Athletics 2021

Chivito550 · 15-06-2021 10:55am

Hamachi wrote: »

Perhaps. I’ve just finished the autobiography of another elite female distance runner. It definitely doesn’t include pit stops at MaccyDs.

I saw Rudisha drinking a can of Coca-Cola an hour after a race in Melbourne years back.

They are people, not robots. They'll have the very occasional treat.

Oldira · 15-06-2021 11:44am

Chivito550 wrote: »

This is not true. I saw Dina Asher-Smith and half the GB team horsing into Burger King at the airport in Doha before flying home after Worlds. Its absolutely OK to treat yourself to a bit of sh1te every now and again, particularly after having competed and ran well.

That's the relevant phrase

average_runner · 15-06-2021 12:57pm

Chivito550 wrote: »

I saw Rudisha drinking a can of Coca-Cola an hour after a race in Melbourne years back.

They are people, not robots. They'll have the very occasional treat.

Totally agree.

Coke is a great recovery drink. Gets the sugars back up quickly. Enables a tired brain.

If they can't have a treat, whats the point in living. Bolt loved his food.

Its great seeing pro's have treats, it sends the right message out to kids

BeepBeep67 · 15-06-2021 1:03pm

This I feel does cast a shadow of doubt over BTC and Schumacher and the rallying around of her fellow US professionals, is this was another nation the sentiments would be quite different.
I also find this statement from Houlihan bizarre coming from a professional athlete.

When I got that email, I had to read it over about ten times and google what it was that I had just tested positive for. I had never even heard of nandrolone.

Anyone with a passing interest in sport and 'cough-cough' marginal gains has heard of nandrolone!

Dodge · 15-06-2021 1:07pm

average_runner wrote: »

The Americans aren't happy over this at all. Very different tone when its one of their own.

Most countries take a different tone when it’s one of their own to be fair

robinph · 15-06-2021 1:14pm

BeepBeep67 wrote: »

Anyone with a passing interest in sport and 'cough-cough' marginal gains has heard of nandrolone!

I can accept that someone with zero interest in any sport of any description, or even watching any news report on anything and just watching soaps and Love Island might not know about it. But for a sports person to claim to have not heard of it would be like claiming to not know what the Olympics was, or to have never heard of Nike.

Sacksian · 15-06-2021 1:26pm

This is from a 2019 article about "inadvertent doping":

The possibility of nandrolone-contaminated meat leading to a positive drug test presented itself as an issue at the 2000 Olympics. By 2008, researchers advised Olympians to refrain from eating “indefinable meat dishes (such as pasta filled with meat), which could be made from low-quality meat,” boar meat, and pork offal. The World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) issued a statement in 2011 urging athletes to use caution when consuming meat. The U.S. Anti-Doping Association (USADA) issued its own guidance on clenbuterol, suggesting that players avoid eating liver, liver products, and “unusual or exotic meat products” when not in the States.

If she's failed a test due to a contaminated burrito, it's very sad - but it also comes close to professional negligence on the part of her or her coach. How does a professional athlete not have that drummed into their head every single day??

Eat junk food all you like, but maybe draw the line at a food truck. I don't understand why you would take a chance like that?

[link to article: https://tht.fangraphs.com/the-strange-case-of-inadvertent-doping/]

MichiganIrish · 15-06-2021 2:16pm

Looking at Houlihan's progression closely, it does show a huge jump from 15.00 for 5k in 2017 to 14.34 in 2018 and subsequently to 14.23 in 2020...and this after being an also ran in the Olympic final in 2016 and World Champs final in 2017. Also major progression over 1500m from 4.03 in 2016 to 3.57 in 2018. Her progression from also ran to legit global medal contender in her mid to late 20s would remind you of a certain British athlete...

Mar Azul · 15-06-2021 4:42pm

New PB for Chris O Donnell 45:86

yerwanthere123 · 15-06-2021 4:46pm

Hamachi wrote: »

Ciara Mageean definitely didn’t know. I recall reading an interview with her after the Doha final where she spoke of Shelby being in tears after not medaling, despite running 3:54:xx. Ciara seemed very sympathetic towards her.

