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PS4 sells 4.2 million units!

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    #122
    MiskyBoyy
    Registered Users Posts: 8,798 ✭✭✭MiskyBoyy


    gaynorvader wrote: »
    So what you are saying is that because you bought a game for a previous console, Sony should now have to pay to stream that game to you on your new console? I disagree, I think that's an entirely unreasonable request on your part.

    I think we're not going to get anywhere here. There's obviously 2 different opinions that aren't going to agree lol. I can see both opinions making some sense. Besides, this isn't even on topic. Should be in a general PS4 thread or a dedicated galkai thread.


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    #123
    gaynorvader
    Registered Users Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭gaynorvader


    DaLad wrote: »
    I think we're not going to get anywhere here. There's obviously 2 different opinions that aren't going to agree lol. I can see both opinions making some sense. Besides, this isn't even on topic. Should be in a general PS4 thread or a dedicated galkai thread.

    I can't see the logic in owning a game entitling you to streaming it too. I don't expect Netflix to allow me to stream a movie if I own the DVD.


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    #124
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,936 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    the groutch wrote: »
    the gap in sales will only widen, most of those who want an Xbone will have it at this stage, there's still massie demand for the ps4, especially those who are waiting for Watchdogs & DriveClub

    Have you got a time machine to prove this. The only thing certain about the videogame industry is how uncertain it is. The Megarive for over 2 years was an also ran until Sonic came out, the 3DS was supposedly a massive flop and is now the biggest selling console at the moment and the PSP managed to rise from it's grave in Japan with the release of Crisis Core and Monster Hunter. I also seem to remember a certain Playstation 3 tanking for nearly 2 years before outselling it's rival in the end. It's not over yet.
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    #125
    nesf
    Registered Users Posts: 27,645 ✭✭✭✭nesf


    DaLad wrote: »
    I think we're not going to get anywhere here. There's obviously 2 different opinions that aren't going to agree lol. I can see both opinions making some sense. Besides, this isn't even on topic. Should be in a general PS4 thread or a dedicated galkai thread.

    Eh, you paid for the right to stick that disc into a PS1 and play the game. You didn't purchase any future editions or ways to play the game. Otherwise we'd all be getting posted out carts/discs every time a game is re-released on a handheld or something.


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    #126
    joe123
    Registered Users Posts: 6,521 ✭✭✭joe123


    the groutch wrote: »
    the gap in sales will only widen, most of those who want an Xbone will have it at this stage, there's still massie demand for the ps4, especially those who are waiting for Watchdogs & DriveClub

    Thats rubbish to be honest. People will wait for a big game to be released before getting a next gen, wait for price drops, wait for games to stop coming out on last gen.

    I am fairly sure Il be getting an Xbox one but have no notion of buying one yet. Same goes for most people I know that are thinking of getting a next gen console. (whether it be ps4 or xbox one)


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    #127
    nesf
    Registered Users Posts: 27,645 ✭✭✭✭nesf


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    Have you got a time machine to prove this. The only thing certain about the videogame industry is how uncertain it is. The Megarive for over 2 years was an also ran until Sonic came out, the 3DS was supposedly a massive flop and is now the biggest selling console at the moment and the PSP managed to rise from it's grave in Japan with the release of Crisis Core and Monster Hunter. I also seem to remember a certain Playstation 3 tanking for nearly 2 years before outselling it's rival in the end. It's not over yet.

    Indeed. We haven't seen how people 1 or 2 years on will react when there is a fuller line up of titles and a price cut on the consoles or some cheap bundle or whatever. Quite a lot of people buy consoles on release but many are like me and won't touch them until the line up has strengthened and the price dropped a bit. Making trend predictions now is rather crazy. I mean, really, how many people ended up with every console from the last generation? I mostly play PC games but I had a Wii, Vita, DS, 3DS and XBox 360 by the end of it and only didn't get a PS3 because of a large unplayed PC library and the lack of any exclusive that made me think parting with a few hundred quid was a good idea. If I wasn't heavily into strategy games (a genre that exists almost solely on PC) I'd have almost certainly owned a PS3 as well.


