Class Rep training junket?

the_observer · 05-10-2011 02:11PM

We'd love to hear what people think about this by the way, if anyone's willing to fire us an email studentobserverireland@gmail.com we'd be greatly appreciative.

Ataxia · 05-10-2011 03:12PM

Yay controversy!

So several questions:

1. What is the content of this training? Why does it take so long? Can some of it be printed out on handouts and read in their spare time?

2. Clubs & Socs training is held in the evenings but the SU still seems to think it's reasonable to assume that people will show up without free accomodation (and indeed attendance is mandatory). Why is this different?

3. What kind of class rep is attracted by the promise of a free piss up in a hotel and why do you imagine they would make good student representatives?

4. Why not take attendance at all the modules and then email out a list of all the absentees if you're worried about people only showing up for the food?

XxMCRxBabyxX · 05-10-2011 03:39PM

LeixlipRed wrote: »

I was a little worried when I posted this up that people's response would be, "there's that lefty bastard moaning again" But I'm heartened by the fact that, contrary to what we're constantly told, some students here do actually give a **** about how the university and SU spend their money.

For once you and I actually agree! :-D

LeixlipRed · 05-10-2011 03:48PM

Aww, shucks :P

eogriffin · 05-10-2011 03:54PM

Less of the love in, more of the controversy!

Kiwi_knock · 05-10-2011 05:27PM

It is a cheap tactic to get people involved in the SU. No point addressing why so many feel a disconnect with the SU, lets just throw money at the problem.

There has been no convincing argument why the training needs to be held off campus. I do not see how a weekend away is going to make people better class reps compared to what could be offered on campus. And the fact that the Exec thinks students who are interested in free trips are the future of the SU is very worrying.

Can not wait for the Facebook pictures of this informative and worthwhile weekend.

Ostrom · 05-10-2011 06:25PM

Is this going on for more than one day, and if so, are students being put up in said hotel?

the_observer · 05-10-2011 06:29PM

Short piece on the story so far, more coming tomorrow:

http://stobserver.wordpress.com/2011/10/05/msu-to-train-class-reps-in-a-hotel/

Ostrom · 05-10-2011 06:32PM

Not another ...-gate

Also the other half is sitting across from me, she was elected class rep last week (other college) and I picked her up from training yesterday evening.

They were kept for 8 hours and a got a set dinner from it - can anyone confirm if they are staying for the night or is this just about the cost of a suitable meeting room for one day?

the_observer · 05-10-2011 06:39PM

efla wrote: »

Not another ...-gate

Sorry, we're gits for a cliche.

Also, we'll look into confirming that for you if we can

cython · 05-10-2011 06:40PM

efla wrote: »

Not another ...-gate

Also the other half is sitting across from me, she was elected class rep last week (other college) and I picked her up from training yesterday evening.

They were kept for 8 hours and a got a set dinner from it - can anyone confirm if they are staying for the night or is this just about the cost of a suitable meeting room for one day?

I presume that since insufficient overnight accommodation here was an obstacle to a campus swap as mentioned earlier, they must be planning on staying for the night. Also, the below from banquo would seem to be confirmation:

banquo wrote: »

We started off looking at hostels and B&Bs, but there's not one in the country that can fit 120-150 people for a night. Most hotels would even struggle at that. The hotel we're going to is the cheapest we could find.

If just for the day, then hostels/B&Bs would be irrelevant

Ostrom · 05-10-2011 06:45PM

cython wrote: »

I presume that since insufficient overnight accommodation here was an obstacle to a campus swap as mentioned earlier, they must be planning on staying for the night. Also, the below from banquo would seem to be confirmation:

If just for the day, then hostels/B&Bs would be irrelevant

That makes it extra-dodgy, considering a significant proportion of WIT's students commute from Wexford / Kilkenny / West Waterford, and yet still managed to squeeze training into a few hours

edit: @ the observer: sorry, that sounded quite mean! Well done on getting the article out so quick

the_observer · 05-10-2011 06:59PM

efla wrote: »

edit: @ the observer: sorry, that sounded quite mean! Well done on getting the article out so quick

No worries

Cargin · 05-10-2011 07:22PM

Kiwi_knock wrote: »

There has been no convincing argument why the training needs to be held off campus. I do not see how a weekend away is going to make people better class reps compared to what could be offered on campus. And the fact that the Exec thinks students who are interested in free trips are the future of the SU is very worrying.

