Thomas Cook Grafton Street store occupied by the workers

TheZohanS

PCPhoto wrote: »

its more than likely that the Gardai will mount a morning attack probably 5am or some silly hour or something - to avoid the press.

cant see them doing it at 11am or in daylight..... it's gonna get messy (I Think)

If one of the workers is actually pregnant they'll be very careful, I'd imagine the workers will stand down as soon as the media hype has faded.

fryup

all we need now is the sh*t stirrers from sinn fein to turn up

Sully

fryup wrote: »

all we need now is the sh*t stirrers from sinn fein to turn up

They were there already, holding up a banner.

PCPhoto

fryup wrote: »

all we need now is the sh*t stirrers from sinn fein to turn up

they were there today.

Zohan - two (2) of the wimmens is knocked up ...... yup you heard me right, two of the female staff are indeed heavily pregnant - infact, I believe I overheard earlier that both have only about 2weeks left before they are due.

some of the staff members were fast to point out that one of the pregnant ladies was the first to state that she was willing to goto jail and have her child in jail.

Nodin

Crackity Jones wrote: »

They are protesting because they want more redundancy payment. It has nothing to do with wanting to work. Fin

They were in negotiation for weeks trying to keep at least one shop open. Please inform yourself of at least the basics before chipping in.

PCPhoto

Sully wrote: »

The press will remain their overnight, knowing the boys in blue will strike at any moment.

Maybe they will rush in through the back, after first cutting all power and shooting in some teargas?

as far as I understand most people (including press) believe that nothing can/will happen until 11am .... but my understanding is that the gardai have already been given the green light by the judge to go in at any time.

JONJO THE MISER

They really are mamking a show of Ireland, what company in there right mind would now choose Ireland to invest in and these posters on here going on about how much money Buissness make better wake up to themselves, buisness are supposed to make money thats what there for, what diffrence does it make how much money they make as long as they treat there workers right and in this case the company has and gone above the min redunancy level to pay. Some posters on here seem to live in a fantasy world, where everyone should get equal pay requardless of how hard they work, there either teenagers or some deluded students but they cant possible be Adults with thinking like that.

Crackity Jones

Nodin wrote: »

They were in negotiation for weeks trying to keep at least one shop open. Please inform yourself of at least the basics before chipping in.

All reports I have seen have said protest is over better redundancy. That's pretty basic to me

miju

no sympathy for them tbh. they're getting 5 weeks plus 2 weeks statutory. alot of people these days are just getting their 2 weeks statutory and nothing more.

i actually hope Thomas Cook pull the offer and just offer statutory 2 weeks redundancy to teach those bints a lesson in not being greedy. theres a recession on ffs their time would be better served out looking for new jobs rather than sitting in hoping in vain for more money from an already generous redundancy package.

Sierra Oscar

Crackity Jones wrote: »

All reports I have seen have said protest is over better redundancy. That's pretty basic to me

Also management decided on Friday to close the stores prematurely, after they stated they would close at the end of the month earlier. Thats what sparked the sit-in.

Nodin

Crackity Jones wrote: »

All reports I have seen have said protest is over better redundancy. That's pretty basic to me

You stated

It has nothing to do with wanting to work.

. Their first course of action was to try and save at least some of the jobs.


In addition

Giving evidence, Mr Doherty said that staff decided, following discussions with management, to forego the 3.5% pay rise agreed under the national agreement on the 8 May but that four days later, management said they would be closing its shops in Dublin.
On 24 July, a secret ballot delivered a 100% vote in favour of industrial action.
He said they had given written notice of their intention to begin industrial action on 7 August, but that management had pre-empted their lawful action when they told staff last Friday the stores were closing immediately. He said he felt the 'gloves were off' at that stage and felt the sit-in was the right course of action.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0803/thomascook.html

sdanseo

According to the ringleader, most of the staff are there 10 years + and her 17 years. That's the guts of one and two years' pay respectively, so I'd normally have feck all sympathy for them.

But the way they were allegedly treated - lined up like a feckign firing squad if you believe some reports - combined with the boss getting his cushty €6m bonus, put together with the apparent success of the UK operations means to me that HQ just couldnt be arsed trying to make the shops profitable. It was more convenient to close them, nothing else, I'd say.

