M17/M18 - Gort to Tuam [open to traffic]

antoobrien

glineli wrote: »

But do we not still have the problem that whoever wins the retender has to raise private capital or is this where the EIB cash comes in?

Going on the text of the speech, it looks like the NPRF will put up some cash and the EIB will match it.

betistuc

The start date of this project worries me. Anything can happen between now and then. If its shovel ready why can't they start immediately. Regardless, the news is good!!

P.S. Why are so many referring to these roads as N17/18 , I thought they were motorways not dual carriageways!

Sponge Bob

Separately the Gort - Tuam scheme was allocated €12.4m in 2012 for Land Purchases etc and two schemes north and south of Milltown on the N17 got €7m between them. They are onsite on the larger of the latter 2 schemes and should tender for the Carrownurlaur bend later this year unless they fancy handing the €2m back.

The Gort Tuam scheme was allocated some €23m last year....again for land purchases and also allocated €39m in 2010 along with €52m in 2009.

I couldn't say that all of the money arrived and was spent each year but that lot adds up to significantly over €100m spent already if it was.

Tech3

This was originally meant to be finished by next year

Benbecul97

Brentmeister wrote: »

if the construction starts next year, would it be fair to presume the gort-galway section will open first, maybe late 2014?

Also curious about this - anyone know?

Surely it makes sense to first complete the linking of the M18 with the M6, and then work on the road north of this interchange.

antoobrien

Benbecul97 wrote: »

Also curious about this - anyone know?

Surely it makes sense to first complete the linking of the M18 with the M6, and then work on the road north of this interchange.

The project was originally due to start in November 2010 and last until sometime in 2014. The original link is not available but here;s what was said on this thread at the time:

serfboard wrote: »

And the second part of that article states:

It is expected that work will begin early 2011 and be completed by the end of 2014.

Speaking today Minister Dempsey said: “This new road improvement scheme will make a very big difference to the west of Ireland.

“It will significantly improve safety and reduce journey times for traffic travelling north-south along the Atlantic corridor. It will improve connectivity between Dublin and the western region and it will significantly assist in the economic development of Border, Midlands and Western regions,” said Dempsey.

It's not often (read, ever) that I'd accuse a politician (particularly an FFer) of under-selling something, but in this case I think that Mr. Dempsey is doing so. This will make a massive difference to the West Of Ireland.

Now roll on the M20 and the GCOB, he said greedily.

munchkin_utd

Benbecul97 wrote: »

Also curious about this - anyone know?

Surely it makes sense to first complete the linking of the M18 with the M6, and then work on the road north of this interchange.

you could also argue that it makes more sense to do it the other way round as.
a) Major bottleneck Tuam is bypassed
b) Major bottleneck Claregalway is bypassed
c) new arterial route provided to Taoiseachs Constituency a swathe of Mayo and indeed Galway - as an alternative to the substandard N5.

Benbecul97

antoobrien wrote: »

The project was originally due to start in November 2010 and last until sometime in 2014. The original link is not available but here;s what was said on this thread at the time:

Thanks, but cant see anywhere in your link where it mentions what section will be worked on first.

munchkin_utd wrote: »

you could also argue that it makes more sense to do it the other way round as.
a) Major bottleneck Tuam is bypassed
b) Major bottleneck Claregalway is bypassed
c) new arterial route provided to Taoiseachs Constituency a swathe of Mayo and indeed Galway - as an alternative to the substandard N5.

Fair enough, but I think having direct motorway access between the 3rd and 4the biggest cities should be No1. priority.

antoobrien

Benbecul97 wrote: »

Thanks, but cant see anywhere in your link where it mentions what section will be worked on first.

It was never (to my recollection) discussed by in the proposals. The only reference I can think of is in a dail question, where the junior minister stated the project should be delivered "as one" instead of in stages.

Personally I think they should do the N6-N17 & Tuam bypass sections first isntead of doing N18-N6, just in case anybody gets the bright idea of cancelling them once the N18 section is done. Besides, it always seems like there's more there's more traffic coming from (and through) North East Galway than south Galway.

serfboard

antoobrien wrote: »

Personally I think they should do the N6-N17 & Tuam bypass sections first isntead of doing N18-N6, just in case anybody gets the bright idea of cancelling them once the N18 section is done. Besides, it always seems like there's more there's more traffic coming from (and through) North East Galway than south Galway.

From a national infrastructure point of view it would seem to make more sense to do the M18 first. From a traffic point of view it would make more sense to do the M17 first.

