Clare GAA discussion thread

Clareman · 14-07-2015 11:09AM

Hibrasil wrote: »

Are we talking another Frank Murphy here

No, Frank Murphy was far more skilled in ensuring the best happened to Cork GAA, be it being able to get games replayed, sending offs overturned, big games to Cork, meant that Frank is far more powerful that our fella, I can't remember the last time we had a good performance in HQ, don't forget this is the same guy who was in charge in the 90s when there were some "strange" decisions against Clare that he did nothing about, this hasn't changed.

Hibrasil · 14-07-2015 11:26AM

Clareman wrote: »

No, Frank Murphy was far more skilled in ensuring the best happened to Cork GAA, be it being able to get games replayed, sending offs overturned, big games to Cork, meant that Frank is far more powerful that our fella, I can't remember the last time we had a good performance in HQ, don't forget this is the same guy who was in charge in the 90s when there were some "strange" decisions against Clare that he did nothing about, this hasn't changed.

Long serving dynasties are not good for any organisation - the more vibrant the organisation the more likely there will be blood on the floor at meetings (metaphorically speaking - not fisticuffs in any way) - Stepford wives syndrome (dutiful subservience etc..) on the part of county board committee members is what is responsible - nobody having the courage to speak out and tackle the issue - they are people who shoulder the blame for the ongoing debacle that is Clare Hurling. we should have won a lot more silverware with the wonderful talent that we had.

Clareman · 14-07-2015 11:46AM

I'm going to try to be as impartial as possible in reviewing Davy's performance for the past season, I'm also going to try to make it as much as a business review rather than a personality or sporting review.

Davy is the Clare Hurling Manager, as a Manager he is responsible to manage all aspects of the team from on-field performance to logistics, I would say this would be an extremely difficult task which takes a lot of skill, I don't think any 1 person could look after all aspects themselves and would need to a very strong back-room team to do a lot of the tasks.

Administration
Logistics - I didn't hear of any issues getting to matches or gear issues, so good performance here.
Financials - Again, I haven't heard of any issues with suppliers getting paid or players getting their expenses, so good performance here.

1 of the main tasks of any manager is to maintain relationships with the people reporting to them, the people they report to and also external stakeholders.
Relationships
County Board - I would say that this is a top notch performance and I would say that the "County Board Liaison" is very happy with the performance so good performance here.
Media - A number of run ins with local and national media mean that this would be down as a mixed performance, throw in an extremely poor personal performance with the national media drops this down to a bad performance. Bringing in a PR team show that the issue has been identified and that steps are being taken to fix the issue, this would be seen as a good thing for the future.
Other sports - Issues with players playing football mean this would be down as a bad performance.
Clubs - the previous year saw a bit spate with the clubs in Clare, this followed on to 2015 with no interaction between the management and the clubs, coupled with the majority of players of the County Champions electing not to play for him this year this would be down as a bad performance.

The main responsibility for the management would be on field results and comparison to direct competition.
Results
League - 1 victory and 5 losses resulted in relegation - bad performance
Munster Championship - beaten by a team who went on to be well beaten in their next outing - bad performance
All Ireland Series - victory over a poor team and loss to another team but this down as a bad performance

A number of key metrics should be looked at to see how the performance is against other teams, sometimes results can give a false sense of performance as you maybe unlucky to be up against exceptional performances by others.
Metrics
Defending - in the league Clare conceded the most amount of goals and the third highest amount of points, this would be a poor performance
Scoring - In the league again, Clare scored the joint second lowest amount of goals and the third lowest amount of points, overall they were third highest scores, this would be a mixed performance, 17 wides in the All Ireland qualifier against Cork was a very poor performance but as Cork had 20 wides this won't impact the mixed performance.
Discipline - In the championship they had 1 player sent off (down from 3 in the previous year), they conceded an extremely number of frees in their first championship game but this did not appear to be an issue in future games, normally this would be a good performance but as the sending off and frees conceded resulted in the loss of 1 game this is a mixed performance

