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If you are pregnant , don't bother with MY school

12467…18

Comments

  • #152
    eviltwin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    noddyone2 wrote: »
    'Lucky' not to get pregnant? Since when does 'luck' come into it? Contraception is widely available. Bad parenting maybe?

    Lots of people screw up and take chances, sometimes they get lucky and dodge a bullet.


  • #153
    It wasn't me!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    Putting herself about? Who's to say she didn't have sex within a long term relationship? Jesus, lots of pretty crude assumptions being thrown around here.


  • #154
    Biggins
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 34,567 ✭✭✭✭Biggins


    Old Tom wrote: »
    Ah, "we all"... I see you are a Voice Of the Community now father ...

    Ok, I'm gonna make myself a cup of coffee, have a nice day sir.

    Your funny. I like you! :D

    I do ...seriously! Please return soon. :D
    You make me smile and laugh. :D


  • #155
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    micropig wrote: »
    ash23 wrote: »


    I'm fairly sure they are annoyed because a young girl was treated really badly.


    Yes it's the states fault, It's the schools fault, it's societies fault..


    everyones fault but the mother and her daughter



    She was enrolled in another school before giving birth - the state was providing her education


    This is just a hissy fit she is throwing because she didn't get to go to the school she wanted,

    Tough Sh1T


    No it's actually just the schools fault. The school manager to be specific.
    Her choices shouldn't be lesser than that of a girl who didn't get pregnant. That's discrimination and if my child were discriminated against you can be damn right I'd complain.


  • #156
    micropig
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,366 ✭✭✭micropig


    noddyone2 wrote: »
    'Lucky' not to get pregnant? Since when does 'luck' come into it? Contraception is widely available. Bad parenting maybe?

    Not Irish style contraception;)


    and then we all have to act shocked and surprised when the 'accident' results in a child:rolleyes:


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  • #157
    Aspen Scruffy Rim
    Posts: 0 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Aspen Scruffy Rim


    noddyone2 wrote: »
    Since when does 'luck' come into it? Contraception is widely available.

    And contraception is 100% effective and never ever ever fails under any circumstances ever


  • #158
    branbee
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 179 ✭✭branbee


    noddyone2 wrote: »
    eviltwin wrote: »
    pmsl at this

    The "sin" is in having sex...most kids who have sex - and adults for that matter - will be lucky enough not to get pregnant. Sadly for the ones who do - the girls that is - they wear their "sin" in public which makes it easier for people like you to think they are slappers.
    'Lucky' not to get pregnant? Since when does 'luck' come into it? Contraception is widely available. Bad parenting maybe?

    Coz contraception is 100% effective every single time a couple have sex is it?


  • #159
    micropig
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,366 ✭✭✭micropig


    ash23 wrote: »
    No it's actually just the schools fault. The school manager to be specific.
    Her choices shouldn't be lesser than that of a girl who didn't get pregnant. That's discrimination and if my child were discriminated against you can be damn right I'd complain.

    She had a place in another school, the state was providing her with an education, just not in the same school as her friends


  • #160
    kylith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    Old Tom wrote: »
    They don't like it - they don't take her. It's freedom and democracy.
    Whoever likes taking single mothers - open your own school and go ahead.
    How about schools being paid for by the public don't discriminate against the public, and anyone who wants to set their own draconian entry criteria open their own school, paid for out of their own pocket?

    A couple of girls in my year got pregnant, and were encouraged to finish their education. They were very open about how hard it was to look after a baby and how stressed they were. Nothing was glamourised, no-one thought it'd be a great idea to get knocked up, and everyone lauded their commitment to education.


  • #161
    micropig
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,366 ✭✭✭micropig


    bluewolf wrote: »
    And contraception is 100% effective and never ever ever fails under any circumstances ever


    Not as many times as Irish people like to make out
    branbee wrote: »
    Coz contraception is 100% effective every single time a couple have sex is it?

