CRP on Rosslare Rail Line

save the rail · 11-11-2010 04:00PM

KC61 wrote: »

I would imagine that Gerry Murphy is looking at all the services quoted above, and not just the early morning commuter from Rosslare and the evening return.

Also, the NTA have committed to fully reviewing the South Wexford bus network in 2011 - reference the link in the NTA/Oireachtas committee thread.

To be fair BE provide great services from Rosslare-Waterford via Wexford, the only problem is that those big busses are expected to negotiate narrow potholed country roads and given a time frame to do so which does not take that into account.

I agree the NTA have committed to reviewing the bus network in 2011, but when in 2011? for everyday that (a passenger is not happy) goes by its a day closer to people giving up on public transport.
To be fair to the NTA they have been very helpful and supportive duing and since SRG campaign but the issues on public transport particulary the morning replacement service need sorting sooner rather than later

dowlingm · 11-11-2010 04:34PM

schemingbohemia wrote: »

For an allegedly poor replacement service it seems to have trebled patronage on buses in the area

It would be nice if there were figures produced on that but of course that will be commercial-confidential. After all, picking figures at random, if bus = 10 and train = 30 and bus post train = 30 you have trebled your ridership but lost 25% of public transport share. Also, these figures would have to include in scope only the non-trunk portion (i.e. exclude from New Ross-Waterford) to show the effectiveness or otherwise in the catchment at issue.

purplepanda · 11-11-2010 05:33PM

The Bus is a waste of time for those in SW Wexford trying to get to Waterford City because it travels via New Ross & the usual traffic jams which both increase the journey time to make the service unviable. This situation will not change until / if ever the Barrow Bridge / New Ross Bypass is built!!!

Anyone in SW Wexford who wants to get to Waterford is better off getting a lift, hitch-hiking, or using a pushbike via the Ballyhack- Passage East Car Ferry, even walking from the Ferry up to John Meades & getting a Waterford City bus into town is better than trying to rely on this new "improved" bus service!!!:mad::mad:

So much for the NTA trying to improve public transport in South Wexford

Good Luck to the STR / SWIFT & their campaign, they are the only people who have a real understanding of the current situation.

The NTA. Government & most politicans don't give a ****e about Wexford & the SE:mad::mad:

KC61 · 11-11-2010 06:13PM

save the rail wrote: »

To be fair BE provide great services from Rosslare-Waterford via Wexford, the only problem is that those big busses are expected to negotiate narrow potholed country roads and given a time frame to do so which does not take that into account.

I agree the NTA have committed to reviewing the bus network in 2011, but when in 2011? for everyday that (a passenger is not happy) goes by its a day closer to people giving up on public transport.
To be fair to the NTA they have been very helpful and supportive duing and since SRG campaign but the issues on public transport particulary the morning replacement service need sorting sooner rather than later

To be fair to the NTA they have quite a lot on their plate and are still setting up!

Read that link that I referred to and you will see the volume of work that they have. South Wexford is the first region in the country that they are reviewing - I think that would suggest that they do recognise the priority.

KC61 · 11-11-2010 06:16PM

purplepanda wrote: »

The Bus is a waste of time for those in SW Wexford trying to get to Waterford City because it travels via New Ross & the usual traffic jams which both increase the journey time to make the service unviable. This situation will not change until / if ever the Barrow Bridge / New Ross Bypass is built!!!

Anyone in SW Wexford who wants to get to Waterford is better off getting a lift, hitch-hiking, or using a pushbike via the Ballyhack- Passage East Car Ferry, even walking from the Ferry up to John Meades & getting a Waterford City bus into town is better than trying to rely on this new "improved" bus service!!!:mad::mad:

So much for the NTA trying to improve public transport in South Wexford

Good Luck to the STR / SWIFT & their campaign, they are the only people who have a real understanding of the current situation.

The NTA. Government & most politicans don't give a ****e about Wexford & the SE:mad::mad:

I would disagree - the NTA have bent over backwards to facilitate everyone here.

Nowhere else in the country has had this level of attention.