Finally, the most important aspect of any managers role would be to manage their team and any issues that may crop up, as I don't have full insight into what happened with the team I can't comment on everything, but I will look at some of the higher profile issues that came up throughout the year and their impact.
Player Management
Podge Collins - former All Star was given an ultimatum of playing hurling or football, I would put this as a mixed performance as it removes a great performer from the mix but it is a managers decision on what he wants players to do.
Other Footballers - again, this was a decision he took, so mixed performance
Davy O'Halloran - fringe player that took to the papers to voice his issues with how he was being treated, for a player to take to the papers is a very poor reflection of the manager, couple this with the poor handling of the situation this would be seen as a poor performance.
Colm Galvin - player decided to go to the US, he still came back with the full backing of management, this situation was handled very well so this would be a good performance

By my count that's 17 criteria to rate him on, 4 Goods, 5 Mixed and 8 Bad/Poor, personally I wouldn't be looking forward to that annual appraisal.

Hibrasil · 14-07-2015 01:06PM

Clareman wrote: »

By my count that's 17 criteria to rate him on, 4 Goods, 5 Mixed and 8 Bad/Poor, personally I wouldn't be looking forward to that annual appraisal.

Dropping down a pay grade !!;)

letowski · 14-07-2015 01:51PM

The Clare team of the U21 match v Waterford is:

Hogan
Quirke Fitzgearld O'Brien
McGuane Cleary O'Gorman
Conroy Hehir
Duggan Gleeson Galvin
Ward Sod Ryan Taylor

Big ask really for the lads, this is a really strong Waterford team coming up. Some interesting selections, I thought Hayes Deasy and Shane Taylor might get in but overall its pretty much as strong a team the management have. Deasy omitted with Shanahan out leaves us a little light again. The big concern for me would be Sods and Duggans poor form atm.

Hopefully the lads in the full back line can have a good outing, I think Quirke and Fitzgearld are good lads. Id give us an outside chance, Maloney knows everything now about the grade so I think the lads will be in devent shape.

Best of luck to them, we need a lift!

Twiceasnice97 · 14-07-2015 02:02PM

the question is not whether any other manager could do better than the current incumbent.
Its whether any other manager could possibly do worse in the last two years

we are in 1b back where we started four years ago so now is the time for a new manager to come in and have a clean run at it.

Twiceasnice97 · 14-07-2015 02:04PM

marco_polo wrote: »

They were actually causing a few problems inside in the opening stages and winning plenty ball albeit without much reward, how McGrath and O'Donnell ended up so far out the field in the second half is baffling.

because that is the way we train day in day out all the time.

ast year we had the jack browne debacle the day we were knocked out this year we had conlon coming off and then going back on again, conor ryan wing forward, kelly full forward and o donnell cunningham mcgrath and reidy all playing in the middle of the field

Clareman · 14-07-2015 02:05PM

For me the question isn't about bringing through a bunch of under 21s and hoping to get them to win an All Ireland, it's about getting a team which won an All Ireland back there again. Comparing this bunch of players to past great underage teams isn't a valid comparison in my opinion, they have already proven they can win an All Ireland, now they have to do it again.

Clareman · 14-07-2015 02:08PM

Twiceasnice97 wrote: »

because that is the way we train day in day out all the time.

ast year we had the jack browne debacle the day we were knocked out this year we had conlon coming off and then going back on again, conor ryan wing forward, kelly full forward and o donnell cunningham mcgrath and reidy all playing in the middle of the field

Don't get me started on the whole "more or less told to take Conlon off", don't give me that sh1te Davy, no ref is going to warn a manager about a potential sending off of a player, they will either send them off or not, if it didn't come from the ref then it might have come from a linesman, they don't have any power over giving cards, it might have come from an umpire, then it was just their opinion, it might have come from the forth offical, which I doubt considering Davy couldn't get them to tell him how much time was left the last time they played in Semple Stadium.

Clareman · 14-07-2015 02:13PM

F**k it, I can't let it go, from this article I took out Davy's direct quotes

"We didn’t want to do it, but we were more or less told that if we didn’t do it, it would be happening very quickly and we might be down to 14 which is hard. He got a yellow early.”