I wholeheartedly agree. The notion that the elected class reps need to be held "captive" is a serious note for concern. Why on earth would we want people like that representing us at all?
If the Exec anticipates that level of commitment, what's to say that after this training course they ever show up to any UC ever again? Are we looking at a 'bums-on-seats' tactic whose sole purpose is to create the appearance of a filled quota, so to speak, of trained Reps?
That we have a brewing scandal here over a high-profile training course whose dominating focus is on enforcing attendance leaves me feeling like any possible agenda for 'doing good' is being surpassed by the suggestion of an agenda for 'looking good'.

Tesco Massacre · 05-10-2011 07:24PM

We really need to get to the bottom of this before it turns into a crisis.

I propose we meet in the Shelbourne Hotel at noon on Friday, where we shall spend the weekend deliberating on said crisis.

LeixlipRed · 05-10-2011 08:56PM

The wheels are in motion on a picket of the SU and a petition calling for the cancellation of this trip. If anyone would like to help with this they can contact me by PM. Also, if anyone knows any class reps who are uneasy or unwilling to attend this junket perhaps they could get them to go back to their classes and ask their class what they think about?

Ian Beale · 05-10-2011 09:09PM

banquo wrote: »

I don't get the references to politicians, or where these 'deluxe lunches' are coming from.

We would love to host it on campus for next to nothing, but hosting it on campus doesn't work. It's never worked. When all classes are taken into account, you need about 130/140 Class Reps for NUIM / St. Pat's. One of the modules is how the Universities work - their internal structure, who to go to with particular problems, correct methods of appeal, etc. It's a lot of facts and logistics and can be pretty boring stuff. Whether or not someone is there for the freebies, if we have them captive for the module they'll know the stuff by the end, and the class won't have elected someone who has absolutely no idea how to help them.

If you have it on campus then people just wander off for the modules back to their house / down the town / anywhere but a 90 minute talk on their long list of responsibilities as a class rep.

Having it in a hotel won't change that, chances are you'll get even more people just going for the craic and they'll still wander off anyway.

There is no justification for this expense and quite frankly I wouldn't have voted for you if I had known you'd do something like this. Even get it added to the constitution that class reps have compulsory training on campus. Even if you can't enforce it this year at least the following years will benefit from it.

LeixlipRed · 05-10-2011 09:15PM

Anyone know what date the training is on? We're a bit confused about that, 14th and 15th of this month is what we think?

TheManHimself · 05-10-2011 09:33PM

I find it ridiculous that the SU is spending an outrageous amount per class rep on training and hotel accomadation. I mean what the hell is so special about this training that it cant be done on campus, utilising our own facilities to their maximum potential.

The price tag is what is getting people's backs up here, not the very worthy task of offering guidance to incoming class reps.

Although I must say that I personally believe last year's constitution change was a big missed opportunity for having a full open assembly on campus, and allowing any student to participate, the whole exercise of constitutional change seemed geared toward changing minor details in the SU structure rather than broadening campus democracy.

That aside, the SU should reverse this junket, and it is a junket, despite the spin that comes from the Union. There are kids who can't afford to buy lunch in college, and this sorta nonsense just smacks of elitism.

Duddy · 05-10-2011 09:49PM

I believe the €93 refers to the student levy paid by all students at the start of the year, not a per-class rep amount.

Beau · 05-10-2011 10:11PM

Can I go?

