Off Topic Chat. (MOD NOTE post# 3949 and post#5279)

Cass · 10-07-2017 9:31pm

What is yer man's story/background? Seems far too familiar with firearms to be shooting them for the first time. Even how he cycles the bolt in the last minute of the video, to his grip when firing. If it is his first time then he has some natural ability.

At least it's not like these numpties. Using all the typical stereotypes, catchphrases and generally going into it with preconceived ideas and coming out the other side saying they're dangerous, unsafe and "they cannot believe people can own a gun that size, in their house".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnUXLRJmojk

tac foley · 10-07-2017 9:48pm

This is a good one, too

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T34y668fRhQ

tac

gunny123 · 10-07-2017 10:03pm

What i liked was the target system. No spotting scopes, tv, and video cameras or any of that, you shoot and your score pops up on the display. Also can you imagine the poo-storm if you tried to open a range like that in Ireland, facing the back of someones house ? The phoneline to Joe Fluffy would go into meltdown.

tac foley · 10-07-2017 10:32pm

Almost every village in Switzerland has its own 300m rifle range and 25m pistol range - the rationale behind it is simple, Switzerland really DOES have a citizen armed forces made up of the ordinary Joe. Sunday consists going to church, a light lunch and then the afternoon on the range.

Not a lot of things better than that, eh?

Well, yes, the Eidgenossisches Feldschiessen is a LOT better - 127’840 Teilnehmer am 2017 Eidgenössischen Feldschiessen - and boys and girls from age 14 compete against each other - http://stephenhalbrook.com/articles/swiss_teen_rifle_festival.html

tac

tac foley · 11-07-2017 9:27am

Bringing on the young shooter?

Certainly, Sir.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=unN-Fp-wuMM

tac

Cass · 11-07-2017 11:05am

At the risk of being a nay sayer the issue we have here is the age limit. While it's legal for a youngster (under 16 and no license) to shoot on a range most ranges impose an age limit. The average being 12 to 14 years old before they can shoot.

That means in the same 6 to 8 year period from when most other youngsters start our lot are only beginning. At say 14 they going against kids from other countries that not only have them beat for experience but most likely have medals and accolades under their belts.

Sparks · 11-07-2017 12:02pm

Cass wrote: »

What is yer man's story/background?

Lindybeige? Essentially, amateur historian with a particular interest in ancient soldiering and ancient logistics. Has a lot of entertaining youtube bits taking the swords-and-sandals genre of films to pieces pointing out their really god-awful errors.

Sparks · 11-07-2017 12:08pm

gunny123 wrote: »

What i liked was the target system. No spotting scopes, tv, and video cameras or any of that, you shoot and your score pops up on the display.

We have that already in a lot of Irish ranges though. It's easier and cheaper with 10m airgun but the systems are available for everything involving a bullseye target up to centerfire rifle stuff at pretty long ranges. It just gets more expensive as you go up because it gets harder to make them so they'll last (you're essentially making a sensitive electronics system that will sit out in the rain and the mud while people shoot at it; it's not trivial to do that right

)

Also can you imagine the poo-storm if you tried to open a range like that in Ireland, facing the back of someones house ? The phoneline to Joe Fluffy would go into meltdown.

If it was a centerfire rifle range pointed at the back of someone's house (as in, where their house would be the backstop) I think I'd call Joe Fluffy myself, that'd be insane.
But we've already had/still have ranges for smaller calibres that were/are like that. They're just indoors so that nobody gets too nervous. Firearms and the Irish public aren't overly familiar with each other in any good ways given our modern history...

tac foley · 11-07-2017 12:23pm

Cass wrote: »

At the risk of being a nay sayer the issue we have here is the age limit. While it's legal for a youngster (under 16 and no license) to shoot on a range most ranges impose an age limit. The average being 12 to 14 years old before they can shoot.

That means in the same 6 to 8 year period from when most other youngsters start our lot are only beginning. At say 14 they going against kids from other countries that not only have them beat for experience but most likely have medals and accolades under their belts.

