M8 - Cashel to Cullahill

D.L.R. · 28-10-2008 8:15pm

what is the point comparing with England? might as well compare with Germany or China while you're at it. England is most certainly not "empty apart from the urban areas" - its heavily populated everywhere between London and Yorkshire, by our standards.

If you must compare with the Brits, then Scotland would be a much better gauge - centralised, hilly, same population, same area, etc.

Lennoxschips · 28-10-2008 8:20pm

MYOB wrote: »

Scale them all down and we're not that different.

That's a big ask.

We're a completely different country in terms of population distribution.

The irony is that England built a motorway network in a style that would suit Ireland, while Ireland is building a motorway network in a style that would have suited England.

Incompetence on both sides of the Irish Sea.

AugustusMaximus · 28-10-2008 8:26pm

Lennoxschips wrote: »

That's a big ask.

We're a completely different country in terms of population distribution.

The irony is that England built a motorway network in a style that would suit Ireland, while Ireland is building a motorway network in a style that would have suited England.

Incompetence on both sides of the Irish Sea.

I would have said that scaled down, France would be a much better example.

Cities well distributed with seperate inter urbans linking them all.

Ireland is completely the wrong shape to be able to have just one or two main corridors to serve all the cities.

BluntGuy · 28-10-2008 8:28pm

D.L.R. wrote: »

what is the point comparing with England? might as well compare with Germany or China while you're at it. England is most certainly not "empty apart from the urban areas" - its heavily populated everywhere between London and Yorkshire, by our standards.

Scotland would be a much better gauge - centralised, hilly, same population, same area, etc. I wonder how our network stacks up to theirs?

In Scotland there are a few motorways, most of them centered on Glasgow, Edinburgh and Stirling. The main motorways are the M8 and the M9 (which actually connect at a free-flow junction) and the M74/A74(M) linking Glasgow to the Border.

In terms of linear distance, our networks are very similar in length... at the moment.

When our network is complete, it will be much more expansive and much greater in length than the Scottish network. It will also be a lot more logical, Scotland's motorway network is somewhat disjoined and patchy, with many spur motorways such as the M80 and the M898 and gaps (the two M8s don't link up).

However, arguably, we're the same in places as the M4 and M7 don't link with the M50 and the M18 doesn't connect with the M7 etc.

L1011 · 28-10-2008 8:36pm

Scotland also has a sub-WS2 grade road from its capital to the border using the signed "THE SOUTH, LONDON" route...

Amtmann · 29-10-2008 12:25pm

I just rang the RoadbridgeSisk offices. The road will open on Monday, 8 December.

Irish and Proud · 29-10-2008 2:07pm

Furet wrote: »

I just rang the RoadbridgeSisk offices. The road will open on Monday, 8 December.

Well, Santa is coming early and in the process, we'll have about 50 miles of continuous M8 from Cullahill to Mitchelstown by Christmas. That's on top of the 35 miles of M6 from Kinnegead to Athlone we now have since the summer. Although incomplete, we'll now have 6 proper motorways (30 miles of more) - the following are approximate distances:

1) M01... 50 miles ex former M1 south of M50 jct;
2) M04... 29 miles (+4 miles with reclassification);
3) M06... 35 miles;
4) M07... 35 miles;
5) M08... 50 miles;
6) M50... 30 miles inc DPT and M11 (OK, I'm cheating!).

Future motorways of 30 miles or more include:

7) M03... 2009 (est);
8) M09... 2010 (latest);
9) M11... 2012 (if we're lucky!);
10) M18... 2015 (if we're lucky!).

Again, the above does not refer to total completions, but refers to when continuous motorways stretching for 30 miles of more are realised!

I hope Arklow to Rathnew scheme commences by 2010!

Regards!

ipodrocker · 29-10-2008 2:41pm

Furet wrote: »

I just rang the RoadbridgeSisk offices. The road will open on Monday, 8 December.

thats great news hope they stay by their word!

