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Landis admits doping, points finger at LA - Please read Mod Warning post 1

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,778 ✭✭✭✭Inquitus


    872f361770c5612bf779965158d09755.png

    He won it 21 tours ago.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,266 ✭✭✭Junior


    Inquitus wrote: »

    He won it 21 tours ago.

    Which wasn't what you had said, you said in the last 20 winners


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,778 ✭✭✭✭Inquitus


    Junior wrote: »
    Which wasn't what you had said, you said in the last 20 winners

    The last 20 winners:

    Indurain x 5
    Riis
    Ulrich
    Pantani
    Armstrong x 7
    Periero
    Contador
    Sastre
    Contador x 2

    All drug cheats imo, I don't believe LeMond was.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 260 ✭✭mo_bhicycle


    Inquitus wrote: »
    The last 20 winners:

    Indurain x 5
    Riis
    Ulrich
    Pantani
    Armstrong x 7
    Periero
    Contador
    Sastre
    Contador x 2

    All drug cheats imo, I don't believe LeMond was.
    Are the Sastre suspicions just down to the CSC connection or is there more to it than that?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,217 ✭✭✭furiousox


    Junior wrote: »
    Which wasn't what you had said, you said in the last 20 winners

    That's what I thought you meant too.
    General consensus (whatever that is) is that LeMond was the last clean winner, that's why I asked.
    Sorry for the crossed wires.

    CPL 593H



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,567 ✭✭✭rebel.ranter


    More news coverage of the issue:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/05/sports/cycling/05armstrong.html?_r=2

    NY Times saying the net may be closing on LA


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭penexpers


    More news coverage of the issue:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/05/sports/cycling/05armstrong.html?_r=2

    NY Times saying the net may be closing on LA

    Already posted in this thread.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,916 ✭✭✭NickDrake


    Inquitus wrote: »
    The last 20 winners:

    Indurain x 5
    Riis
    Ulrich
    Pantani
    Armstrong x 7
    Periero
    Contador
    Sastre
    Contador x 2

    All drug cheats imo, I don't believe LeMond was.

    Well it is FACT that Riis was dirty. Sastre was with CSC so you would have to suspect him ya. The rest obviously no doubt about it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 241 ✭✭lyders




  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 11,672 Mod ✭✭✭✭RobFowl


    NickDrake wrote: »
    Well it is FACT that Riis was dirty. Sastre was with CSC so you would have to suspect him ya. The rest obviously no doubt about it.

    I've heard nothing specific about Sastre but he rode for Riis for a long time and Once before that so ............


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,916 ✭✭✭NickDrake




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,480 ✭✭✭✭Lumen




  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 11,672 Mod ✭✭✭✭RobFowl




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 338 ✭✭Liamo08


    Quick question for people who followed Landis' various court appearances. Did he ever testify that he never took PED's? Or was it a case of "I never took testosterone in the 06 tour" - which he still claims as far as I know?

    If so would his admission of systematic use of PED not basically make him guilty of perjury?


  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,277 Mod ✭✭✭✭Chips Lovell


    Liamo08 wrote: »
    Quick question for people who followed Landis' various court appearances. Did he ever testify that he never took PED's? Or was it a case of "I never took testosterone in the 06 tour" - which he still claims as far as I know?

    If so would his admission of systematic use of PED not basically make him guilty of perjury?

    I don't think he's been up in court over drug use yet.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,584 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    NickDrake wrote: »
    Well it is FACT that Riis was dirty. Sastre was with CSC so you would have to suspect him ya. The rest obviously no doubt about it.

    I think Sastre was very very lucky.
    It came at a time that there was no real (dirty) GC contender and he was allowed go from the base of climbs at the fast but steady pace that he likes, there was no one to disrupt his pace with AC or Schelck style attacks.

    I'd like to think Sastre was/is clean.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 338 ✭✭Liamo08


    el tonto wrote: »
    I don't think he's been up in court over drug use yet.

    Did he not testify when his case was before the Court of Arbitration for Sport and then when is was appealed the Federal Court?

    From wiki:
    On September 20, 2007, Landis was found guilty of doping by a 2–1 vote of the hearing committee, with Patrice Brunet and Richard McLaren in the majority, and Christopher Campbell dissenting. Landis was also banned from the sport for two years, dated retroactively to January 2007. Landis appealed the decision of the committee to the Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS).[33] The hearing ran from March 19 to March 24, 2008 in New York. The decision was announced on June 30, 2008,[34] with the result that the conviction and ban were upheld. In September 2008 Landis moved in U.S. federal court to vacate the CAS arbitration award, contending that the procurement of the award was tainted by partiality and conflicts of interest. Additionally, Landis contested the $100,000 U.S. "costs" award, characterizing it as a disguised punitive award.[35] The parties agreed to dismiss the case with prejudice in December 2008, finally ending the litigation surrounding the doping case.[36]


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,480 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    tunney wrote: »
    I think Sastre was very very lucky.
    It came at a time that there was no real (dirty) GC contender and he was allowed go from the base of climbs at the fast but steady pace that he likes, there was no one to disrupt his pace with AC or Schelck style attacks.

