Greystones - Who do you want and why? [ELECTION 2011] All posts here.

Cheeky Chops · 08-02-2011 9:55pm

mikedragon32 wrote: »

Well in fairness to Harris, sitting on boards is probably no different to sitting on your hole in the Daíl, so he's eminently qualified.

At the other end, Donnelly will be wasted there. A smart guy like him should be making decisions and changing things up. Sitting on his hole in the Daíl means that he'll need to negotiate just to get time to speak, let alone influence anything. Your vote for him might not be wasted, as it looks like he's a cert for a seat, but his presence there is probably a waste.

Still undecided!

How can you justify the statement that he is a cert for a seat? Would he be well known in Blessington for example?

Sinister Roche sent me a "personal" letter last week looking for my vote. Oh how I laughed.

mikedragon32 · 08-02-2011 10:36pm

It's my opinion Cheeky, not a statement.

As for Dick Roche, the least said about him the better. It's testament to his level of delusion that he didn't take his money and run like the other rats.

recedite · 08-02-2011 10:48pm

Fiachra2 wrote: »

The other problem is that FG and Labour will (almost certainly) form a government and so all these independents will actually have virtually no influence.

Ain't necessarily so. FG are predicted to be close to an overall majority, so they could enlist the support of the Greens and/or a group of independents to form a govt. It's what FF did last time.

Donnelly hits the nail on the head when he states his vision on his website;
"We must face up to a simple fact: unsustainable debt cannot be sustained. Instead, it must be dealt with bravely, expertly and definitively. Policies taken so far by the government and supported by the opposition have been negligent in the extreme.
We must:Insist that the remaining senior bondholders accept losses
Foreign investors invested in the Irish banking system at their own risk. They were rewarded handsomely for their investments during the good years and now, during the bad, they must accept their losses."

But then Donnelly says "The punitive 5.83% interest rate can and must be renegotiated: by people with real economic understanding and expertise who can deal with the IMF in their own language."
But the fact is that the IMF rate is calculated according to a strict formula and is not subject to negotiation. Angela Merkel has already signalled that the interest rate on the separate EU loan can be lowered, if we insert a "debt brake" into our constitution. The loan term will also be extended to 30 years, just like the big home mortgages in recent years. So as soon as we get the referendum organised that is available. No doubt Enda will claim the credit for "negotiating" that one later on, in March or April, but the fact is, all he can do is show up and sign on the dotted line.

There are two other alternatives for anyone who disagrees with the way the State took on all the bad debts of the banks and developers, and then sank under the weight;
1. Sinn Féin.
2. New Vision independents with the backing of David Mc Williams (lets face it, he was right about the bubble, but the govt. wouldn't listen)and other assorted economists;http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0201/1224288695000.html
Fís Nua (translates as New Vision) is a greener version which aims towards a sustainable steady state economy without the usual boom & bust cycle that we have become accustomed to. If you like the sound of that, vote for Kinsella or Kavanagh.

hamstervision · 09-02-2011 9:07am

mikedragon32 wrote: »

As for Dick Roche, the least said about him the better. It's testament to his level of delusion that he didn't take his money and run like the other rats.

I love how Dick Roche's posters look like he's running as an independent until you see the teeny-tiny little FF logo in the corner.

Speaking of posters, there's new FF ones up with Martin's face on them inside the entrance to Charlesland. And Niall Byrne still hasn't taken down his. I've emailed him, my wife emailed him and rang the number on his site, which turned out to be his home number. His wife said that the campaign manager would sort it. Nothing's been done. She rang the number again last night and she'd barely told his wife what it was in relation to when she hung up on her! Nice.

Mr Posh · 09-02-2011 10:55am

Fiachra2 wrote: »

I would question his certainty of a seat. To get elected its not enough to poll well in Greystones and Bray (or Boards!). You have to achieve in the rest of the county and I would have doubts about that.

The other problem is that FG and Labour will (almost certainly) form a government and so all these independents will actually have virtually no influence. SF have had a number of TD's in the Dail for quite a few years but no influence because the successive coalitions didnt need their support.

I admire the integrity and enthusiasm of independents but politics involves swallowing a lot of unpleasant pills and trying to compromise with people with whom you may have only limited commonality and that means joining a party.

Fiachra

Your seconded point unfortunately is true in the current system, but I suppose I’m still deluding myself that we can change how the political system operates. There is real enthusiasm in the country for reform in the Dail which should not be exclusive to the elected government. I read somewhere and think it might even have been on Donnelly’s web site, opposition must have the ability to hold the government to account. The civil service should include a department of the opposition, providing opposition parties with research and policy support to ensure they hold the government to there promise and question suggested decisions.