    It is possible to use more than 1 form of contraception...


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  • #162
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    micropig wrote: »
    She had a place in another school, the state was providing her with an education, just not in the same school as her friends

    The issue is that she was discriminated against. She was offered a place and then it was withdrawn because she was pregnant.
    She was offered another place a year later and it was withdrawn when they realised she had a child.
    She was discriminated against by the school, firstly for being pregnant, then for her marital status.

    The ombudsman has found she was discriminated against. Discrimination is never acceptable.


  • #163
    Min
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,550 ✭✭✭Min


    It wasn't me! wrote: »
    Putting herself about? Who's to say she didn't have sex within a long term relationship? Jesus, lots of pretty crude assumptions being thrown around here.

    Well to have sex at that age means she put herself about, she was not required to have sex, I presume and hope she was not raped, so she did it of her own volition.


  • #164
    MagicMarker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    micropig wrote: »
    It is possible to use more than 1 form of contraception...

    You can use as many as you like, it's never going to be 100% effective.


  • #165
    St.Spodo
    Registered Users Posts: 1,027 ✭✭✭St.Spodo


    Min wrote: »
    To forgive one has to be sorry for the wrong they did.

    Was this schoolgirl sorry she has loose morals while wanting to enter a lay Catholic school which has different morals?
    If the school girl was sorry for her actions, then the school should have taken her in, if not then the problem is not the school's.

    From a catholic point of view, fair enough. I'm not going to address the issue of catholic ethos in schools and it is there prerogative to allow in whomever they like. That said, a teenager having sex doesn't mean he or she has loose morals.


  • #166
    eviltwin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    micropig wrote: »
    She had a place in another school, the state was providing her with an education, just not in the same school as her friends

    Do you think people who experience discrimination should just suck it up and get over it? Or should they shine a light onto it so we can all see just what kind of crap some people have to deal with?


  • #167
    It wasn't me!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    Min wrote: »
    Well to have sex at that age means she put herself about, she was not required to have sex, I presume and hope she was not raped, so she did it of her own volition.

    "putting herself about" implies she was promiscuous, when this may very well not be the case. She'll never be "required" to have sex, but it happens, at a variety of ages, and the consequences should never include ostracism or discrimination.


  • #168
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    Min wrote: »
    Well to have sex at that age means she put herself about, she was not required to have sex, I presume and hope she was not raped, so she did it of her own volition.

    I didn't read any information about the conception or her sex life in that report. Please direct me to the link where it states that she "put herself about".

    How many girls were shunned for being sluts when they were actually being raped by their fathers, brothers, teachers, local priests etc? Shoved in workhouses and outcast from society based on assumptions about their sex lives and promiscuity.

    Sad to see that people would happily go back to those days.


  • #169
    omck80
    Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭omck80


    micropig wrote: »
    Not Irish style contraception;)


    and then we all have to act shocked and surprised when the 'accident' results in a child:rolleyes:

    Not all contraception is 100% effective. Nobody here know's the full facts of the pregnancy. I think she should be allowed finish her education to make a better life for her and her child which is what I did while working too with NO social welfare payments just good support from a good family which she seem's to have too. Not all of us single mothers are in it for a "free house and welfare payments".


  • #170
    eviltwin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    Sad to see that in an age where we are supposed to accept that sex is a two way thing the burden of blame still falls on the woman.


  • #171
    Cherrycola
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,378 ✭✭✭Cherrycola


    I wonder if the boy who knocked her up(assuming he was also a student) was refused entry from any catholic schools due to the fact he was about to become a single parent?! :rolleyes:


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  • #172
    Old Tom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 237 ✭✭Old Tom


    Biggins wrote: »
    Your funny. I like you! :D

    I do ...seriously! Please return soon. :D
    You make me smile and laugh. :D
    Ah no worries, just drop me a PM whenever you need me...