“You have a fair idea what the story is. I don’t want to go into it. When you have to take off one of your ball winners it’s tough. He’s a massive ball winner, it’s disappointing. In fairness, we were getting the heads up on what was in his (Barry Kelly’s) head.

“We were advised of it. It isn’t something we would have wanted to do. Maybe it was a good tip off if that was what was in his head.

“It wasn’t that we wanted to take off John Conlon because he was playing bad. If that’s the way, that’s the way. We have no complaints about that.”

So he was being told that another human being was thinking, sorry but that's a load of bullsh!t, someone had an opinion and Davy acted on the information given to him, of course Conlon was in danger of being sent off, Davy had a few options, 1 take him off, 2 leave him on and 3 leave him on but warn him not to do anything that could get him booked, he took the first option now he's trying to make an excuse for it.

Between miwadi, solving drugs and now mind reading the guy is making us a laughing stock

tatoo · 14-07-2015 02:48PM

Clareman wrote: »

I'm going to try to be as impartial as possible in reviewing Davy's performance for the past season, I'm also going to try to make it as much as a business review rather than a personality or sporting review.

Davy is the Clare Hurling Manager, as a Manager he is responsible to manage all aspects of the team from on-field performance to logistics, I would say this would be an extremely difficult task which takes a lot of skill, I don't think any 1 person could look after all aspects themselves and would need to a very strong back-room team to do a lot of the tasks.

Administration
Logistics - I didn't hear of any issues getting to matches or gear issues, so good performance here.
Financials - Again, I haven't heard of any issues with suppliers getting paid or players getting their expenses, so good performance here.

1 of the main tasks of any manager is to maintain relationships with the people reporting to them, the people they report to and also external stakeholders.
Relationships
County Board - I would say that this is a top notch performance and I would say that the "County Board Liaison" is very happy with the performance so good performance here.
Media - A number of run ins with local and national media mean that this would be down as a mixed performance, throw in an extremely poor personal performance with the national media drops this down to a bad performance. Bringing in a PR team show that the issue has been identified and that steps are being taken to fix the issue, this would be seen as a good thing for the future.
Other sports - Issues with players playing football mean this would be down as a bad performance.
Clubs - the previous year saw a bit spate with the clubs in Clare, this followed on to 2015 with no interaction between the management and the clubs, coupled with the majority of players of the County Champions electing not to play for him this year this would be down as a bad performance.

The main responsibility for the management would be on field results and comparison to direct competition.
Results
League - 1 victory and 5 losses resulted in relegation - bad performance
Munster Championship - beaten by a team who went on to be well beaten in their next outing - bad performance
All Ireland Series - victory over a poor team and loss to another team but this down as a bad performance

A number of key metrics should be looked at to see how the performance is against other teams, sometimes results can give a false sense of performance as you maybe unlucky to be up against exceptional performances by others.
Metrics
Defending - in the league Clare conceded the most amount of goals and the third highest amount of points, this would be a poor performance
Scoring - In the league again, Clare scored the joint second lowest amount of goals and the third lowest amount of points, overall they were third highest scores, this would be a mixed performance, 17 wides in the All Ireland qualifier against Cork was a very poor performance but as Cork had 20 wides this won't impact the mixed performance.
Discipline - In the championship they had 1 player sent off (down from 3 in the previous year), they conceded an extremely number of frees in their first championship game but this did not appear to be an issue in future games, normally this would be a good performance but as the sending off and frees conceded resulted in the loss of 1 game this is a mixed performance

Finally, the most important aspect of any managers role would be to manage their team and any issues that may crop up, as I don't have full insight into what happened with the team I can't comment on everything, but I will look at some of the higher profile issues that came up throughout the year and their impact.
Player Management
Podge Collins - former All Star was given an ultimatum of playing hurling or football, I would put this as a mixed performance as it removes a great performer from the mix but it is a managers decision on what he wants players to do.
Other Footballers - again, this was a decision he took, so mixed performance
Davy O'Halloran - fringe player that took to the papers to voice his issues with how he was being treated, for a player to take to the papers is a very poor reflection of the manager, couple this with the poor handling of the situation this would be seen as a poor performance.
Colm Galvin - player decided to go to the US, he still came back with the full backing of management, this situation was handled very well so this would be a good performance

By my count that's 17 criteria to rate him on, 4 Goods, 5 Mixed and 8 Bad/Poor, personally I wouldn't be looking forward to that annual appraisal.

