Schools Cup 2014/2015 mod warning post 1

Bsd · 01-09-2014 7:50pm

FR2 wrote: »

Usually the first week of December!

Last year it was in may for the munster senior cup

The Lost Sheep · 01-09-2014 9:08pm

Bsd wrote: »

Last year it was in may for the munster senior cup

Munster Draw would have been made already but for some schools complaints on new regulations being put in place regarding player eligibility. The Senior Cup qualifier competition draw has been made as have the B/C school competitions. All are on the Munster website

RedemptionZ · 09-09-2014 1:00am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zS_kQ7EqIbA

This is the highlights of Scots College from Australia in 2014 who seemingly dominated their competition throughout the season. Just wondering how do you think they'd fare against say the Rock side of last year or the Clongowes team of 2011? Just interesting to see the comparison. Apparently they've been poaching a lot of NSW reps, where have we seen that before

? But in all seriousness they look to have some very skillful probably better rounded players than you'd see in Ireland schools but smaller packs.

Only a highlight reel obviously so doesn't show the full picture. Well worth watching for the support lines alone, absolutely gorgeous stuff.

tedgre · 09-09-2014 10:34pm

Just a few questions on the leinster u19 team..
Anyone know what nick peters is like as a player? Has came out of nowhere this year.

Also what happed to Charlie Cregan? Colm Mulcahy? Rowan Osborne? Rob Lalor? Dan Lavelle? Sean O'Hare?

Also saw Eoin O'Neill is involved but im fairly sure he didnt even start for michaels when in 6th year?

Finally Matthew Byrne from terenure? What type of player is he?

leinster89 · 13-09-2014 5:39pm

Leinster Schools drew with Ulster 17-17. Two very good sides, best Ulster side ive seen in 5 years.

Hagz · 13-09-2014 6:18pm

That's great. Were you at game, did any Ulster players in particular catch your eye?

OceanSixteen · 14-09-2014 2:38pm

Kyle Dixon a student of Castleknock College for 5 years who 'moved' to Blackrock College at the beginning of 6th year played for Blackrock yesterday against Castleknock

RedemptionZ · 14-09-2014 2:40pm

OceanSixteen wrote: »

Kyle Dixon a student of Castleknock College for 5 years who 'moved' to Blackrock College at the beginning of 6th year played for Blackrock yesterday against Castleknock

Standard stuff really. Poaching is bad enough but it's the fact that Blackrock already have a head start with the best facilities and by far biggest numbers that really gets me. This conversation tends to come up every year, it happens in most sports unfortunately and there's not much we can do about it.

OceanSixteen · 14-09-2014 2:42pm

Another player who will be moving to Blackrock later this year is Ciaran Frawley from Skerries RFC and a Leinster and Ireland U18s player

leinster89 · 14-09-2014 2:48pm

Don't have a problem with it really. Personal choice and freedom, Frawley is a classy outhalf who can play fullback too. Strong tradition of Skerries lads moving to Blackrock with David O'Connor moving there in 3rd year and Conor Oliver joining him for 6th year.
Terenure did it with Dardis and others, Rock do it regularly.
Prefer to not see players moving from school to school though.

Any idea on the blackrock team yesterday?

leinster89 · 14-09-2014 2:51pm

Hagz wrote: »

That's great. Were you at game, did any Ulster players in particular catch your eye?

For ulster James McKeown, Conor Kelly, Robert Lyttle were three standouts i thought.

spillit67 · 14-09-2014 3:54pm

RedemptionZ wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zS_kQ7EqIbA

This is the highlights of Scots College from Australia in 2014 who seemingly dominated their competition throughout the season. Just wondering how do you think they'd fare against say the Rock side of last year or the Clongowes team of 2011? Just interesting to see the comparison. Apparently they've been poaching a lot of NSW reps, where have we seen that before ? But in all seriousness they look to have some very skillful probably better rounded players than you'd see in Ireland schools but smaller packs.

Only a highlight reel obviously so doesn't show the full picture. Well worth watching for the support lines alone, absolutely gorgeous stuff.

Nice video. I thin Australian schools rugby is completely screwed though with unfettered poaching and scholarships destroying the competitive landscape. A warning about what could happen here.