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    #128
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,936 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    nesf wrote: »
    Eh, you paid for the right to stick that disc into a PS1 and play the game. You didn't purchase any future editions or ways to play the game.

    Technically you bought a license to use that software not just a disc. It would be nice if they would honour this but when does being nice trump making more money.
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    #129
    MiskyBoyy
    Registered Users Posts: 8,798 ✭✭✭MiskyBoyy


    Dedicated thread for this:PS Now - Playstation Streaming Service


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    #130
    noodler
    Registered Users Posts: 26,310 ✭✭✭✭noodler


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    Technically you bought a license to use that software not just a disc. It would be nice if they would honour this but when does being nice trump making more money.


    I actually thought of you and this point whilst reading through the thread!

    Its a good points, sometimes you are told you don't own the game - just he right to play it.

    Then when it suits, you are told that you only have the right to play it under certain circumstances!


    I hardly thought Sony would set up a huge operation like the Cloud and offer everyone free games now but still - an interesting point.


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    #131
    johnny_ultimate
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,198 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    It would be a nice benefit of the new service to give you access to the games you own, and if they want to endear themselves to customers they'd identify some way of doing so. But again we're not exactly entitled to it, as it's a completely new service. You weren't given free access to digital, Blu-Ray and streaming upgrades of your DVD or VHS collections, for example, and I don't think anyone expected to be. Companies will sometimes be kind to their loyal customers, but eventually it gets to the point when the generosity borders on a sort of commercial suicide. Also, rights issues grow extremely complicated in these situations: it's not just Sony you have to contend with, but also developers and publishers, who probably would have licensed their game for purchase under very specific circumstances. The contracts drawn up in the PS1 and PS2 era - and even the PS3 one - would not have even considered the possibility of technological advances such as this, and it would be one hell of a messy and pedantic legal discussion if it ever came to that!

    It might be wishful thinking, but I would like to see them identify a way of making your previous generation digital purchases available on PS4, though. There's a record of those purchases on my account, so it would be a shame to have to invest in further digital copies if and when the PS4 gains backwards emulation of some sort. And I'd hope future purchases will have way of accounting for the upcoming services.


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    #132
    CiDeRmAn
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 34,544 CMod ✭✭✭✭CiDeRmAn


    Thank you Retr0 for clarifying my point.
    Much appreciated.


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    #133
    Varik
    Registered Users Posts: 12,512 ✭✭✭✭Varik


    This thread was mostly pointless and really most of it would be better off in the Playstation 4 Or Xbox One? thread.

    To summaries
    • I don't believe Sony and these are shipped numbers
      They've said they're not shipped and are to customers and even if they weren't the PS4 is scarce so it's likely close even if they are shipped.
      well I still don't believe them because......
    • It's a marathon not a sprint
      And Sony will win the marathon for the following reasons......
      No MS will catch up like Sony did before and.......
      Competition is good .......


    Is there really anything more to be said about this.


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    #134
    CiDeRmAn
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 34,544 CMod ✭✭✭✭CiDeRmAn


    And perhaps a last point.

    They'll both ship massive numbers, the differences entirely accountable by the Xbox Ones unpopularity in Japan, and whichever one you buy you'll be happy.

    That suggestion seems to be ticking people off for some unknown reason.


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    #135
    RasTa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭RasTa


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    Technically you bought a license to use that software not just a disc. It would be nice if they would honour this but when does being nice trump making more money.

    This is wrong, doesn't equate to the fact you can't play it 10 years later on a new gaming device.

    Exact same as saying you should get Platoon on blue-ray for free because you bought it on VHS


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    #136
    2Mad2BeMad
    Registered Users Posts: 2,790 ✭✭✭2Mad2BeMad


    Varik wrote: »
    This thread was mostly pointless and really most of it would be better off in the Playstation 4 Or Xbox One? thread.