On the financial side we haven't heard of anyone not being paid, but has anyone found out how much money was raised in the Liam McCarthy tour of 2013 and what became of it ?

There seems to be no accountability required here either.

Clareman · 14-07-2015 03:02PM

tatoo wrote: »

On the financial side we haven't heard of anyone not being paid, but has anyone found out how much money was raised in the Liam McCarthy tour of 2013 and what became of it ?

There seems to be no accountability required here either.

I was trying to stick to this year. I don't think there is ever a hope of getting a full breakdown of the accounts of Clare GAA, don't get me wrong, there'll be a set of accounts presented and I'm sure they'll all be above board and pass all kinds of audits, but they won't be the only sets of accounts available.

keeponhurling · 14-07-2015 05:49PM

This is the first time I've thought this way since he was appointed, but I'd like to see a new manager get a chance.

For two years in a row we have underperformed, that's all.

thinkstoomuch1 · 14-07-2015 06:07PM

Clareman wrote: »

F**k it, I can't let it go, from this article I took out Davy's direct quotes

So he was being told that another human being was thinking, sorry but that's a load of bullsh!t, someone had an opinion and Davy acted on the information given to him, of course Conlon was in danger of being sent off, Davy had a few options, 1 take him off, 2 leave him on and 3 leave him on but warn him not to do anything that could get him booked, he took the first option now he's trying to make an excuse for it.

Between miwadi, solving drugs and now mind reading the guy is making us a laughing stock

I disagree on other points against him but I totally agree with you on this

What he said about the ref was totally wrong and it served no purpose but brought the attention back on him

I understand he's trying to create a siege mentality in clare like clare against the rest but it was totally wrong what he said here and then he said he couldn't say more about it so why say it in the ist place

thinkstoomuch1 · 14-07-2015 06:14PM

Clareman wrote: »

I'm going to try to be as impartial as possible in reviewing Davy's performance for the past season, I'm also going to try to make it as much as a business review rather than a personality or sporting review.

Davy is the Clare Hurling Manager, as a Manager he is responsible to manage all aspects of the team from on-field performance to logistics, I would say this would be an extremely difficult task which takes a lot of skill, I don't think any 1 person could look after all aspects themselves and would need to a very strong back-room team to do a lot of the tasks.

Administration
Logistics - I didn't hear of any issues getting to matches or gear issues, so good performance here.
Financials - Again, I haven't heard of any issues with suppliers getting paid or players getting their expenses, so good performance here.

1 of the main tasks of any manager is to maintain relationships with the people reporting to them, the people they report to and also external stakeholders.
Relationships
County Board - I would say that this is a top notch performance and I would say that the "County Board Liaison" is very happy with the performance so good performance here.
Media - A number of run ins with local and national media mean that this would be down as a mixed performance, throw in an extremely poor personal performance with the national media drops this down to a bad performance. Bringing in a PR team show that the issue has been identified and that steps are being taken to fix the issue, this would be seen as a good thing for the future.
Other sports - Issues with players playing football mean this would be down as a bad performance.
Clubs - the previous year saw a bit spate with the clubs in Clare, this followed on to 2015 with no interaction between the management and the clubs, coupled with the majority of players of the County Champions electing not to play for him this year this would be down as a bad performance.