I would agree with your sentiments regarding SWIFFT - they are doing very good work. Fair dues to them for trying, and I think if (at the very least) increased awareness of and improvements to the Rosslare/Dublin railway results then that can only be good news.

topnotch · 11-11-2010 08:38PM

It's still going to amount to nothing at the end of the day.

save the rail · 11-11-2010 08:45PM

topnotch wrote: »

It's still going to amount to nothing at the end of the day.

it already has so your statement is just a tad wrong :eek:

Transportuser09 · 11-11-2010 09:42PM

topnotch wrote: »

It's still going to amount to nothing at the end of the day.

Surely the CRP for the Rosslare-Dublin line is something. It never had one before. A few years a ago a local campaign in Tipperary managed to get a morning commuter service going from Nenagh to Limerick. And the Rosslare-Dublin line already as a decent level of service compared to Nenagh so I see no reason why the CRP might'nt be able to work with IÉ to improve services on a line which they at least have some interest in (not alot maybe but more than the regional routes). Even if it's only an extra service here and there then the group will have achieved something.

Hungerford · 11-11-2010 10:22PM

KC61 wrote: »

Also, the NTA have committed to fully reviewing the South Wexford bus network in 2011 - reference the link in the NTA/Oireachtas committee thread.

They are also committed to reviewing rail services in Waterford and Wexford, which seems to be an inappropriately small area for consideration. I just get the general impression that the NTA could become another UTA given their apparent enthusiasm for buses.

Judgement Day · 12-11-2010 11:27PM

Great to see that joined up thinking is alive and well at Irish Rail - the clowns can manage to close the Waterford/Rosslare line but they can't get it together to remove it from their online journey planner. :rolleyes: http://www.irishrail.ie/your_journey/your_station.asp?letter=B&action=showdetail&station_id=22

Oliver1985 · 13-11-2010 12:28AM

Is this Crp someones boyhood dream or is there actually any chance of it happening?

foggy_lad · 13-11-2010 02:20AM

Oliver1985 wrote: »

Is this Crp someones boyhood dream or is there actually any chance of it happening?

it started out being CPR for the waterford-rosslare rail line but that is dead and buried as there is no outside interest in re-opening it(none with money anyway) so now they are trying to get some british railway enthusiasts interested in the line from gorey to rosslare:)

are any save the rail people acting as paid consultants for any of the delicate talks and negotiations that have supposedly been going on?

save the rail · 13-11-2010 01:32PM

Oliver1985 wrote: »

Is this Crp someones boyhood dream or is there actually any chance of it happening?

CRP is happening as we type, IR have given us an office space in rosslare europort, we have been in talks with them in relation to improving the service.

We are also still working with outside companies to reinstate services on Rosslare-Waterford line.

save the rail · 13-11-2010 01:35PM

foggy_lad wrote: »

are any save the rail people acting as paid consultants for any of the delicate talks and negotiations that have supposedly been going on?

All that SRG have done has been paid for out of their own pockets. No-one is paying us, we do it because we believe railways should not be shut

serfboard · 13-11-2010 02:23PM

save the rail wrote: »

All that SRG have done has been paid for out of their own pockets. No-one is paying us, we do it because we believe railways should not be shut

Fair enough. Sorry if you think that people are being cynical here but there is a lot for people to be cynical about.

Fair play to ye if ye can manage to get Rosslare->Waterford up and running again. My concern would be that ye don't do it with subsidies that match or exceed what IR were getting. There has to be demand for it, ye have to be able to provide the services when people want them, and ye have to be able to do it for little or no subsidy - otherwise it will/should never get off the ground.

(And why for no subsidy? Because we're feckin broke that's why. Colm McCarthy gave particular mention to rail subventions in his Bord Snip report - which I expect to be fully implemented (and more) if/when the EU/IMF come in).

Oh, and by the way, I see that ye're up on the CRO now.

CIE · 13-11-2010 03:44PM

There has to be demand for it

If there's demand for the bus service, there is demand for service via other modes. IE is guilty, however, of holding down average speeds to well below the capabilities of the rail mode (under 40 mph usually). This artifice has to be addressed by the travelling populace instead of said travelling populace allowing themselves to be manipulated into doing what the government wants them to do by either jumping into their cars or onto the bus. (It's a real misnomer when a government that controls all forms of transport modes cites "competition" between modes as a reason for degrading one particular mode.)

markpb · 13-11-2010 03:44PM

CIE wrote: »

If there's demand for the bus service, there is demand for service via other modes.