Judging by other schemes, I think that neither will be done 'first' - they'll both open together, I would imagine. Makes more sense logistically to bring certain types of equipment to the project at the one time.

antoobrien

serfboard wrote: »

From a national infrastructure point of view it would seem to make more sense to do the M18 first. From a traffic point of view it would make more sense to do the M17 first.

Judging by other schemes, I think that neither will be done 'first' - they'll both open together, I would imagine. Makes more sense logistically to bring certain types of equipment to the project at the one time.

Not that I don't agree with your your logic, but I'm thinking of how we can prevent "cute hoorism" from canning the M17 & Tuam sections as being unnecessary if the N18 proceeded first.

Arguably there's a greater need for the M17 section as it claimed that a lot of traffic from Mayo has to come South due to the state of the N5 (emphasis added):

Deleted User wrote: »

Some lorries cannot even fit on the N5 through Ballaghadereen town (due to a very tight narrow 90 degree turn)so lots go the longer route via the N17/18 to Galway, then Dublin. Those that do travel on the N5 do so mainly at night because of the shocking narrow twisty roads and slow speeds mainly in Roscommon. Several exporting multinationals from Mayo had pressed the government to make improvements due to the damage been caused to products on route. They had threatened to pull out. Resulting in the now planned Ballaghdereen bypass starting this Winter and the soon to be opened Longford bypass.

spacetweek

Brentmeister wrote: »

if the construction starts next year, would it be fair to presume the gort-galway section will open first, maybe late 2014?

It will probably take 3 years to complete so 2016.

Sponge Bob

The Gort Ennis construction phase ( and Athlone Ballinasloe) was as little as 23-24 months. If diggers go onsite in 2013 I could see completion in 2015 or early 2016 with (at least) the Tuam Bypass section open by 2015.

glineli

Does this have to go out for tender again? If so how long does that process take?

Benbecul97

Sponge Bob wrote: »

The Gort Ennis construction phase ( and Athlone Ballinasloe) was as little as 23-24 months. If diggers go onsite in 2013 I could see completion in 2015 or early 2016 with (at least) the Tuam Bypass section open by 2015.

Gort-Crusheen was 22km though so approximately a km a month!
The yardstick should be Galway-Ballinasloe, it was 56km this is 57km. How long did it Galway-Ballinasloe take?

FullBeard

Benbecul97 wrote: »

Gort-Crusheen was 22km though so approximately a km a month!
The yardstick should be Galway-Ballinasloe, it was 56km this is 57km. How long did it Galway-Ballinasloe take?

Not a good yardstick as it depends on manpower and machines. Two 40-km M8 schemes were completed in under 24 months each.

Benbecul97

FullBeard wrote: »

Not a good yardstick as it depends on manpower and machines. Two 40-km M8 schemes were completed in under 24 months each.

:rolleyes: of course it depends on manpower, machines, terrain etc. I was talking distance as they are (almost!) identical.

Sponge Bob

If they give Gort - Tuam to a pack of pros like Roadbridge it can be done in 24 months as Fullbeard says and this is not 'length' dependent.

I would advise that a LOT of heavy plant equipment has been liquidated/sold and then exported since 2010 and that it may no longer be possible to gather plant in Ireland to do a job like this in 24 months....as it would have been as little as 2 years ago.

In other words we may not have the overall capacity any longer.

funnyname

Just looking at the old plans, will there only be one junction between Gort and Rathmorrissy? Surely there should be one for the r446 and another one between that and the one north of Ardrahan?

yer man!

funnyname wrote: »

Just looking at the old plans, will there only be one junction between Gort and Rathmorrissy? Surely there should be one for the r446 and another one between that and the one north of Ardrahan?

Well the junction at kiltiernan will be used for ppl going to clarinbridge and kilcolgan. The next junction is M6 as you said, I don't know where many people would really need to go between these two junctions. You will join the M6 to get to Athenry - Dublin, Oranmore - Galway.

the keen edge

I know the landowners at the Kiltiernan junction, last week they were saying that motorway service stations will be located there.

Can anybody confirm this?

funnyname

yer man! wrote: »

Well the junction at kiltiernan will be used for ppl going to clarinbridge and kilcolgan. The next junction is M6 as you said, I don't know where many people would really need to go between these two junctions. You will join the M6 to get to Athenry - Dublin, Oranmore - Galway.

But in fairness you won't actually carry on after Kiltiernan and join the M6 for Galway and Oranmore, you'll come off the M18 and go via the old n18 and save yourself about 12km.

Sponge Bob

the keen edge wrote: »

I know the landowners at the Kiltiernan junction, last week they were saying that motorway service stations will be located there.

Can anybody confirm this?

