Who thinks Sean Quinn is a great businessman now?

lazygal · 11-11-2011 1:42pm #1

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2011/1111/breaking26.html

Declared bankrupt in Northern Ireland today. I hope all of those who defended him as a great businessman who did so much for his home region cop on now and recognise how much damage his speculation did to the country.

orourkeda · 11-11-2011 1:43pm

I worked for him for 6 years.

This is no surprise

syklops · 11-11-2011 1:45pm

We lost a lot of things during the boom, but its nice to see we didnt lose everything. Things like begrudgery and the delight we have at seeing people who tried, fail.

Stay proud lazygal.

FetchTheGin · 11-11-2011 1:45pm

Well played by Quinn.

Only has to wait a year before he is back in business, considering his family have most of his assets, I doubt if this will have any profound effect on him.

Sad but true.

ejmaztec · 11-11-2011 1:46pm

He'll be back in business in a year.

lazygal · 11-11-2011 1:47pm

syklops wrote: »

We lost a lot of things during the boom, but its nice to see we didnt lose everything. Things like begrudgery and the delight we have at seeing people who tried, fail.

Stay proud lazygal.

He broke the rules associated with running an insurance company and invested far too heavily in one bank, Anglo, to the detriment of his other businesses. That's fact, not begrudery.

orourkeda · 11-11-2011 1:47pm

syklops wrote: »

We lost a lot of things during the boom, but its nice to see we didnt lose everything. Things like begrudgery and the delight we have at seeing people who tried, fail.

Stay proud lazygal.

Is he to be congratulated for managing to bankrupt himself despite being ireland richest man at one point?

ronaneire · 11-11-2011 1:48pm

It's all about the dum dum duh dee dum dum

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6JAJVAGC9M

Turnstyle · 11-11-2011 1:48pm

If it was another first world country he would be in prison for what he done, not here though... nice of him to keep sifting away offshore assets at the cost of Irish taxpayers, true hero alright :rolleyes:

I Heart Internet · 11-11-2011 1:49pm

Once heard him boast that he had never done a feasibility study in his life. Just dived in. No **** Sean????

smash · 11-11-2011 1:50pm

So he's allowed pay his tax in the republic of Ireland and banks with an Irish bank, but is allowed declare himself bankrupt under UK law?

Is that right?

CardBordWindow · 11-11-2011 1:51pm

He was once Ireland's richest man, now his family members are! Declared bankrupt so now he has no debt. Well played sir, well played.

orourkeda · 11-11-2011 1:51pm

smash wrote: »

So he's allowed pay his tax in the republic of Ireland and banks with an Irish bank, but is allowed declare himself bankrupt under UK law?

Is that right?

Yeah. Presumably irish bankruptcy laws dont suit him. He is from Fermanagh if that changes things

AnonoBoy · 11-11-2011 1:54pm

orourkeda wrote: »

Yeah. Presumably irish bankruptcy laws dont suit him. He is from Fermanagh if that changes thongs

Yes being from Fermanagh has a great influence on changing underwear.

In before ninja edit!

Howjoe1 · 11-11-2011 1:56pm

There are bankrupt ordinary citizens who struggle to put food on the table for their children.

Quinn through a complicated maze has put all his assets in family member names and moved them off shore.

Is he penniless? i don't believe so. Is he still a millionaire? i think so.

Is that €2.8 BILLION that is owed to Anglo Irish Bank, that State has gauranteed in our names as citizens, for which we suffer cuts to pay the Bond Holders, are we not to see I penny of it?

AM I feeling sorry for Quinn? No

Just another black day in this Banana Republic.

Robbo · 11-11-2011 2:00pm

syklops wrote: »

We lost a lot of things during the boom, but its nice to see we didnt lose everything. Things like begrudgery and the delight we have at seeing people who tried, fail.

Stay proud lazygal.

And there are Drumlins Have Eyes style characters in the border counties who still think he's a demi-god because "he got the cousin a job making tay in the quarry".

spider guardian · 11-11-2011 2:01pm

I can't see him queueing up at a soup-kitchen any time soon

Lemlin · 11-11-2011 2:06pm

Robbo wrote: »

And there are Drumlins Have Eyes style characters in the border counties who still think he's a demi-god because "he got the cousin a job making tay in the quarry".

No, you'll find there are people who appreciate that the man brought jobs to the region at a time when the IDA brought none. Plenty of these people are also still in employment.

orourkeda · 11-11-2011 2:13pm

Lemlin wrote: »

No, you'll find there are people who appreciate that the man brought jobs to the region at a time when the IDA brought none. Plenty of these people are also still in employment.

Plenty of them lost these jobs through mismanagemnet and financial recklessness

foxyboxer · 11-11-2011 2:14pm

You can have all the billions in the world but once your reputation is destroyed you're no-one.