Missing the point there. The level of demand at which a train service is efficient and viable is vastly higher than the level of demand which can sustain a bus service.

topnotch · 13-11-2010 04:05PM

At the end of the day the line will never be profitable without freight no matter how many surveys are taken :rolleyes:.

CIE · 13-11-2010 04:38PM

markpb wrote: »

Missing the point there. The level of demand at which a train service is efficient and viable is vastly higher than the level of demand which can sustain a bus service.

Oh, this myth again. Maybe if Irish Rail didn't deliberately hold down average speeds, and thus run trains inefficiently, the manipulation of "level of demand" would end; there is no demand for slow trains. And what of multiple units? Their efficiency per passenger way exceeds that of buses, otherwise what's the purpose of running them in short configurations.

topnotch wrote: »

At the end of the day the line will never be profitable without freight no matter how many surveys are taken

And how many roads are profitable...? All transport modes are funded by the government, so that leads to a conflict of interest. You can only have "competition" with private sector involvement and very minimal government interference. The point about railfreight is not an invalid one, but when you have IE cutting freight haulage by 40 percent four years ago with no growth plans, the conflict of interest is glaringly obvious.

corktina · 13-11-2010 09:24PM

topnotch wrote: »

At the end of the day the line will never be profitable without freight no matter how many surveys are taken :rolleyes:.

what freight do you imagine you might find in the south east that would be profitable? freight would lose more money than passenger would!

cbl593h · 13-11-2010 09:26PM

topnotch wrote: »

At the end of the day the line will never be profitable without freight no matter how many surveys are taken :rolleyes:.

So thats an excuse not to try???

wild handlin · 13-11-2010 09:59PM

corktina wrote: »

what freight do you imagine you might find in the south east that would be profitable? freight would lose more money t
than passenger would!

The beet brought in serious revnue to IE before it's demise.

What about keg traffic/cement traffic to Wexford?

Before I start - I want to make it clear that I have no connection with railways/lobby groups.
However, it cannot go un-noticed that 9/10 times that a poster updates us all on how the CRP is going, they get shot down in flames!!
"Who is the company(s) involved!?!" is often remarked; why the facination to know who is coming in to run the line? For crying out loud, you don't hear other companies/groups stating "We have had potential intererst from 4 groups, they are A,(Based in X) B,(Based in Y) and C,(Based in Z). If the group wants us to know, they will let us know; simple as.

There is definatly a sence of "wanting things to fail" here in this area of boards....e.g "I want to open a new railway line from point A to point B - what do you think?"

The answers are usually: "Ohh, it will never work!! Who are you? Why do you want to do this? Don't you know it will never work? Your wasting your time!" blaaa blaaa blaaa, there was plenty of posters on the WRC thread who mooted the WRC as being a failure from day 1, yet all have gone VERY quiet since the opening; especially when the initial figures were released which showed more of a demand for the line than was first expected.....

Judgement Day · 13-11-2010 10:23PM

wild handlin - I agree with you to a point - there are some anti-rail posters here (I am not one of them as I use trains wherever possible for myself and formerly for parcels) but it has to be said that the Save the Rail campaign/SWIFFT seems to have been diverted down a cul de sac. When the original campaign to retain the Waterford/Rosslare line was started the Rosslare/Gorey line did not feature and its recent introduction into the scheme of things merely serves to muddy the water. Certain figures in the 'Save the Rail' campaign seem to be using it as a way of increasing their political profile ahead of the next election - perhaps the committee should declare their political affiliations? Also the parachuting of a leading RUI member on to the committee also makes me deeply suspicious of what is afoot.

save the rail · 13-11-2010 10:29PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

wild handlin - I agree with you to a point - there are some anti-rail posters here (I am not one of them as I use trains wherever possible for myself and formerly for parcels) but it has to be said that the Save the Rail campaign/SWIFFT seems to have been diverted down a cul de sac. When the original campaign to retain the Waterford/Rosslare line was started the Rosslare/Gorey line did not feature and its recent introduction into the scheme of things merely serves to muddy the water. Certain figures in the 'Save the Rail' campaign seem to be using it as a way of increasing their political profile ahead of the next election - perhaps the committee should declare their political affiliations? Also the parachuting of a leading RUI member on to the committee also makes me deeply suspicious of what is afoot.