In this scenario an educated independent would have a lot to offer the country even in opposition; this election is already feeling like the same old same old with Kenny ducking debates as it may endanger his coronation!! Is this a taste of what we can expect in a leader?

recedite · 09-02-2011 11:05am

Maudi wrote: »

i tend to agree,simon is to eager.with little track record,he reminds me of one of those snake oil quacks from those old western movies

Snake oil salesmen have always been with us. All they ever want is a slightly better standard of living than you or me.

Stephen Donnelly; "has spent the last ten years gaining skills that will make him a better public representative for the people of Wicklow and Ireland....( he is a person with) with real economic understanding and expertise who can deal with the IMF in their own language".

Ireland, 200 years ago, the Priests; "have spent the last ten years gaining the skills of reading and writing, that will make us better public representatives for the people of Ireland....( we are the people with) real understanding of Latin who can intercede with God in his own language.

Ireland, 3000 years ago, @Newgrange Winter Solstice, the Druids;
"have spent the last ten years gaining the skills of reading animal entrails to see into the future, that will make us better public representatives for the people of Ireland....( we are the people with) real understanding of Magic Spells who can make the Sun get stronger, and so end this long winter.

mikedragon32 · 09-02-2011 11:24am

hamstervision wrote: »

I love how Dick Roche's posters look like he's running as an independent until you see the teeny-tiny little FF logo in the corner.

Speaking of posters, there's new FF ones up with Martin's face on them inside the entrance to Charlesland. And Niall Byrne still hasn't taken down his. I've emailed him, my wife emailed him and rang the number on his site, which turned out to be his home number. His wife said that the campaign manager would sort it. Nothing's been done. She rang the number again last night and she'd barely told his wife what it was in relation to when she hung up on her! Nice.

Fear not sir. Posters will come down today if the candidates to it. Tomorrow if they don't.

audreyp · 09-02-2011 11:56am

Excellent! The posters are annoying but I was more put off by the rudeness from some of the candidates.

There hasn't been a single canvasser at my door either, where are all the candidates?

I think Stephen Donnelly is my preferred candidate so far but that could be because he is the only one with a decent website with a lot of information on it.

hamstervision · 09-02-2011 11:58am

audreyp wrote: »

The posters are annoying but I was more put off by the rudeness from some of the candidates.

I really liked Simon Harris's trick of dropping a "Sorry I missed you" note through the door even if you're at home. Saves him actually having to talk to people.

tennisplayer · 09-02-2011 12:35pm

Whats the problem with the posters, they will be down in a few weeks.
Is Charlesland a no go area for posters and candidates ?

hamstervision · 09-02-2011 12:39pm

tennisplayer wrote: »

Whats the problem with the posters, they will be down in a few weeks.
Is Charlesland a no go area for posters and candidates ?

I think the issue is that the posters are inside the estate. The roads are fair game since they're owned by the Council (although apparently there's argument over whether or not the road outside Charlesland is actually owned by the Council since they allegedly refused to grit it) but certainly there shouldn't be posters inside the estate itself.

loobylou · 09-02-2011 12:56pm

Fiachra2 wrote: »

I would question his certainty of a seat. To get elected its not enough to poll well in Greystones and Bray (or Boards!). You have to achieve in the rest of the county and I would have doubts about that.

Agree that he's no certainty and obviously the wider area he can gain support the better for him, but it should still be possible to get elected based on a good vote from the Bray/Greystones part of the constituency.
To an extent all the parties do this, in FG Harris will concentrate on the same area (and probably the same voters) as Donnelly, Timmins will get the vote from the west of the mountains, Doyle from the Wicklow/Arklow area.
For FF Roche will have a large following in the north of the county with Fitzgerald to soak up the FF vote from the Arklow area which will transfer to Roche when he's eliminated.
Labours decision to put forward 3 candidates without a wide geographical spread looks to me like political lunacy.

Mr Posh · 09-02-2011 1:45pm

Genuine question,

All the councillors who are contesting the next election have responsibilities which they signed up to a year and a half ago in the local election.

Who is standing in for them as councillors as they spend most of there time campaigning for the best part of 4 weeks?

Fiachra2 · 09-02-2011 1:58pm

recedite wrote: »

Ain't necessarily so. FG are predicted to be close to an overall majority, so they could enlist the support of the Greens and/or a group of independents to form a govt. It's what FF did last time.

."[/I]

But then Donnelly says "The punitive 5.83% interest rate can and must be renegotiated: by people with real economic understanding and expertise who can deal with the IMF in their own language."
.

I have yet to see a poll that indicates that outcome but maybe i misssed something.