We used to see maybe a person every couple of years moving school but it seems to be a couple a year now, very disappointing to see.

RedemptionZ · 14-09-2014 5:25pm

spillit67 wrote: »

Nice video. I thin Australian schools rugby is completely screwed though with unfettered poaching and scholarships destroying the competitive landscape. A warning about what could happen here.

We used to see maybe a person every couple of years moving school but it seems to be a couple a year now, very disappointing to see.

Let's call a spade a spade though, Blackrock are responsible for almost all of the poaching. Terenure did take the two players from Newbridge back in 2012 but Blackrock have been doing it on a much more frequent basis and on a much larger scale. I believe the stat thrown around last year was that 10 of the starting 15 In the SCT weren't in the school in first year. It's definitely the dark side to the schools competition but I suppose it's inevitable that it will happen in a competitive environment. No fair way of preventing players from moving school that I can think of.

Also to be fair I'm not having a go at blackrock per se, I've no doubt most schools would be doing the same if they were able to provide the accommodation rock can. Just think it's worth noting that they are the prime offenders and if it that '10 out of the 15 weren't in 1st year' thing becomes normal then the competition will be ruined.

The Lost Sheep · 14-09-2014 5:48pm

spillit67 wrote: »

Nice video. I thin Australian schools rugby is completely screwed though with unfettered poaching and scholarships destroying the competitive landscape. A warning about what could happen here.

We used to see maybe a person every couple of years moving school but it seems to be a couple a year now, very disappointing to see.

Australia suffers from rugby being very much a upper class sport and underage the sport completely dominated by small number of schools

Should something be done about players moving? Something possibly should be but as proved when something was tried in Munster to stop it there will be massive opposition

RedemptionZ wrote: »

Let's call a spade a spade though, Blackrock are responsible for almost all of the poaching. Terenure did take the two players from Newbridge back in 2012 but Blackrock have been doing it on a much more frequent basis and on a much larger scale. I believe the stat thrown around last year was that 10 of the starting 15 In the SCT weren't in the school in first year. It's definitely the dark side to the schools competition but I suppose it's inevitable that it will happen in a competitive environment. No fair way of preventing players from moving school that I can think of.

Also to be fair I'm not having a go at blackrock per se, I've no doubt most schools would be doing the same if they were able to provide the accommodation rock can. Just think it's worth noting that they are the prime offenders and if it that '10 out of the 15 weren't in 1st year' thing becomes normal then the competition will be ruined.

I disagree with that regarding Blackrock. All schools or virtually all do it. Yes it is difficult to stop it but putting in more rules as to when a youngster must be a registered student and when they become eligible for the rugby side is part of way to do it.
Totally agree on the last sentence

Hagz · 14-09-2014 5:48pm

I'm quite surprised at Blackrock tbh. They were never this active in bringing in outside talent, but in the last couple years they seem to be employing this tactic more and more.

That's not to say I'm against it. They seem to be targeting youth players, and in my opinion such players have really benefited from it.

spillit67 · 14-09-2014 5:56pm

Blackrock, Clongowes and Roscrea are the ones active in bringing Youth players in. It gives me an even greater level of respect for what St Michaels have done in the last 7 or 8 years.

It's a difficult one as regards bringing Youth players or people from Development schools in. I do not buy the tired excuse that it is for promotion - Leinster rugby has brought through lots of youths and people from non traditional schools in recent years. It certainly might improve their access to training and competitive environment though. Players from other traditional schools is utter poison for the competition though. Players converging on what particular school has the most talented set of players in an age group is bad for the competition and for the sport. I personally don't see the attraction of leaving your mates for a better chance of a medal, it wouldn't be worth anything to me. We should also look at the wider remit of underage rugby, it is about more than those going pro, it's about playing beyond school and being involved in the game at grassroots whether that is a school or club throughout your life. It must be extremely disheartening to see your best player leave your school and instantly damage your team's chances.

spillit67 · 14-09-2014 6:01pm

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Australia suffers from rugby being very much a upper class sport and underage the sport completely dominated by small number of schools

Not talking about that. The GPS in Sydney for example, are all middle to upper class fee paying schools. The only one that isn't is Sydney Boys High School which is a selective academic school. The GPS has been damaged because of poaching and scholarships. It is Leinster schools rugby x 10. Some schools are not willing to do that just for rugby and the competitive balance has been eroded.

