20% foreign people in Ireland now - highest in Europe

Oman

i think it was a bad desision to join the eu in the first place i mean i have nothing against foreigners but 20% thats just taking the irish out of ireland,

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

so as well as not letting foreigners into Irland, should we also not let irish people leave Ireland?

barclay2

Here look the figure of 20% is just wrong. I have a close relative working in the department of enterprise and employment, in the migrant workers' rights section. According to him, the census estimate of around 420000 immigrants i.e. TEN percent of the republic's population, is considered broadly accurate - with the exception of the figure for chinese people. The census counted around 25000 chinese, but its reckoned (by agencies such as the Chinese embassy) that there could be around 50-60000 here. Possibly less, unlikely to be more.

20%, or anything near it, is wrong.

And the high numbers of illegal chinese has very little to do with Ireland's membership of the EU, other than that it helped make us rich enough to attract so many chinese in the first place.

Tha Gopher

LeixlipRed wrote:

Ah yes, she's female and quite clearly a racist so I should try and score her by telling her how great she is. I'd perv at you too love . Is that better? :rolleyes:

Shes a racist because she thinks one group go over the top in their comments or behaviour around her? If i dont go to a particular pub because its full of drunken oul ones trying to maul me, am I an ageist?

Spook_ie

Had an interesting comment in the cab that with all these foreign nationals having babies here that we will have a good olympics team for 2032 and might even get a soccer team that can win something

Red Alert

I like the polish people - the women are hot

(Immature I know but I had to say it)

liberty 2007

It depresses to see how many people seem to be taken in by the pro immigrant propaganda from the mass media over the last several years. "we need them for the economy". We DON'T live in an economy, we live in a society. That society has to function through the good times and the bad times. Anyone who thinks the east Europeans will go home when the economy goes down hill, are fooling themselves and everyone who listens to them. The dole they'll be entitled to receive here will be far more then the wage they would get get at home. Many of them will be quite happy to draw the dole and work in the black economy.
The burden of that and other negative issues arising from the very large numbers of immigrants in the country is likely to eventually lead to civil unrest.
Perhaps the Polish Government will send a military force to defend it's citizens?
Seem far fetched, read your history books, it's happened many times in the past and as long as humans live on this earth, it will happen again.

mike65

A foreigner writes.....























BOO!

Mike.

Mr.Nice Guy

SimpleSam06 wrote:

Correlation does not equal causation, say it after me.

Correlation does not equal causation.

Good lad.

Just because there are a lot of immigrants coming into the country does not mean the EU designated Ireland as a skip for all of their undesireables. It simply means Ireland is seen as being wealthy and has a reputation internationally for wealth. "Celtic tiger" ringing any bells at all?

So according to you the fact we are taking in ENORMOUS amounts of immigrants - unlike the French who are reluctant to take them - has nothing whatsoever to do with the latter having more power than us? Oh to be as naive as you!

Oh excuse me I forgot - correlation does not equal causation, right? Sounds to me like a formula to justify ignorance.

"Hey smoking causes lung cancer!"

"Pish, posh. Correlation does not equal causation!"

Get a clue mate. Good lad.

SimpleSam wrote:

Poor people go to rich countries. No conspiracy required.

Why are poor people IN THEIR DROVES going to this country? That is the real issue. The answer? We have not got the power to buck the trend.

Seanies32 wrote:

Your avoiding the point. He was born in a foreign country. Immigrants are born in foreign countries.

Im not avoiding the point. My point is that being born in a foreign country does not necessarily make one a foreigner. National identity is a complex matter.

Seanies32 wrote:

Thank God the Americans didn't take the same line after the Famine.

Yeah thank God the Americans welcomed the Irish with open arms! Thank God they didn't have signs saying "No Irish need apply". God bless those forward-thinking, welcoming Americans!

Seanies32 wrote:

We had the freedom to impose restrictions on Romania and Bulgaria because it suited us. We had no restrictions a couple of years ago because it was decided it was in our interest. We then had the freedom to change our policy.

We have as much freedom as Brussels will allow us. Ask the British people, who were promised a referendum on the EU treaty and then told they couldn't have one, how free they are. Ask the Dutch people as well.

You think we're in control of our own destiny? If only that werre true.

karen3212 wrote:

I am completely confused, do you want Irish idiots to have less of a say in who governs them or do you think we are too stupid to know what is best for us? If we are too stupid then surely it is good that Germans and French have more say in what we do.

I want Irish people to stop being idiots, read a newspaper once a while, maybe watch the news and realise that a) we have a government built on disgraceful corruption and b) there is an effort on the part of the European Union to remove our sovereignty.

