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[US] DollHouse [** Spoilers **] (Renewed!)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 44,032 ✭✭✭✭Basq


    Eliza looks "teh sex" in that.. yummy! :eek:

    But after seeing the trailer, does it remind anyone else slightly of 'My Own Worst Enemy'? The new drama starring Christian Slater, currently airing on NBC.

    Still, very much looking forward to this.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,081 ✭✭✭ziedth


    I'm also really looking forward to this to put it midly Joss is fairly good at TV shows so I hope this gets a good one, Nice to see Fred from angel with a bit of work,

    Wait for the Cameos from Mal and other members from Firefly/Buffyverse.

    Hope its good cant wait the ad yet cause in work and big brother is watching :eek::eek::eek:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,906 ✭✭✭J-blk


    basquille wrote: »
    does it remind anyone else slightly of 'My Own Worst Enemy'?

    Yep, very much in fact, the core idea seems similar, though "Dollhouse" seems to deal more with a team, rather than focusing on one agent (though the trailer was all about Eliza...).

    Still, I'm very much looking forward to this and hope it lasts, rather than go the way of Firefly (sniff...). I'm quite enjoying "My Own Worst Enemy" but apparently it is tanking in the ratings and could be canned soon - so that could be bad news for "Dollhouse", if it initially seems similar to the US audience (maybe they should include some kind of dancing contest in the pilot to boost ratings... :P).


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I thought that Dollhouse had already been cancelled? Or was that J.J Abrahm's new show?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 44,032 ✭✭✭✭Basq


    Neither have been cancelled.. JJ Abram's new show is 'Fringe' and in no real fear of cancellation I'd imagine.

    Dollhouse was pushed back to January.. as it was originally going to air in September. Maybe that's where you're getting confused.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,518 ✭✭✭matrim


    I'm really looking forward to this too.

    Is the woman in the trailer that says "Nothing is as it seems to be", the same as the one who played the evil watcher in buffy (trying to get some glove).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,906 ✭✭✭J-blk


    I thought that Dollhouse had already been cancelled? Or was that J.J Abrahm's new show?

    Both Fringe and Dollhouse had shut down production for scripts to be reworked/improved on...

    Fringe returns this Wednesday in the US and has already been given a full season (22?) pickup by the network. I'm hoping Dollhouse will fare as well too but it is a Joss Whedon show on FOX...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 44,032 ✭✭✭✭Basq


    Oh God.. Fox has given it the infamous "Friday Night Death Slot!" :(

    Other Sci-fi shows cancelled in Fox’s Friday Death Slot:
    The Adventures of Brisco County Jr. (1993)
    MANTIS (1994)
    Strange Luck (1995)
    Sliders (1996)
    Millennium (1996)
    The Visitor (1997)
    Harsh Realm (1999)
    Freakylinks (2000)
    Dark Angel (2000)
    The Lone Gunmen (2001)
    John Doe (2003)
    Firefly (2003)

    It will have it's premiere on Friday the 13th of February 2009... any more bad omens?! :D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,906 ✭✭✭J-blk


    Yep, just noticed the other thread - damn you, FOX! I'd say the show doesn't have a chance in hell now. Not only is it in the Friday night death-slot, it has Terminator: SCC as its' lead-in, which even though I enjoy as a show, has performed pretty poorly ratings-wise (and is probably being moved to Fridays so it can be killed off along with "Dollhouse")...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 270 ✭✭Full_Circle


    Both Sliders and Millennium got a good few seasons under their belts before they ended, so maybe it isnt all bad. Still, it might take just one more of his shows to be cancelled before Joss finally learns his lesson of associating with Fox.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,081 ✭✭✭ziedth


    Just a thought I had but surely the "friday night death slot" shouldn't really apply anymore like it did in the late 90's early 00's since alot of people in the states not how TEVO (American sky plus don't know spelling).