NEWINGTON old boy and Wallabies great Phil Kearns said the supremacy of Scots was dreadful for rugby, and urged schools to either allow unfettered recruiting for all schools, or ban enticements.

His comments came after the blowout result when Scots College defeated Newington College in the 1st 15 GPS match, 101-0.

``Yeah it’s clearly quite a good program going on there. They must have some very good coaching,’’ Kearns laughed, tongue embedded in his cheek.

``Every school accuses others schools of doing the same thing. Shore say they don’t have any players on scholarships, I’m not sure I believe that. And I’m sure Scots are doing it.

``Either you make the decision that everyone is allowed to have scholarships and recruits, or no one is allowed to. But this is not just happening in rugby, It’s basketball, it’s rowing, it’s all sports.’’

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/phil-kearns-says-the-supremacy-of-scots-college-is-dreadful-for-rugby-after-1010-drubbing-of-newington-college/story-fni0cx12-1227003526800

There are other problems in Australian schoolboy rugby, from what you mention above with few working class schools and also the competitions themselves. There is no equivalent of the provincial competitions we have here or the New Zealand schools competition. GPS is an Association of schools, it would be kind of like if there was no LSC here and there was a Holy Ghost Schools competition for under 18s.

Hagz · 14-09-2014 6:12pm

RedemptionZ wrote: »

I believe the stat thrown around last year was that 10 of the starting 15 In the SCT weren't in the school in first year.

That stat is false anyway that's for sure.

RedemptionZ · 14-09-2014 6:18pm

Hagz wrote: »

That stat is false anyway that's for sure.

Yeah I think it sounds a bit too outrageous, but I know it was an alarming number.

Hagz · 14-09-2014 6:22pm

RedemptionZ wrote: »

Yeah I think it sounds a bit too outrageous, but I know it was an alarming number.

I reckon it's the other way round. 10/15 were in school in 1st year, and 5 weren't. The 5 being Loughman, O'Connor, Oliver, Kearns and Carberry.

RobbieRuns · 14-09-2014 6:24pm

In fairness to Blackrock, because the record that they have and the fact that it is a boarding school, it is also a case of good players wanting to go there as much as them going out to recruit them. (Rockwell and Clongowes similar)

Lots of parents of good rugby players want them to study as well and the mix of boarding, good education combined with the chance of good rugby coaching and bringing their game up a level is appealing. I have always believed that the history and record of Rock has people wanting to go there. Not always sure that they "poach".

aspin · 14-09-2014 7:03pm

leinster89 wrote: »

Don't have a problem with it really. Personal choice and freedom, Frawley is a classy outhalf who can play fullback too. Strong tradition of Skerries lads moving to Blackrock with David O'Connor moving there in 3rd year and Conor Oliver joining him for 6th year.
Terenure did it with Dardis and others, Rock do it regularly.
Prefer to not see players moving from school to school though.

Any idea on the blackrock team yesterday?

I can understand the youth players and don't have a big issue with it. Frawley is a fine player and will be a big addition to Blackrock. Would be favourite for Irish clubs 10 shirt this year.
Dixon has played two years SCT with Castleknock. Maybe should be a rule that you cant play SCT for different schools.

funtime93 · 15-09-2014 4:18pm

Hagz wrote: »

I reckon it's the other way round. 10/15 were in school in 1st year, and 5 weren't. The 5 being Loughman, O'Connor, Oliver, Kearns and Carberry.

O'Hagan was another.

lukey967 · 15-09-2014 6:49pm

funtime93 wrote: »

O'Hagan was another.

Was Dane Fitzpatrick in the school from the beginning do you know?

SaveOurLyric · 15-09-2014 6:59pm

F all boarders in Williamstown these days. Hardly a factor.

Hagz · 15-09-2014 7:15pm

lukey967 wrote: »

Was Dane Fitzpatrick in the school from the beginning do you know?