I’m disappointed in Shelby Houlihan. I liked her and thought that she seemed like a bit of a character. I will admit though that I’ve had my suspicions about some of the BTC athletes for a while.

Without getting into doping speculation, I believe that a particular East African female runner who has been delivering unprecedented performances this year, is a flashing red beacon. I hope that she is either popped or chooses not to run the 1500, which will open the door to victory for legitimate competitors like Faith Kipyegon or Laura Muir.

Presume you mean Tsegay. I really like her, but yeah her results this year are highly suspect. She struggled her way to a 14:46 5k in Ostrava later September and nine months last she's running 14:13. Indoor WR for 1500m isn't so bad I guess, it is her distance, but to then run 29:39 for 10k on her first attempt...

Hamachi · 15-06-2021 7:04pm

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

Presume you mean Tsegay. I really like her, but yeah her results this year are highly suspect. She struggled her way to a 14:46 5k in Ostrava last September and nine months last she's running 14:13. Indoor WR for 1500m isn't so bad I guess, it is her distance, but to then run 29:39 for 10k on her first attempt...

Yeah, Tsegay is who I had in mind. I don’t find her performances this year in any way credible. Even the indoor 1500m world record, where she left Muir for dust, didn’t ring true for me. That 10K debut is particularly egregious, particularly when you compare it to somebody like Klosterhalfen, who only ran 31 minutes flat in her debut at the distance.

I’m sorry to say it all just stinks for me.

yerwanthere123 · 15-06-2021 10:57pm

Hamachi wrote: »

Yeah, Tsegay is who I had in mind. I don’t find her performances this year in any way credible. Even the indoor 1500m world record, where she left Muir for dust, didn’t ring true for me. That 10K debut is particularly egregious, particularly when you compare it to somebody like Klosterhalfen, who only ran 31 minutes flat in her debut at the distance.

I’m sorry to say it all just stinks for me.

Hope you're prepared for it to potentially get even stinkier! She's going for Dibaba's 1500m record this weekend in Poland.

https://twitter.com/MemorialKusego/status/1404729363074105345

I think she'll get it too.

Slow_Runner · 16-06-2021 8:41am

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

Presume you mean Tsegay. I really like her, but yeah her results this year are highly suspect. She struggled her way to a 14:46 5k in Ostrava later September and nine months last she's running 14:13. Indoor WR for 1500m isn't so bad I guess, it is her distance, but to then run 29:39 for 10k on her first attempt...

Looking at the rate current times are tumbling across the board how much of her improvement is down to shoe technology and how much down to "marginal gains"??

jamule · 19-06-2021 8:19pm

sarah lavin 12.95pb in madrid.

wgtomblin · 19-06-2021 9:30pm

Also in Madrid, Mark English 1.45.22 , 2nd pl. Eilish Flanagan 9.48 in steeple

shotgunmcos · 19-06-2021 9:39pm

jamule wrote: »

sarah lavin 12.95pb in madrid.

Surely good enough to get to Tokyo. Top 40 women go. 12.95 puts her mid 50s but with nearly 20 Americans ahead she looks good. US ridiculous depth in this event.

jamule · 19-06-2021 10:19pm

Corscadden ran 3.36.16 somewhere. ranked 42nd

hurdles1 · 19-06-2021 10:22pm

shotgunmcos wrote: »

Surely good enough to get to Tokyo. Top 40 women go. 12.95 puts her mid 50s but with nearly 20 Americans ahead she looks good. US ridiculous depth in this event.

Great to see sarah get that sub 13 after a rough few years. Some expert on twitter said she can now be competive on a world level. If they check the figures 12.4 is needed at that level and even European level lot more required 12.6 ... . Hopefully she can kick on and try make a European final in future. Derval o Rourkes record will take a lot of beating.

Hamachi · 19-06-2021 10:49pm

Not an Irish result, but notable from a European perspective.

On a cool, damp evening in Romania, Femke Bol lowered the Dutch 400m record for the third time this season to 50:37. It surely only a matter of time before she runs sub-50.