BluntGuy · 29-10-2008 3:04pm

It's good news in the fact that we now have a confirmed opening date...

But I would've liked to have seen it open slightly sooner, ah well...

In more good news, this thread is finally back on topic!

BluntGuy · 29-10-2008 3:07pm

Irish and Proud wrote: »

Well, Santa is coming early and in the process, we'll have about 50 miles of continuous M8 from Cullahill to Mitchelstown by Christmas. That's on top of the 35 miles of M6 from Kinnegead to Athlone we now have since the summer. Although incomplete, we'll now have 6 proper motorways (30 miles of more) - the following are approximate distances:

1) M01... 50 miles ex former M1 south of M50 jct;
2) M04... 29 miles (+4 miles with reclassification);
3) M06... 35 miles;
4) M07... 35 miles;
5) M08... 50 miles;
6) M50... 30 miles inc DPT and M11 (OK, I'm cheating!).

Future motorways of 30 miles or more include:

7) M03... 2009 (est);
8) M09... 2010 (latest);
9) M11... 2012 (if we're lucky!);
10) M18... 2015 (if we're lucky!).

Again, the above does not refer to total completions, but refers to when continuous motorways stretching for 30 miles of more are realised!

I hope Arklow to Rathnew scheme commences by 2010!

Regards!

Well the M6, M7, M8 and M9 will be the longest motorways in Ireland, each over 100 km in length (the M7 may even reach 200 km if they eventually re-designate the bit after Naas and the Limerick tunnel).

The M20, M1 and M18 will be next, followed by err... the rest of them.

If they were ever to construct a full M25 from Rosslare to Cork, that would be very long (by our standards anyway) too...

Anyway, once this opens, the M8 will be the longest motorway in Ireland!

ipodrocker · 29-10-2008 4:16pm

great to sse our motorways are on time and ahead of time too!

D'Peoples Voice · 29-10-2008 5:24pm

Irish and Proud wrote: »

Well, Santa is coming early and in the process, we'll have about 50 miles of continuous M8 from Cullahill to Mitchelstown by Christmas. That's on top of the 35 miles of M6 from Kinnegead to Athlone we now have since the summer. Although incomplete, we'll now have 6 proper motorways (30 miles of more) - the following are approximate distances:

1) M01... 50 miles ex former M1 south of M50 jct;
2) M04... 29 miles (+4 miles with reclassification);
3) M06... 35 miles;
4) M07... 35 miles;
5) M08... 50 miles;
6) M50... 30 miles inc DPT and M11 (OK, I'm cheating!).

Future motorways of 30 miles or more include:

7) M03... 2009 (est);
8) M09... 2010 (latest);
9) M11... 2012 (if we're lucky!);
10) M18... 2015 (if we're lucky!).

Again, the above does not refer to total completions, but refers to when continuous motorways stretching for 30 miles of more are realised!

I hope Arklow to Rathnew scheme commences by 2010!

Regards!

Ironic for someone calling themselves "Irish and Proud" to be using a means of measurement not accepted in Ireland:D:D:D
Are you sure you're not a plastic paddy? In the Republic of Ireland we use kilometers unless you work for Iarnrod Eireann!
So that would be
11 km - dundalk
9.4 km north of dundalk
29 km Kilbeggan to Athlone
39.5km Cullahil to Cashel
40km Cashel to Micthelstown
8km M50
5.6km port tunnel
22.9 Km Gorey bypass
13.65km Rathnew/Ashford
etc, etc

BluntGuy · 29-10-2008 5:34pm

Where are people getting 40km for Cashel-Mitchelstown?

As far as I know the Cashel-Mitchelstown scheme is 37 km, the Cashel bypass is 6.7 km and the Cashel-Cullahill stretch is 41 km.

The Fermoy bypass is 18 km long and Watergrasshill - Dunkettle is roughly 15 km long.