  • #173
    Biggins
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 34,567 ✭✭✭✭Biggins


    Old Tom wrote: »
    Ah no worries, just drop me a PM whenever you need me...

    :pac:

    Roger that! :D


  • #174
    noddyone2
    Registered Users Posts: 313 ✭✭noddyone2


    Cherrycola wrote: »
    I wonder if the boy who knocked her up(assuming he was also a student) was refused entry from any catholic schools due to the fact he was about to become a single parent?! :rolleyes:
    He got to bone her, got away with it. What's new?


  • #175
    micropig
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,366 ✭✭✭micropig


    omck80 wrote: »
    Not all contraception is 100% effective. Nobody here know's the full facts of the pregnancy. I think she should be allowed finish her education to make a better life for her and her child which is what I did while working too with NO social welfare payments just good support from a good family which she seem's to have too. Not all of us single mothers are in it for a "free house and welfare payments".

    Our children are under educated about the proper use of education and consequences.


    She wanted to go to a school, owned and run by a private individual, she was refused


    The state was providing her an education in another school.


  • #176
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    micropig wrote: »
    She wanted to go to a school, owned and run by a private individual, she was refused


    ..............because of her marital status and family status which is against the law. No brainer really.


  • #177
    eviltwin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    micropig wrote: »
    Our children are under educated about the proper use of education and consequences.


    She wanted to go to a school, owned and run by a private individual, she was refused


    The state was providing her an education in another school.

    Yes by all accounts she is happy and doing well in the new school but that is hardly the point is it? Should we just turn a blind eye to discrimination now?


  • #178
    Min
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,550 ✭✭✭Min


    Cherrycola wrote: »
    I wonder if the boy who knocked her up(assuming he was also a student) was refused entry from any catholic schools due to the fact he was about to become a single parent?! :rolleyes:

    We can hope so, we need equality for all.


  • #179
    Min
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,550 ✭✭✭Min


    eviltwin wrote: »
    Yes by all accounts she is happy and doing well in the new school but that is hardly the point is it? Should we just turn a blind eye to discrimination now?

    Surely schools should be allowed to set higher standards for it's students if the school so wishes.


  • #180
    micropig
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,366 ✭✭✭micropig


    eviltwin wrote: »
    Yes by all accounts she is happy and doing well in the new school but that is hardly the point is it? Should we just turn a blind eye to discrimination now?

    Maybe the school, got the reports from the other schools she attended and we're not impressed?

    The state did not refuse her an education, in fact they went out of their way by providing a home tutor


    Why doesn't her mother start her own school for single parents if she's so concerned?


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  • #181
    It wasn't me!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    Min wrote: »
    Surely schools should be allowed to set higher standards for it's students if the school so wishes.

    Provided they're not discriminatory, perhaps. If it were on the grounds of academic achievement it'd be different. This is a case of not wanting "her sort" around the place, and that's wrong.


  • #182
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    micropig wrote: »
    Maybe the school, got the reports from the other schools she attended and we're not impressed?

    The state did not refuse her an education, in fact they went out of their way by providing a home tutor


    Why doesn't her mother start her own school for single parents if she's so concerned?


    Nobody said the state denied her an education. Just that she was discriminated against. The school manager specifically stated her pregnancy and child were the reasons he didn't want her in the school.
    Did you read the report at all like?

    Yes, lets all start up our own schools :rolleyes:

    Apparantly teaching is very easy and requires no sort of experience, education or training. You heard it here first folks!


  • #183
    eviltwin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    micropig wrote: »
    Maybe the school, got the reports from the other schools she attended and we're not impressed?

    The state did not refuse her an education, in fact they went out of their way by providing a home tutor


    Why doesn't her mother start her own school for single parents if she's so concerned?


    Plenty of teens have babies, have done for donkey's years, this is the first time I have heard of a school saying no on that basis, I think Emily Logan said it was the first complaint of that nature they had too.