Switzerland is not just a different country - as far as firearms are concerned, it's a different world.

I'll refrain from vicariously blowing its trumpet in future.

tac
www.swissrifles.com

tac foley · 11-07-2017 12:29pm

Sparks wrote: »

Lindybeige? Essentially, amateur historian with a particular interest in ancient soldiering and ancient logistics. Has a lot of entertaining youtube bits taking the swords-and-sandals genre of films to pieces pointing out their really god-awful errors.

Sometimes he's funny and sometimes he's a PITA. He's a bit like Marmite, I guess.

tac

gunny123 · 11-07-2017 5:55pm

Sparks wrote: »

Lindybeige? Essentially, amateur historian with a particular interest in ancient soldiering and ancient logistics. Has a lot of entertaining youtube bits taking the swords-and-sandals genre of films to pieces pointing out their really god-awful errors.

Like centurions wearing wrist watches in ben-hoor

?

tac foley · 11-07-2017 6:16pm

gunny123 wrote: »

Like centurions wearing wrist watches in ben-hoor ?

Also in El Cid.

tac

Grizzly 45 · 11-07-2017 10:29pm

Not to mind the jet contrail over the circus maximus in the chariot race start up parade.Fierce advanced lot in ancient Rome.:D

Nekarsulm · 12-07-2017 9:10am

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Not to mind the jet contrail over the circus maximus in the chariot race start up parade.Fierce advanced lot in ancient Rome.:D

And 20 metre tramlines in the wheat fields in Gladiator ;D

tac foley · 12-07-2017 10:14am

Just might happen that the Romans were more advanced than we ever gave them credit for. After all, there were no power lines in either Ben Hur or El Cid, which leads me to believe that they had broadcast power, like they do in 'Star Trek'. No gas stations, either, so they must have gotten their coffee elsewhere, right?

tac

Grizzly 45 · 12-07-2017 11:48am

Nah,they stole the broadcast power from the Atlantians along with all their other technology.:P:P[ Took Mr Tesla to rediscover that idea in the 20th century.] So if they were that smart,isnt it then possible they invented wrist watches too so the film is actually historicaly accurate??
As Abe Linclon ,the famous vampire hunter and US president said "never belive everything you read on the internet."

gunny123 · 13-07-2017 4:20pm

Someday..............when i win the lottery

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ncj3bux7c5o

tac foley · 13-07-2017 4:57pm

Gunny123 - I actually handled one of these beautiful guns at a gun show in Seattle a couple of years ago.

It points like a shotgun and, I'm told, with a suitable calibre it stops stuff like the footprint of G*d.

It was also for sale, and at $35,000 it had gone by the end of the show. The artisan who makes these astonishing rifles is well into his eighties, and with the best will in the world there won't be that many more of them coming.

I'd spend my money like a shot - so to speak.

tac

Grizzly 45 · 13-07-2017 7:48pm

Reminds me alittle bit of the Bronco 22/410 combo.A pull&twist design but alot lighter and cruder

Well if you wanted somthing a little bit cheaper,not by much mind with a unique design.Check out the Cosmi shotguns. I have handled one of these guns,but never fired it.Lovely bit of workmanship too,every bit is hand made,but it's just weird in my mind.Still if Breshnev and Giscard Estang used them....

http://www.cosmiguns.com/copia-di-home

ezra_ · 14-07-2017 9:59am

Saw another thread that had reference to the word 'sniper'.

Is the origin of the word associated with the snipe bird?

tac foley · 14-07-2017 10:24am

ezra_ wrote: »

Saw another thread that had reference to the word 'sniper'.

Is the origin of the word associated with the snipe bird?

Yes, the word is derived directly from the skill required - with a flintlock fowler - to take these agile little birds.

Until the advent of WW1, the term used for a skilled shooter was 'sharpshooter' or simply 'marksman'. In fact, the word 'sharpshooter' has entered many Germanic languages as a direct translation - '

German - 'Scharfschuetzer'

Swedish, Danish and Norwegian - 'Skarfskytter'.