As for Mitchelstown-Fermoy, I've seen 16km, 18km and 22 km?!! Which one is correct?

E92 · 29-10-2008 5:52pm

D'Peoples Voice wrote: »

In the Republic of Ireland we use kilometers unless you work for Iarnrod Eireann!

What are these "kilometer" things you speak of?

Because there's no such thing as "kilometers" in this country.

Oh, and it's Iarnród Éireann as opposed to "Iarnrod Eireann" too.

BluntGuy · 29-10-2008 6:15pm

E92 wrote: »

What are these "kilometer" things you speak of?

Because there's no such thing as "kilometers" in this country.

Oh, and it's Iarnród Éireann as opposed to "Iarnrod Eireann" too.

I think "kilometer" is the American spelling...

Anyway, I have a feeling I'll drag this further off-topic if I continue, I better shut up...

To bring it back on topic (or nearly anyway), how long will the Mitchelstown-Fermoy section be? I've seen 16, 18 and 22 km. Anybody else got another possible length?

D'Peoples Voice · 30-10-2008 2:42pm

BluntGuy wrote: »

Where are people getting 40km for Cashel-Mitchelstown?

As far as I know the Cashel-Mitchelstown scheme is 37 km, the Cashel bypass is 6.7 km and the Cashel-Cullahill stretch is 41 km.

I was using the NRA as my source

BluntGuy · 30-10-2008 3:17pm

D'Peoples Voice wrote: »

I was using the NRA as my source

Well that kinda explains it...

Nope. As far as I know, the stretch is 37km -

12km from Cashel - Cahir, 25km from Cahir - Carrigine.

The NRA's website must be including part of the Cashel bypass or Fermoy-Mitchlestown scheme. Either way, it doesn't really matter, but it would be nice for them to actually know how long the stretches of road they're building are.

Amtmann · 30-10-2008 4:52pm

That extra 3km includes the 2+1 N24 Bypass of Cahir.

BluntGuy · 30-10-2008 5:11pm

Furet wrote: »

That extra 3km includes the 2+1 N24 Bypass of Cahir.

Okay. I understand now.

But surely that should be listed as a seperate link-road. It says MAINLINE LENGTH: 40km. The mainline of the M8 in that section is only 37 km...

Oh... I don't even know what I'm complaining about anymore! The bloody road's been built already, I should just shut up!

Lennoxschips · 30-10-2008 7:22pm

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

I would have said that scaled down, France would be a much better example.

Cities well distributed with seperate inter urbans linking them all.

Ireland is completely the wrong shape to be able to have just one or two main corridors to serve all the cities.

You could have many smaller corridors instead. Or a couple of major corridors supplemented by smaller corridors.

But we've chosen to have many major corridors. A system is being built that is much to large for an island country of four million.

Zoney · 31-10-2008 12:36am

Many major corridors? We have rural two lane motorways, not remotely extravagant.

As it is, the entire west, midwest, southwest and south depends on two routes in/out of Dublin, the N4 and N7.

Any further rationalisation would indeed just lead to the kind of problems in the UK where you have to spend a fortune accommodating M50-style upgrades of the trunk corridors.

invincibleirish · 31-10-2008 3:03am

Zoney wrote: »

Any further rationalisation would indeed just lead to the kind of problems in the UK where you have to spend a fortune accommodating M50-style upgrades of the trunk corridors.

But the UKs population didnt increase massively during its Motorway building years, the only thing that changed was car ownership increased. Rationalization on the Interurbans would have meant extra cash to spend on upgrades of congested roads/ upgrade of public transport options.

Danno · 31-10-2008 10:19pm

Whats the problem building these roads? I'd rather be looking at them than looking for them!

Amtmann · 08-11-2008 4:50pm

New signage is being erected daily now. It looks like the builders are doing all the final fixes now. This is being kept very quiet in the press. You'd think Cashel South Tipp and Kilkenny councillors would be trumpeting this.