With regard to the second point. One thing is for sure Stephen, even if he is elected, will not be negotiating with the IMF or EU. That task will be left to the party leader of the dominant party. What needs to happen after the election is that party leaders informed understanding on how the "deal" can be renegotiated. Clearly the two Brians were completly out of their depth as was whoever was advising them. I have no doubt Stephen has a good knowledge of the issues involved but as in independet he wont get to put it to use.

Incidentally he is wrong in asserting that the government policies were supported by the opposition. Labour, he might recall voted against the bank bailout.

hamstervision · 10-02-2011 9:30am

mikedragon32 wrote: »

Fear not sir. Posters will come down today if the candidates to it. Tomorrow if they don't.

Stephen Donnelly responded to my email saying he'd get right on it and his posters were taken down yesterday. As of this morning, the Niall Byrne and generic FF posters were still up. Niall Byrne's have been up for over a week now and he hasn't responded to any emails (and his wife hung up the phone last time my wife tried to contact the number on his site). FF yesterday said they'd contact the local people responsible for it but as of yet nothing has happened.

mikedragon32 · 10-02-2011 2:09pm

Harris' "Obama-style" poster is gone of the roundabout too...

Maybe Byrne figures he hasn't a hope in hell anyway, so why bother?

I'll get onto the committee and see if they've taken any steps to remove the posters yet (remembering to remove the plastic straps also, of course!).

hamstervision · 10-02-2011 2:36pm

mikedragon32 wrote: »

Harris' "Obama-style" poster is gone of the roundabout too...

Ah, that was my favourite one, though it did confuse me. Why was Greystones in quotes? Was he saying "Greystones" and it just happened to be missing a speech bubble? Or does he want to be known as Simon "Greystones" Harris?

mikedragon32 · 10-02-2011 4:55pm

hamstervision wrote: »

Ah, that was my favourite one, though it did confuse me. Why was Greystones in quotes? Was he saying "Greystones" and it just happened to be missing a speech bubble? Or does he want to be known as Simon "Greystones" Harris?

Well that poster seems to be on the rountabout at the Mill Road now if you miss it!

Wasn't sure about the quotation marks either. Maybe it's that he represents *fingers waving and eye winking* "Greystones"?

At this stage, I'm starting to think I'll ask any candidates if they're cat people or dog people and vote accordingly. Seems as good a system as any other...

markymark21 · 10-02-2011 5:31pm

hamstervision wrote: »

I really liked Simon Harris's trick of dropping a "Sorry I missed you" note through the door even if you're at home. Saves him actually having to talk to people.

Its amazing the amount of Simon Harris posters in Bray and I haven't even seen him once.. and I live 3 minutes from the main street

I don't understand all the hype. I went to school with him and I think of him now as I did then. The guy is a kiss-arse who swans around making promises and ensuring every body is his friend. He has no back bone and if he gets elected he will be walked over by senior politicans

Ask him any economic or difficult questions and he will direct you to the Fine Gael website - I doubt he has even read the 'Five Point Plan'.

All he boosts about is his autism charity, no offense but its all a bit self-serving and doesn't effect the economy of wider-society one bit...unless you have autism

Mr Posh · 10-02-2011 7:34pm

Anyone seen any canvassers in Charlesland yet?

The Bishop Basher · 10-02-2011 7:51pm

tennisplayer wrote: »

Whats the problem with the posters, they will be down in a few weeks.
Is Charlesland a no go area for posters and candidates ?

+1

You're complaining about the posters and then whining about the lack of canvassers ??

Make up your minds.

Stephen D all the way for me but then I always vote independent in general elections. We need expertise, not amateurs or political acumen. Party politics is inherently flawed as it creates self interest over the common good.

As for Dick Roche running, well that's just farsical but then the same voters voted for the FF muppets time and again over the last couple of decades. Never underestimate the stupidity of voters out there.

loyatemu · 10-02-2011 10:22pm

I see Nicky Kelly has put himself forward as an Independent this time - he'll pull in a decent vote in the south of the county and hit Labours 1st preferences.

I wonder if someone will paint "Vote Nicky Kelly" on the wall above the Glenview (bit of nostalgia there for the old-timers).

Son of Jack · 10-02-2011 10:28pm

An inordinate amount of Harris bashing on this thread, which has become increasingly gratuitous.

markymark21 wrote: »

I don't understand all the hype. I went to school with him and I think of him now as I did then.The guy is a kiss-arse who swans around making promises and ensuring every body is his friend.

One would hope that when one leaves school you leave a schoolboy's way of thinking behind and develop fresh opinions and ways of expressing oneself.

markymark21 wrote: »

Its amazing the amount of Simon Harris posters in Bray and I haven't even seen him once.. and I live 3 minutes from the main street

The Wicklow constituency extends a great deal further than Bray Main Street.

