Willie Frazer has died

Gimme A Pound · 29-06-2019 12:38pm

Yamanoto wrote: »

The Loyalist rabble never purported to commit acts of violence in our name.

Yeah that I get, but it still doesn't explain the below:

Mad_maxx wrote: »

the southern media has always demanded far too little of unionism, unionism has never been expected to atone for anything

Equal criticism surely made more sense. Loyalists didn't claim to be acting in our name but they do consider us the enemy and they were just killing and mistreating our fellow fenians, which... unless you're Beserker or Janfebmar is... mmmm... kinda bad too.

Mad_maxx · 29-06-2019 12:48pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Willie clearly had hatred issues.

But he at least had good reason. If one of our parents were killed would we turn the other cheek?

And those that are spouting bile against this man. Well, what's your excuse for acting like him?

You have to understand that Scottish calvinists live for conflict, the term " fighting Irish" was originally granted to the Scots Irish who emigrated to America long before us, those people live to argue, if we ever get a united Ireland, we will have to accept that 20% of the Dail will be made up of ulster folk like Willie frazier who cannot let anything slide

Strong willed people but inherently difficult, they see it as rigorousness

Tommy Kelly · 29-06-2019 12:50pm

Fionn1952 wrote: »

Well I know for a fact that at least one of his closer friends lurks on here. Why would you be surprised to find that some of his family and friends do?

It's not like there arent any Unionist/Loyalists from the North on here like.

like I couldn't care less. Let them lurk away like.

janfebmar · 29-06-2019 12:56pm

Danzy wrote: »

His father and Uncle and other were involved in a murder gang that were extreme in their hate and savagery, even by the standards of the time.
.

His father and uncle and the 4 other close family members that were murdered were never found guilty of any crimes, as far as I know, nor were they given paramilitary funerals.

Yamanoto · 29-06-2019 1:03pm

Gimme A Pound wrote: »

Ignore them? You could say that about absolutely anything. As said, far more forgiveness down here of loyalism, and that's an example. Criticism is not fetishisation.

If you're hearing what Loyalists are saying on their various grubby fora about the deaths of some fairly obscure Republican individuals, then you're fetishising the bile. If you're sharing it among friends, then you're fetishising the bile. Excoriating them for doing it, but seeking it out all the same & delighting at just how base the other crowd show themselves up to be.

As for your perception that Loyalists aren't subject to the same levels of examination or criticism down South, once again, they weren't purporting to commit acts of violence in our name - THAT's why the spotlight shines brighter on Republican terrorism.

_blaaz · 29-06-2019 1:06pm

Yamanoto wrote: »

once again, they weren't purporting to commit acts of violence in our name - THAT's why the spotlight shines brighter on Republican terrorism.

Id be interested to know if you can identify any occasion where the ira claimed to fight in anyones name??

Pretty sure that phrase of them claiming to fight in our name is indo makey-uppy rubbish.......

Shine a spotlight on it all yous want.....just dont make stuff up

dashcamdanny · 29-06-2019 1:13pm

I for one enjoyed his comments and I am sad to hear of his demise .

The peace process needed people like Willie to give an example of how not to become. And even laugh at.

He was a man filled with hate and bigotry, and had and complete inability to forgive or move on. Although without a doubt he had reason.

Never again will we every get stories like this.

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/willie-frazer-fury-over-gaa-shirt-in-eastenders-but-its-only-a-school-pe-top-30015790.html

armaghlad · 29-06-2019 1:15pm

Gimme A Pound wrote: »

Yeah that I get, but it still doesn't explain the below:

Equal criticism surely made more sense. Loyalists didn't claim to be acting in our name but they do consider us the enemy and they were just killing and mistreating our fellow fenians, which... unless you're Beserker or Janfebmar is... mmmm... kinda bad too.

Not just your “fellow fenian”, they killed in Dublin and Monaghan. They also did the Miami Showband. They targeted bars, families and individuals. They went after innocent civilians. All intricately linked to a farmhouse in Glenanne. It’s said it’s the only UDR base never to be rebuilt after IRA attack such was the level of infiltration by the UVF

FTA69 · 29-06-2019 1:30pm

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Adams = A vile man who carried many a bombers coffin and marched in many IRA parades. Never condemned the bombers either! Deeply embedded and steeped in Violent Irish Terrorism. For many years the enemy within (this State) as well as being a hate figure up North to those (outside Sinn Fein & the IRA).

Frazer = Loyalist & Orange to the core, but obviously damaged, maybe because his dad + other members of his family were murdered by the IRA?