EDIT: And add the fact that if you believe the above, they decided to close early and go against their word to avoid bad press...

maggie797 wrote: »

as a manager I would be watching all these people very closely and I certainly would not give them a job if and when they do leave there sit in and start looking around for work. Managing a business is enough pressure at the moment without the extra worry of " difficult" staff.. I have heard thomas cook pulled out earlier then planned because of union issues?? dont know how true this is...but it would make me wonder.... 5 weeks is not a bad deal at all and I cant see what they are whinging at...

Oh come off it - there's a difference between being difficult and standing up for yourself against management that clearly have no concern for them at all. Please don't be so managerially biased and downright arrogant.

Rock on, sit-inners!

Mrmoe

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

They really are mamking a show of Ireland,

We will be shamed, what will the neighbors think:rolleyes:.

TheZohanS

Irish Independent

Assistant manager Sinead Hammett, who has worked at the store since it opened 10 years ago, expressed her anger.
"I've been here almost 10 years, and so I'm very emotional. I was shocked to hear the store would be closing down -- only a few weeks ago they gave us additional training and introduced 'proud values' for staff.
"We were also reassured about our jobs and told that the recession had affected us but that we would scrape through."

Carlow52

PCPhoto wrote: »

they were there today.

Zohan - two (2) of the wimmens is knocked up ...... yup you heard me right, two of the female staff are indeed heavily pregnant - infact, I believe I overheard earlier that both have only about 2weeks left before they are due.

some of the staff members were fast to point out that one of the pregnant ladies was the first to state that she was willing to goto jail and have her child in jail.

All very well till she gets a dose of H1N1

Crackity Jones

Nodin wrote: »

You stated . Their first course of action was to try and save at least some of the jobs.


In addition

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0803/thomascook.html

Hold on. Are we or are we not discussing the illegal and pointless sit in. My consistent point is that the sit in is about improved redundancy. You can selectively quote from that r t e article all you want but I stand by my comments. Also the company have said they will go to labour court if sit in ends making it even more ridiculous.

ynotdu

the dail was in recess,the courts were not sitting.
the high court found time to sit on a bank holiday
these workers must be a clear and present danger to the state:rolleyes:

once again proof it was needed that the courts pick on *the small*people and look after those helpless millionaires!

P.S what percentage of judges have paid the levy they were excluded from?but were asked as responsible, upstanding, fair, and decent citesens to cough up the same as the rest of the public service on a voluntry basis?:rolleyes:

Nodin

Crackity Jones wrote: »

Hold on. Are we or are we not discussing the illegal and pointless sit in.

It may be illegal, but its most certainly not pointless. If there's enough money to give a 5 Million STG bonus to one individual, then there should have been enough to at least persevere with one shop for another year or two until things pick up, or reward staff who've been with the company long term, in whats a notoriously high pressure sales enviroment.

Instead they indulged in some bizarre acts of almost ritual humiliation and tried to shut shop early when it didn't go down.

Nietzschean

Nodin wrote: »

It may be illegal, but its most certainly not pointless. If there's enough money to give a 5 Million STG bonus to one individual, then there should have been enough to at least persevere with one shop for another year or two until things pick up

Why? Company is there to make money, employee's get paid to do job, if shop doesn't make money company will close the shop. Company can open new shop if the economy changes. Seems to make perfect sense? CEO bonus payments are irrelevent, infact part of his pay is probably due to a cost cutting drive in closing un-profitable shops like these.

The income from these shops isn't contributing to that 5Mill so it seems irrelevent, if we went with that logic any profitable company would never be able to close any unprofitable part of it anywhere in the world...which would just be bizzare?

or reward staff who've been with the company long term, in whats a notoriously high pressure sales enviroment.

They were paid to do a job, it doesn't matter what the job was their pay should have been inline with the work. They are being hugely rewarded by a generous 2.5x statutory redundancy package. So I don't see how the company isn't rewarding previous loyalty with that?

Instead they indulged in some bizarre acts of almost ritual humiliation and tried to shut shop early when it didn't go down.