    I could be wrong now, Anyway i'm looking forward to it! as for the rest of the stuff on fox I wouldn't wash my balls with them.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 55,534 ✭✭✭✭Mr E


    TIVO is more common, but doesn't really count for much, ziedth. Like Sky+, you can skip past the ads. They are more interested in live ad revenue, which (if people use TIVO) they aren't going to make much from.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,906 ✭✭✭J-blk


    The ratings are also still calculated using the retarded Nielsen system, which only represents a small amount of the population (which is fascinated by dumb reality shows it seems) and does not take into account TiVo, any other sort of DVR, online streaming like Hulu, Amazon and digital downloads from iTunes, etc. And because of the way ratings are calculated, Friday night is still a death slot.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,081 ✭✭✭ziedth


    Mr E wrote: »
    TIVO is more common, but doesn't really count for much, ziedth. Like Sky+, you can skip past the ads. They are more interested in live ad revenue, which (if people use TIVO) they aren't going to make much from.

    I see I didn't think of it like that, I stand corrected and the system seems to be deeply flawed.

    it really is a Pity cause JW deserves a good run for one of his shows like he had with Buffy but didn't really have with Angel/Firefly.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 55,534 ✭✭✭✭Mr E


    Angel had a good 5 year run.
    Firefly was screwed, though.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,588 ✭✭✭JP Liz


    Whedon announced he was planning to shoot a significant number of Dollhouse webisodes — one for every regular episode produced


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,192 ✭✭✭TarfHead




  • Closed Accounts Posts: 97 ✭✭vivadeadponies


    Both Sliders and Millennium got a good few seasons under their belts before they ended, so maybe it isnt all bad. Still, it might take just one more of his shows to be cancelled before Joss finally learns his lesson of associating with Fox.

    sliders thrived in that slot didn't it?

    when it switched channels it went to hell


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,588 ✭✭✭JP Liz


    part of me kinda wants this show to fail so he might make a sequel or prequel to Serenity/Firely in some form i.e. film, book or comic, tv series etc


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,906 ✭✭✭J-blk


    JP Liz wrote: »
    part of me kinda wants this show to fail so he might make a sequel or prequel to Serenity/Firely in some form i.e. film, book or comic, tv series etc

    As much as I loved Firefly, that's not gonna happen so I hope Dollhouse is a runaway success and Joss Whedon gets to tell the whole story he has in mind, regardless how many seasons it takes him...

    FOX managed to partially restore my faith in the fact that maybe they do give a crap about this show (and T:SCC), with an awesome Grindhouse-style ad - check it out here:

    http://www.tvsquad.com/2009/02/04/fantastic-dollhouse-terminator-promo-video/

    But I still wouldn't hold my breath about the show lasting...


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,082 ✭✭✭lostexpectation


    oh very tarantino -ish


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,013 ✭✭✭SirLemonhead


    Ah right, seemed interested in this. Joss Whedon wrote it? blech :confused:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 55,534 ✭✭✭✭Mr E


    Starting next Friday. Not long to wait now....


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,714 ✭✭✭✭Earthhorse


    Next Friday here, or in the States?

    Has a network over here picked it up yet?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 55,534 ✭✭✭✭Mr E


    States, Earthhorse. No idea if anyone over here has picked it up yet. I think it'll need to get some traction over there first before anyone over this side pays any money for it.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I was referring to Six Degrees previously


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 44,032 ✭✭✭✭Basq


    Some goddamn woeful reviews so far..! :(

    http://www.aintitcool.com/node/40111
    Entertainment Weekly gives it an “B-minus” and says:

    … Dushku's acting is dexterous and beguiling. Given the artfully vague hints of an intriguingly desperate past for Echo, as well as Whedon's track record, we ought to cut the show some slack. Let's see if Whedon can bring this doll to greater life. …

    USA Today gives it two and a half stars (out of four) and says:

    … an empty-vessel premise that probably couldn't support a series even were it more adroitly cast … The result is a show that his most devoted fans will debate and embrace, and a mass audience just won't get. … We love you, Joss, but please, build something else.