The main responsibility for the management would be on field results and comparison to direct competition.
Results
League - 1 victory and 5 losses resulted in relegation - bad performance
Munster Championship - beaten by a team who went on to be well beaten in their next outing - bad performance
All Ireland Series - victory over a poor team and loss to another team but this down as a bad performance

A number of key metrics should be looked at to see how the performance is against other teams, sometimes results can give a false sense of performance as you maybe unlucky to be up against exceptional performances by others.
Metrics
Defending - in the league Clare conceded the most amount of goals and the third highest amount of points, this would be a poor performance
Scoring - In the league again, Clare scored the joint second lowest amount of goals and the third lowest amount of points, overall they were third highest scores, this would be a mixed performance, 17 wides in the All Ireland qualifier against Cork was a very poor performance but as Cork had 20 wides this won't impact the mixed performance.
Discipline - In the championship they had 1 player sent off (down from 3 in the previous year), they conceded an extremely number of frees in their first championship game but this did not appear to be an issue in future games, normally this would be a good performance but as the sending off and frees conceded resulted in the loss of 1 game this is a mixed performance

Finally, the most important aspect of any managers role would be to manage their team and any issues that may crop up, as I don't have full insight into what happened with the team I can't comment on everything, but I will look at some of the higher profile issues that came up throughout the year and their impact.
Player Management
Podge Collins - former All Star was given an ultimatum of playing hurling or football, I would put this as a mixed performance as it removes a great performer from the mix but it is a managers decision on what he wants players to do.
Other Footballers - again, this was a decision he took, so mixed performance
Davy O'Halloran - fringe player that took to the papers to voice his issues with how he was being treated, for a player to take to the papers is a very poor reflection of the manager, couple this with the poor handling of the situation this would be seen as a poor performance.
Colm Galvin - player decided to go to the US, he still came back with the full backing of management, this situation was handled very well so this would be a good performance

By my count that's 17 criteria to rate him on, 4 Goods, 5 Mixed and 8 Bad/Poor, personally I wouldn't be looking forward to that annual appraisal.

You make a good debate here and it's well presented and yes certain things regards he's management should be reviewed

However one thing I totally disagree with is the view regards dualism in davy or any manager was right to not allow it

I'm not just saying this to back davy here I was totally against dual codes in cork from the ist day last year and it was a disaster and Walsh said it could not be done and he's hurling improvement this year has been great

Le chin Wexford said it could not be done
Gavin wouldn't even entertaining the idea with Dublin and Kilkenny to do both

Just look at clare playing hurling and football so close together it wouldn't have worked

Cratloe proved and even Rochestown at school level in cork you can do it for a while but as the season goes on and the bigger games come it really can not be done in both codes

He was totally right like any manager to stamp it out imo and say choose one code

Figerty · 14-07-2015 08:01PM

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

You make a good debate here and it's well presented and yes certain things regards he's management should be reviewed

However one thing I totally disagree with is the view regards dualism in davy or any manager was right to not allow it

I'm not just saying this to back davy here I was totally against dual codes in cork from the ist day last year and it was a disaster and Walsh said it could not be done and he's hurling improvement this year has been great

Le chin Wexford said it could not be done
Gavin wouldn't even entertaining the idea with Dublin and Kilkenny to do both

Just look at clare playing hurling and football so close together it wouldn't have worked

Cratloe proved and even Rochestown at school level in cork you can do it for a while but as the season goes on and the bigger games come it really can not be done in both codes

He was totally right like any manager to stamp it out imo and say choose one code

Cratloe won a double Clare Championship! That's pretty much a history making exercise. If the Clare fixtures weren't such as screw up, then they could well have won one munster.
The reality is he has had himself declared king for two more years at least..that it poor work and it will come back to haunt him.

Davy is right to want the best from his team.. but his narrow minded methods cost him not one hurler but three...

The john Conlon fiasco is symptomatic of the midset of Davy..it's actually sad to hear him coming out with that nonsense...Next we will hear that he got it from the three priests....