From what i've read(on this thread/news sites) it went something like pay cut -> agreed by all -> managment decide to shut down in 30 days -> unions decide to strike -> management shut with immediate effect(while still actually paying the 30 days notice i presume)

So while queueing people up seems callous , at a guess i'm presuming it was to inform each employee of the specifics of their redundancy package. Its probably pretty difficult to organise a mass layoff without people being annoyed. I don't think they got it right, but I don't think it sounds like they had any malicious intent either....

PrivateEye

So, will the Gardai actually pull female striking workers out of a building by force?

Better question, will their 'union' bother us with more billboards asking if the Gardai deserve to pay the Pension Levy?
Full solidarity to the police after this :rolleyes:

ynotdu

Nietzschean wrote: »

Why? Company is there to make money, employee's get paid to do job, if shop doesn't make money company will close the shop. Company can open new shop if the economy changes. Seems to make perfect sense? CEO bonus payments are irrelevent, infact part of his pay is probably due to a cost cutting drive in closing un-profitable shops like these.

The income from these shops isn't contributing to that 5Mill so it seems irrelevent, if we went with that logic any profitable company would never be able to close any unprofitable part of it anywhere in the world...which would just be bizzare?

They were paid to do a job, it doesn't matter what the job was their pay should have been inline with the work. They are being hugely rewarded by a generous 2.5x statutory redundancy package. So I don't see how the company isn't rewarding previous loyalty with that?

From what i've read(on this thread/news sites) it went something like pay cut -> agreed by all -> managment decide to shut down in 30 days -> unions decide to strike -> management shut with immediate effect(while still actually paying the 30 days notice i presume)

So while queueing people up seems callous , at a guess i'm presuming it was to inform each employee of the specifics of their redundancy package. Its probably pretty difficult to organise a mass layoff without people being annoyed. I don't think they got it right, but I don't think it sounds like they had any malicious intent either....

Hi,ah c,mon everybody is entitled to their views on things from extreme right to extreme left,but the dogs on the street know many employers are abusing the recession to lower workers pay and change their terms and conditions to their remaining employee,s.
a sit in by employee,s hardly merited a High court intervention on a bank holiday monday did it?
I suggest Thomas Cooke are going to these lents as a warning to their UK staff?
What about the landlords of premises in Grafton Street who will not lower the rents to longstanding tenants who always paid on time and to the full?

Loyalty works both ways,and in the end employers who are found to be abusing the present situation will be remembered..............

holyjoe

PrivateEye wrote: »

So, will the Gardai actually pull female striking workers out of a building by force?


is there any reason why they shoudnt?
they're breaking the law and last time i checked females had to abide by
the law the same as anyone else.


apart from shuting down the shop early thier argument is ridicolus.
its just pure greed. id be delighted with 5 weeks per year redundancy.

does that mean ur wan whos there 17 years would be getting 85 weeks pay
tax free!! ffs

Nietzschean

ynotdu wrote: »

but the dogs on the street know many employers are abusing the recession to lower workers pay and change their terms and conditions to their remaining employee,s.

The dogs on the street also knows we are generally over-paid in ireland(higher cost of living and all that) compared to the rest of europe/us, the employers might be seeking to profit out of the poor work environment but it is their job as managers to maximise profits. If employee's will work for the lower pay then by a capitalist view point you were paying too much.... its not very nice but these are all for-profit companies....

a sit in by employee,s hardly merited a High court intervention on a bank holiday monday did it?

I'm not sure on the legal aspects of their sit in so I can't really comment, but I would have presumed illegal tresspass and immediate expulsion by the gardai. But given it is something which requires swift resolution i don't find it too surprising some court would hear it at the weekend(i certainly wouldn't want to wait a few weeks to have the gardai remove some randomers from my house, which on a legal stand point i presume is the same as the ex-employee's remaining on the premesis?). But like i said i'm not clued in really on the legal surroundings....

I suggest Thomas Cooke are going to these lents as a warning to their UK staff?

Maybe,maybe not, i'm not sure how that has any bearing on the case though. 'if your store isn't profitable we will close it' , it doesn't seem like a threat so much as common business sense?

