Leaked IAAf report on doping

LuckyLloyd · 02-08-2015 10:05PM

walshb wrote: »

A complete non story. 1/3 athletes, suspicious tests. Give it a rest and get back to us when something actually happens.

The real non story is the idea that the lack of abnormal blood markers in the leaked samples "clear" Farrah and Bolt. But make no mistake sir, this leak is significant as a confirmation of what anyone not mired in naivety long suspected already.

Stop at nothing to win.

average_runner · 02-08-2015 10:15PM

Ceepo wrote: »

For me the the worst part of this story is that it was leaked from iaaf. And in there statement the they say they will do every thing to protect there privacy policy. Which on the face of it sounds fine but it's the same as what the cycling federation done in previous times. I'm not saying that all of these suspicious test should automatically be banned but there seems to be a lack of transparency that the iaaf need to take there head out if the sand and stand up and be counted.
Yes of course there is a drug problem in athletics but brushing it under the carpet is not the answer.

In there defense for hiding the issue some of the biggest sports have been hiding it for years with a perceived it's not a problem in our sport and getting away with it.
In a recent report Golf came out as the highest % of failed test per tested people and the media didn't or chose not to make to much of it. Last year the highest % was Rugby again there was nothing made of it in the media.
Sorry can't link the report at the moment but a quick search will find it.

Golf came third, it wasn't based on drugs but abusive substances, ie pain killers can be counted there.

The fact that people keep mentioning other sports, tells me people aren't willing to believe that athletics is filthy. This kind of hiding drug results has happened for years especially in the USA.

Wild Garlic · 02-08-2015 10:31PM

I'm probably missing something here so I'll apologise in advance, but at what point does a result of a doping test stop been suspicious and become positive.
Or is it simply a case of an abnormally high amount of a certain blood cell been present in a sample which may or may not be a result of the use of a banned substance?

jack presley · 02-08-2015 10:33PM

Wild Garlic wrote: »

I'm probably missing something here so I'll apologise in advance, but at what point does a result of a doping test stop been suspicious and become positive.
Or is it simply a case of an abnormally high amount of a certain blood cell been present in a sample which may or may not be a result of the use of a banned substance?

Apparently other things can trigger the high readings, e.g. pregnancy ad probably certain illnesses etc.

pconn062 · 02-08-2015 11:05PM

average_runner wrote: »

Golf came third, it wasn't based on drugs but abusive substances, ie pain killers can be counted there.

The fact that people keep mentioning other sports, tells me people aren't willing to believe that athletics is filthy. This kind of hiding drug results has happened for years especially in the USA.

Don't know how you came to that conclusion? The problem is that Joe Soap things athletics is filthy and that "sure they're all it!". But this is mainly because, compared to other sports, athletics actually has a pretty good system in place for catching dopers and spends more money on it that a lot of other sports, meaning that a lot of the time the dopers actually get caught! It not that people (like me) are denying that there is a doping issue in athletics, there clearly is. But you have all the keyboard warriors saying "athletics is filthy, rabble rabble" before turning on the football or rugby (or tennis, golf etc) and thinking those sports are clean as a whistle.

Ceepo · 03-08-2015 01:38AM

average_runner wrote: »

Golf came third, it wasn't based on drugs but abusive substances, ie pain killers can be counted there.

The fact that people keep mentioning other sports, tells me people aren't willing to believe that athletics is filthy. This kind of hiding drug results has happened for years especially in the USA.

Maybe you missed where i said there is a drug problem in athletics !!!

average_runner · 03-08-2015 07:33AM

pconn062 wrote: »

Don't know how you came to that conclusion? The problem is that Joe Soap things athletics is filthy and that "sure they're all it!". But this is mainly because, compared to other sports, athletics actually has a pretty good system in place for catching dopers and spends more money on it that a lot of other sports, meaning that a lot of the time the dopers actually get caught! It not that people (like me) are denying that there is a doping issue in athletics, there clearly is. But you have all the keyboard warriors saying "athletics is filthy, rabble rabble" before turning on the football or rugby (or tennis, golf etc) and thinking those sports are clean as a whistle.

Lets see, Chinese won a load of medals and it was well known they cheated, no medal given back to Sonia.

We have men in their 30's running 100m quicker than the bionic man could.

The Americans have hidden positive results from their trials for the Olympics numerous times.

We have Feck all testing in countries that are power houses in athletics, ie Jamaica and Kenya.