Frazer was a bit 'touched' for whatever reason, but for people to come in here and make sneid remarks about him just as he's dies is very crass, and then to also "big up" & excuse Adams major part in all the death & mayhem......

Yeah so Adams is a bad bastard regardless of context; in no way having been influenced by his finding himself in a state predicated on violence and sectarianism that oppressed him in his community - all of that apparently being irrelevant.

But Willie Frazer, the mate of Loyalist paramilitaries, gets a pass because his combatant family were killed in a political conflict?

Sounds very fair analysis alright.

janfebmar · 29-06-2019 1:34pm

FTA69 wrote: »

But Willie Frazer, the mate of Loyalist paramilitaries, gets a pass because his combatant family were killed in a political ...

Frazer or his 6 close family members who were murdered were never found guilty of any crimes or never got any paramilitary funerals etc

steddyeddy · 29-06-2019 1:40pm

janfebmar wrote: »

His father and uncle and the 4 other close family members that were murdered were never found guilty of any crimes, as far as I know, nor were they given paramilitary funerals.

Ah really? You haven't mentioned that yet.

Franz Von Peppercorn II · 29-06-2019 1:40pm

I didn’t know much about him but reading his comments on the GAa and Ireland etc he seems to be a moderate version of Ruth Dudley Edwards or Eoghan Harris.

Surprised the independent didn’t give him a gig.

FTA69 · 29-06-2019 1:41pm

janfebmar wrote: »

Frazer or his 6 close family members who were murdered were never found guilty of any crimes or never got any paramilitary funerals etc

Frazer was even described by the police as having too close links with Loyalist paramilitaries; he ran a nightclub in which two young men were stabbed to death by the UVF who regularly drank there. He attended the funeral of one of the main figures of the Glennane gang and described him as “a decent man” despite them being involved in the murder of 120 odd innocent people whom they attacked at random.

Please stop trying to portray him as a run of the mill lad who spoke out for all victims; you’re fooling absolutely nobody.

Galwayguy35 · 29-06-2019 1:50pm

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Adams = A vile man who carried many a bombers coffin and marched in many IRA parades. Never condemned the bombers either! Deeply embedded and steeped in Violent Irish Terrorism. For many years the enemy within (this State) as well as being a hate figure up North to those (outside Sinn Fein & the IRA).

Frazer = Loyalist & Orange to the core, but obviously damaged, maybe because his dad + other members of his family were murdered by the IRA?

Frazer was a bit 'touched' for whatever reason, but for people to come in here and make sneid remarks about him just as he's dies is very crass, and then to also "big up" & excuse Adams major part in all the death & mayhem......

You conveniently ignored the bit in my post about Adams part in the peace process.

I've no doubt he was in the IRA and as I said before he should have admitted it years ago but whether you like it or not without him the peace process was doomed to failure.

John Hume knew this as well which is why he started talks with him.

ToddyDoody · 29-06-2019 2:31pm

RIP but I know he'll enjoy loyalist heaven.

janfebmar · 29-06-2019 2:32pm

FTA69 wrote: »

Frazer was even described by the police as having too close links with Loyalist paramilitaries;.

Link?

Odhinn · 29-06-2019 2:34pm

janfebmar wrote: »

Link?

Mr Frazer had been informed in a letter from the Firearms and Explosives Branch of the Northern Ireland Office on May 12 2003 that the Chief Constable had revoked his firearms certificate "as the applicant was unfit to be in possession of firearms and that he based his decision on a reliable intelligence report that you (Mr Frazer) associated with loyalist terrorist organisations."

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/leader-of-love-march-not-fit-to-own-gun-police-26401301.html

29-06-2019 3:03pm

JustAThought wrote: »

What in the name of God is that about?

British intelligence tried to get UVF to ‘shoot up a school’, documentary claims (The Irish Times, 20 Feb. 2019)

A former RUC officer has alleged that British intelligence tried to persuade the Ulster Volunteer Force to attack a Catholic primary school in Co Armagh in retaliation for the Kingsmill massacre, in a new documentary to be premiered in Belfast on Thursday.

In the feature length documentary, Unquiet Graves: The Story of the Glenanne Gang, ex-RUC officer John Weir claims that British military intelligence was behind a plot to attack the primary school at Belleeks in Co Armagh and to kill children and teachers.

Weir, a self-confessed member of the Glennane Gang, who was convicted of the 1977 murder of Catholic man William Strathearn, said the UVF was urged to carry out the attack in retaliation for the 1976 Kingsmill massacre in which the IRA singled out and killed 10 Protestant workmen.