This is super impressive given that she is still only 21 and her primary event is the 400m hurdles. I’m really looking forward to seeing her challenge the Americans in Tokyo and feel like she has a great shot at a medal. She’s a beautiful runner, extremely relaxed and fluid. I actually feel like she could also be amazing at the 800m and would love to see her try out that event.

Forge83 · 19-06-2021 11:26pm

Hamachi wrote: »

Not an Irish result, but notable from a European perspective.

On a cool, damp evening in Romania, Femke Bol lowered the Dutch 400m record for the third time this season to 50:37. It surely only a matter of time before she runs sub-50.

This is super impressive given that she is still only 21 and her primary event is the 400m hurdles. I’m really looking forward to seeing her challenge the Americans in Tokyo and feel like she has a great shot at a medal. She’s a beautiful runner, extremely relaxed and fluid. I actually feel like she could also be amazing at the 800m and would love to see her try out that event.

At the moment she doesn’t look a polished enough hurdler to challenge Muhammad or Maclaughlin but certainly looks good enough for bronze.
I would agree re the 800m also.

jamule · 20-06-2021 12:40pm

sarah healy down for poland today, 5 ethipoians in the race so the pace should be hot. anything around her pb will cement her place but i think she could go close to 4.04

yerwanthere123 · 20-06-2021 12:52pm

Stream for Chorzow here. Will feature Sarah Healy in the 1500m, but perhaps more importantly, a world record attempt by Gudaf Tsegay. Race at 2.30pm our time.

Hamachi · 20-06-2021 12:59pm

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

Stream for Chorzow here. Will feature Sarah Healy in the 1500m, but perhaps more importantly, a world record attempt by Gudaf Tsegay. Race at 2.30pm our time.

Not a fan of Tsegay, but if she tows Sarah Healy to a fast time and fingers crossed, an automatic Q, I’m all-in, at least for this afternoon.

yerwanthere123 · 20-06-2021 1:04pm

Hamachi wrote: »

Not a fan of Tsegay, but if she tows Sarah Healy to a fast time and fingers crossed, an automatic Q, I’m all-in, at least for this afternoon.

I'll be wincing when she's coming down the home straight anyway, that's for sure

I think she'll get it, 3:48.27 is my very specific prediction that will probably be wildly wrong :pac: Hoping for a good time for Sarah too obviously.

Hamachi · 20-06-2021 1:14pm

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

I'll be wincing when she's coming down the home straight anyway, that's for sure I think she'll get it, 3:48.27 is my very specific prediction that will probably be wildly wrong :pac: Hoping for a good time for Sarah too obviously.

I think you’re right and that predicted time looks on the nose to me

.

The only thing that might inhibit her is that the temperature will be > 30 degrees in Chorzow this afternoon. Not sure if that will be a major factor over a distance as short as 1500m though.

Thanks for the live stream link. Will fire it up in an hour.

yerwanthere123 · 20-06-2021 2:39pm

3:54.01 for Tsegay, so nowhere near the world record, although it is a slight personal best. Hassan and Kipyegon were actually faster in Florence!

Ceepo · 20-06-2021 7:28pm

Daragh McElhinney 3rd 7.52 3000m in Milan.
Good to see him bounce back from a below par performance in Watford

Itziger · 21-06-2021 8:35am

Boy do the Yanks like a bit of sentimentality. Do they like a 'story'?!

Check out the YouTube replays of the women's 400 Trials final.

Jeez, those trials are tough, eh. Full Olympic level of heats, semis and Final in a lot of the events.

They'll either toughen you up for the real thing or maybe leave an imprint. Impressive stuff.

average_runner · 21-06-2021 2:32pm

The US Trails are great to watch. The amount of talent is unreal.
Way better than the European Championship for competitiveness

Dubh Geannain · 21-06-2021 8:17pm

average_runner wrote: »

The US Trails are great to watch. The amount of talent is unreal.
Way better than the European Championship for competitiveness

They've been great to follow so far. Following straight after the NCAA championships which brought many young athletes to the fore. It's been interesting to see them then trying to compete against the seasoned pros.

jamule · 21-06-2021 10:36pm

The rankings (and only showing 3 per country). updated date was 15th, due to be updated tommorrow.