If by the beginning you mean 1st year then yes. And in fairness, although O'Hagan wasn't there since 1st year, he was there since 3rd year. In my opinion that's a completely different scenario to someone coming to the school in 5th/6th year.

Bridge93 · 16-09-2014 12:24pm

Hagz wrote: »

If by the beginning you mean 1st year then yes. And in fairness, although O'Hagan wasn't there since 1st year, he was there since 3rd year. In my opinion that's a completely different scenario to someone coming to the school in 5th/6th year.

O' Hagan was a 2nd year in Rock

The cup final team last year was:
Dane Fitzpatrick - First year
Hugo Kean - Junior School
Jeremy Loughman - 5th year
Jack Dwan - Junior school
David O Connor - 3rd Year
Caelan Doris - 1st year
Conor Oliver - 6th year
Nick Timoney - Junior school
Tristan Brady - Junior school
Sean Kearns - 5th year
Ian Kinsley - Junior school
Jack Power - Junior school
Hugo Keenan - Junior school (I think)
Zack O Hagan - 2nd year
Joey Carberry - 6th year

2 from 6th year
2 from 5th
1 from 3rd
1 from 2nd
2 from 1st
7 from the junior school

RedemptionZ · 16-09-2014 3:19pm

Slightly off topic here but interesting stat: In 2013 the starting team for St. Michaels had only one player who didn't come through the junior school. Seems like it's tough to make the crossover to high level rugby if you don't already play it at a high level from a young age.

DonnellysArm · 16-09-2014 7:18pm

Bridge93 wrote: »

O' Hagan was a 2nd year in Rock

The cup final team last year was:
Dane Fitzpatrick - First year
Hugo Kean - Junior School
Jeremy Loughman - 5th year
Jack Dwan - Junior school
David O Connor - 3rd Year
Caelan Doris - 1st year
Conor Oliver - 6th year
Nick Timoney - Junior school
Tristan Brady - Junior school
Sean Kearns - 5th year
Ian Kinsley - Junior school
Jack Power - Junior school
Hugo Keenan - Junior school (I think)
Zack O Hagan - 2nd year
Joey Carberry - 6th year

2 from 6th year
2 from 5th
1 from 3rd
1 from 2nd
2 from 1st
7 from the junior school

The year before the team starting in the final:

Jeremy Loughman - 5th year
Tom Cooke - Junior School
Oliver Jager - 2nd Year
David O'Connor - 3rd year
Gary Fenn - 1st year
Raeff Tyrrel - 1st year
David Fortune - Junior School
Nick Timoney - Junior School
Charlie Rock - 1st year
Peter Quirke - Junior School
Sean Coughlan - Junior School
Steve Lawton - 1st year
Garry Ringrose - Junior School
Zack O'Hagan - 2nd year
Jack Power - Junor School

1 from 5th
1 from 3rd
2 from 2nd
4 from 1st
7 from Junior School

Only 1 player who didnt play Junior Cup or Junior League matches for Blackrock.

Bridge93 · 17-09-2014 12:05am

DonnellysArm wrote: »

The year before the team starting in the final:

Jeremy Loughman - 5th year
Tom Cooke - Junior School
Oliver Jager - 2nd Year
David O'Connor - 3rd year
Gary Fenn - 1st year
Raeff Tyrrel - 1st year
David Fortune - Junior School
Nick Timoney - Junior School
Charlie Rock - 1st year
Peter Quirke - Junior School
Sean Coughlan - Junior School
Steve Lawton - 1st year
Garry Ringrose - Junior School
Zack O'Hagan - 2nd year
Jack Power - Junor School

1 from 5th
1 from 3rd
2 from 2nd
4 from 1st
7 from Junior School

Only 1 player who didnt play Junior Cup or Junior League matches for Blackrock.

both Gary Fenn and Raef Tyrell were in Willow Park as far as I'm aware but could be wrong.
Your point remains though, that last years SCT was the outlier rather than the norm. That one 5th year Jeremy was brought in for last years SCT. The fact he helped 2013 was a bonus.

