Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2011-2012

Deise_2012 wrote: »

How did maurice shanahan and martin o neill play? Would love to know where they are going to find a place for noel connors in the backline, they've been absolutely brilliant so far

well , rather than a starting 15 a starting 20 should be normal nowadays , remember how important it was against cork in 2010 and we fielded 23 player to win the munster title .

In otherwords,tis no harm in having a few reserves we'll need them come championshiop

deiseach wrote: »

Dead right. We're always underdogs against Kilkenny and it's never done us any good!

I doubt its because what analysts say when we play against Kilkenny is the reason we lose!

Deleted User wrote: »

I think while its the best management possible that we could get for this job that they have a serious job on their hands all the same.
He has a squad of talented sticksmen no doubt but there seems to be no willingness to battle for the dirty ball unlike Waterford today. While the old management werent up to the job if im being honest i think they had a job on their hands given some of the personnel they have to deal with. The likes of Lar and Seamus Callinan etc are all terrific hurlers we know too well but its not worth squat if you are getting muscled off the ball with little fightback

Fair enough, can see where you are coming from. There was no shortage of fight from Tipp in 2010 & 2011, at least when you came up against Kilkenny. It was a pity Sheedy & O'Shea stepped down when they did, I think it seriously dented the momentum built up. Is there feeling within Tipp that, that momentum can be regained, or is it a case of a valuable year having being lost I wonder.

Never mind the highlights, you can feel like you were there by reading my match report, with evocative images like this one:



Um, probably best to hope for some highlights.

A marvellous and well-deserved victory for Waterford. I thought it was going to be another very frustrating experience, especially when Lar Corbett got clear possession on the right wing just after Waterford had equalised, but he underhit his shot into the wind and it dropped short to Iggy O’Regan.


On the balance of play, Waterford really should have been well clear at half time, despite playing into the stiff wind. Although the defence did very well in terms of gaining possession, they gifted Tipp several points through misplaced passes and poor clearances. Meanwhile at the other end several good chances were wasted through underhitting shots into the wind. I think Brian O’Halloran was guilty of this three times.


It may be that Waterford relaxed expecting the game to come to them with wind assistance in the second half, but Tipp really upped their work rate after the change of ends and dominated the third quarter. Like against Kilkenny last week, Waterford couldn’t win a ball in the half forward line, and really we need to vary our puckout tactics to adjust to situations like this. Also, Waterford kept sending shortish balls down the wings rather than trying a few long balls into the goalmouth. In fact, the first time they tried this Seamus Prendergast made a great catch, and Cathal McAllister was too quick to blow for a free after Pender put Brian O’Sullivan in with a clear goal chance.


However, when push came to shove, Waterford really took over in the last ten minutes, with Brick making some marvellous clearances and Jamie Nagle thundering into the game. In the closing minutes they dug out the ball in a series of schemozzles around midfield, again showing the fantastic fighting spirit which has characterised this team since the league began.


I thought our goose was cooked when Pauric Mahony missed those two frees in a row, and really they should try out Jake Dillon as we need more reliability here. However, the three points which won it for Waterford were out of the top drawer – first Jamie Barron from a difficult angle out on the right wing, then Jake Dillon off his left out on the left, and then Kevin Moran’s coup de grace. Full marks to Brian O’Sullivan for constantly harassing Brendan Cummins as he came out along the end line trying to clear. Eventually Cummins was forced to make a loose clearance which Moran snapped up out on the left sideline. He did really well to evade two markers without fouling the ball, and then fired a magnificent ball over the bar.


Iggy O’Regan got no shot to save, which is a great tribute to the defence, but he did send two puckouts out over the sideline in the first half. His puckouts were very predictable, high up into the air in the first half against the wind and while he got good length into them with the wind in the second half, they were still easily won by the Tipp half back line.
The full back line did really well after a dodgy enough opening few minutes. Seamus Callanan did get five points from play, but he got a good supply of ball in from out the field and no full back in the country can match his pace. Brick was magnificent at centre back but we were weak enough at wing back for most of the game, and this is where we need to step up if we are to get more scores up front. I thought that Jamie Nagle was poor for 60 minutes, making a lot of mistakes and using the ball poorly, although he did make a big contribution to the late fightback. I thought that Paudie Prendergast struggled a bit on the other side, and was surprised that Darragh Fives was not brought in here.


Once again,Shane O’Sullivan won a lot of ball in midfield, but took too much out of it at times and ran into trouble. Not everything went right for Kevin Moran, who started at midfield, but he kept at it and overall made a big contribution.


Brian O’Halloran played a lot of ball in the first half and scored two good points, but should have got more and faded out, with the rest of the half forward line, in the second half and was replaced by Darragh Fives. Seamus Pender as usual did a lot of hard work. Maurice Shanahan found it very hard to get possession, but the two good possessions he got in the first half led to the goal and a pointed free. He still needs a couple of games to recover full match fitness. He was replaced by Brian O’Sullivan midway through the second half.


Jamie Barron, apart from scoring 1-1, was very impressive with his work rate, ability to rob players in possession, and ability to look up under pressure and lay the ball off. Jake Dillon made his mark with two good points. While Martin O’Neill’s free-taking was impeccable, he made little impact in general play and was replaced in the final quarter by Pauric Mahony who used his strength to win a couple of vital 50/50 balls late on.. Waterford do need to figure out better ways of playing good ball into a forward line mostly made up of players of low stature.