Clareman · 14-07-2015 08:18PM

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

You make a good debate here and it's well presented and yes certain things regards he's management should be reviewed

However one thing I totally disagree with is the view regards dualism in davy or any manager was right to not allow it

I'm not just saying this to back davy here I was totally against dual codes in cork from the ist day last year and it was a disaster and Walsh said it could not be done and he's hurling improvement this year has been great

Le chin Wexford said it could not be done
Gavin wouldn't even entertaining the idea with Dublin and Kilkenny to do both

Just look at clare playing hurling and football so close together it wouldn't have worked

Cratloe proved and even Rochestown at school level in cork you can do it for a while but as the season goes on and the bigger games come it really can not be done in both codes

He was totally right like any manager to stamp it out imo and say choose one code

I put down the whole dualism as a mixed performance, it's the managers decision after all but I think it could have been dealt with a whole lot better. I really don't think any sports man can do dual sports, even in athletics people struggle to do 2 different events.

I do think that Cratloe would have won at least a Munster title in either grade if they were up for only 1 of them, being up for 2 caught up with them in the end, and I don't think it was the Clare fixtures that got them caught but the week after week in the Munster club.

Clareman · 14-07-2015 08:34PM

Actually, the more I think about things the more I think the biggest problem with Davy is that he doesn't make a decision and just stick to it, there always seems to be someone out to get him or an outside reason for something, if he came out and said "I don't think players can play 2 sports, I told the players this and explained that they are welcome to be part of the panel if they wanted but they decided to play football so best of luck to them, I'll be supporting them if I every go to see them play", that would have been the end of that. If he had said "We gave away too many frees and Limerick took their chances so best of luck to them, we'll work on our tackling" that would have been the end of that. If he had said "John had been booked and I thought he was running the risk of being booked again so I took him off, at the end I felt we needed his ball winning skills again so I brought him on taking the risk of the second booking" that would have been the end of that. If he had said "Davy knew the rules and went against them, in line with what we agreed with the players we dished out the discipline, Davy didn't like it but that's his decision, I don't want to talk about what happens within the squad so I won't be going further about it in the media, if Davy wants to call me at any time he knows my number" that's be the end of that.

Clareman · 14-07-2015 08:35PM

Clareman wrote: »

I put down the whole dualism as a mixed performance, it's the managers decision after all but I think it could have been dealt with a whole lot better. I really don't think any sports man can do dual sports, even in athletics people struggle to do 2 different events.

Oops, I read my post again and I was contradicting myself, at the end I was speaking about handling the players and in the middle I was talking about other sports in general, there was a massive "them and us" mentality in Clare about the hurlers and footballers which is why I went for a poor performance there.

LuckyGent88 · 14-07-2015 09:21PM

apparently confirmed tonight that Davy is staying on for last 2 years of contract

had a players meeting yesterday evening in roslevan so he must have the backing of the players anyway

Clareman · 14-07-2015 09:23PM

LuckyGent88 wrote: »

apparently confirmed tonight that Davy is staying on for last 2 years of contract had a players meeting yesterday evening in roslevan so he must have the backing of the players anyway

Can you imagine the meeting? "Right lads, I'm going to stay on unless ye don't want me to, so if any of ye don't want me to stay let me know now", be a brave player to do it, probably knows for definite that he'll never play for Davy again.

Also, players should just play not decide who the manager is, yes have players involved in the decision making but don't have them the decision makers, Davy himself tried to organise a players strike under Tony Considine and that didn't work out well for anyone.

Figerty · 14-07-2015 09:58PM

Clareman wrote: »

Can you imagine the meeting? "Right lads, I'm going to stay on unless ye don't want me to, so if any of ye don't want me to stay let me know now", be a brave player to do it, probably knows for definite that he'll never play for Davy again.

Also, players should just play not decide who the manager is, yes have players involved in the decision making but don't have them the decision makers, Davy himself tried to organise a players strike under Tony Considine and that didn't work out well for anyone.

That is the problem. This announcement is to put an dead end on any speculation. The problem with this is that he has stirred up more resentment towards himself.
The sad part of this is that Davy's heart is in the right place but his head isn't good enough for the job.

Clareman · 14-07-2015 10:01PM

Figerty wrote: »

That is the problem. This announcement is to put an dead end on any speculation. The problem with this is that he has stirred up more resentment towards himself.
The sad part of this is that Davy's heart is in the right place but his head isn't good enough for the job.