“The plan that was decided on was to shoot up a school in Belleeks,” said Weir, who added that the targets would be “children and teachers”.

Long since released and now living in South Africa, Weir told the director of the film Seán Murray that the alleged plan by British military intelligence was to cause the situation in Northern Ireland to “spiral out of control”.

Mr Murray, who comes from a west Belfast republican family, said from his conversations with Weir in South Africa the alleged British military intelligence plot was to foment a “civil war”.

“From their vision such a war would be quite short; they thought they could have a quick, short and sharp process of cleansing out the IRA,” said Mr Murray.

In the end the UVF refused to carry out the attack, said Weir. Mr Murray said that Weir in granting the interview was engaging in a “cathartic process – I think he was trying to get as much information off his chest as possible”.

The film is based on Anne Cadwallader’s book, Lethal Allies which recounts how the Glennane Gang of loyalist paramilitaries, frequently working in collusion with RUC officers and Ulster Defence Regiment soldiers in the mid-Ulster area, is estimated to have killed more than 120 people, the vast majority of them Catholics, between 1972 and 1976.

Lethal Allies is largely based on investigations carried out by the now defunct Historical Enquiries Team, a division of the PSNI, and on declassified papers and official reports.

The gang’s victims included the 33 people killed in the 1974 Dublin and Monaghan bombings, those killed in the 1975 gun and bomb attack on the Miami Showband, the 1976 killings of six members of the Reavey and O’Dowd families in south Armagh and the killings in August 1975 of Seán Farmer and 22-year-old Colm McCartney, a cousin of the late Nobel laureate Seamus Heaney...

29-06-2019 3:44pm

Leaving aside Willie's association with those gentle souls in the Glennane Gang, can we remember his humour?

Like the time he lost the plot because he saw an alleged "GAA jersey"... on Eastenders!

Willie Frazer fury over 'GAA shirt' in Eastenders - but it's only a school PE top

Or the time in 2011 he, with great astuteness it must be said, noted that the rubble from the dismantled Pomeroy RUC barracks, which the IRA had attacked many times, was being used to make the surface of the local... GAA club better.

Victims ‘feel betrayed’ over rubble row

There were so many of these gems - a special mention to Willie posting photos of a letter he allegedly received from the IRA with a bullet in it, except for people online noted that there was no postal sorting stamp on the envelope and the handwriting looked suspiciously like Willie's own handwriting. hehe. By far Willie's funniest contribution to humanity was when he lost the plot with the alleged goings-on in little St Patrick's primary school in Donaghmore in Fermanagh. I'll let Wikipedia take over now:

In May 2012, after seeing the Italian flag being flown as part of a cultural event held in Donaghmore's St Patrick's Primary School and mistaking it for the Irish Tricolour, Frazer accused the school for 4-to-11-year-old children of being "the junior headquarters of SF/IRA youth", stating on Facebook that "I wounder do they also train the children in how to use weapons, for it seems they can do what they wont."(sic) Concerned for the safety of students and the school's reputation, teachers informed police of the accusations and photographs of the school posted by Frazer were later removed from Facebook.

After the Fermanagh incident, Jake O'Kane's hilarious "flegs" sketch couldn't but give Willie a star role (from 1:50 on):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8JqKxrloQQ

The Satanist · 29-06-2019 4:10pm

Mad_maxx · 29-06-2019 4:11pm

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

I didn’t know much about him but reading his comments on the GAa and Ireland etc he seems to be a moderate version of Ruth Dudley Edwards or Eoghan Harris.

Surprised the independent didn’t give him a gig.

Frazier may have been an unpleasant fellow but let's not be cruel by lumping him in with Ruth dudley Edwards and eoghan Harris

janfebmar · 29-06-2019 4:59pm

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Frazier may have been an unpleasant fellow but let's not be cruel by lumping him in with Ruth dudley Edwards and eoghan Harris

He played GAA for a year in his youth, or so it is said, before his Dad and 5 other close relatives were murdered by Republicans.

FTA69 · 29-06-2019 5:09pm

janfebmar wrote: »

He played has for a year in his youth, or so it is said, before his Dad and 5 other close relatives were murdered by Republicans.

Yawn. Repeating yourself now and not engaging with any points made.

Childish and banal nonsense. Transparent.

janfebmar · 29-06-2019 5:12pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Leaving aside Willie's association with those gentle souls in the Glennane Gang, can we ...