    Time Magazine says:

    … If it weren't for Whedon's pedigree, I'm not sure I'd be dying to see a second episode. …

    The Los Angeles Times says:

    … beyond disappointing. Overcrowded with plotlines, high-tech gimmicks and ambition yet empty of emotional connection and purpose, "Dollhouse" tries so hard to be so many things it winds up being nothing much at all. …

    The Chicago Tribune says:

    … is "Dollhouse" worth watching? Though Whedon fans no doubt want the answer to be a slam-dunk "yes," I can only, at this point, supply a more tentative "Yes, but …" …

    The Washington Post says:

    … a pretentious and risible jumble … Slices of mumbo don't come much more jumbo than this … it's enough to make one long for the days when TV dramas were criticized for being too pat, too predictable, too much like one another. Whedon, who directed the pilot, certainly dressed it up stylishly, but I'll take simple coherence over fancy-pants trappings any day. …

    The San Francisco Chronicle says:

    … a major disappointment. … judging from two additional episodes - one a step forward, the other a step back to the underwhelming quality of the pilot - it could be that Whedon has invested too much hope in his muse, Eliza Dushku, the star of "Dollhouse." It could also be that the premise is too flawed for anyone to elevate.

    The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette says:

    … isn't awful, but neither is it remarkably good. It's a passable hour of entertainment that shows potential to improve but flails and confuses (and occasionally bores) from the start. …

    The Salt Lake Tribune says:

    … The kidnapping story is standard criminal fare, and we are given little to no information about Echo's background, which might give viewers a reason to latch on to her character. … I'll watch a few more episodes, but I'm afraid it won't be any more watchable than one of "Star Trek's" worst episodes ever.

    The Newark Star Ledger says:

    … The idea seems too complicated by half … it looks like a slate that keeps getting half-wiped as Whedon struggles to decide what to draw. …

    The Boston Globe says:

    … doesn't stand up to the broad interpretations it invites. … Ultimately, you'll want to think about "Dollhouse" more than you'll want to think about watching "Dollhouse." …

    Variety says:

    Joss Whedon's cult following is no secret, but he seems assured of attracting the faithful and little else with "Dollhouse" -- a series that exhibits a kitchen-sink mentality, throwing in a half-dozen assorted plot threads that intertwine to create confusion. … attempting to unravel this convoluted package suggests that by the time "Dollhouse" finds itself, there won't be anybody but hard-core Whedon worshippers left to play with. …

    The Hollywood Reporter says:

    … it's easy to see the high aspiration and grand potential of the series but far more difficult to develop any sort of attachment to either the conceit or its enchanting young star and co-producer, Eliza Dushku. … Although Whedon infuses "Dollhouse" with an impressively detailed story line and social structure as well as nifty production values, the show lacks something for viewers to grab onto. Having a personality-shifting protagonist makes for a rooting challenge and, at its core, a disappointingly soulless exercise. On the other hand, Whedon knows how to build a story like few others, and Dushku is an uncommonly talented performer who breathes vibrant life into the ever-evolving blank canvas scheme. So this could definitely turn into something special over time, if the Friday night ratings can justify the patience.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,714 ✭✭✭✭Earthhorse


    Hmmm. I read a few of them then stopped. People are gonna round on me for saying this but...first few episodes of Firefly sucked. Maybe it'll take him a while to find his feet but I'm confident Joss will pull off another show worth watching.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 55,534 ✭✭✭✭Mr E


    Ouch.

    (I'm still going to watch it).


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,906 ✭✭✭J-blk


    TBH, I don't care what self-important TV critics have to say, I can make up my own mind. Most of the reviews seem to say something along the lines of "oh, it's complicated and too many plot lines"... Sheesh, why don't they go watch "Dancing with the Z-list" or some other f*cking reality crap then... or "According to Jim"...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,640 ✭✭✭Pushtrak


    What are peoples take on who will pick this show up? TV3? Sky One? BBC1?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 55,534 ✭✭✭✭Mr E


    If it does well, then its anyones game. If RTE buy it, they'll show it at 4:15am. Sky might give it a better shot.

    If it doesn't do well, then it mightn't show here at all (or on sci-fi if you're lucky).


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 17,994 Mod ✭✭✭✭ixoy


    Mr E wrote: »
    If it doesn't do well, then it mightn't show here at all (or on sci-fi if you're lucky).
    So Sci-Fi channel it will be then, yeah? I'm already prepared for the worst, what with the time slot and with all the trouble on the set itself.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 55,534 ✭✭✭✭Mr E


    OK so after basquille's collection of reviews above, I was expecting the worst.