Just because one individual hasn't seen him doesn't mean he hasn't been there!

markymark21 wrote: »

He has no back bone ...

Well I saw him on Florence Road last week. He was walking upright, so I assume he has a spine.

markymark21 wrote: »

and if he gets elected he will be walked over by senior politicans

In my opinion this is the only part of this post that could indeed hold water. This will be true of any new politician. Look at George Lee for example.

markymark21 wrote: »

I doubt he has even read the 'Five Point Plan'.

I think he most definitely has! Going up for election as a Fianna Gael candidate is the least you would do.

markymark21 wrote: »

All he boosts about is his autism charity, no offense but its all a bit self-serving and doesn't effect the economy of wider-society one bit...unless you have autism

Well I do take offence at a cheap shot taken at those who have autism which is why I have replied to this post.

As for 'charity'; that can be defined as 'a foundation created to promote the public good (not for assistance to any particular individuals)' so it is not self serving at all.

Edited to add: Oops just realised who you are. Small world time! Sure your Mum has a very high opinion of young Mr. Harris. She's always singing his praises. Perhaps that is what annoyed you.

As I said it was your crack about autism that annoyed me.

Maudi · 11-02-2011 12:05am

markymark21 wrote: »

Its amazing the amount of Simon Harris posters in Bray and I haven't even seen him once.. and I live 3 minutes from the main street

I don't understand all the hype. I went to school with him and I think of him now as I did then. The guy is a kiss-arse who swans around making promises and ensuring every body is his friend. He has no back bone and if he gets elected he will be walked over by senior politicans

Ask him any economic or difficult questions and he will direct you to the Fine Gael website - I doubt he has even read the 'Five Point Plan'.

All he boosts about is his autism charity, no offense but its all a bit self-serving and doesn't effect the economy of wider-society one bit...unless you have autism

i agree.he really comes across as smarmy and a bit pants,speaking of pants...governments are like underwear..they need to be changed often and for the same reason

Mr Posh · 11-02-2011 10:17am

IMO…………I simply do not believe Harris has the relevant work experience to represent me in the Dail; its clear to me that Harris will have no power in FG and will be stuck on the back benches as seems to be the FG way of toeing the party line with no opinion of his own. He appears to be is a career politician which is what we so desperately need to move away from.

Now I’m sure he is a nice lad but surely he would have been better served finishing his term as councillor and fulfilling his commitment to the people of Greystones and Wicklow who voted him a year and a half ago rather than downing tools and the first sign of seat in the Dail.

I’d rather be represented by someone who sits in opposition and has the ability and know how to ensure questions are being asked of the elected government.

Before anyone replies with the old chestnut about independents and opposition parties not having a say because they are not in power is one of the many things that needs to reformed. We need to reform the way the opposition benches operation by giving them access to resources to ensure they are doing there democratic duty of questioning the decisions that are being made.

Son of Jack · 11-02-2011 10:40am

A convincing argument, Mr. Posh. Point well made without resorting to personal remarks.

I have no axe to grind. I will be voting Labour.

I just object to the personal comments made on this thread about a young man who is obviously hardworking and idealistic and has stuck his head above the parapets.

Mr Posh · 11-02-2011 11:30am

Son of Jack wrote: »

A convincing argument, Mr. Posh. Point well made without resorting to personal remarks.

I have no axe to grind. I will be voting Labour.

I just object to the personal comments made on this thread about a young man who is obviously hardworking and idealistic and has stuck his head above the parapets.

Nothing wrong with an idealistic outlook in my mind, after all it was with idealistic eyes that the proclamation of independence was built.

Its just experience outside of politics that bothers me, I will also be voting Labour but will certainly have place for Donnelly.

Blandpebbles · 11-02-2011 7:20pm

Snake oil salesman great description of all of them.

Donnelly quote 'an unsustainable economy is unsustainable..' if you can't dazzle em with brilliance, baffle with BS.

As I said before pure consultant speak. He will have zero ability to influence if elected.

Saw the Sinn Fein announcement last night and they continue to impress, but Adams needs to go. Where is Brady, no sign of him canvassing here.

Simon Harris has his dad out canvassing for him, poor man having to hear how much his son is disliked.

Charlie Keddy, now there is a man of our time

Annasopra · 11-02-2011 7:55pm

Have you seen the videos about Jim Tallon?

luapenak · 13-02-2011 6:34pm

I can't believe I still haven't been canvassed yet. I'm still quite undecided so someone really should try canvass me, then again most of politicians are sure to trip up on the list of questions I have for them.

Greystones - Who do you want and why? [ELECTION 2011] All posts here.

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