    To summaries
    • I don't believe Sony and these are shipped numbers
      They've said they're not shipped and are to customers and even if they weren't the PS4 is scarce so it's likely close even if they are shipped.
      well I still don't believe them because......
    • It's a marathon not a sprint
      And Sony will win the marathon for the following reasons......
      No MS will catch up like Sony did before and.......
      Competition is good .......


    Is there really anything more to be said about this.

    Its nice too have a debate everynow and again I suppose haha

    really though if everyone stuck too the main post regarding ps4 impressive sales then this thread should of been stuck in the ps4 section


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    #137
    Magill
    Registered Users Posts: 5,732 ✭✭✭Magill


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    Technically you bought a license to use that software not just a disc. It would be nice if they would honour this but when does being nice trump making more money.

    At the end of the day its a service you're paying for, it isn't the "game".. you RENT.. you don't own it. It would be like buying a game and then going to Xtra-vision and asking for a copy of a game for free because you bought a copy and should have rights to the software !

    Honestly why are people even complaining about this, if you have the game already just go play the copy you have ! Stop being so greedy trying to hog up all the damn bandwidth.


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    #138
    Otacon
    Registered Users Posts: 6,721 ✭✭✭Otacon


    I think discussion of the sales numbers should revolve around the fact that, despite the relative doom and gloom surrounding the specs (in comparison to PCs), launch titles (no clear must-haves) and added competition from Android consoles and the upcoming Steam boxes, the PS4 and XBO have sold more than 7 million units in about 6 weeks.

    That is simply massive.


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    #139
    Magill
    Registered Users Posts: 5,732 ✭✭✭Magill


    Yeah, its really good for gaming in general. Hopefully the wii u can pick up sales this year too.


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    #140
    Varik
    Registered Users Posts: 12,512 ✭✭✭✭Varik


    Otacon wrote: »
    I think discussion of the sales numbers should revolve around the fact that, despite the relative doom and gloom surrounding the specs (in comparison to PCs), launch titles (no clear must-haves) and added competition from Android consoles and the upcoming Steam boxes, the PS4 and XBO have sold more than 7 million units in about 6 weeks.

    That is simply massive.

    The none portable Android consoles aren't a threat to either the ONE or PS4, the OUYA or any of it ilk isn't even worth the relatively low price.

    No one is going to chose a steam box over a console, they'll either buy one in addition to the main gaming PC or instead of one.


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    #141
    CiDeRmAn
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 34,544 CMod ✭✭✭✭CiDeRmAn


    RasTa wrote: »
    This is wrong, doesn't equate to the fact you can't play it 10 years later on a new gaming device.

    Exact same as saying you should get Platoon on blue-ray for free because you bought it on VHS

    If a company is adding value, as I've stated before, be it a HD remaster, online coop, enhanced controls, 3D, then I've no quibble with spending money on the game, I'm getting something new, despite it being a game I've played and owned.
    But if all they are doing is streaming the same content, unenhanced from a remote location, I don't see why I shouldn't be able to access this content when I've already paid for it.
    The same suggestion arose when the PSP was released and they reported PS games were going to playable, I seem to remember initially there was going to be a way to play the games you already owned without more outlay but Sony backtracked.
    Look the point is made, folk agree/disagree, it isn't a deal breaker in terms of console ownership so can we move on.


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    #142
    gaynorvader
    Registered Users Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭gaynorvader


    CiDeRmAn wrote: »
    If a company is adding value, as I've stated before, be it a HD remaster, online coop, enhanced controls, 3D, then I've no quibble with spending money on the game, I'm getting something new, despite it being a game I've played and owned.
    But if all they are doing is streaming the same content, unenhanced from a remote location, I don't see why I shouldn't be able to access this content when I've already paid for it.
    The same suggestion arose when the PSP was released and they reported PS games were going to playable, I seem to remember initially there was going to be a way to play the games you already owned without more outlay but Sony backtracked.
    Look the point is made, folk agree/disagree, it isn't a deal breaker in terms of console ownership so can we move on.