    However, I.... liked it.

    The '....' is a reservation - this is obviously a season long story (at least), and the first episode was good (but not fantastic). Its a great idea for a show, and the whole Dollhouse aspect was great. However, we all know how fickle the American TV Audience is, and we all know how ratings-sensitive Fox are. If the people who tuned in this week to check it out don't come back next week, then the show is goosed.

    A reserved thumbs up from me... I'd love to see where they go with it, but I fear I won't get the chance.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,837 ✭✭✭abelard


    I didn't think it was amazing either but definitely good.

    I'm very hopeful for the concept though and I thiknk it has a lot of potential. I just hope it gets the audience that, it looks like for now at least, it deserves.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,864 ✭✭✭uberpixie


    Joe90 with hotties tbh.

    I did enjoy it though. :D
    Would def watch another few episodes.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,788 ✭✭✭tvnutz


    I liked it as well,really like the concept of it anyway. It didn't blow me away like many shows try to do with their first episode. That tactic can work really well or be a disaster.

    But it was definatly interesting,the concept of it gives the show potential,there are so many stories that can be told.

    Of course American viewers are impatient and fickle,and FOX clearly don't care about the show. Putting it on a friday clearly shows that. I don't know why Joss Whedon did a show with them again. They dumped the Sarah Conner Chronicles on a friday because they knew it would do badly and they will cancel it at the end of the season.

    Ratings for Dollhouse:

    1. It averaged 4.72 million viewers (#3 behind CBS' Flashpoint and ABC's Supernanny) from 9-10 p.m., with a second-place finish among adults 18-49 (2.0/ 6).

    2. The positive news was growth out of Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles of 1.01 million viewers and 43 percent among adults 18-49.

    The growth is good but for FOX 4.72million is not a good number compared to their other shows and that number will drop next week,no doubt.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,082 ✭✭✭lostexpectation


    eliza looking well, joss is not afraid of showing up the hotness, why is the handler always black?

    see the use of tilt shift in the intro, all the rage these days, but suits it, very seventies, puppet like.

    what about the first section when she was out, i thought she'd meet that guy somewhere agian and not recognize him...?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 21,634 ✭✭✭✭Richard Dower


    Just saw the first ep. totally sucks a**!, took ages to even get the central plot and once i did i was totally bored!

    I'm not a fan of Eliza in anything tbh and her "acting" skillz in this are no better then anything i have seen from her before. It's clear Josh's original concept has been all but neutered by Fox and clearly the graveyard Friday night slot dosen't bode well for this series. I suspect if figures slump it will be pulled after 6-8 episodes and the remaninder will end up on the Sci-Fi channel.

    On that note...Fox sucks!, they pulled Keen Eddie before it's time and they also pulled the excellent Opposite Sex after just 6 episodes!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 33 Companion Cube


    to the above poster, i couldn't disagree with you more. While it wasnt amazing you have to take into account 2 key factors...

    First pilot's are notoriously not representative of the weekly quality of alot of shows, they need to introduce the premise, the characters and in the case of self contained episodes tell a decent story as well. Its alot to cram into 40-50 minutes.

    Second Joss Whedon pilots are also quite bad as well, i thought the buffy pilot was pretty dire, the angel pilot was better but still didn't represent what that show had to offer and while the firefly pilot was actually excellent, the one that actually aired first "the train job" was probably the worst of the short run series.

    The show didnt have the humor of most whedon shows, its darker but its well told and executed. Besides according to a few preview screenings, the 2nd episode is ALOT better.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 21,634 ✭✭✭✭Richard Dower


    But the concept is hardly original?...implanting a new personality into someone. Is there more to it then that?, will each week see Echo having a new personality an on some "mission" with the odd data leak here and there and her questioning who she really is??....is that all there is to it?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 33 Companion Cube


    umm, as far as alot of shows go these days its pretty damn original. And its pinned as a self contained episode series so yeah its a weekly problem and solution inside each episode like every other Whedon show (except certain seasons of angel).

    However, not every episode is going to be from echo's perspective, its going to deal with other actives inside the dollhouse. You also have the outside subplots of the FBI agent's mission to reveal the place.

