RWC Pool C: Ireland vs USA Eagles, Sun 11 Sep 7am; Pre/During/Post Match Thread.

irishbucsfan · 07-09-2011 3:28pm

I've heard Murphy will start.

bamboozle · 07-09-2011 3:32pm

Ireland by 20-40

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I believe that we had a pretty good defense when we won against France in '09 on the way to a Grand Slam. Certainly managed to get through the game without a missed tackle as embarrasing as D'Arcy's attempt to bring down Rougerie earlier this year.

Maybe you're right. However could we expect the pairing that helped us beat a team like France manage against the crushing might of USA.

a quote from RTE's match report on the day

'Harinordoquy punched the first hole in Ireland's defence when he steamrollered over O'Gara,
who had obviously been targeted as the weak link.'

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/sixnations/2009/0207/ireland_frances.html

no doubt they'd be in no bother v USA, i'd still rather McFadden ahead of a fit darcy or wallace at the moment, plus Deccie is going to start Sexton, ROG will only start vs russia.

theboss80 · 07-09-2011 3:34pm

Ireland by less than 20

Team I expect to see

Court
Flannery (50)
Ross (60)
DOC
POC
Ferris (60)
SOB
Heaslip
Reddan (50)
O'Gara (50)
Earls (40)
Wallace
BOD
Bowe
Murphy(60)

Bench: Buckley, Best, Kearney, Leamy, Murray, Sexton , Trimble

Otacon · 07-09-2011 3:36pm

Ireland by less than 20

theboss80 wrote: »

Team I expect to see

No lock cover?

thomond2006 · 07-09-2011 3:41pm

Ireland by less than 20

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I've heard Murphy will start.

I've a feeling Murphy would be in the first choice 22 at the moment. Had that role during the Grand Slam season and did nothing wrong when called upon.*

*Might be clutching at straws!

theboss80 · 07-09-2011 3:49pm

Ireland by less than 20

Otacon wrote: »

No lock cover?

Nope , don't expect anything other than full game from POC and DOC to be honest, its the backs that need to get a decent run and a bit of confidence which will come from scores. Ferris can cover if badly needed.

I suspect at the minute DK does not know his first choice 2,10,11 or 15 so decent runs for them all and make a call then. If he goes with Leo on the bench which is likely then either Kearney or Murphy does not play in this game which means they don't play against Oz either and don't think either has shone much more than the other.But would b a harsh call to leave either out of 22 but if both are included then either Trimble or Earls doesn't get a run, Trimble is the form wing and Deccie has a soft spot for Earls so that's another big call to be making which is why I included them both and performance wins the jersey against Australia.

totallegend · 07-09-2011 4:08pm

theboss80 wrote: »

Nope , don't expect anything other than full game from POC and DOC to be honest, its the backs that need to get a decent run and a bit of confidence which will come from scores. Ferris can cover if badly needed.

I suspect at the minute DK does not know his first choice 2,10,11 or 15 so decent runs for them all and make a call then. If he goes with Leo on the bench which is likely then either Kearney or Murphy does not play in this game which means they don't play against Oz either and don't think either has shone much more than the other.But would b a harsh call to leave either out of 22 but if both are included then either Trimble or Earls doesn't get a run, Trimble is the form wing and Deccie has a soft spot for Earls so that's another big call to be making which is why I included them both and performance wins the jersey against Australia.

Wow, I assumed when you listed Kearney on the bench that it was a typo; you don't seriously think DK will go into any match with only three forwards on the bench?

Also, I don't think "performance wins the jersey against Australia" is any sort of a basis to be picking a team. If Earls goes out and scores a first-half hat-trick against the part-timers and journeymen of the USA, does that negate his poor showings against France (twice) and England? No, Trimble has earned the wing jersey and he will get it.

theboss80 · 07-09-2011 4:16pm

Ireland by less than 20

So Trimble nailed down for 11 against USA, Aus and Italy? By the way I totally agree with you that he has earned it but can't see Earls being left out in the cold just like that and the centre experiment has been tried and failed so we wont see him there again during the WC(unless vs Russia) and have FB cover so he wont play or should I say start there either.