Dr. Nguyen Van Falk · 05-10-2011 10:53PM

how u become a class rep, mite just sign up get my free meal then step down the next day, i imagine a lot of other people where thinking the same thing when they signed up, if we want to stop this it mite b an idea to go around to all the class's and ask the students to demand that their class rep boycotts this nonsense

LeixlipRed · 05-10-2011 10:54PM

Dr. Nguyen Van Falk wrote: »

how u become a class rep, mite just sign up get my free meal then step down the next day, i imagine a lot of other people where thinking the same thing when they signed up, if we want to stop this it mite b an idea to go around to all the class's and ask the students to demand that their class rep boycotts this nonsense

That's something we could do, plenty of time between now and Monday.

DB21 · 05-10-2011 11:00PM

<snip>

Sorry guys, I had a post done. But as of now, I feel it's a conflict of interest for me to comment publicly on this matter.

pegnose · 06-10-2011 02:24AM

banquo wrote: »

*types quickly*

You'll find that in every college that does this - and we consulted plenty in planning this - that people turn up for the food, head off down the town or off with their mates and skip the modules, the point of class rep training, and come back for the dinner. Doesn't work. You gotta get everyone in the one place and keep them there.

Did you consult DCU in this research?

What they did last year was to hold it in the college and have it over two days, hosting a sleep-over in the college during. Everybody brought a sleeping bag/duvet and did not just head into town with their mates after food. Everybody had a great time and the training session was a success.

JediPoncho · 06-10-2011 11:07AM

Just wanted to weigh in on this myself. Not a regular poster to boards by any means but as a former class rep and NUIM Alumnus, I am disgusted not only by the idea of this trip but moreso at the pathetic attempt by Rob to try to justify it under the grounds that it will increase the level and quality of attendance.
Regarding the argument that there is no consequence to reps non-attendance, I like the idea that a role could be taken and made public so that the students can see if their own representatives bothered to attend and have them replaced accordingly.

Is it yet known the estimate of total cost for this excuse?

At a time when wasted lightbulbs on the campus apparently cannot be replaced due to cost it seems like such an insult to recruit the "popular kid" in class to go on a drinking trip. Sort of puts the question in my head, how many angry boardees does it take to change a junket?

LeixlipRed · 06-10-2011 11:14AM

Facebook event for the picket/petition can be found here:

https://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=124516060984132

Invite people and share it please. Not really sure on a time but I said 12 noon on that, we'll provisionally go with that.

Nision · 06-10-2011 02:54PM

Ok, so much for the controversy.

On the protest event page of the 10 people attending/maybe attending.
5 are not maynooth students or members of the union.
3 of those 5 were NEVER maynooth students.
Another 2 are "student observer" heads who are presumably there to cover it rather than support it.

That leaves two men who are presumably trying to recruit a dog.

So is this being organised by People before profit, Right to work, FEE, United left Alliance or whatever the SWP are calling themselves this week?

the_observer · 06-10-2011 03:19PM

We're hopefully going to try do some sort of interview with Rob about this. Naturally we'll ask any questions you folks may have. So send us a PM here, or an email to the usual studentobserverireland@gmail.com

-dave

Pajoe89 · 06-10-2011 03:43PM

Nision wrote: »

Ok, so much for the controversy.

On the protest event page of the 10 people attending/maybe attending.
5 are not maynooth students or members of the union.
3 of those 5 were NEVER maynooth students.
Another 2 are "student observer" heads who are presumably there to cover it rather than support it.

That leaves two men who are presumably trying to recruit a dog.

So is this being organised by People before profit, Right to work, FEE, United left Alliance or whatever the SWP are calling themselves this week?

In fairness, it does take a while for events like this to get people interested and attending. It's not another "Kates Birthday" bull**** event. I've had a look and at least 8 of the people attending are students or alumni. In fairness, I think alumni are allowed to have an opinion and perhaps revisit their college don't you? Naturally on events, people are inclined to invite most people they know regardless of relevance to the event so counting the first 15 to click attend is pretty invalid.

Class Rep training junket?

Comments