You may be right though. If we're too stupid to vote for politicians with integrity and to safeguard our national identity then maybe we are better off allowing the Germans and French more say. I've not completely given up on us though despite the best efforts of FF voters to turn this country into a laughing stock.

karen3212 wrote:

I thought the boom was brought about by the condom.

Well a kind of boom is brought about by that.

karen3212 wrote:

What's wrong with having direct acess to a few hundred million people to trade with, bulkbuying etc. I don't think their cultures are any worse than ours, and I can fly all the way around Europe without having to change my money every half hour. Also I love hearing foreign languages here too, and how different are we really to people from other countries. All people have pride in their own cultures, I don't think you have to worry about our culture, it has amalgated with others for thousands of years, and we still like it.

What's wrong with protecting our sovereignty, retaining our national veto in key areas and making sure we don't lose our right to rule on matters like justice and immigration?

I'm all for immigration - I just want us to be in control of it and not Brussels. I'm kind of whacky in that way.

You see I'm one of those crazy radicalists who believes that Irish people ought to be able to make their own decisions. What can I say, I'm a dreamer. But I'm not the only one.

Hagar

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Ask the British people, who were promised a referendum on the EU treaty and then told they couldn't have one, how free they are.

That's our fault, we got two. We could have had more but we gave the the Government the result they wanted the second time...

K-9

Mordeth wrote:

so as well as not letting foreigners into Irland, should we also not let irish people leave Ireland?

Brilliant!;)

K-9

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

So according to you the fact we are taking in ENORMOUS amounts of immigrants - unlike the French who are reluctant to take them - has nothing whatsoever to do with the latter having more power than us? Oh to be as naive as you!

So you're equating Frances' immigration problem with ours. Any statistics on immigrants in France compared to Ireland?

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Why are poor people IN THEIR DROVES going to this country? That is the real issue. The answer? We have not got the power to buck the trend.

I know, shocking isn't it. Them bloody Irish going from a poor country to rich countries in the 18 and 1900's.

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Im not avoiding the point. My point is that being born in a foreign country does not necessarily make one a foreigner. National identity is a complex matter. .

No, that was my point! So you've learned something from this thread! So the 20% foreigners may not actually be foreigners!

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Yeah thank God the Americans welcomed the Irish with open arms! Thank God they didn't have signs saying "No Irish need apply". God bless those forward-thinking, welcoming Americans!

You've proved my point, fast forward 100 years! Countries adjust!
I know, America was so discriminatory against the Irish! What century do you live in? What country gave the Irish a chance? If you think America treated the Irish badly overall, post your links.

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

We have as much freedom as Brussels will allow us. Ask the British people, who were promised a referendum on the EU treaty and then told they couldn't have one, how free they are. Ask the Dutch people as well.

So tell the Romanians that!

K-9

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

You may be right though. If we're too stupid to vote for politicians with integrity and to safeguard our national identity then maybe we are better off allowing the Germans and French more say. I've not completely given up on us though despite the best efforts of FF voters to turn this country into a laughing stock.

Seeing as you've brought a political party into it and you believe you see the future, enlighten us, who did you vote for in the election? What party best reflects your opinion?

Mr.Nice Guy

Seanies32 wrote:

So you're equating Frances' immigration problem with ours. Any statistics on immigrants in France compared to Ireland?

According to the French national institute of statistics 9 million non-nationals live in France (8% of the country's population). According to the Irish census non-nationals make up 10% of our population. However according to Minister of State for integration Conor Lenihan the census gave a "serious underestimate" of the number of foreign nationals living in the State. See here:

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/ireland/2007/0917/1189076546717.html

Hope that information proves comforting to you.

Seanies32 wrote:

I know, shocking isn't it. Them bloody Irish going from a poor country to rich countries in the 18 and 1900's.

I'm not sure what you mean. Care to elaborate?

Seanies32 wrote:

No, that was my point! So you've learned something from this thread! So the 20% foreigners may not actually be foreigners!

Oh so 20% might not be foreign. Of course! I guess most of them have different customs and speak a different language due to bad schooling, right?

Seanies32 wrote:

You've proved my point, fast forward 100 years! Countries adjust!I know, America was so discriminatory against the Irish! What century do you live in? What country gave the Irish a chance? If you think America treated the Irish badly overall, post your links.

I'll go you one better than a link. Here's some extracts from a book called "The Irish Americans'' by Ernest Wood (highly recommended). It might change your rose-tinted view of how the Americans treated us Irish:

Many Americans considered "Bridget" (as they stereotyped the Irish domestic), clumsy, lazy, an indifferent housekeeper and a poor cook. Irish maids were blamed for broken dishes. They were accused of stealing food. They were docked in pay when they left the house without permission.

Or how about this...

