cause.

If anything WOT would probably consider this part of their extended route, Sligo - Wexford, and in theory would enhance the viability of their sector.

Hungerford

Judgement Day wrote: »

The paltry savings that will be made from the closure of the Waterford/Rosslare line will make little difference to the CIE/IE deficit and it suits them very nicely to be able to use it as an excuse for the closure. Incidentally, as CIE/IE now appear to be claiming that passengers numbers on the WRC are double their expectations it follows that they need to save less on other loss making routes.

Ahem...

Loss from WRC - around €2.5m per annum
Loss from Waterford - Rosslare - around €2m per annum.

Are these numbers just a coincidence?

Judgement Day

Hungerford wrote: »

Ahem...

Loss from WRC - around €2.5m per annum
Loss from Waterford - Rosslare - around €2m per annum.

Are these numbers just a coincidence?

A happy coincidence perhaps but what about this point 'as CIE/IE now appear to be claiming that passengers numbers on the WRC are double their expectations it follows that they need to save less on other loss making routes'.

Judgement Day

From the Enniscorthy Guardian of 19th May, 2010 and also available here: http://irishrailways.blogspot.com/

The comment highlighted in red shows why this line is doomed. The local councillors clearly never use the line and haven't the slightest idea about traffic that CIE/IE carry - Celtic Linen - ffs!!!! :mad::mad::mad:

P.S. Can anybody tell me what Service Planning Manager Myles McHugh actually does from one end of the year to the next to justify his salary - specifics please!!

---

IARNRÓD ÉIREANN EXECUTIVES IN FIRING LINE AT COUNCIL

IARNRÓD ÉIREANN executives put themselves in the firing line to take the full scorn and outrage of Wexford county councillors last week. But there was no sign of the rail company changing its imminent intention to shut down the Rosslare to Waterford line at the end of the meeting in County Hall. The best their representatives could offer was a replacement bus service for the people of South Wexford.
The firm was represented at the county council meeting by service planning manager Myles McHugh, Waterford-based district manager Emmet Cotter and local station manager David Murphy. McHugh stated that Iarnród Éireann had experienced a severe economic jolt over the past two years, with revenue dropping sharply. The company was looking for savings. The Rosslare-to-Waterford service was in line for the axe as it was putting a significant hole in revenue.
The visiting executive pointed out that though students were the main users of the existing train service, the train station in Waterford is not close to the institute of technology campus. The plan was to bring in a bus that will leave them right to the door at WIT. He reckoned the move would result in savings of €2 million per annum.
Cllr. Larry O’Brien observed that if Iarnród Eireann were a private company it would have gone out of business years ago. He described the timetable as laughable and criticised the past lack of investment in the line. Cllr. George Lawlor felt that changes made at Rosslare port had only served to discommode passengers and those moving freight.
Myles McHugh countered criticism alleging lack of planning, investment and marketing around the council chamber by saying that the population of the area – including Bridgetown, Wellingtonbridge, Ballycullane and Campile – served by the line was sufficient to generate just 45 customers – equivalent to one bus load. Given the cost of maintaining the track, and the departure of the sugar beet business from Wellingtonbridge, the operation no longer made sense, he suggested.
‘We would have to spend millions just to keep the line open,’ said Emmet Cotter. Still, Cllr. Pat Codd was very disappointed by his stance and complained that the closure will be another slap in the face for Wexford. With strict lowspeed limits set for trains on long stretches of the line, the Fine Gael man reckoned it had been destined for closure for years.
Cllr. Michael Murphy observed that the service was so badly advertised that many residents of the district did not even realise where their local station was. The Fianna Fáil man felt that company executives should resign. Cllr. Denis Kennedy (FG) felt that a sixmonth trial of a new timetable should be tried. Councillors and county manager Eddie Breen were hopeful that Coca-Cola or Celtic Linen could generate fresh business for the railway but the Iarnród Éireann trio did not share their optimism.

‘The Percy French philosophy is alive and well,’ concluded Cllr. Padge Reck.

Judgement Day

From the Facebook campaign tonight: http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/group.php?gid=367387502018

Joe Ryan Tomorrows papers will carry notices from Irish Rail setting out their intention to end services on the line on July 21st. It seems that the company has decided to ignore the process they opted for themselves in April with the NTA and is now seek closure under the 1958 Transport Act.
After yesterday's charade in Dail Eirean what's left of their credibility is shot to bits!

Ham'nd'egger

wild handlin wrote: »

For once I actually agree with Judgment Day!!

The Wexford - Rosslare - Waterford - Limerick Junction line has been on the books for closure since the mid-70's. The only thing stopping CIE/IE from shutting the line was the serious amount of railfreight operated across the line (Sugar beet, Bulk + Bag cement, Container traffic, pulp wood traffic). Once these flows were "lost" to road (more like given...:rolleyes:) IE became more desperate to close the entire line.

The only freight that used the line as a whole was sugar beet; this market was closed by the EU and not Irish Rail. Of the other markets you mention, Bell Ferry went bust, IFI closed their plant in Arklow so fertiliser traffic was lost; timber freight trains still run between Ballina and Waterford albeit less frequently given the economic downturn as has bulk cement.

Our man in Havana

Judgement Day wrote: »

From the Facebook campaign tonight: http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/group.php?gid=367387502018

Joe Ryan Tomorrows papers will carry notices from Irish Rail setting out their intention to end services on the line on July 21st. It seems that the company has decided to ignore the process they opted for themselves in April with the NTA and is now seek closure under the 1958 Transport Act.
After yesterday's charade in Dail Eirean what's left of their credibility is shot to bits!

This is very bad news. :mad:

westtip

Transportuser09 wrote: »

I don't think there is any point in that, it comes across as mudslingling. The WRC is here to stay like it or not. Complaining to west on track isn't going to solve a thing. If the Rosslare-Waterford route is to remain, IÉ need to be persuaded that there is a demand for an increased service on the line (I personally believe there may be with a better service pattern). Whether or not this can be done aside, there is no use in writing letters to west on track, it just comes across a begrudgery.

My post was entirely tongue in cheek - West on track don't have a clue about transport planning and live in a fairy land of make believe. The WRC southern branch line from Ennis to Galway will doubtless limp on the WRC northern branch line to Claremorris probably won't happen and will be a complete waste of time if it does. Begrudgery as far as WOT are concerned is good they are selfish to even think a line on the WRC is needed...the rest of the country needs to tell them their rail line is taking resources from places where it is really needed.

Its not a corridor by the way - its a T junction with a branch line from Galway to Limerick via Athenry and a proposed branch line from Galway to Claremorris (where) via Athenry. The Corridor is a myth. People living on the "corridor" get on the train (in the main) for one reason only - to go up to Dublin. Teh "corridor" is a myth created by West on Track - it quite simply does not exist either cuturally or economically.