There is no proof he had association with Glennane gang, is there?

steddyeddy · 29-06-2019 5:13pm

janfebmar wrote: »

He played has for a year in his youth, or so it is said, before his Dad and 5 other close relatives were murdered by Republicans.

J I think this is the one thread where you might be able to make some decent, relevant points. The thing is you've shot yourself in the foot here. You've spent so many other threads trying to insult Ireland and all things Irish as you see them by bringing IRA, Nazis, eamon De Valera, economy, IMF and everything else that it's really really difficult to take you seriously. You alternate between saying you're a unionist voter to not unionist, you support UVF and bloody Sunday to condemning them and on one thread you even said that pilots throw turds onto Ireland when they fly over. You've brought these opinions in every type of thread ranging from housing to flower arranging. You should have saved your A game for this thread dude and maybe then you would have been taken seriously.

Gimme A Pound · 29-06-2019 5:15pm

Yamanoto wrote: »

If you're hearing what Loyalists are saying on their various grubby fora about the deaths of some fairly obscure Republican individuals, then you're fetishising the bile. If you're sharing it among friends, then you're fetishising the bile. Excoriating them for doing it, but seeking it out all the same & delighting at just how base the other crowd show themselves up to be.

Why don't you say that about any criticism of anything so? Why just this? It really looks like you're attempting to shut down criticism of loyalist rhetoric specifically. I don't seek the stuff out or share it - what are you on about? And my criticism of loyalist bigotry is hardly just to do with what they say about the deaths of republican figureheads. Holycross - better just "ignore" that...

I am not a republican - I'm just an Irish person who will obviously be critical of a group of people that views me as the enemy for no reason and advocates the killing of other Irish people. This would be a rational view to most, but not to many in Ireland, who think only a radical could hold that view, and that we should ignore it but endlessly criticise the other crowd.

As for your perception that Loyalists aren't subject to the same levels of examination or criticism down South, once again, they weren't purporting to commit acts of violence in our name - THAT's why the spotlight shines brighter on Republican terrorism.

Wha? You already said that and I acknowledged it with "Yeah that I get, but it still doesn't explain the below: (quote from Mad_maxx) Equal criticism surely makes more sense. Loyalists didn't claim to be acting in our name but they do consider us the enemy and they were just killing and mistreating our fellow fenians..."

The contortions people twist themselves into to downplay loyalist extremism...

dashcamdanny wrote: »

I for one enjoyed his comments and I am sad to hear of his demise

Sure thing dude.

Fionn1952 · 29-06-2019 5:18pm

Gimme A Pound wrote: »

Why don't you say that about any criticism of anything so? Why just this? It really looks like you're attempting to shut down criticism of loyalist rhetoric specifically. I don't seek the stuff out or share it - what are you on about? And my criticism of loyalist bigotry is hardly just to do with what they say about the deaths of republican figureheads. Holycross - better just "ignore" that...

I am not a republican - I'm just an Irish person who will obviously be critical of a group of people that views me as the enemy for no reason and advocates the killing of other Irish people. This would be a rational view to most, but not to many in Ireland, who think only a radical could hold that view, and that we should ignore it but endlessly criticise the other crowd.

Wha? You already said that and I acknowledged it with "Yeah that I get, but it still doesn't explain the below: (quote from Mad_maxx) Equal criticism surely makes more sense. Loyalists didn't claim to be acting in our name but they do consider us the enemy and they were just killing and mistreating our fellow fenians..."

The contortions people twist themselves into to downplay loyalist extremism...

Sure thing dude.

In fairness, whether you choose to distance yourself from it, or don't identify with it, I don't. I am very much a Republican.....I still dont think a thread on the death of any person is the place to have this sort of thing out.

Phileas Frog · 29-06-2019 5:19pm

NIMAN wrote: »

One loon less.

Wonder what he died of? He was only 58.

A Friday

Gimme A Pound · 29-06-2019 5:19pm

steddyeddy wrote: »

You've spent some many other threads trying to insult Ireland and all things Irish as you see them by bringing IRA, Nazis, eamon De Valera, economy, IMF and everything else that it's really really difficult to take you seriously. You alternate between saying you're a unionist voter to not unionist, you support UVF and bloody Sunday to condemning them and on one thread you even said that pilots throw turds onto Ireland when they fly over.

God how disgusting.

steddyeddy · 29-06-2019 5:22pm

Gimme A Pound wrote: »

God how disgusting.

I'm not god I'm afraid.