A gambler whose luck ran out.

jmayo · 11-11-2011 2:14pm

syklops wrote: »

We lost a lot of things during the boom, but its nice to see we didnt lose everything. Things like begrudgery and the delight we have at seeing people who tried, fail.
...

And isn't it sad to see that after everything that has happened there are still people like you who still look up to chancers who get to siphon their money off to family members before walking away from their debts and leaving the ordinary taxpayers of the country counting the cost of them ?

lazygal wrote: »

He broke the rules associated with running an insurance company and invested far too heavily in one bank, Anglo, to the detriment of his other businesses. That's fact, not begrudery.

Correction "to the DETRIMENT of the people of this country".

Lemlin wrote: »

No, you'll find there are people who appreciate that the man brought jobs to the region at a time when the IDA brought none. Plenty of these people are also still in employment.

Using your argument seanie fitz and fingers fingelton deserve respect.
Sure look at all the jobs they created and all the people they helped with loans.

ronan45 · 11-11-2011 2:15pm

Ireland's Ex-Richest Man Bankrupt

(c) Sky News 2011, 12:57, Friday 11 November 2011
An entrepreneur who was once the richest man in Ireland (Xetra: A0Q8L3 - news) has declared himself bankrupt over debts of two billion euro (£1.7bn) to the former Anglo-Irish Bank.

Sean Quinn ran a multi-billion empire until it collapsed over the last two years due to massive, secret stock market gambles on the share price of the now nationalised rogue lender.

Mr Quinn said he had done everything to avoid bankruptcy, which was declared at the High Court in Belfast.

"I have done absolutely everything in my power to avoid taking this drastic decision. The vast majority of debt that Anglo maintains is owed is strenuously disputed.

"However, I cannot now pay those loans which are due, following Anglo taking control of the Quinn Group of companies, which I and a loyal team spent a lifetime building. I find myself left with no other alternative."

The businessman, dubbed the "Mighty Quinn", was said to be worth 4.72bn euros (£3.7bn) at the height of his success.

Mr Quinn accused the Irish government of holding him at fault for the devastation wreaked on the country's economy after Anglo - the developers' bank - went bust.

"I worked tirelessly to find a solution to the problems, which arose from ill-fated investments in Anglo," he said. "Anglo, and more recently the Irish Government, are intent on making scapegoats of my family and I."

ronan45 · 11-11-2011 2:16pm

I BET he will be still living in Luxury this time next year...........
And the year after that and the year after that

Does anyone really think this guy will end up in an apartment in the outskirts of Dublin worrying about his heating bills ??? LOL

Sir Oxman · 11-11-2011 2:25pm

syklops wrote: »

We lost a lot of things during the boom, but its nice to see we didnt lose everything. Things like begrudgery and the delight we have at seeing people who tried, fail.

Stay proud lazygal.

I seriously think going down this road is silly, syklops.
More than likely, the people of this country will not see one cent of the billions this man and his family owe.
He pulled the wool over many eyes and will never see a day of hardship for the rest of his life.
Justice and accountability are missing in this country and today we see another gambling ars*hole get away.

crazygeryy · 11-11-2011 2:26pm

2.8 billion jesus.h.christ.

thats all I can say to that.

Robbo · 11-11-2011 2:27pm

Lemlin wrote: »

No, you'll find there are people who appreciate that the man brought jobs to the region at a time when the IDA brought none. Plenty of these people are also still in employment.

And Quinn's been doing his best to jeopardise those jobs since he started his leveraged Stamp Duty dodging misadventure into Anglo, followed by the spiriting away of all assets into family members names through Byzantine overseas corporate structures. Let's not forget that he ran an insurance operation that was, according to the Regulator, not sufficiently robust to deal with being in the sector and the numerous underhand measures used to evade or minimise claims (50% off your excess if you don't go near a solicitor, sending ex-Gardai to peoples houses to coerce them into accepting small settlements etc).

I really can't see what you hold against the IDA. Do you expect them to show the CEO of some American MNC around Cavan or Monaghan and say: "Well here's where the infrastructure isn't, over there is where the diesel laundering and subsistence farming are and if you look to your left you'll see the kind of stony grey soil that got Paddy Kavanagh moist, sure why would you want to base your widget processing operation anywhere else?"

If you're that easily bought, so be it. But the cost of his Anglo dealings to the taxpayer ain't gonna be small.

conorhal · 11-11-2011 2:27pm

ejmaztec wrote: »

He'll be back in business in a year.

Where as every pleb with an insurance policy will still be paying the insurance levy imposed to bail out Quinn insurance for the next 20yrs.....

Lemlin · 11-11-2011 2:38pm

jmayo wrote: »

Using your argument seanie fitz and fingers fingelton deserve respect.
Sure look at all the jobs they created and all the people they helped with loans.