The Russians, more experienced than most in the art and trade of sniper, actually DO use the word 'sniper' as a direct translation - снайпер - pronounced 'sniper'.

I'm not going to enlarge on the present day usage of the word, rather the mis-usage, where every urban killer with a rifle is called sniper. I used to run a course that was attended by military snipers from most NATO countries, and the last thing they are is a trigger-happy killer.

tac

Grizzly 45 · 14-07-2017 12:16pm

I always thought the term "Sharp shooter" also derived from the not so Wild West ,with the professional buffalo hunters.As they mostly used the Sharps rifle for decimating herds.It simply became Western slang to refer to a bufflo hunter as a "sharp shooter"

tac foley · 14-07-2017 12:41pm

This title pre-dates the slaughter of the buffalo by a substantial margin. In fact, the term "sharp shooter", was in use in British newspapers as early as 1801. In the Edinburgh Advertiser, 23 June 1801, can be found the following quote in a piece about the North British Militia; "This Regiment has several Field Pieces, and two companies of Sharp Shooters, which are very necessary in the modern "Stile of War". The term appears even earlier, around 1781, in Continental Europe, translated from the German Scharfschütze.

tac

tac foley · 16-07-2017 4:22pm

What a day today, folks!!! Guest day at our club and an unprecedented number of taker-uppers of member's friends, co-workers and relations. Almost a hundred showed up today, including about 45 guests of all ages, from 9 to 80 y/o.

I drug along my .58cal Musketoon carbine, a muzzle-loader from 1861, a .45.70 Govt Winchester High Wall from 1885, and my Ruger Old Army .44cal BP revolver.

All the .45-70 Govt loads were BP, too, so the smoke was thick and smelly, AND dirty, I'm happy to relate. Nobody who shot any of them went away without a great cheesy grin, even the 9 y/o shooting the Musketoon, although I DID reduce the load for him by about half.

Stats for my collection -

22 shots of 535gr Minié ball over 65gr of FFg.

1 shot of ditto over ca.30gr of FFg.

32 rounds of .45-70 Govt with 405g lead bullets

8 x cylinder loads [48] shots of 145gr ball over 30gr of 3Fg in the revolver, mostly by folks who had never handled ANY kind of handgun before, let alone a fire-breathing whomper like the ROA.

...and afterwards, the compulsory bar-b-q, of course.

A great day, for sure.

tac

gunny123 · 16-07-2017 11:35pm

Tac, its amazing how talking someone very sceptical or hostile towards firearms, into having a shot or two, often converts them onto our side. Its a pity it cannot be done en masse, the majority of our problems would disappear into the ether.

tac foley · 16-07-2017 11:44pm

You are absolutely right, Sir. Sadly, all the people that I've had a part in introducing to shooting over the years have actually asked to have try. I've never actually encountered a truly anti-gun person that I managed to get to come along to a shoot session. Like many shooters, I seem to have acquired only friends who are also shooters, like me.

It's like the old story about the Garda going to a school to talk to the kids about the dangers of talking to strangers. One little lad in the front row put his hand up, and remarked 'I don't know any strangers...'

Same here, all our friends either shoot or don't. If they don't it's not because they are against shooting per se, just that it does not hold any interest for them.

Odd to think that there ARE people with that kind of mindset, but it takes all kinds, right?

tac

Nekarsulm · 16-07-2017 11:50pm

Sounds like a brilliant day, Tac.
I brought the wife clay pigeon shooting today for the first time in her life. She started with the 391 Beretta, but one guy had his 10 year old kids lovely little Franchi 20 bore o/u and offered it to her to try. She got on great with it , still talking about it tonight ........

tac foley · 17-07-2017 12:02pm

Nekarsulm wrote: »

Sounds like a brilliant day, Tac.
I brought the wife clay pigeon shooting today for the first time in her life. She started with the 391 Beretta, but one guy had his 10 year old kids lovely little Franchi 20 bore o/u and offered it to her to try. She got on great with it , still talking about it tonight ........