Gimme A Pound · 29-06-2019 5:27pm

Fionn1952 wrote: »

In fairness, whether you choose to distance yourself from it, or don't identify with it, I don't. I am very much a Republican.....I still dont think a thread on the death of any person is the place to have this sort of thing out.

People always discuss a well known person when they've just died. It's in poor taste to jeer at their death but not to say negative things about them. What's also in poor taste is using it as a platform to wind people up like Janfebmar (grotesquely bigoted) is doing.

Fionn1952 · 29-06-2019 5:29pm

Gimme A Pound wrote: »

People always discuss a well known person when they've just died. It's in poor taste to jeer at their death but not to say negative things about them. What's also in poor taste is trying to wind people up like Janfebmar is doing.

I'd agree on the latter point too, but as my aul man used to say, 'you lie down with dogs, you get fleas'.

janfebmar · 29-06-2019 5:40pm

steddyeddy wrote: »

J I think this is the one thread where you might be able to make some decent, relevant points. The thing is you've shot yourself in the foot here. You've spent so many other threads trying to insult Ireland and all things Irish as you see them by bringing IRA, Nazis, eamon De Valera, economy, IMF and everything else that it's really really difficult to take you seriously. You alternate between saying you're a unionist voter to not unionist, you support UVF and bloody Sunday to condemning them and on one thread you even said that pilots throw turds onto Ireland when they fly over. You've brought these opinions in every type of thread ranging from housing to flower arranging. You should have saved your A game for this thread dude and maybe then you would have been taken seriously.

Rubbish and lies, but what else eould I expect from you. I never voted unionist in my life, I never supported the uvf or any other paramilitaries etc. I always condemned the paramilitaries on both sides.
To be taken seriously, republicans need to stop condoning the IRA. You should also stick to the facts about dead people. People are innocent until proven guilty. The is no proof Frazer was in the Glennane gang or anything like it.

Shelob1 · 29-06-2019 5:40pm

A true son of Ulster and will be sadly missed from all his friends. True and loyal right to the very end. Will be attending his funeral. Rest easy William.

29-06-2019 6:00pm

steddyeddy wrote: »

J I think this is the one thread where you might be able to make some decent, relevant points. The thing is you've shot yourself in the foot here. You've spent so many other threads trying to insult Ireland and all things Irish as you see them by bringing IRA, Nazis, eamon De Valera, economy, IMF and everything else that it's really really difficult to take you seriously. You alternate between saying you're a unionist voter to not unionist, you support UVF and bloody Sunday to condemning them and on one thread you even said that pilots throw turds onto Ireland when they fly over. You've brought these opinions in every type of thread ranging from housing to flower arranging. You should have saved your A game for this thread dude and maybe then you would have been taken seriously.

Did they? Did they really? That's so many new kinds of special.

steddyeddy · 29-06-2019 6:04pm

Shelob1 wrote: »

A true son of Ulster and will be sadly missed from all his friends. True and loyal right to the very end. Will be attending his funeral. Rest easy William.

Me too. Want to share a ride?

Gimme A Pound · 29-06-2019 6:05pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Did they? Did they really? That's so many new kinds of special.

On the thread about Americans, a couple of geniuses complaining about bigotry towards Americans (and I agree very much with them) are fine with anti Irish sh1t. Self loathing is very prevalent in this country though.

_blaaz · 29-06-2019 6:05pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Did they? Did they really? That's so many new kinds of special.

I googled this myth (as everyone keeps saying it) and added boards tag and found this

Different name posted though!!

Larbre34 · 29-06-2019 6:10pm

There are a few ways to engage in politics and campaigning. Some are smart and play the very long game, make what at the beginning seem like extreme or outlandish ideas completely normal and accepted. Thats a rare skill, to slowly heat the water under the frog, and it takes a couple of generations to bed in.

On the other hand, you have clowns. Clowns like we see in the World around us today who do their cause no favours with their extremism and failure to bring others along in the long term because it generates backlash, friction, polarisation and a difficult and temporary tenure for their idealogy.

Fraser was such a clown. As mentioned earlier, the diametric opposite to a David Ervine, or a Martin McGuinness. He could have tried to be a Thatcher or Reagan but he chose to be Johnson or Trump. From that point of view, long term peace, mutual respect and equality in Ireland will be helped by his departure. There are a few more on both sides that could follow him frankly. The pragmatic unionist / loyalist now is the one who looks ahead to plan for how their community shall live exactly as they do now, with their British identities and traditions and a regional governance but in a United Ireland.

Fraser wasnt any of that and so despite the personal bereavement for his family at such a young age, to society he was no loss.