I must of missed where Seanie Fitz and Fingers Fingleton were entrepreneurs who started up their own companies' and actually created jobs.

sbsquarepants · 11-11-2011 2:38pm

Does anyone here honestly think that man is poor?
He would just rather not waste the vast piles of money he's "earned" over the years by paying his debts.
He's as rich as a king and always will be!

GetWithIt · 11-11-2011 2:41pm

The poor man. Any chance Joe could organize a whip around to give him some comfort in his old age.

At least they didn't take the automatic right to a Medical Card from OAPs in the end. That would have been the ultimate insult for him. He'll still have his health, thank God.

Lemlin · 11-11-2011 2:45pm

Robbo wrote: »

And Quinn's been doing his best to jeopardise those jobs since he started his leveraged Stamp Duty dodging misadventure into Anglo, followed by the spiriting away of all assets into family members names through Byzantine overseas corporate structures. Let's not forget that he ran an insurance operation that was, according to the Regulator, not sufficiently robust to deal with being in the sector and the numerous underhand measures used to evade or minimise claims (50% off your excess if you don't go near a solicitor, sending ex-Gardai to peoples houses to coerce them into accepting small settlements etc).

I really can't see what you hold against the IDA. Do you expect them to show the CEO of some American MNC around Cavan or Monaghan and say: "Well here's where the infrastructure isn't, over there is where the diesel laundering and subsistence farming are and if you look to your left you'll see the kind of stony grey soil that got Paddy Kavanagh moist, sure why would you want to base your widget processing operation anywhere else?"

If you're that easily bought, so be it. But the cost of his Anglo dealings to the taxpayer ain't gonna be small.

I never disagreed that they will be small and I totally agree he has made mistakes. What I took offence to was someone labelling the people in the border counties Drumlins Have Eyes type characters. There are people there who have worked for the man for 40 years so I don't think its wrong for them to feel some gratitude.

The fact of the matter is that the man brought jobs to the region when the national company for enterprise could not do so. The fact is that the IDA are responsible for industrial growth in Ireland and, say what you want about the border region, it's their task to brings jobs there and they were more than happy to sit back and neglect the region because the Quinn Group was in the area.

He's made plenty of mistakes since and I agree, he should have every cent taken off him because we'll be paying it back for long enough but to brand everything he did negatively is also wrong.

The Quinn Group were functioning 22 years and providing jobs before he even touched the financial sector.

Galtee · 11-11-2011 3:15pm

I still think he's a great business man. He did you a favour, when you've built up your own multi billion euro group then you can learn from his mistakes and not lose it all.

edgecutter · 11-11-2011 3:24pm

He showed initiative and did something that many of us would be too afraid to do. We need more people like him to get this country working again and we should never be proud that he failed.

lazygal · 11-11-2011 3:24pm

Galtee wrote: »

I still think he's a great business man. He did you a favour, when you've built up your own multi billion euro group then you can learn from his mistakes and not lose it all.

What favour exactly? The insurance levy we all have to pay? The €2.8 billion he owes to Anglo? Or the insurance business which didn't have enough to cover itself financially?

lazygal · 11-11-2011 3:25pm

edgecutter wrote: »

He showed initiative and did something that many of us would be too afraid to do. We need more people like him to get this country working again and we should never be proud that he failed.

I'm not proud he failed-I'm mad as hell that HIS failure is costing ME money in my insurance premia and losses in Anglo Irish Bank.

smash · 11-11-2011 3:26pm

Galtee wrote: »

He did you a favour

Yea, he made sure we all have to pay an extra % on top of our insurance premiums to cover his losses.

AstonMartin · 11-11-2011 3:28pm

syklops wrote: »

We lost a lot of things during the boom, but its nice to see we didnt lose everything. Things like begrudgery and the delight we have at seeing people who tried, fail.

Stay proud lazygal.

Do you realise he is trying to get the taxpayer to pay E2.8bn of his gambling debt?

Galtee · 11-11-2011 3:31pm

lazygal wrote: »

What favour exactly? The insurance levy we all have to pay? The €2.8 billion he owes to Anglo? Or the insurance business which didn't have enough to cover itself financially?

It's easy criticise someone else from your when they fail, but at least he had built up a massive business from very little. It's better to have loved and lost and all that yadi ya ya.

AstonMartin · 11-11-2011 3:32pm

CardBordWindow wrote: »

He was once Ireland's richest man, now his family members are! Declared bankrupt so now he has no debt. Well played sir, well played.

anglo can go after his kids for 77m each and his wife for 102m due to personal guarantees according to the indo.

Galtee · 11-11-2011 3:32pm

smash wrote: »

Yea, he made sure we all have to pay an extra % on top of our insurance premiums to cover his losses.