    But it does rest on how much you like eliza because alot of episodes will rest on seeing her range of acting as she tackles completely different personas each week, that and waiting to see how the dollhouse eventually falls apart.

    But i dunno, maybe it doesnt have enough guns going off or explosions to keep people interested.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,503 ✭✭✭✭Also Starring LeVar Burton


    But the concept is hardly original?...implanting a new personality into someone. Is there more to it then that?, will each week see Echo having a new personality an on some "mission" with the odd data leak here and there and her questioning who she really is??....is that all there is to it?

    It's Joss Whedon - there's gonna be more to it than just new personality every episode.
    It wasn't bad - it has got potential. I'll give it another 2 episodes before I decide either way.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,560 ✭✭✭Ivan


    I really liked it. It had subtle undertones throughout, which is atypical of Joss Whedon but not of similar types of shows. Perhaps I'm being a fanboi and I admit I do like pretty much everything else Joss has done (although not the later Buffy series') but I still felt engrossed in the show which is something pretty rare for me of late.

    I really cant understand though how some critics are saying the plot is convoluted. It's a bloody sci-fi show and the plot is no more complex than any other Sci-Fi show out there. Honestly, can we get a Sci-Fi fan to critique the show please?

    Seriously...

    … a pretentious and risible jumble … Slices of mumbo don't come much more jumbo than this … it's enough to make one long for the days when TV dramas were criticized for being too pat, too predictable, too much like one another. Whedon, who directed the pilot, certainly dressed it up stylishly, but I'll take simple coherence over fancy-pants trappings any day. …

    It's not a drama you failure of a human being, it's a Sci-Fi drama. The "Sci-Fi" part is the clue.

    And yes, a definite Joe 90 vibe to it, I tried to use that as a comparison to explain to a friend what the premise of the show was, to a friend. When he didnt know what Joe 90 was I had to explain that one too :p

    Season 1 preview which was at the end of the pilot episode, albeit not the version I saw ;)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBJJVj8TYr0


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 51 ✭✭acid.rain


    i read about this in Entertainment Weekly about some dolls being mindwiped to take on hostage negotiations and specializing in appropriated hand to hand combat. the premise?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,906 ✭✭✭J-blk


    Ivan wrote: »
    I really cant understand though how some critics are saying the plot is convoluted. It's a bloody sci-fi show and the plot is no more complex than any other Sci-Fi show out there. Honestly, can we get a Sci-Fi fan to critique the show please?

    Nicely said. It seems these critics are only happy with yet another crime/cop drama of some sort and everything else is too "convoluted" for them... The main problem is, I can see these kinds of critics representing the audience that FOX will be looking for and without mainstream success, it'll be canned very soon. TBH, I'd be very worried about this show even reaching Firefly's run of episodes...

    I liked it. It wasn't mind-blowing, OMG-best-pilot ever, but it nicely set the scene for the various main plot threads and does show potential. Not too sure what to make of that scene right at the end there, I know it's setting things up, but it did seem a bit too out of place - the guy watching the video could be anyone... The first few seconds also seemed to imply that Echo was in a way "sentenced" or volunteered to be in the Dollhouse, but once wiped, the actives seem to have no idea of what has happened to them.

    So overall, good, with potential but there is 0% chance of this surviving for any length of time...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,082 ✭✭✭lostexpectation


    i don't think it explained how they exist it such a dumb state...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,518 ✭✭✭matrim


    I thought it was a decent first episode, which setup the series well. It will be interesting to see how they develop it further (if they are given the chance)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 44,032 ✭✭✭✭Basq


    Ouch!
    Expectations were low.

    But they weren't quite this low.

    The series premiere of Joss Whedon's "Dollhouse" was seen by 4.7 million viewers Friday night and garnered a 2.0 preliminary adults 18-49 rating and 6 share. It was beaten in the 9 p.m. hour by ABC's "Supernanny" (6.1 million viewers, 2.2/7) and is the lowest-rated scripted series premiere on a major broadcast network this season aside from NBC's now-defunct "Crusoe."


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,082 ✭✭✭lostexpectation


    how many have they made? will it be on next week?


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