What about the landlords of premises in Grafton Street who will not lower the rents to longstanding tenants who always paid on time and to the full?

Then grafton street will have vacant shops and begin to loose out more to O'Connell street and the shopping centres outside the centre..... supply and demand and all that...

Loyalty works both ways,and in the end employers who are found to be abusing the present situation will be remembered..............

From anything I've read in this i've yet to see how Thomas Cook are abusing anything? And you'll find that as what comes with employment any company which 'abuses' the current down turn but pays at/above market rates after it to get good employee's will still get them.....

ynotdu

holyjoe wrote: »

PrivateEye wrote: »

So, will the Gardai actually pull female striking workers out of a building by force?


is there any reason why they shoudnt?
they're breaking the law and last time i checked females had to abide by
the law the same as anyone else.


apart from shuting down the shop early thier argument is ridicolus.
its just pure greed. id be delighted with 5 weeks per year redundancy.

does that mean ur wan whos there 17 years would be getting 85 weeks pay
tax free!! ffs

Holyjoe,If the lady you mention DID get 85 weeks would it make you jealous?(sarcastic i know)or are You really concerned about how all in this economy will fare? many so old if they lose their jobs will not get another one and their Pensions possibly worth ziltch due to the stupidity of much better paid Bankers and Govt ministers.

I do not believe there is a black and white answer as to who abuses the most when it comes to unions or employers.

it has to be said though that many employers *took the money and ran*
and in response to other posters,YES we did get greedy and become uncompetive on one level.

on the other hand the utility companies refused to lower their charges,
also the likes of Tesco had to wait until we are near basket cases to *suddenly*find costcutting measures:mad:

joethebrit

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

They really are mamking a show of Ireland, what company in there right mind would now choose Ireland to invest in and these posters on here going on about how much money Buissness make better wake up to themselves, buisness are supposed to make money thats what there for, what diffrence does it make how much money they make as long as they treat there workers right and in this case the company has and gone above the min redunancy level to pay. Some posters on here seem to live in a fantasy world, where everyone should get equal pay requardless of how hard they work, there either teenagers or some deluded students but they cant possible be Adults with thinking like that.

Has this poster not noticed the epidemic of workplace occupations that have been occurring around the developed world for the last six months; there have been well publicised occupations in Britain, France and the United States some of which have involved managerial and other senior staff either being held hostage or leading the protest themselves. Given that the Irish workforce and their unions are generally more slavish than those of Ireland's main competitors and that many mainland European countries have higher redundancy payments Ireland will remain a viable option until EITHER foreign investors realize that they can get the same work done in Poland or Slovenia for a third of the price if they are willing to overcome the inconvenience of learning Polish or Serbo-Croat OR competitor states lower their Corporation Tax rates. One of the two will certainly happen soon and even if they don't the Irish GDP won't recover to the 2007 level until 2014 (at the earliest). It's up to every individual to get what they can while they can and will the last one out of the country please turn off the lights!

pink13penguin

About 20 workers were arrested at 5am this morning. They will be taking to the high court later on!

A protest will take place outside the court from 1pm to support the brave workers.

A statement read by management confirmed that they now have control of the premises!

Bandit12

pink13penguin wrote: »

About 20 workers were arrested at 5am this morning. They will be taking to the high court later on!

A protest will take place outside the court from 1pm to support the brave workers.

A statement read by management confirmed that they now have control of the premises!

Fantastic to see our Gardai do a brave days work all the while the junkie's and lowlifes walk the city's streets everyday scottfree. What a country:mad:

Board Senseless

Ah, that old chestnut.

Mossy Monk

Bandit12 wrote: »

Fantastic to see our Gardai do a brave days work all the while the junkie's and lowlifes walk the city's streets everyday scottfree. What a country:mad:

They broke the law. Why would you be happy to see the Gardaí turn a blind eye to these idiots. Double standards.

Shield

Bandit12 wrote: »

Fantastic to see our Gardai do a brave days work all the while the junkie's and lowlifes walk the city's streets everyday scottfree. What a country:mad:

You'll find the Gardaí enforce every court order issued by a High Court Judge, whether they like it or not. You're not even close to comparing like with like.