200m m (56)
34 Leon Reid
36 Marcus lalor
400m(48)
O'Donnell 72
800m (48)
English 26
Fitzsimmons 53

1500m (45)
Coscadden 32
McCann 60
Travere 83
5000m (42)
Tobin 46
Hiku 67
Keane 74
400m h
Barr 8th Q
3000m stp (45)
Fay 64

100m w (56)
Neville 54
200m (56)
Healy 32
Rhashdit 73

400 (48)
Healy 36
Becker 70
Madlsey 88
800(48)
Power 19
Clerig Butler 47
Hartigan 48
1500(45)
Mcgeheen 11 Q
Healy 34
100m h (40)
Lavin 42
3000m stp (45)
Finn 19th Q
Flanagan 50
High Jump
Hept 24
O Connor 24

Dodge · 21-06-2021 11:21pm

The update them every Wednesday. It looks like O’Connor has been overtaken in the heptathlon but Healy (both of them), English and Power are safe as houses

Some borderline ones will need big national championship performances

FitzjamesHorse · 21-06-2021 11:42pm

C O'Donnell and Phil will be on the plane anyway (relay)
Coscadden, Lawlor, English look safe in the Mens.
Sarah Healy and Power in the Womens.
Hartigan and Siofra could still get the QT
O'Connors best hope might be a withdrawal in the Top 24.
Lavin, Tobin and Flanagan could still do it.

The big problem is better performances at a time when a lot of people in other countries are doing the same.
Will there be "pacing" at Nationals.

Dubh Geannain · 22-06-2021 7:20am

Donovan Brazier has not made the Olympics!!

Hamachi · 22-06-2021 7:48am

Dubh Geannain wrote: »

Donovan Brazier has not made the Olympics!!

Nor has Jenny Simpson. It’s a shame to see one of the mainstays of US athletics miss out. It looks like Father Time may have caught up with her.

Sacksian · 22-06-2021 8:37am

Isaiah Jewett illustrates some of what makes the 800m such a compelling distance.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFyTojpygE0

I don't think I've ever seen someone go out HARD and then go even harder on the 400m-600m split: through 400m in 50.6 and then a 25 for the 400m-600m split - doesn't let anyone catch up to him when they'd be expecting him to settle. And he held it together pretty well in the last 100 too.

Pherekydes · 22-06-2021 9:11am

Jewett gave it some. Should make it an interesting race in Tokyo. No dawdling through the bell in 55. Murphy's still got it!

wgtomblin · 22-06-2021 10:12pm

Dubh Geannain wrote: »

Donovan Brazier has not made the Olympics!!

And no Cheruiyot either in the 1500. He's been almost unbeatable in the event these past 3 or 4 years. It really opens things up. Ingebrigsten may now be favourite but won't have it easy.

Oldira · 23-06-2021 2:00pm

FitzjamesHorse wrote: »

C O'Donnell and Phil will be on the plane anyway (relay)
Coscadden, Lawlor, English look safe in the Mens.
Sarah Healy and Power in the Womens.
Hartigan and Siofra could still get the QT
O'Connors best hope might be a withdrawal in the Top 24.
Lavin, Tobin and Flanagan could still do it.

The big problem is better performances at a time when a lot of people in other countries are doing the same.
Will there be "pacing" at Nationals.

He looked safe but is now in serious bother. Five lad made the QT at the weekend and there were 4 places awarded as wildcards meaning he is now ranked 47 of 48. I expect thee will be a few more direct qualifiers this weekend and English is out of the Nationals (quarantine rules). He's been really unlucky.

Forge83 · 23-06-2021 2:06pm

Oldira wrote: »

He looked safe but is now in serious bother. Five lad made the QT at the weekend and there were 4 places awarded as wildcards meaning he is now ranked 47 of 48. I expect thee will be a few more direct qualifiers this weekend and English is out of the Nationals (quarantine rules). He's been really unlucky.

Surely he is not out of nationals?

Oldira · 23-06-2021 2:32pm

Forge83 wrote: »

Surely he is not out of nationals?