The Pheasant2 · 17-09-2014 12:09am

Bridge93 wrote: »

both Gary Fenn and Raef Tyrell were in Willow Park as far as I'm aware but could be wrong.
Your point remains though, that last years SCT was the outlier rather than the norm. That one 5th year Jeremy was brought in for last years SCT. The fact he helped 2013 was a bonus.

You're correct on Fenn and Tyrell, both came through Willow

Hagz · 20-09-2014 10:24pm

Munster schools beat Ulster 22-7.

When was the last time Munster won the schools interpros?

The Lost Sheep · 20-09-2014 11:25pm

Hagz wrote: »

Munster schools beat Ulster 22-7.

When was the last time Munster won the schools interpros?

10+ years. Leinster have won them all for last 10 years or so

Leinster88 · 22-09-2014 11:38am

Could this finally be the year Leinster don't win the schools interpros?

spillit67 · 22-09-2014 11:40am

Any friendly results?

Leinster88 · 22-09-2014 12:09pm

spillit67 wrote: »

Any friendly results?

Would they not be fairly irrelevant with so many top players not playing due to the interpros?

Michaels have played twice against Castleknock and CBC Monkstown and lost both: 35-29 & 30-27.

They are however missing the following players: Rory Mulvihill, James Ryan, Oisin Dowling, Max Deegan, Barry Fitzpatrick, Dave Duggan, Oisin O'Meara & Jack Kelly. Along with some injuries.

spillit67 · 22-09-2014 1:00pm

Just interested!

The Lost Sheep · 22-09-2014 1:30pm

spillit67 wrote: »

Any friendly results?

Leinster88 wrote: »

Would they not be fairly irrelevant with so many top players not playing due to the interpros?

Michaels have played twice against Castleknock and CBC Monkstown and lost both: 35-29 & 30-27.

They are however missing the following players: Rory Mulvihill, James Ryan, Oisin Dowling, Max Deegan, Barry Fitzpatrick, Dave Duggan, Oisin O'Meara & Jack Kelly. Along with some injuries.

Wouldn't say fairly irrelevant and still give good idea on how some schools are going at this stage. Campbell College and Sullivan Upper had away wins over Ballyclare and Banbridge at weekend but no results from Leinster or Munster schools...

spillit67 · 22-09-2014 1:35pm

CBC Cork lost to CBC Monkstown 27-25 acc. to twitter

Rugby_Man5 · 22-09-2014 8:47pm

C.u.s lost to St.marys on Saturday i think

ken76 · 23-09-2014 8:39am

Obviously its very early in the year but what are the expectations for Belvo this year?

Inspector Coptoor · 23-09-2014 4:33pm

Could do well.
Two junior cup finalists teams coming through in 4th and 5th year.

11 guys involved in leinster training camps over the summer and 7 involved in the U-18 leinster set up for the interpros.

This year and next year could be real
Shout for a cup run.

milosh · 25-09-2014 5:43pm

Any Senior or Junior results from yesterday. The Leinster Leagues must be starting soon.

the baby bull elephant · 25-09-2014 5:45pm

milosh wrote: »

Any Senior or Junior results from yesterday. The Leinster Leagues must be starting soon.

Marys beat Newbridge. Not sure on score.

Rugby_Man5 · 25-09-2014 6:12pm

Marys won 22-10 i think

Hagz · 27-09-2014 6:30pm

Congratulations to Munster schools. Nice to see Munster get some silverware at underage level.

Hagz · 27-09-2014 6:41pm

Nasty collision that resulted in a red card.

The Lost Sheep · 27-09-2014 7:13pm

Hagz wrote: »

Congratulations to Munster schools. Nice to see Munster get some silverware at underage level.

Long time coming. At least 5 seasons since an interpro title has been won by Munster apart from the now defunct section A schools interpros which were won 3 seasons ago

Hagz wrote: »

Nasty collision that resulted in a red card.

Looking at the other pics of that ref made the right call. Deserved red card. Anyone at game feel different?

rughug · 01-10-2014 4:13pm

Boys, any results from the Leinster Schools Senior League games today. First round of games

rughug · 01-10-2014 4:22pm

Boys, any results from the Leinster Schools Senior League games today. First round of games

Schools Cup 2014/2015 *mod warning post 1*

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Schools Cup 2014/2015 mod warning post 1