29-06-2019 6:12pm

_blaaz wrote: »

I googled this myth and added boards tag and found this

Different name posted though!!

Oh. My. God. That's extraordinary, or what we used to describe in less sophisticated times as 'so fúcking retarded'.

steddyeddy · 29-06-2019 6:15pm

I have yet to offer my condolences to his family and friends but I'll do so now. I don't agree with his politics but I think he was another victim of the troubles. He was undoubtedly linked to the paramilitary groups on one side of the conflict so I don't think he's a campaigner for the victims at all. He was definitely pushing one side of the conflict and supported violence to do that. In his defence he did seem completely unhinged and I imagine that the loss of his family would have been central to that. Finally I'll say I wouldn't wish cancer on anyone. Hopefully he's at peace now.

Junkyard Tom · 29-06-2019 6:22pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

The pragmatic unionist / loyalist now is the one who looks ahead to plan for how their community shall live exactly as they do now, with their British identities and traditions and a regional governance but in a United Ireland.

Who are these pragmatic unionists? Both the DUP/UUP are implacably opposed to a Irish Language Act as well as other rights-based issues.

If anything Unionism is regressing as it has difficulty dealing with the fact that they're no longer in charge, have lost their majority, and are increasingly uncomfortable with nationalist parity being achieved.

steddyeddy · 29-06-2019 6:24pm

I think this could be a good thread where people set aside their differences to offer condolences or have an honest reflection about the life of Frazer but it's already been ruined, and not by republicans.

No the people that really ruin it are the people who start new accounts to pretend to be from the unionist community. Do you really think you're honouring unionism and the whole ideology behind it by using the ideology to start a fake account designed to annoy posters on an Irish website? Is that what unionism is? Is that how much Willie Frazer meant to the community? He meant so much that no real unionist posters can offer their view? Just a serial rereg and someone who starts an account so he can pretend to be at their funeral? Is there any real unionists here or is that what unionism is now?

OldMrBrennan83 · 29-06-2019 6:25pm

steddyeddy wrote: »

I think this could be a good thread where people set aside their differences to offer condolences or have an honest reflection about the life of Frazer but it's already been ruined, and not by republicans.

No the people that really ruin it are the people who start new accounts to pretend to be from the unionist community. Do you really think you're honouring unionism and the whole ideology behind it by using the ideology to start a fake account designed to annoy posters on an Irish website? Is that what unionism is? Is that how much Willie Frazer meant to the community? He meant so much that no real unionist posters can offer their view? Just a serial rereg and someone who starts an account so he can pretend to be at their funeral? Is there any real unionists here or is that what unionism is now?

Why would someone automatically have to offer condolences? The man was utter scum.

the dark phantom · 29-06-2019 6:25pm

_blaaz · 29-06-2019 6:28pm

OldMrBrennan83 wrote: »

Why would someone automatically have to offer condolences? The man was utter scum.

Its abput having touch of class....bitterness only destroys happiness of person who is bitter (you give condolences to his family)

You can either turn out like.frazer bitter or move on to a new future and let the bitterness die out(one of best ira chiefs of staff was buried this week and man got respect he was due off of unionism without anyone screaming scum at him and his family,be a grown up ffs)

steddyeddy · 29-06-2019 6:31pm

OldMrBrennan83 wrote: »

Why would someone automatically have to offer condolences? The man was utter scum.

I agree but I think it's important to be the bigger man. Unionism was defined as not giving an inch. That's why it's loosing ground. It's not a sustainable position and won't win the hearts and minds of the other side.

OldMrBrennan83 · 29-06-2019 6:34pm

steddyeddy wrote: »

I agree but I think it's important to be the bigger man. Unionism was defined as not giving an inch. That's why it's loosing ground. It's not a sustainable position and won't win the hearts and minds of the other side.

If you're looking someone to give you a nice pat on the back then maybe it is.

Gimme A Pound · 29-06-2019 6:40pm

OldMrBrennan83 wrote: »

Why would someone automatically have to offer condolences?.

Depends on where it's coming from. Yeah a number of people here are just being contrarian and attention seeking but Eddy is being genuine, just thinking from another perspective - William Frazer as a person with a family who'll miss him. That doesn't downplay what he was like as a public figure.

Feisar · 29-06-2019 6:40pm

Look the man had a tough time of it. He’s dead now and that’s that.

NI will only heal not only when his likes (from both sides) have passed on but also the memories of them have faded.

Willie Frazer has died

Comments