If Davy's heart was in the right place he'd be doing everything he could for Clare hurling, listen/read any of his interviews and make a note every time he mentions "I" or "Me", make no doubt about it, it's all about him.

Figerty · 14-07-2015 10:06PM

Clareman wrote: »

If Davy's heart was in the right place he'd be doing everything he could for Clare hurling, listen/read any of his interviews and make a note every time he mentions "I" or "Me", make no doubt about it, it's all about him.

Ya, you could be right there.

Twiceasnice97 · 14-07-2015 10:10PM

Clareman wrote: »

Actually, the more I think about things the more I think the biggest problem with Davy is that he doesn't make a decision and just stick to it,

if you think thats the biggest problem with his management then i hereby sack you as a performance reviewer

Twiceasnice97 · 14-07-2015 10:13PM

Clareman wrote: »

Can you imagine the meeting? "Right lads, I'm going to stay on unless ye don't want me to, so if any of ye don't want me to stay let me know now", be a brave player to do it, probably knows for definite that he'll never play for Davy again.

Also, players should just play not decide who the manager is, yes have players involved in the decision making but don't have them the decision makers, Davy himself tried to organise a players strike under Tony Considine and that didn't work out well for anyone.

think a bit deeper about that statement and the implications for clares hurling future with this group depending on how that works out.

soft men dont win munster championships and all irelands. if you cant speak your mind in a meeting you sure as hell wont stand up when the heat is on in the championship

thinkstoomuch1 · 14-07-2015 11:23PM

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/davy-fitzgerald-and-colm-collins-to-stay-with-clare-sides-for-2016-1.2284895

Is Kinnerk coming back

He's travelling and the talk was he would rejoin clare

thinkstoomuch1 · 14-07-2015 11:30PM

I think a review should of taken place and not the decision rushed through as this isn't going to go down well with he's critics

I think if Kinnerk came back I'd given him one year extension just one year with three targets
Division one promotional
All ireland finals least with panel available

Munster final at least

Also I'd tell him no more referee out burst no more media attention but closed shop and needs change the image and rain in he's style

On the basis Kinnerk and only that coming back and seems players behind him unless they speak out I'd given one year
But next year unless performance are upped he's gone

In that way fans may get behind him as they know there minimum standards acceptance

This was rushed way too early imo just three day after defeat

Hidalgo · 14-07-2015 11:47PM

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

You make a good debate here and it's well presented and yes certain things regards he's management should be reviewed

However one thing I totally disagree with is the view regards dualism in davy or any manager was right to not allow it

I'm not just saying this to back davy here I was totally against dual codes in cork from the ist day last year and it was a disaster and Walsh said it could not be done and he's hurling improvement this year has been great

Le chin Wexford said it could not be done
Gavin wouldn't even entertaining the idea with Dublin and Kilkenny to do both

Just look at clare playing hurling and football so close together it wouldn't have worked

Cratloe proved and even Rochestown at school level in cork you can do it for a while but as the season goes on and the bigger games come it really can not be done in both codes

He was totally right like any manager to stamp it out imo and say choose one code

For me the disappointing thing about the dual codes last summer was Davy hanging Podge out to dry after the defeat to Cork.
In his post match interview he stated that 'there's lads that think they can play both codes but they can't'. For me it was deflecting attention away from a poor performance and laying the blame at the door of one starter who played football.
There was an agreement in place all year but Davy felt the need to point out that football was the problem on live TV.

thinkstoomuch1 · 14-07-2015 11:50PM

Hidalgo wrote: »

For me the disappointing thing about the dual codes last summer was Davy hanging Podge out to dry after the defeat to Cork.
In his post match interview he stated that 'there's lads that think they can play both codes but they can't'. For me it was deflecting attention away from a poor performance and laying the blame at the door of one starter who played football.
There was an agreement in place all year but Davy felt the need to point out that football was the problem on live TV.

Fair enough it was done poorly

But the concepts of dualism won't work in the modern game

Clare GAA discussion thread

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