And whats excuse are all the other insurance companies who have been raising their rates for the last 4 yrs using?

thebaz · 11-11-2011 3:33pm

Sean Quinn is still viewed in certain quarters as an upstanding citizen - yet he possibly owes more to the state than any other individual through his Anglo gamble - and now when Anglo (us) try to claw back some of the money, we find it is hidden through a complicated maze of Eastern European , family member accounts - Will we see him crying on RTE evening news again, about how unfairly he is being treated -outstanding upstanding citizen indeed -

skelliser · 11-11-2011 3:33pm

this is open to everyone here btw.
There is nothing to stop anyone from ireland going to the UK and declaring bankrupt.

all aboard!!!

lazygal · 11-11-2011 3:33pm

Galtee wrote: »

It's easy criticise someone else from your when they fail, but at least he had built up a massive business from very little. It's better to have loved and lost and all that yadi ya ya.

WFT??? He is costing all of us money! ALL OF US ARE PAYING FOR HIS MEGLOMANIA AND LACK OF ANY SENSE OF RESPONSIBILITY!

Galtee · 11-11-2011 3:34pm

lazygal wrote: »

WFT??? He is costing all of us money! ALL OF US ARE PAYING FOR HIS MEGLOMANIA AND LACK OF ANY SENSE OF RESPONSIBILITY!

How? His losses are personal losses not group losses. That's why he's declaring himself bankrupt.

smash · 11-11-2011 3:36pm

Galtee wrote: »

And whats excuse are all the other insurance companies who have been raising their rates for the last 4 yrs using?

I fail to see how that has anything to do with the fact that we're forking him out for billions. Other companies increase their rates to cover costs or losses but it only comes back on their customers and not a whole country. And for the record, my insurance premium went down this year, not up.

Galtee wrote: »

How? His losses are personal losses not group losses. That's why he's declaring himself bankrupt.

Yes, he's declaring himself bankrupt. But we're still paying for his company because of his bad management and gambling.

lazygal · 11-11-2011 3:38pm

Galtee wrote: »

How? His losses are personal losses not group losses. That's why he's declaring himself bankrupt.

What about the insurance levy? Is that not a direct result of his actions?

Galtee · 11-11-2011 3:44pm

smash wrote: »

I fail to see how that has anything to do with the fact that we're forking him out for billions. Other companies increase their rates to cover costs or losses but it only comes back on their customers and not a whole country. And for the record, my insurance premium went down this year, not up.

I don't understand. explain it to me how Quinns dealings with Anglo are costing us other than increased premiums which as previously mentioned have been going up over the last 4 years anyway.

smash · 11-11-2011 3:49pm

Galtee wrote: »

I don't understand. explain it to me how Quinns dealings with Anglo are costing us other than increased premiums which as previously mentioned have been going up over the last 4 years anyway.

You kind of answered your own question. As I stated previously, my premium went down this year. But not by the full amount because a levy has been forced upon me to cover Quinn's mistakes. The levy will remain until the 2.8b is recovered.

How can you possibly not understand that?

hatrickpatrick · 11-11-2011 3:51pm

He needn't worry.
The taxpayer will surely be forced to pay for his mistakes. No chance of those who screwed up paying for their own mess, eh?

Katekat · 11-11-2011 3:55pm

I have worked in the insurance area for 11 years for number of international insurers but never Quinn Insurance. Each and everyone of these companies always questioned why Quinn Insurance was doing so well and how they became one of the largest motor insurers in Ireland in such a short period of time 1) yes lower premiums 2) their claims handlers, aggressive, bullying tactics (not their fault considering they were all commission like contracts and every time they had to reopen a file they were penalised in their own pocket) 3) their cover, tried to get out of paying their own policyholders with clauses of every kind. Insurers have stricter regulations than banks especially when it comes to premium capital held, so when it was discovered that Quinn was using Quinn insurance as his own personal bank the writing was on the wall.

:mad: Now, in relation to comments like border counties Drumlins Have Eyes type characters, I have never come across the discrimination of northern people or border people as I have in my own country. I for one, along with many friends from home are sick and tired of the "nordie" insulting comments and its getting worse. I have received insulting comments in Dublin, waterford, cork etc, so its not just a regional issue. I have been to 9 different countries and have never been insulted like I have in my own country and its a disgrace...... rant over.

Galtee · 11-11-2011 3:56pm

smash wrote: »

You kind of answered your own question. As I stated previously, my premium went down this year. But not by the full amount because a levy has been forced upon me to cover Quinn's mistakes. The levy will remain until the 2.8b is recovered.

How can you possibly not understand that?

Oh, So why have anglo taken a 49% stake in quinn group and why are they still pursuing him seperately for the 2.3 billion?

Who thinks Sean Quinn is a great businessman now?

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