In the popular stereotype, Irish women, especially those employed as domestics, were foolish and careless, and Irish men were drunken, dirty, violent and lazy. By the 1850s, many early Presbyterian Irish immigrants began calling themselves "Scotch-Irish" to set themselves apart from the new arrivals.

More serious was anti-Irish violence. In Masachusetts alone, houses were stoned (Boston, 1829), Yankee laborers rioted against Catholics employed on Construction jobs (Lowell, 1831) and a convent was burned (Charlestown, 1834) - all this before the famine immigrants arrived. Philadelphia had to declare martial law to stop anti-Catholic and anti-Irish riots in 1844. By the 1850s the Know-Nothing Party, that advocated "America for Americans", was marshalling both public opinion and physical violence against the Irish. Riots broke out in Philadelphia, Newark, Baltimore, Brooklyn, St Louis and several Masachusetts cities. In Louisville, Know-Nothings rioted against both Germans and Irish, setting fires and looting stores and houses until many immigrants fled the city A popular jingle in San Francisco in 1854 declared:

The Know-Nothings have done the job
Wide-Awake boys acted accordin'
If you want to get a lick
Just say you're a Mick
And they'll kick you on the other side of Jordan.

But hey Seanies32, don't let these facts get in the way of your assumptions! Sure doesn't the whole world love us Irish? "Begorrah and bejaysus" and so forth! And sure don't we owe it to every other nation to open up our borders since we were treated SO wonderfully by other nations!

Please spare me from the "Ole, Ole" blarney bullsh*t.

Seanies32 wrote:

So tell the Romanians that!

What?

Seanies32 wrote:

Seeing as you've brought a political party into it and you believe you see the future, enlighten us, who did you vote for in the election? What party best reflects your opinion?

I voted for an alternative. I gave Labour my first preference and Fine Gael my second preference. They best reflected my opinion since I am of the crazy opinion that corruption and incompetence is actually a bad thing.

Who did you vote for, dare I ask?

Moriarty

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

According to the French national institute of statistics 9 million non-nationals live in France (8% of the country's population).

France has a population of 112.5 million people? French really is the language of love.

9 million people who live in France have no nationality? Were they all born on the moon?

moe_sizlak

ferdi wrote:

Appart from the comment about 'no headscarves in public places' i agree wholeheartedly with everythin Kevin Myers said tonight on the Late Late.

i agreed with him on the veil in public too

Cheeky_gal

LeixlipRed wrote:

Ah yes, she's female and quite clearly a racist so I should try and score her by telling her how great she is. I'd perv at you too love . Is that better? :rolleyes:

OMG I'm a racist!?! Since when??

Tha Gopher wrote:

Shes a racist because she thinks one group go over the top in their comments or behaviour around her? If i dont go to a particular pub because its full of drunken oul ones trying to maul me, am I an ageist?

haha he seems to have gone quiet, that shut him up...good woman!

Tha Gopher

Cheeky_gal wrote:

haha he seems to have gone quiet, that shut him up...good woman!

Im a dude

scruff321

darkman2 wrote:

Well, we kind of knew, but its been confirmed by the CSO that 20% of the population here is now foreign. We believed we would learn from other countries mistakes in relation to integration etc but now we have raced past them and find ourselves in a difficult position that they are not even in yet! In the context of the country's practically first 'black school' open in Balbriggan (descibed in the Senate today as 'apparthied') we now have major questions that we must answer and decisions we have to take - hard ones for lefties IMO - if we are not to see potentially disastrous societal problems here in the next decade. The liberals were warned - the silent majority kept silently thinking it and now we have sleeped walked into a situation where I believe the social cohesion of this country is now being put at risk.

I read a letter in a local newsletter today from a girl in secondary school countering accusations that her classmates were racist to a black student and would not associate or talk to her. The liberals in the area hopped on it as usual. But in her letter she said this was complete rubbish and the OPPOSITE was the case. She claimed the sizeable foreign students in the secondary school were not associating with the Irish but rather just forming a large ethnic group that would not even talk to the Irish students.

Perhaps a small localised issues but the alarm bells are starting to ring now with me. We have gone too far and the hens are quickly coming home to roost - even the bleeding heart liberals are quiet now - which seems to suggest they recognise that we are heading for trouble faster then any of our EU neighbours.

Though I would of thought Kevin Myers rumblings every week in the independent about the need to quickly get our thumbs out of our ass by articulating what we all privately know is warning enough.

How much trouble are we honestly in? And what realistically can we do with enough firmness to slow this tide which simply cannot continue?

This is an issue that requires urgency.


P.S no racism please.

blah,blah,blah have you forgotten that we irish have been the ones emigrating around the world for years and now that foreigners are coming over here we have to moan every 5 seconds "they're takin our jobs" :rolleyes:

Cheeky_gal

Tha Gopher wrote:

Im a dude

LOL oops!