AugustusMaximus · 08-11-2008 4:55pm

Furet wrote: »

New signage is being erected daily now. It looks like the builders are doing all the final fixes now. This is being kept very quiet in the press. You'd think Cashel South Tipp and Kilkenny councillors would be trumpeting this.

What sort of timescale are we looking at there Furet ?

Any esimation on time saving with the opening of this scheme ?

ipodrocker · 09-11-2008 12:06am

Furet wrote: »

I just rang the RoadbridgeSisk offices. The road will open on Monday, 8 December.

Furet last quoted saying 8th Dec, which is only 4 weeks away! But if the process is faster that would be class and also NRA will come out and say the scheme opened so many months ahead as they always do.

Amtmann · 09-11-2008 1:00am

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

What sort of timescale are we looking at there Furet ?

Any esimation on time saving with the opening of this scheme ?

Well I'd say that with the bypassing of Horse and Jockey, Littleton, Urlingford and Johnstown (none of which are really bottlenecks), plus the 120 limit, you could save maybe ten minutes at absolute most on your journey when traffic on the soon-to-be R639 is light (at weekends and such). Of course, when the soon-to-be R639 between Cashel and Cullahill is busy, which it certainly is on weekdays, the time saving would be significantly greater on the motorway (perhaps 15 minutes: no more lorry convoys, granny-driver build-ups, or agricultural vehicles; these aren't a problem at weekends because the existing road is mostly wide, straight, and of good quality).

The real benefit of this 40km scheme is one of eliminating juggernaut convoys and improving safety. The section between Cashel and Urlingford in particular experiences very heavy traffic at certain times. The Horse and Jockey junction especially is chaotic sometimes. But the big time saver on the M8 corridor will be the Mitchelstown to Fermoy section, which could knock 12 to 15 minutes off the journey -- bearing in mind that scheme is only 16km long, that's a remarkable reduction in journey time.

corktina · 09-11-2008 8:39am

just right! I have to drive to Dublin Xmas night....anyone fancy a sweepstake on how long it';; take me now?

AugustusMaximus · 09-11-2008 2:24pm

corktina wrote: »

just right! I have to drive to Dublin Xmas night....anyone fancy a sweepstake on how long it';; take me now?

Christmas night !!.

Two hours Cork to Dublin, easy. Depends how fast you want to go. I doubt any Gardai will bother you.

corktina · 09-11-2008 7:08pm

just as well...i'll be hanging out the door langered again i expect.....

corktina · 09-11-2008 7:09pm

(i was joking...)

corktina · 09-11-2008 7:11pm

(before anyone asks) I got a daughter working Stephens day in Dublin.....so someone has to drive up from Cork to take her back.....what a top class Pappa I am....

marmurr1916 · 09-11-2008 8:56pm

Furet wrote: »

Well I'd say that with the bypassing of Horse and Jockey, Littleton, Urlingford and Johnstown (none of which are really bottlenecks), plus the 120 limit, you could save maybe ten minutes at absolute most on your journey when traffic on the soon-to-be R639 is light (at weekends and such). Of course, when the soon-to-be R639 between Cashel and Cullahill is busy, which it certainly is on weekdays, the time saving would be significantly greater on the motorway (perhaps 15 minutes: no more lorry convoys, granny-driver build-ups, or agricultural vehicles; these aren't a problem at weekends because the existing road is mostly wide, straight, and of good quality).

The real benefit of this 40km scheme is one of eliminating juggernaut convoys and improving safety. The section between Cashel and Urlingford in particular experiences very heavy traffic at certain times. The Horse and Jockey junction especially is chaotic sometimes. But the big time saver on the M8 corridor will be the Mitchelstown to Fermoy section, which could knock 12 to 15 minutes off the journey -- bearing in mind that scheme is only 16km long, that's a remarkable reduction in journey time.