Who is supposed to using the campaign to increase their political profile?
If a leading member of RUI wants to help why would we stop him? he has done more to support us & help us than most.
Use your brains JD we were asked by the NTA to start a CRP on the Rosslare to Gorey route, what were we supposed to do? refuse because you dont agree? If we refused how can we justify fighting to retain that part of the line in the future, we would be shot down and told you were asked to try improve services & passenger numbers and refused so no point in complaining now.
:mad:

topnotch · 13-11-2010 10:38PM

What say will swifft have if a new company does come in.
The will be pushed aside and end up with no say in the decisions.

Judgement Day · 13-11-2010 10:38PM

save the rail wrote: »

Who is supposed to using the campaign to increase their political profile?
If a leading member of RUI wants to help why would we stop him? he has done more to support us & help us than most.
Use your brains JD we were asked by the NTA to start a CRP on the Rosslare to Gorey route, what were we supposed to do? refuse because you dont agree? If we refused how can we justify fighting to retain that part of the line in the future, we would be shot down and told you were asked to try improve services & passenger numbers and refused so no point in complaining now.
:mad:

You tell me about political affiliations - that's what I'm asking. And, yes I do believe that your campaign has been diverted from its original raison d’etre and that will be its undoing. As regards the RUI involvement - fair enough - but I believe that the individual concerned has a very narrow view (his own) of what constitutes an adequate rail service and is not prepared to allow any dissent - which is. as you know, why I will have nothing further to do with your campaign. As somebody who uses the DSER section of IE a lot more than your parachuted member I don't see that this is fair.

save the rail · 13-11-2010 10:44PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

You tell me about political affiliations - that's what I'm asking. And, yes I do believe that your campaign has been diverted from its original raison d’etre and that will be its undoing. As regards the RUI involvement - fair enough - but I believe that the individual concerned has a very narrow view (his own) of what constitutes an adequate rail service and is not prepared to allow any dissent - which is. as you know, why I will have nothing further to do with your campaign. As somebody who uses the DSER section of IE a lot more than your parachuted member I don't see that this is fair.

This campaign has been political free since day one, Mayor Ryan was involved in it and is Labour as you know but it wasnt a labour campaign.

As for RUI member I dont see why as an adult you couldnt accept that in this campaign there are members whom you dont like. That does not stop you from offering an opinion as to what is happening. We have put on FB a few times has anyone any suggestions to improve services and we acted on what the passengers requested.

save the rail · 13-11-2010 10:45PM

topnotch wrote: »

What say will swifft have if a new company does come in.
The will be pushed aside and end up with no say in the decisions.

perhaps we will be pushed aside by a new company, but it wont matter as long as there is a service running, although I dont see that happening, each company have stated they would like CRP on the line

Judgement Day · 13-11-2010 10:54PM

save the rail wrote: »

This campaign has been political free since day one, Mayor Ryan was involved in it and is Labour as you know but it wasnt a labour campaign.

As for RUI member I dont see why as an adult you couldnt accept that in this campaign there are members whom you dont like. That does not stop you from offering an opinion as to what is happening. We have put on FB a few times has anyone any suggestions to improve services and we acted on what the passengers requested.

Okay, I will take your word that Joe Ryan is the only political involvement in the campaign - for now. However, 'as an adult', I am telling you that I have no intention of helping, in anyway, with your campaign as long as Mark Gleeson is involved - and I'm not alone in that. Talk to some of his former buddies from Platform 11/RUI if you want more information about who you have on board. Of course you probably value his 'expertise' more anyway - so off you go.

topnotch · 13-11-2010 10:55PM

what has crp achieved on the rosslare-gorey section

CRP on Rosslare Rail Line

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