    If other schools can accept people with kids why not this school? She is not looking for anything other than an education, no demands for time off or a creche on site etc

    As for setting up her own school...my god your ignorance is something else..do you really want a form of educational segregation? Hasn't that line of thinking caused enough trouble?


  • #184
    dvpower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    St.Spodo wrote: »
    From a catholic point of view, fair enough. I'm not going to address the issue of catholic ethos in schools and it is there prerogative to allow in whomever they like. That said, a teenager having sex doesn't mean he or she has loose morals.
    From a catholic point of view, she is a fornicator, and so long as we allow the RCC to discriminate based on their ethos, they will be allowed to exclude fornicators.


  • #185
    eviltwin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    dvpower wrote: »
    From a catholic point of view, she is a fornicator, and so long as we allow the RCC to discriminate based on their ethos, they will be allowed to exclude fornicators.

    If the Catholic church does not deny access to people who have sex outside marriage what makes a school thinks they can?


  • #186
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    dvpower wrote: »
    From a catholic point of view, she is a fornicator, and so long as we allow the RCC to discriminate based on their ethos, they will be allowed to exclude fornicators.


    Half the school will be excluded so. Hymen testing for all! :p


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  • #187
    Min
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,550 ✭✭✭Min


    It wasn't me! wrote: »
    Provided they're not discriminatory, perhaps. If it were on the grounds of academic achievement it'd be different. This is a case of not wanting "her sort" around the place, and that's wrong.

    She should have tried to enter an all boys school and cry discrimination.

    This school simply doesn't teach parents or pregnant girls.


  • #188
    Biggins
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 34,567 ✭✭✭✭Biggins


    dvpower wrote: »
    From a catholic point of view, she is a fornicator, and so long as we allow the RCC to discriminate based on their ethos, they will be allowed to exclude fornicators.

    You do know that many a time, even in the present day, people that have fornicated previously ...have then gone on to become priests too?
    If they are good enough to be allowed join the main org', surely a single person can get over himself and his daftness, and not discriminate against a young school girl?


  • #189
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    Min wrote: »
    She should have tried to enter an all boys school and cry discrimination.

    This school simply doesn't teach parents or pregnant girls.

    Exemption has been made around sex and is specifically mentioned in the report. The ombudsman has found that pregnancy and being a parent is not a good enough reason for exclusion.
    End of. Decision made.


  • #190
    It wasn't me!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    And in 1913 black South Africans couldn't buy land in white areas. That was wrong too.


  • #191
    omck80
    Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭omck80


    micropig wrote: »
    Our children are under educated about the proper use of education and consequences.


    She wanted to go to a school, owned and run by a private individual, she was refused


    The state was providing her an education in another school.

    I still think it's wrong that she was accepted twice then refused entry. Why was she accepted the second time round when the school manager knew she had a baby because she was pregnant when he last dealt with her. I'm not saying that she has to go to that school to finish her education but people need to cop on. She is a child and if my child was treated like that I would complain too. I think some people need to change their attitude in this day and age and I hope to God they never have a child that may get pregnant and become a single parent.


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  • #192
    micropig
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,366 ✭✭✭micropig


    eviltwin wrote: »

    As for setting up her own school...my god your ignorance is something else..do you really want a form of educational segregation? Hasn't that line of thinking caused enough trouble?


    Plenty of countries have schools for young mothers. The students can bring the baby in to school with them, learn about sex, life and having respect for their bodies..things which their parents at home failed to teach them, and no they are not laundry's



    Although with the high rate of teen pregnancies in Ireland, maybe we should look at setting up schools for those that aren't pregnant;)


  • #193
    Min
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,550 ✭✭✭Min


    ash23 wrote: »
    Exemption has been made around sex and is specifically mentioned in the report. The ombudsman has found that pregnancy and being a parent is not a good enough reason for exclusion.
    End of. Decision made.


    So who made up these exemptions?