ISTR it was meant to be at the M6 junction but that this did not pass planning....so possibly Kiltiernan instead.

yer man!

funnyname wrote: »

But in fairness you won't actually carry on after Kiltiernan and join the M6 for Galway and Oranmore, you'll come off the M18 and go via the old n18 and save yourself about 12km.

Ya I know but sure the motorway really goes to Athenry and not Oranmore. There's a sign on the Gort motorway that has Oranmore on it in a blue motorway sign on the on ramp north bound.

jenningso

http://www.galwaynews.ie/26848-gort-tuam-motorway-work-start-early-next-year

"Tuesday’s official unveiling of the Government’s stimulus package means the consortium, Direct Route, is expected to start constructing the road in the Spring/Summer of 2013, with an end of 2016 completion date"

antoobrien

funnyname wrote: »

Just looking at the old plans, will there only be one junction between Gort and Rathmorrissy? Surely there should be one for the r446 and another one between that and the one north of Ardrahan?

There's an issue of having minimun distances between junctions, one of the reasons why the Athlone DC can't be converted to Motorway status - they'd have to close off a few junctions. So it's proabbly that they couldn't create junctions at Kiltiernan & Ardrahan or the R446 & M6 as they'd be too close to each other.

Anothter thing going against an R446 junction is that they don't want the traffic going in the R446 - they want it going in along the Motorway. It's easy enough to get to the R446 from athenry, they've created a small link road to between the M6 and Derrydonnel to keep traffic out of the village.

From a pragmatic POV the ideal place to have a junction is on the exiting N18. the M18 crosses the N18 at Kiltiernan, so this is the logical point. Otherwise we'd have to create long link roads (such as the 8km link to the Lougrhea bypass from the M6) to get to places link Ardrahan, that don't really have anything to justify it (Loughrea has several factories and office buildings).

antoobrien

jenningso wrote: »

http://www.galwaynews.ie/26848-gort-tuam-motorway-work-start-early-next-year

"Tuesday’s official unveiling of the Government’s stimulus package means the consortium, Direct Route, is expected to start constructing the road in the Spring/Summer of 2013, with an end of 2016 completion date"

Does anybody know if that means that BAM have been kicked off this project?

irishgeo

antoobrien wrote: »

Does anybody know if that means that BAM have been kicked off this project?

according to this old BAM article they were preferred bidder but its all up in the air now. The only who will know are the NRA.

BAM led Consortium is preferred bidder for Gort to Tuam PPP Scheme

The National Roads Authority has selected the BAM led Consortium as preferred bidder for the N17/N18 Gort to Tuam PPP Scheme.The project includes the design, build, finance and maintenance of approximately 57 km of motorway between Gort and Tuam, part of the Atlantic road corridor. The works comprise; three grade separated junctions, including a major intersection with the new M6 Dublin-Galway interurban motorway, a roundabout, two railway bridges, five river bridges, 31 road bridges and several other structures.

This is the first scheme of Ireland’s Second PPP Roads Programme and a first for the BAM Balfour Beatty Consortium. The PPP Scheme will be funded by way of availability payments over the period of the contract.Theo Cullinane CEO of BAM Contractors, in a note congratulating those who worked on the bid observed, “I am sure in years to come it will be seen as a defining project in the company history, particularly when set against the current economic backdrop. It is with these difficult times in mind that I would like to thank all at BAM and Balfour Beatty for their commitment, dedication and passion shown over many months”.

It is the National Roads Authority’s intention to achieve financial close in the shortest time possible. Work is expected to commence in early 2011 and be completed by the end of 2014.

« Back to main news page

funnyname

Sponge Bob wrote: »

ISTR it was meant to be at the M6 junction but that this did not pass planning....so possibly Kiltiernan instead.

But wouldn't it make sense to have a service station at Rathmorrissy to benefit the M18 as well as the M6. People going westbound on the M6 would be able to grab a bite to eat and get fuel before heading off on a long journey rather having to wait until they get to the one on the M4. Also it will be benefit the people going eastbound as they will have just been on a long journey so they can get out and stretch their legs, again grab a bite to eat and refuel.

Do these planners never think of the bigger picture or is it all about vested interests?

antoobrien

funnyname wrote: »

But wouldn't it make sense to have a service station at Rathmorrissy to benefit the M18 as well as the M6. People going westbound on the M6 would be able to grab a bite to eat and get fuel before heading off on a long journey rather having to wait until they get to the one on the M4. Also it will be benefit the people going eastbound as they will have just been on a long journey so they can get out and stretch their legs, again grab a bite to eat and refuel.

Do these planners never think of the bigger picture or is it all about vested interests?

Well the planners decided that the plans submitted for the station at Rathmorrissy weren't safe, so I don't think it's vested interests that was the problem there.