Unless Mrs Neckarsulm had a job, your generosity is going to cost you dearly.

tac

Nekarsulm · 17-07-2017 12:09pm

tac foley wrote: »

Unless Mrs Neckarsulm had a job, your generosity is going to cost you dearly.

tac

Luckily she has a much better job than I have

gunny123 · 19-07-2017 7:04pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qBFRqCDK6o

tac foley · 19-07-2017 7:11pm

tac

Grizzly 45 · 25-07-2017 1:28am

Melania Capitan,in cae you haven't heard about this
She was a Spanish 24 year old huntress who killed herself last week because of online anti hunting bullying on FB and twitter.Not content with getting her to kill herself these lowlife pond scum finish off by even filling her FB page with abuse.....:mad::mad:
These are the kind of people we are up against ,keyboard social justice warriors and little big men. So just a heads up if you ,youur son or daughter or any relative who hunts and posts stuff online be perepared for this kind of sht possibly coming your way..Do not stop posting,but just remember there are 30 year olds still living in their parents spare bedrooms,who have nothing better to do than make someones onlife life miserable.:(

gunny123 · 25-07-2017 12:09pm

It's easy to be brave on the internet. Pond life. But online bullying has never bothered me, as i never seen the attraction of posting what you are doing on the web for the world to see.

gunny123 · 26-07-2017 10:02pm

Stop the world i want to get off :rolleyes:

http://www.thejournal.ie/former-taoiseach-brian-cowen-awarded-honorary-doctorate-3516023-Jul2017/

Grizzly 45 · 27-07-2017 11:14am

Hope fully the final kick in the Irish peoples teeth of the Celtic Tiger disaster. It makes an utter mockery of doing anything academic when an utter buffoon gets awarded one for sheer incompetance.Still,I suppose the Nobel peace prize is about as valueable these days too,when they handed one to Barrack Obama.

tac foley · 28-07-2017 4:06pm

...and to Yasser Arafat.

tac

gunny123 · 28-07-2017 8:08pm

It seems to be the season for all the rubbish to come out of the woodwork, bertie, cowan and in the uk war-monger in chief, blair.

Grizzly 45 · 29-07-2017 2:31am

The " Three Amigos" ride again! We just need one more and we have "the four horsemen of the Apocalypse" instead.:eek:

gunny123 · 31-07-2017 7:56pm

If you want to see unbelieveable skill with a bow, watch this video, Lars Anderson makes legolas from lotr look like a donkey.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEG-ly9tQGk

Sparks · 31-07-2017 8:33pm

An awful lot of actual archers would beg to differ though...

https://www.facebook.com/notes/anna-maltese/yes-ive-seen-the-video-thank-you-for-posting-it-/10152769003622585?pnref=story

gunny123 · 31-07-2017 10:32pm

How do you mean "actual archers" Sparks ? Strikes me he is an actual archer after seeing what he could do in that video.

Sparks · 01-08-2017 11:27am

I mean people who do actual archery, both competitive and for historical/archeological research purposes (eg. figuring out how the mongols made their bows, that kind of thing). They've pointed out that he's using a very light bow compared to normal hunting bows or warbows, that some of the arrows he's using are basically designed to let you do the tricks he's doing with them (the ones he shoots or catches), and that basic physics means you can't do some of those things in the context that he says you can (if you were fast enough to catch an ordinary arrow shot from an ordinary hunting bow for example, it's speed and kinetic energy is sufficient to strip the skin off your hands and it wouldn't stop).

I mean, come on, if it takes you 14 attempts to get something to work on film using a weak bow and trick arrows, it's not really valid to claim the technique works in the general case.

tac foley · 01-08-2017 11:38am

Back in the day, I used to shoot a modern replication of a 17thC Turkish Jannisary short recurve bow as a demonstration. It had actually been made in the late '50's for instructional purposes, and I collected it from the maker in the early '70's when I was living in Ankara for a short while on my Turkish language course.