15. Kearney/Murphy (?)
14. Bowe owns that shirt
13. BOD owns that shirt
12. D'Arcy fit owns that shirt
11. Trimble deserves that shirt but doesn't quite own it yet.Which is why I think both will play against USA.

LostPassword · 07-09-2011 4:58pm

USA

Interesting article here: http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/rugby/2011/0907/1224303656717.html

Suggests that Murray is in contention for the starting scrum-half role over Reddan :eek:

Also suggests that Buckley is likely to start at.... Loose head :eek::eek::mad:

totallegend · 07-09-2011 5:01pm

theboss80 wrote: »

So Trimble nailed down for 11 against USA, Aus and Italy? By the way I totally agree with you that he has earned it but can't see Earls being left out in the cold just like that and the centre experiment has been tried and failed so we wont see him there again during the WC(unless vs Russia) and have FB cover so he wont play or should I say start there either.

15. Kearney/Murphy (?)
14. Bowe owns that shirt
13. BOD owns that shirt
12. D'Arcy fit owns that shirt
11. Trimble deserves that shirt but doesn't quite own it yet.Which is why I think both will play against USA.

No, I think he has it nailed down for the Australia game; if he plays poorly then of course other guys come into the mix for Italy and Earls will be at the head of the queue. I agree that he doesn't own the 11 shirt by any stretch, just my point is that playing well against USA is no indication of how anyone will fare against the Wallabies. I'd say Earls will be wearing 22 against both USA and Australia (but I think McFadden gives better cover options).

Podge_irl · 07-09-2011 5:06pm

Ireland by less than 20

LostPassword wrote: »

Also suggests that Buckley is likely to start at.... Loose head :eek::eek::mad:

He'll get reamed at loosehead even against the States. I really hope that doesn't happen. What a joke.

Grimebox · 07-09-2011 5:09pm

Ireland by less than 20

USA forward Scott LaValla posing in the trinity cancer society annual naked calender

wixfjord · 07-09-2011 5:19pm

I seriously hope we play our strongest team in this, including Court and Ross, and go out to properly flatten them.

Play Reddan and Sexton, get our back row running onto quick ball at them, and go for the jugular early on. It's a risky strategy, as we've seen from the recent France game, but when it comes off we're brilliant, as we've seen from the England 6N game.

Come on lads, last chance saloon for some of ye, so lay down a marker, because it's needed.

Stev_o · 07-09-2011 5:29pm

Ireland by less than 20

Podge_irl wrote: »

He'll get reamed at loosehead even against the States. I really hope that doesn't happen. What a joke.

He's going to be in the 22 regardless. So we can either put up with him starting hoping he does okay or coming off the bench and screwing us around the scrum. Id prefer him starting tbh.

trackguy · 07-09-2011 5:30pm

Podge_irl wrote: »

Mind you, Sexton was playing with a scrum half who was so poor he managed to go from first choice to out of the squad.

Would imagine whoever starts against USA will start against Aus. About the only position where it's unclear who'll start I would think.

True enough but for whatever reason, he didn't impress.

bamboozle wrote: »

take it you dont believe in having a defence so...

i'd love to see Sexton, McFadden, BOD at 10 12 13 but Deccie will go with Sexton Wallace BOD if Darcy is fit.

Kidney has shown a willingness to pair ROG and Wallace, 10 & 12, before. Not a hope in hell of McFadden getting the 12 slot (even against USA).

I think Kidney will be trying to settle the team now. Fly-half is hard to call. 12 is not - it will be Wallace, because of injury.

theboss80 · 07-09-2011 5:38pm

Ireland by less than 20

totallegend wrote: »

No, I think he has it nailed down for the Australia game; if he plays poorly then of course other guys come into the mix for Italy and Earls will be at the head of the queue. I agree that he doesn't own the 11 shirt by any stretch, just my point is that playing well against USA is no indication of how anyone will fare against the Wallabies. I'd say Earls will be wearing 22 against both USA and Australia (but I think McFadden gives better cover options).