    Who decided who is exempt and who isn't?


  • #194
    eviltwin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    micropig wrote: »
    Plenty of countries have schools for young mothers. The students can bring the baby in to school with them, learn about sex, life and having respect for their bodies..things which their parents at home failed to teach them, and no they are not laundry's



    Although with the high rate of teen pregnancies in Ireland, maybe we should look at setting up schools for those that aren't pregnant;)


    So you think its okay to lump these girls away like they are dirty or shameful? It might not be a laundry but its the same idea.

    Out of interest does your place of work refuse admission to people who are single parents?


  • #195
    dvpower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    eviltwin wrote: »
    If the Catholic church does not deny access to people who have sex outside marriage what makes a school thinks they can?
    I presume that the Catholic Church do deny access to the sacraments to people who have sex outside of marriage and who haven't repented (where they know about it).


  • #196
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    Min wrote: »
    So who made up these exemptions?

    Who decided who is exempt and who isn't?

    Read the report.
    It clearly outlines the basis on which it is acceptable to exclude people from a school and also explains why.


  • #197
    Min
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,550 ✭✭✭Min


    ash23 wrote: »
    Read the report.
    It clearly outlines the basis on which it is acceptable to exclude people from a school and also explains why.


    But that doesn't say who made up the rules in the first place.


  • #198
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    Min wrote: »
    But that doesn't say who made up the rules in the first place.

    I'd imagine the schools initially and then decisions were made by the relevant authorities as to what was acceptable and what wasn't. In this case the powers that be have decided that the grounds of pregnancy isn't acceptable, particularly as the school don't make their ethos clear. It's all very clearly explained in the findings of the ombudsman for children.


  • #199
    micropig
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,366 ✭✭✭micropig


    eviltwin wrote: »
    So you think its okay to lump these girls away like they are dirty or shameful? It might not be a laundry but its the same idea.

    Out of interest does your place of work refuse admission to people who are single parents?

    Who said locking them away like dirt or shame?...you came up with that vision


    young mothers have additional educational needs. They need to learn to care for child. They need to learn about budgeting. These are skills they will need to use sooner than their childless peers. Schools in other countries have been set up to cater for these. extra rooms, where the child can sleep, eat etc during the day. A more flexible timetable so that the mother can attend to the child


    Why is it the same idea as a laundry?

    Is it better the child is a home with a child minder/grandparent all day, than teaching the mother the skills to cope properly?


  • #200
    eviltwin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    micropig wrote: »
    Who said locking them away like dirt or shame?...you came up with that vision


    young mothers have additional educational needs. They need to learn to care for child. They need to learn about budgeting. These are skills they will need to use sooner than their childless peers. Schools in other countries have been set up to cater for these. extra rooms, where the child can sleep, eat etc during the day. A more flexible timetable so that the mother can attend to the child


    Why is it the same idea as a laundry?

    Is it better the child is a home with a child minder/grandparent all day, than teaching the mother the skills to cope properly?


    Well you are the one proposing we take them out of mainstream education...I think that speaks volumes.

    As for parenting, budgeting skills I think they are things all students could benefit from.


  • #201
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    micropig wrote: »
    Who said locking them away like dirt or shame?...you came up with that vision


    young mothers have additional educational needs. They need to learn to care for child. They need to learn about budgeting. These are skills they will need to use sooner than their childless peers. Schools in other countries have been set up to cater for these. extra rooms, where the child can sleep, eat etc during the day. A more flexible timetable so that the mother can attend to the child


    Why is it the same idea as a laundry?

    Is it better the child is a home with a child minder/grandparent all day, than teaching the mother the skills to cope properly?

    So you'd support spending massive amounts of money on "special schools" with free childcare for young mothers but you don't support the right of a young mother to attend a mainstream school of her choice?
    I do think there should be additional support for young mothers trying to get an education but I also think that if they would be happier in an ordinary everyday school, that should be their choice.


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