The great thing about this team so far in the league is that, despite the relative inexperience of a lot of the players, they are playing a lot of good skillful and thoughtful hurling, while showing great collective fighting spirit. Today’s win, and the manner of it, were a great tonic.

Thanks...great report.

noiniho wrote: »

What to you mean the wrong way? a right handed hurler will have his right hand on top and catch the ball in his left hand, a left handed hurler will have his left hand on top and will catch the ball in his right, these are both the 'right way'

some unorthodox ways (or the wrong way) would be different variations of switching hands, like have the right hand on top of the hurley to catch the ball in your left, throwing up the ball and placing your left hand on top when striking (Gary Kirby, Richie Mullaly),

I dont think any of our current team hurl this way or I would not call any hurler on our team an unorthodox hurler, Paul Codd would have been another exampl of an unorthodox hurler.

Are you mixing up left handed hurlers and unorthodox hurlers?

I think the most common unorthodox style is to hold the hurl in the left hand, but to strike on the right. In doing so you get to catch with your right hand.

A lot of goalkeepers go with this style. Paul Codd and JJ Delaney are a couple of examples of outfield players who use it.

Definitely Walsh Park. 3.00 throw in.

kensutz wrote: »

In Walsh Park

I heard that the sod was in excellent condition yesterday. Fair play to the ground staff if this was the case - a lot of pitches up and down the country are closed after the recent weather.

When Peter Power was coaching in the schools he would get the players to put their hurleys in a pile and then would throw a hurley at each player to see which hand he used to catch it. This was his way of establishing which was the player's dominant hand. A player who caught/held the hurley in his right hand was a right-handed player and vice versa. He would then get players to play the ball on the side of the dominant hand i.e. right-handed players would play off their right side and vice-versa for left-handed players. I am told that Ken McGrath started off as a boy holding the hurley in the wrong hand i.e. he held the hurley in his left hand although he was naturally right-handed. A perceptive teacher is supposed to have corrected his style which can be difficult to do when a player gets older.

It seems to be the general view of coaches that playing off the non-dominant side leads to a lack of efficiency and speed of striking. Despite this, a lot of top left-handed players still play off their right side, including JJ Delaney and Padraig Maher. Kilkenny's Frank Cummins was one left-handed player who always played off his left side. Of course, most top players nowadays can play the ball off both sides.

Iggy O'Regan is unusual in holding the hurley in his right hand but playing off his left side. Kevin Moran is left-handed and prefers to play off that side (thankfully, in view of yesterday's superb winning point). This is also the case with Martin O'Neill. Pauric Mahony takes the frees off his right side although he seems to be more comfortable playing off his left in general play. Both Maurice Shanahan and Brian O'Halloran are left-handed players who prefer to play off their left side. Dan Shanahan was also a left-handed player who was very weak on this right side which made him easy to mark as he wasn't capable of doing much damage once you kept him on his right side. He was able to make up for this by ghosting unmarked into scoring positions.

Probably the best way to figure out a player's dominant hand is to watch which hand they use to carry the hurley when they are running without the ball.

Giveitfong wrote: »

When Peter Power was coaching in the schools he would get the players to put their hurleys in a pile and then would throw a hurley at each player to see which hand he used to catch it. This was his way of establishing which was the player's dominant hand. A player who caught/held the hurley in his right hand was a right-handed player and vice versa. He would then get players to play the ball on the side of the dominant hand i.e. right-handed players would play off their right side and vice-versa for left-handed players. I am told that Ken McGrath started off as a boy holding the hurley in the wrong hand i.e. he held the hurley in his left hand although he was naturally right-handed. A perceptive teacher is supposed to have corrected his style which can be difficult to do when a player gets older.

It seems to be the general view of coaches that playing off the non-dominant side leads to a lack of efficiency and speed of striking. Despite this, a lot of top left-handed players still play off their right side, including JJ Delaney and Padraig Maher. Kilkenny's Frank Cummins was one left-handed player who always played off his left side. Of course, most top players nowadays can play the ball off both sides.

Iggy O'Regan is unusual in holding the hurley in his right hand but playing off his left side. Kevin Moran is left-handed and prefers to play off that side (thankfully, in view of yesterday's superb winning point). This is also the case with Martin O'Neill. Pauric Mahony takes the frees off his right side although he seems to be more comfortable playing off his left in general play. Both Maurice Shanahan and Brian O'Halloran are left-handed players who prefer to play off their left side. Dan Shanahan was also a left-handed player who was very weak on this right side which made him easy to mark as he wasn't capable of doing much damage once you kept him on his right side. He was able to make up for this by ghosting unmarked into scoring positions.

Probably the best way to figure out a player's dominant hand is to watch which hand they use to carry the hurley when they are running without the ball.

In the case of a leftie, the impact would be softened,given from the day we are born everything from buttons on clothes to buttons on a microwave are designed for righties, indeed most lefties end up using a moue right handed too.

This gives rise to a situation where i am slightly better right handed at darts,play snooker lefty,box orthodox hurl left handed, and bat in softball left handed, while playing right handed outfield.

I cant speak for inter county hurling ,but lefties tend to be more adaptable, and likely are better in the right wing ,most likely making them an easier pick for a manager.

And would it be an advantage for a goalie? given that most players would hit it to their good side out of habit/ in line with a righthanders natural swing ?