    I'd like to think Sastre was/is clean.

    I wasn't paying attention when Sastre was winning, but when I've watched him recently he's just looked slow. :(


  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,277 Mod ✭✭✭✭Chips Lovell


    Liamo08 wrote: »
    Did he not testify when his case was before the Court of Arbitration for Sport and then when is was appealed the Federal Court?

    From wiki:

    I don't think that ever went to hearings though.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 12,616 Mod ✭✭✭✭Zascar


    Why don’t they just get a 100% fully independent tester to take every sample they can find of Armstrongs and anyone else’s – and re- re-test them all.
    If he was truly innocent – he should be suggesting this himself. If he has never doped then he has nothing to hide.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 338 ✭✭Liamo08


    el tonto wrote: »
    I don't think that ever went to hearings though.

    Ah right, so he'll avoid any Marion Jones type punishments so.


  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,277 Mod ✭✭✭✭Chips Lovell


    tunney wrote: »
    I think Sastre was very very lucky.
    It came at a time that there was no real (dirty) GC contender and he was allowed go from the base of climbs at the fast but steady pace that he likes, there was no one to disrupt his pace with AC or Schelck style attacks.

    I'd like to think Sastre was/is clean.

    Some day I'd love to read the inside story of Sastre's career. He intrigues me. On the one hand he rode for ONCE and CSC. On the other, he's said to be quite anti-doping, especially since Chaba Jimenez died, who was his brother in law. Also he never seemed to get on that well with Riis, who seemed exasperated at him at times.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 338 ✭✭Liamo08


    Zascar wrote: »
    Why don’t they just get a 100% fully independent tester to take every sample they can find of Armstrongs and anyone else’s – and re- re-test them all.
    If he was truly innocent – he should be suggesting this himself. If he has never doped then he has nothing to hide.

    That'd be some laugh. I think it'd be more a case of how many they didn't catch as opposed to how many they did if they retested everyones samples going back as far as the late 1990's and early 2000's.


  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,277 Mod ✭✭✭✭Chips Lovell


    Lumen wrote: »
    That's defeatist.

    Aside from the odd outlier (e.g. PFC abuse) it seems likely that the current level of doping, in terms both of physiological benefit and health risks, is much lower than it has been for several decades....

    Tend to agree with Lumen here.

    I think we've come a long way from where we were a few years ago. At this stage it's getting much harder to dope, but more importantly, it's now possible to ride clean.

    We were at a point where, unless you were ridiculously talented, you had to dope. Not to win, just to survive. I remember Jorg Jaschke saying after he was done by Operation Puerto, that at one stage he tried riding clean and was being blown out the back of the bunch even on railway bridges. Now you've got guys we know to be clean (at least have every reason to believe they are) managing to stay competitive and people like Gilbert winning races.

    That doesn't mean that I don't think people are still doping. But the advances in testing mean that nobody can load up like they did in the past. You don't even need to test positive anymore. If you're blood profile looks wrong, you'll get done, as we saw with Pellizotti. What this means is that the gap between the dopers and non-dopers is getting smaller.

    That doesn't make it fair, but it does mean at least the clean guys are in with a shout now. That and the higher risk factor associated with doping adds to the incentive not to.

    At the moment I think there are four groups of riders in the peloton:

    1. Those who've always riden clean
    2. Those who used to dope but stopped
    3. Those who think doping is just part of the sport and will continue to do so as long as they can.
    4. The guys who are afraid to stop.

    I think there are a lot of the top guys in the fourth category. In a way it's like the nuclear arms race. Everyone spent years going one up on each other in terms of doping and the realisation has now set in that the sport has to change. But if you stop how can you be sure that your rivals are going to as well?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,266 ✭✭✭Junior


    stolen_from_DC.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,252 ✭✭✭✭Pherekydes


    mloc123 wrote: »
    Shows how good Lance is, clean as a whistle and still beating all those dirty cancer loving cheats.

    Well, Greg Lemond can do it! Even after he was shot!


  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,277 Mod ✭✭✭✭Chips Lovell


    Pherekydes wrote: »
    Well, Greg Lemond can do it! Even after he was shot!

    Not really. After EPO was introduced, Lemond was nowhere. He abandoned the the last two Tours he rode.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,318 ✭✭✭✭Raam


    Was this already posted? I've no idea really.
    DALLAS—Saying that it would probably be best if everyone sat down for this, seven-time Tour de France winner Lance Armstrong informed the U.S. populace Thursday that he wanted to tell it something, but that the nation first had to promise it wouldn't get angry once he did.

    Read the rest...
    http://www.theonion.com/articles/lance-armstrong-wants-to-tell-nation-something-but,17973/


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 252 ✭✭markcroninbsc




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 151 ✭✭jeffwode


    Lance Armstrong Wants To Tell Nation Something But Nation Has To Promise Not To Get Mad http://onion.com/dAolYA


This discussion has been closed.
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