Not sure. Rules say 5 day quarantine but media says he is running.

jamule · 23-06-2021 2:33pm

Oldira wrote: »

He looked safe but is now in serious bother. Five lad made the QT at the weekend and there were 4 places awarded as wildcards meaning he is now ranked 47 of 48. I expect thee will be a few more direct qualifiers this weekend and English is out of the Nationals (quarantine rules). He's been really unlucky.

he is ranked 31 , taking out >3 per country leaves him at 26 , he made up a place this week. So even if there are 4 wildcards and 5 behind him with Qs, he is still at worst 35th of 48.

Oldira · 23-06-2021 2:44pm

jamule wrote: »

he is ranked 31 , taking out >3 per country leaves him at 26 , he made up a place this week. So even if there are 4 wildcards and 5 behind him with Qs, he is still at worst 35th of 48.

Have a look at this

https://www.worldathletics.org/stats-zone/road-to/7132391?eventId=10229501

Its not the World Rankings that apply but special Olympic ones which are a combination of those that meet qualifying time and rankings. English now ranks 47 of 48 as 41 runners have met the qualifying standard. He missed by 2/100 of a second last weekend.

Dodge · 23-06-2021 2:54pm

jamule wrote: »

he is ranked 31 , taking out >3 per country leaves him at 26 , he made up a place this week. So even if there are 4 wildcards and 5 behind him with Qs, he is still at worst 35th of 48.

That’s wrong. There’s only 5 places left for rankings and he’s the 4th of them. There are 43 places already gone to people with the time and universality places

Effectively, he can’t really improve his ranking now anyway. He can run the time or hope others don’t overtake him…

jamule · 23-06-2021 2:56pm

Oldira wrote: »

Have a look at this

https://www.worldathletics.org/stats-zone/road-to/7132391?eventId=10229501

Its not the World Rankings that apply but special Olympic ones which are a combination of those that meet qualifying time and rankings. English now ranks 47 of 48 as 41 runners have met the qualifying standard. He missed by 2/100 of a second last weekend.

thanks , I didn't know they actually had that done. It just shows the rankings ain't worth a bollix,

jamule · 23-06-2021 5:07pm

Oldira wrote: »

Not sure. Rules say 5 day quarantine but media says he is running.

I presume as his alter ego (Dr English) has been fully vacinated. Not sure if it makes a difference to the quarentine rules though!

Oldira · 24-06-2021 1:23pm

jamule wrote: »

I presume as his alter ego (Dr English) has been fully vacinated. Not sure if it makes a difference to the quarentine rules though!

English is skipping the Nationals. Running in Leverkeusen instead on Sunday.

Ceepo · 24-06-2021 1:36pm

Oldira wrote: »

English is skipping the Nationals. Running in Leverkeusen instead on Sunday.

Probably assumes jt will be a faster race, and potentially get the auto qt.

That or afraid to get beat in the Nationals

Edit. Does anyone else think that you should have to run your national championship to be selected. Similar to most countries.

Dodge · 24-06-2021 2:49pm

Ceepo wrote: »

Probably assumes jt will be a faster race, and potentially get the auto qt.

That or afraid to get beat in the Nationals

Edit. Does anyone else think that you should have to run your national championship to be selected. Similar to most countries.

We’re not really in a position to choose. Men’s marathon in Rio is the only time in decades where a selection had to be made

English can’t improve his ranking so running the time is his only option. He obviously doesn’t think that possible in Santry

Forge83 · 24-06-2021 3:33pm

Ceepo wrote: »

Probably assumes jt will be a faster race, and potentially get the auto qt.

That or afraid to get beat in the Nationals

Edit. Does anyone else think that you should have to run your national championship to be selected. Similar to most countries.

You kind of do. You have to get permission to miss your national championships if you are a carded athlete or looking to be picked for a major champs.
So AAI have obviously given him permission.

While I see the reasoning behind his decision to race abroad to get the automatic time, I would agree that athletes should have to run their national championships, no exclusions. Especially considering his event has some excellent depth at the moment in Ireland.

Athletics 2021

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