Although I was a well-versed archer, and shot in both longbow and modern recurve sports, this bow nigh-on crippled me just in the stringing, and shooting it with the correct thumb-ring style was a difficult thing to manage at best from standing, let alone sitting on a galloping horse while other folks shot THEIR arrows at you.

When tillered to ensure that I, with my 'standard' 28" draw-length length could shoot it safely, it measured just a tad over 116 pounds

Watching this gentleman rapid-shooting a bow that may have a draw-weight at around 20# or so, as noted in the link quoted above is still clever, but that's all it is.

The other point made in the link is that 'British archers in warfare often pulled as much as 100#. This is patently untrue, since many of the warbows found on the Mary Rose would have had draw weights exceeding 140# and modern longbow shooters regularly shoot in warbows of that kind of draw-weight.

The bow that I shot for a demo that never actually went on TV put a contemporary bodkin-style arrow through both sides of a set of modern chain mail at twenty or so yards, sticking almost a foot out of the back.

tac

tac foley · 01-08-2017 11:53am

gunny123 wrote: »

war-monger in chief, blair.

Sir, these are among the truest words you have ever written here.

tac

gunny123 · 01-08-2017 1:13pm

The thing is sparks, the archers of old were so physically developed, they were actually deformed. They had by order of the king, to practise daily with the bow. As tac says the old bows had massive draw weights.

The fact the chappie in the video is using a light bow is down to his lack of strength not skill.

Sparks · 01-08-2017 2:17pm

Doesn't matter if he's strong or not gunny, the whole "catching arrows" thing has been tested before; if you don't use lightweight arrows and light poundage bows, the thing not only doesn't work, it can't work because of physics. And that's not counting the need for a lot of coordination between archer and catcher.

As to the other tricks... yeah, I don't buy that they're anything more than tricks. Sure, funny to look at and very fast, but... not solid. Being able to get arrows out of the bow fast and being able to hit the target with the arrows fast, those are not the same thing. And that's not a very contrarian viewpoint from what I can tell. For example: http://www.theinfinitecurve.com/archery/bad-archery-pt-251/

Grizzly 45 · 01-08-2017 3:08pm

No author, but it seems someone somewhere pissed on someone's Mc Happy meal.
Any idea what this is about?seems to be a very long and tiresome way of making a few quid.

ezra_ · 01-08-2017 3:13pm

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

No author, but it seems someone somewhere pissed on someone's Mc Happy meal.
Any idea what this is about?seems to be a very long and tiresome way of making a few quid.

That's just crazy.

I didn't know Ireland had such a roaring trade in high end African game guns!

tac foley · 01-08-2017 3:22pm

ezra_ wrote: »

That's just crazy.

I didn't know Ireland had such a roaring trade in high end African game guns!

With a pair of Holland & Holland or Churchill or even Wm Evans super-grade shotguns costing up to £1/4M it seems to me to be an easy way...

tac

Sparks · 01-08-2017 4:41pm

No idea what they're motivated by, but that article is fundamentally wrong because it's mixing up being licenced to possess something and actually being the owner of that thing. Those are wholly separate things in Irish firearms legislation. Which is why you can have multiple people with licences for the same firearm, and is a fundamental part of the training licence.

And I'm reasonably sure it's not Garda policy to issue licences for firearms before the owner imports them, but a legal necessity because without the licence, an ordinary non-RFD person cannot import a firearm legally unless they physically go and fetch it in person.

Shooting Forum - Firearms licencing information

Off Topic Chat. (MOD NOTE post# 3949 and post#5279)

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Forum Charter - Useful Information - Photo thread: Hardware - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads - Upcoming Events - RFDs by County

Forum Charter - Useful Information - Photo thread: Hardware - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads - Upcoming Events - RFDs by County