    Who should pay for renting the servers and the bandwidth then in your opinion?


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    #143
    Magill
    Registered Users Posts: 5,732 ✭✭✭Magill


    CiDeRmAn wrote: »
    If a company is adding value, as I've stated before, be it a HD remaster, online coop, enhanced controls, 3D, then I've no quibble with spending money on the game, I'm getting something new, despite it being a game I've played and owned.
    But if all they are doing is streaming the same content, unenhanced from a remote location, I don't see why I shouldn't be able to access this content when I've already paid for it.
    The same suggestion arose when the PSP was released and they reported PS games were going to playable, I seem to remember initially there was going to be a way to play the games you already owned without more outlay but Sony backtracked.
    Look the point is made, folk agree/disagree, it isn't a deal breaker in terms of console ownership so can we move on.

    But that isn't really Sony decision anyway ? They don't own the rights to most of the games or am I missing something ? Are they expected to pay the publishers for the right to use their game only to let people that bought the game 10 years use their network and system for free. Bare in mind Gaikai cost Sony near $400m and probably a lot more on R&D and improvements on the infrastructure after they bought it.

    You seem keep ignoring all the decent counterpoints to your argument.

    At the end of the day, i can't really see anyone renting old games anyway.. i'd imagine most people that play them will do so through the subscription service they have (Providing it's not super expensive).


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    #144
    richymcdermott
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,447 ✭✭✭richymcdermott


    So I was told today in galway from all retailers who are likely to sell a ps4 thats its booked out till may/june and even people who booked their consoles before christmas alot of them still dont have their consoles :(


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    #145
    RasTa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭RasTa


    CiDeRmAn wrote: »
    But if all they are doing is streaming the same content, unenhanced from a remote location, I don't see why I shouldn't be able to access this content when I've already paid for it.

    You can access it, just fire up your old console.

    The fact that you want it for free is laughable

    I don't even have my old PS1+2 games anymore how are Sony going to figure out who purchased these games?


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    #146
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,936 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    RasTa wrote: »
    I don't even have my old PS1+2 games anymore how are Sony going to figure out who purchased these games?

    You give up your rights to the license when you sell it on.

    As Magill pointed out you have a license to play these games, but that isn't what you are paying for with online purchases or streaming services. Their licenses say you are renting a service from them. Some one has to pay for the bandwidth and servers as well. If you look at the licensing agreement with steam you'll find out you technically don't own any of the games you bought or even have a license to use them like with traditional software.

    Also you can't equate movie and software copyright law, they are totally different.
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    #147
    aN.Droid
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,911 ✭✭✭aN.Droid


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    Technically you bought a license to use that software not just a disc. It would be nice if they would honour this but when does being nice trump making more money.

    You bought a license to use the software on the medium it was published for. Otherwise buying a ps3 version would entitle you to an xbox version and pc version of the software.

    You still have your license to play on ps3, ps2 and ps1. Sony aren't taking it away from anyone.

    They have to pay for servers, bandwidth, technicians, license fee's themselves etc.


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    #148
    Eamo71
    Registered Users Posts: 644 ✭✭✭Eamo71


    Is it true there's no streaming on PS4? That's a big thumbs down for me. I'll be holding onto the 3 for the time being.


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    #149
    Magill
    Registered Users Posts: 5,732 ✭✭✭Magill


    Eamo71 wrote: »
    Is it true there's no streaming on PS4? That's a big thumbs down for me. I'll be holding onto the 3 for the time being.

    what sort of streaming ? Like streaming your own gameplay ? Or netflix and stuff ?

    I think it has both tho.


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    #150
    RasTa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭RasTa


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    You give up your rights to the license when you sell it on.

    I never sold them on


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    #151
    RasTa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭RasTa


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikQRKA-FF_4


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