Mr.Nice Guy

Moriarty wrote:

France has a population of 112.5 million people? French really is the language of love.

9 million people who live in France have no nationality? Were they all born on the moon?

Apologies that should read 4.9 million people making up 8% of their population.

juuge

On saturday I noticed a black security guard in parnell street stopping a traveller(irish gipsy) from entering the store (for whatever reason) and the traveller shouts out to the nigerian... F**K Off ya racist chink !
Kinda sums it up !

moe_sizlak

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Apologies that should read 4.9 million people making up 8% of their population.

b

moe_sizlak

Moriarty wrote:

France has a population of 112.5 million people? French really is the language of love.

9 million people who live in France have no nationality? Were they all born on the moon?

where did you get those statistics , out of your ass , france has no where near a population of 112 million
they have a population of just under 60 million

Moriarty

No shit.

61,538,322 as of last January. ..

robinph

moe_sizlak wrote:

where did you get those statistics , out of your ass , france has no where near a population of 112 million
they have a population of just under 60 million

That 112million comes form the same place as the 20% 'stated' in the first post, somone just made them up because the thought it sounded good to back up their post.

Mr.Nice Guy

moe_sizlak wrote:

where did you get those statistics , out of your ass , france has no where near a population of 112 million
they have a population of just under 60 million

Did you miss this...?

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Apologies that should read 4.9 million people making up 8% of their population.

:rolleyes:

robinph wrote:

That 112million comes form the same place as the 20% 'stated' in the first post, somone just made them up because the thought it sounded good to back up their post.

The 112 million figure resulted from me mistakenly putting '9 million' instead of '4.9 million' which caused some confusion. Now wind your neck in like a good lad.

The figures can be seen here:

http://www.insee.fr/fr/ffc/ipweb/ip1098/graphiques.html#graphique1

(incidentally not figures pulled 'from my ass')

TheBigLebowski

DonJose wrote:

Its not just the construction sector, the high paying jobs in manufacturing are being lost. Ireland lost its competitive years ago. Only today Tyco announced 178 job loses at Shannon. A lot of those people worked at Tyco for 20 years. Where do you see these people finding jobs.

http://rte.ie/business/2007/0927/jobs.html

Sure weren't these jobs that were 'robbed' from the Americans. I too along with thousands of others work for multinationals in jobs that were 'robbed' mostly from americans but a lot from Japan and elsewhere. We can't complain when companies go abroad to save money. That's why they came here in the 1st place.

robinph

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

The 112 million figure resulted from me mistakenly putting '9 million' instead of '4.9 million' which caused some confusion. Now wind your neck in like a good lad.

Thats fair enough, I guess I lost track of what numbers were actually real in this thread so went for the assume they are all bolicks option instead. But like the 20% that someone made up in the first post it now seems to have taken on a life of its own and become a 'fact' with the number of time people keep repeating it now.

chon

Hi,I'm new here and a foreigner as you can see from my name.i've been in ireland for a year now.And i love it.its a lovely country.{pardon me if i'm sidetracking from the main subject}
i just wanna point out some of the difficulties and the unpleasantness i have been facing...I'd like to say i'm kinda disappointed with the way some of the people behaved towards foreigners or is it just to an asian,since i am asian.Its not only me but the countries i come from (some of you may not even know it exist)all the asians have high regards for the Irish. we read a lot about them,heard a lot about them..since we're living in a 20th century,there's Tvs,movies medias etc..etc..we're so familiar with the celebrities like U2,Westlife,Sinead O' Connor,The Corrs to name a few from the music industries also there's Pierce Brosnan,Colin Farrell,Liam Neeson etc..from the movie industries..not only the celebrities but the whole of ireland..we really look up and admire.
Before I came here I honestly thought that the Irish people are very generous,loving,kind and warm hearted.But when I arrived here i was taken in for a rude shock.I was very disappointed and taken aback.
The first day i hung out in the famous Grafton Street and I went in to one of the pub there to have a glass of beer,the bartender was very rude to me,no smile on his face let alone a greetings.And he speaks to me in a very condescending manner as if i was an ignorant or a moron.

Anyways the most unpleasant one ever (not once or twice but many many times)was while travelling by bus.Why can't the driver be nice?Will they get a heart attack if they're being nice?I dunno the answer to that..but..am askin you ppl there are so many foreigners,the city is awashed with tourist..how can a foreigner possibly know how much the fare is..?from one end to the other watever the destination...Why is it so hard and painful for the driver to just tell how much the fare would be when asked.?I wish they were a lil' bit nicer.It would make a big difference!
Sorry guys if i've been a pain in the ass..i'm just a loner here in tis big city and i thought it'd make feel better if i let it off my chest.Thanx for listening and for your patience.God bless ya'll.