Ya I agree with you but just think whoever plays Sunday will play against Oz AND Italy unless they have a mare of a game against Oz. If its Trimble I'd be happy with that but just making the point that I expect Earls to play against USA aswell and think whoever impresses will get the nod. Just my opinion. If all is even performance wise the Trimble gets the nod for me based on August but if not Earls must start regardless of the weakness of USA. It will be about how sharp the players are looking now for DK.

Conas · 07-09-2011 5:41pm

Ireland by less than 20

trackguy wrote: »

I think Kidney will be trying to settle the team now. Fly-half is hard to call. 12 is not - it will be Wallace, because of injury.

It's just stupid that Kidney has the same love for Paddy Wallace as he did for O'Leary for so long. McFadden just can't get into the mix, having said that he didn't exactly hold his hand up against the Scots, but he's a better player than Wallace. If McFadden had made the same mistake as Wallace did against the Welsh this year, and had that kick gone over in 09 against the same team he would never have seen the green of Ireland again. But P Wallace is always in the mix. Would have loved to see Darren Cave or James Downey given a chance. I'm critical of Wallace because I don't see what he brings to the centre at all. D'Arcy just can't seem to get going. Our 12 channel is a weakness.

07-09-2011 5:43pm

Ireland by less than 20

McFadden is a 13.
Wallace is a 12.

They are very different positions.

Ciaran-Irl · 07-09-2011 5:52pm

Ireland by 20-40

If there are doubts around Seanie, D'Arcy and Healy, then I'd like to start with:

Court, Flannery, Ross, Cullen, POC, Ferris, Jennings, Heaslip, Reddan, Sexton, Trimble, McFadden, BOD, Bowe, Kearney

Buckley, Best, DOC, Murray, ROG, Earls

Podge_irl · 07-09-2011 5:53pm

Ireland by less than 20

Stev_o wrote: »

He's going to be in the 22 regardless. So we can either put up with him starting hoping he does okay or coming off the bench and screwing us around the scrum. Id prefer him starting tbh.

I'd rather him on the bench and coming on at TH, or even starting at TH. He's a passable TH most of the time and can be handy round the pitch. He's unbelievably awful at LH.

ormond lad · 07-09-2011 5:54pm

Ciaran-Irl wrote: »

If there are doubts around Seanie, D'Arcy and Healy, then I'd like to start with:

Court, Flannery, Ross, Cullen, POC, Ferris, Jennings, Heaslip, Reddan, Sexton, Trimble, McFadden, BOD, Bowe, Kearney

Buckley, Best, DOC, Murray, ROG, Earls

who would you have on bench as back row cover?
you have only 6 subs named

WeeBushy · 07-09-2011 6:07pm

Deleted User wrote: »

McFadden is a 13.
Wallace is a 12.

They are very different positions.

I always thought McFadden was primarily a 12?

irishbucsfan · 07-09-2011 6:13pm

WeeBushy wrote: »

I always thought McFadden was primarily a 12?

Based on where he has played in the big games he's not even primarily a center.

Who knows where he will end up, but for now he's not a 12 at this level.

WeeBushy · 07-09-2011 6:18pm

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Based on where he has played in the big games he's not even primarily a center.

Who knows where he will end up, but for now he's not a 12 at this level.

What I was trying to say was that I thought he played primarily at 12, as opposed to 13, before breaking into the Leinster team and Ireland setup.

Cpt_Blackbeard · 07-09-2011 6:24pm

In preparation for the AUS game, we are probably going to go for our strongest available team for the US. At the same time, I feel that we need to have our best attacking players on the pitch to try and rack up a good score. Because of that I would love to see a backline of: 11. Earls , 12. BOD, 13. Bowe, 14. Trimble, 15. Murphy
Although, if that backline were to happen (it won't though) Kidney would pick Earls at 13.