We then let all the drug cheats back in and so we show youngsters if you cheat u can earn millions.

And even better, drug cheats are allowed to become coaches
Forget about other sports, it's not the issue here.

pconn062 · 03-08-2015 08:25AM

average_runner wrote: »

Lets see, Chinese won a load of medals and it was well known they cheated, no medal given back to Sonia.

We have men in their 30's running 100m quicker than the bionic man could.

The Americans have hidden positive results from their trials for the Olympics numerous times.

We have Feck all testing in countries that are power houses in athletics, ie Jamaica and Kenya.

We then let all the drug cheats back in and so we show youngsters if you cheat u can earn millions.

And even better, drug cheats are allowed to become coaches
Forget about other sports, it's not the issue here.

I'm not sure what is the point of listing known drug offenses in athletics is? You seem to be missing my point, it's a good thing that we know about all these doping violations, it means that the system for catching cheats in athletics is working. Are you really naive enough to think that athletics is worse than other professional sports? So rather than bash athletics constantly, why not ask ourselves why do we not hear of big scandals like this in other sports, where unlike athletics, the rewards for doping are much greater in terms of monetary value?! The more I hear about drug offenses in athletics makes me sad for the genuinely clean athletes in the sport, but it also makes me glad that more cheats are being caught.

youngrun · 03-08-2015 08:36AM

ThisRegard wrote: »

Sure, let's pretend it never happened.

What happened ?

IAAF database was robbed and leaked to press, of course the establishment mouth of the British state the ST. Political pointscoring . Just in time to embarrass Chinese hosts of Beijing worlds, Russia as the bad guy in general, and of cours to aid Seb Coes IAAF presidency.

I have never read so many ifs, buts, and maybes and potentials re doping in an article as the Sunday Times yesterday , zero proof .
Analysis done by paid lackeys who should have picked up any doping issues in their day jobs .

youngrun · 03-08-2015 08:37AM

Wild Garlic wrote: »

I'm probably missing something here so I'll apologise in advance, but at what point does a result of a doping test stop been suspicious and become positive.
Or is it simply a case of an abnormally high amount of a certain blood cell been present in a sample which may or may not be a result of the use of a banned substance?

Its suspicious if the US or Brits dont win medals and the Russians and Chinese do.

Murph_D · 03-08-2015 09:16AM

Paid lackeys? Should the independent scientists who looked at the data have done the analysis for free?

Bottom line is that large proportion of medal-winning athletes from past decade have "unusual" blood values. None of this may be enough to put the finger on an individual athlete per se but it gives a big picture view that is very damning indeed.

ThisRegard · 03-08-2015 09:58AM

youngrun wrote: »

What happened ?

IAAF database was robbed and leaked to press, of course the establishment mouth of the British state the ST. Political pointscoring . Just in time to embarrass Chinese hosts of Beijing worlds, Russia as the bad guy in general, and of cours to aid Seb Coes IAAF presidency.

I have never read so many ifs, buts, and maybes and potentials re doping in an article as the Sunday Times yesterday , zero proof .
Analysis done by paid lackeys who should have picked up any doping issues in their day jobs .

Yes, it's all a conspiracy by a couple of "paid lackeys". Keep your head in the sand.

LuckyLloyd · 03-08-2015 11:35AM

I definitely believe there was a nationalistic bias to the presentation of the results. The finding shows that testing is hugely deficient, but it doesn't clear any individual athlete or national athletic program over any other. The attempts to purport it as such is nonsense.

average_runner · 03-08-2015 02:54PM

pconn062 wrote: »

I'm not sure what is the point of listing known drug offenses in athletics is? You seem to be missing my point, it's a good thing that we know about all these doping violations, it means that the system for catching cheats in athletics is working. Are you really naive enough to think that athletics is worse than other professional sports? So rather than bash athletics constantly, why not ask ourselves why do we not hear of big scandals like this in other sports, where unlike athletics, the rewards for doping are much greater in terms of monetary value?! The more I hear about drug offenses in athletics makes me sad for the genuinely clean athletes in the sport, but it also makes me glad that more cheats are being caught.

Did u read anything I typed. Chinese were never caught and the American results were wiped, so is that a good thing?

It's a good thing to have drug cheats as coaches?

Forget about other sports, lets sort out our own.
Cycling used to use that line about other sports, and we all know what happened there.

NIMAN · 03-08-2015 03:05PM

paddy no 11 wrote: »

Life time bans for doping its the only deterrent that will work

100% agree.