Keeping it within the bounds of realism, I'd like to see:
1. Court - Healy will likely miss out.
2. Flannery
3. Ross - Although it is only the US and Buckley could be worth a run for his ''famed'' ability in open play.
4. DOC
5. POC
6. Ferris
7. SOB - He needs gametime at 7. Jennings just hasn't had the opportunity to show if he can perform at international level and I feel like it would be too big a risk to give him gametime that would better benefit SOB.
8. Heaslip
9. Murray - He is the only 9 who has potential to be very good. I want him to start and I believe he is definitely in consideration.
10. Sexton - ROG edged the warmups but a great performance from Sexton would get him the jersey for Australia. He needs to show himself as effective at this level as he is in the HC. Last chance to be first choice and he should shine against the US.
11. Trimble - Its almost a sin to not start a player of Earl's attacking threat for what will be an open game but, Trimble is the form player.
12. Wallace - McFadden's greater running threat would be useful but, Wallace's ability as a second five-eight edges it. D'Arcy will likely miss out.
13. BOD
14. Bowe - He needs to shake off the ringrust or Earls could get the not against AUS.
15. Murphy - Kearney is supposedly injured and Murphy is the greater attacking threat.

16. Best
17. Buckley
18. Ryan - With concerns over SOB and Ferris' knee troubles we may need him to slot in in the backrow.
19. Unless Heaslip can cover 7, it has to be Jennings. Leamy's proven ability to perform at this level will probably edge it though.
20. Reddan
21. ROG
22. Earls - Kearney needs gametime and McFadden would be unlucky to miss out but, I can't leave Earls out.

PhatPiggins · 07-09-2011 6:27pm

Ireland by 20-40

Deleted User wrote: »

McFadden is a 13.
Wallace is a 12.

They are very different positions.

You've been warned before about pointing out obvious truths :mad::mad:

Rant,rant,rant Kidney has destroyed Ireland, both the team and the country, rant,rant, rant.

Where's O'leary gone he's basically caused every natural disaster ever rant,rant,rant. Who can we hate now? Paddy Wallace, he's done, well nothing wrong but we hate him anyway, rant ,rant,rant.

Paddy Wallace not only kept Fergus McFadden, Jon Sexton and Mike Ross out of the team for years but was single handedly responsable for the 2007 WC flop

Did I mention, rant, rant, rant

irishbucsfan · 07-09-2011 6:35pm

WeeBushy wrote: »

What I was trying to say was that I thought he played primarily at 12, as opposed to 13, before breaking into the Leinster team and Ireland setup.

When he broke into the Leinster team it was at 13.

Then he showed some defensive weaknesses there, and when O'Malley showed up he was shifted inside. Starting I think with that Dragons defeat in 09.

Cpt_Blackbeard · 07-09-2011 6:38pm

Deleted User wrote: »

McFadden is a 13.
Wallace is a 12.

They are very different positions.

I read an article today, in which McFadden stated that he sees himself as more of a 12 (queue someone quoting Earls about 13). Lets just hope that we don't end up turning a promising 13 into a poor bosh merchant 12 to accommodate his more promising clubmate (O'Malley). I like to call it the D'Arcy debate

Hagz · 07-09-2011 6:39pm

Ireland by less than 20

Deleted User wrote: »

McFadden is a 13.
Wallace is a 12.

They are very different positions.

Isn't McFadden primarily a 12 at Leinster Emmet? I know he played a lot on the wing this year and at 13 in the warm-up, but I thought 12 was his main slot.

07-09-2011 6:42pm

Ireland by less than 20

Hagz wrote: »

Isn't McFadden primarily a 12 at Leinster Emmet? I know he played a lot on the wing this year and at 13 in the warm-up, but I thought 12 was his main slot.

nope, most game time at wing or 13.

He might be a 12 eventually, but he's not a 12 right now, which is all that really matters.

RWC Pool C: Ireland vs USA Eagles, Sun 11 Sep 7am; Pre/During/Post Match Thread.

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