Look at Justin Gatlin, back at the top of the game earning big money after only being caught doping twice before.

How are clean runners meant to compete with that?

The_Kew_Tour · 03-08-2015 03:53PM

Listening to Newstalk this morning Gillick was on the program, and reading between the lines, he pretty much feels that one, if not more of the people who beat him in the 2009 World Final were taking something.

The_Kew_Tour · 03-08-2015 04:02PM

On topic, but its about Justin Gatlin. Good read on a man faster at the age of 33 then he was at 24

http://www.si.com/more-sports/2015/06/27/us-track-and-field-national-champions-justin-gatlin-tyson-gay

walshb · 03-08-2015 04:08PM

ThisRegard wrote: »

Sure, let's pretend it never happened.

Pretend what?

I turned on six one yesterday and this was actually the headline story. Holy fook, what are they actually telling us? That there is doping going on in sport? No way? Nonsense. There seems to be a group of people waiting ever so anxiously for something to actually happen, and they won't be happy until it does.

walshb · 03-08-2015 04:10PM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

The real non story is the idea that the lack of abnormal blood markers in the leaked samples "clear" Farrah and Bolt. But make no mistake sir, this leak is significant as a confirmation of what anyone not mired in naivety long suspected already.

Stop at nothing to win.

Who said Farrah and Bolt were clear? The report simply said that they are not under any suspicion? Who's naive? We all bloody know there are cheats in sport?

walshb · 03-08-2015 04:11PM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Listening to Newstalk this morning Gillick was on the program, and reading between the lines, he pretty much feels that one, if not more of the people who beat him in the 2009 World Final were taking something.

And how about the guys who finished behind him? Maybe they feel like he does.

walshb · 03-08-2015 04:12PM

average_runner wrote: »

Lets see, Chinese won a load of medals and it was well known they cheated, no medal given back to Sonia.

What? When did this happen?

The_Kew_Tour · 03-08-2015 04:18PM

walshb wrote: »

And how about the guys who finished behind him? Maybe they feel like he does.

Maybe they do, what's your point?

Chivito550 · 03-08-2015 04:24PM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Listening to Newstalk this morning Gillick was on the program, and reading between the lines, he pretty much feels that one, if not more of the people who beat him in the 2009 World Final were taking something.

Well we know that the winner of that race LaShawn Merritt tested positive not long after and was banned for 21 months.

walshb · 03-08-2015 04:26PM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Maybe they do, what's your point?

No real point, just an observation, BUT!

Sore bloody loser is my point.....

shels4ever · 03-08-2015 04:35PM

walshb wrote: »

No real point, just an observation, BUT!

Sore bloody loser is my point.....

It actually wasn't him bring it up, they asked if he lost out on a medal because of cheats and he basically said now, as the best he did at world level was 6th and it would need a lot of cheats. Didn't come across a sore loser at all.

The_Kew_Tour · 03-08-2015 04:37PM

walshb wrote: »

No real point, just an observation, BUT!

Sore bloody loser is my point.....

Just read the post above you there. The winner of that race was caught with Drugs.

If you were a Sportsman and you were clean and you were beaten by a man who took drugs, costing you a medal, costing you funding, costing you maybe extra cash from going to other events and marketing, would you really just accept it? I'm sure you would ya.

I'm not referring to Gillick here, I'm talking in general.

shels4ever · 03-08-2015 04:39PM

Chivito550 wrote: »

Well we know that the winner of that race LaShawn Merritt tested positive not long after and was banned for 21 months.

Ah you have to feel for him, he did have a small micky

Still one of the best excuses for a positive test.

The_Kew_Tour · 03-08-2015 04:39PM

Chivito550 wrote: »

Well we know that the winner of that race LaShawn Merritt tested positive not long after and was banned for 21 months.

Did not realise he was in that race. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

It's pity to see men and women on TV and you're thinking "wow, they are super" only to learn down the road they are cheats.

The_Kew_Tour · 03-08-2015 04:40PM

shels4ever wrote: »

Ah you have to feel for him, he did have a small micky

Still one of the best excuses for a positive test.

What's this about ??

Or am I missing a joke?

Chivito550 · 03-08-2015 04:42PM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

What's this about ??

Or am I missing a joke?

http://m.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/olympic-400m-dope-cheat-lashawn-merritt-blames-penis-growth-pill/story-e6frexni-1225940685359

Leaked IAAf report on doping

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