Actually you can get traffic jams in Urlingford and Durrow that each add about 10 minutes to your journey at busier times.

I reckon the Cashel-Cullahill section will save about 30 minutes at peak times and 15-20 minutes at less busy times.

When you factor in the time savings on other sections, the total savings along the entire route from Dunkettle to Portlaoise will be over an hour even at quiet times.

marmurr1916 · 09-11-2008 8:59pm

MYOB wrote: »

Scotland also has a sub-WS2 grade road from its capital to the border using the signed "THE SOUTH, LONDON" route...

Not quite. The A1 from Edinburgh to south of Haddington is high-quality dual-carriageway and there are alternating sections of single- and dual-carriageway from there to Berwick-on-Tweed.

road_high · 09-11-2008 9:02pm

marmurr1916 wrote: »

Actually you can get traffic jams in Urlingford and Durrow that each add about 10 minutes to your journey at busier times.

I reckon the Cashel-Cullahill section will save about 30 minutes at peak times and 15-20 minutes at less busy times.

When you factor in the time savings on other sections, the total savings along the entire route from Dunkettle to Portlaoise will be over an hour even at quiet times.

It can be very slow all the way between Durrow and Urlingford in particular.
And the section before Cashel is horrendous sometimes, traffic can just back and go at a snails pace, particularly with tractors/ geriatric drivers etc...
So roll on the new section.

Stark · 09-11-2008 9:10pm

Yeah I've generally found that section to be the worst for getting unlucky with the person at the top of the queue. Ended up doing an average speed of 40km/hr from Durrow to Urlingford before (wasn't even a constant speed, the driver at the front would build up to somewhere about 50km/hr, panic, jam on the brakes and we'd be back down to below 30km/hr again). Not sure whom to blame more, the driver at the front, or the line of people who won't overtake regardless of the opportunities... Roll on the new road.

L1011 · 09-11-2008 10:57pm

marmurr1916 wrote: »

Not quite. The A1 from Edinburgh to south of Haddington is high-quality dual-carriageway and there are alternating sections of single- and dual-carriageway from there to Berwick-on-Tweed.

Thats not the signposted route, though. The signposted route is A702, A74(M), A74, M6, M42, M40. Writing that out makes it clear how convoluted that is...

My original post made it read like its sub WS2 the entire way, came across wrong. Its not, the A74/A74(M) clearly isn't!

ipodrocker · 10-11-2008 10:46am

has anyone got updated picks of the new section? I presume when it opens access will be at the new roundabout they made outside of urlingford??

Stark · 10-11-2008 10:51am

There'll be access from that roundabout in Urlingford and access to the beginning of the scheme will be at a temporary roundabout near Cullahill (which they'll be getting rid of when they connect it up to the M8 Portlaoise-Cullahill).

larryone · 11-11-2008 9:44pm

Have they finished merging the temp roundabout with the existing road?

marmurr1916 · 11-11-2008 11:14pm

MYOB wrote: »

Thats not the signposted route, though. The signposted route is A702, A74(M), A74, M6, M42, M40. Writing that out makes it clear how convoluted that is...

My original post made it read like its sub WS2 the entire way, came across wrong. Its not, the A74/A74(M) clearly isn't!

I didn't realise it wasn't the signposted route. However, it's the route the vast majority of people use, unless they're into driving slowly!

BluntGuy · 11-11-2008 11:23pm

I don't think it'll be opening early.

All the politicians and executives who, of course, contributed nothing to road need to pencil the date into their diaries so they can turn up, get their name on a plague and scoop up as much credit as possible for the project.

L1011 · 11-11-2008 11:30pm

marmurr1916 wrote: »

I didn't realise it wasn't the signposted route. However, it's the route the vast majority of people use, unless they're into driving slowly!

In my defence, I was going by Warrington so had to use the M6, but I was going to do the sheep thing of taking the signed route anyway - what with having a sat nav that tries to get me arrested or kill me and it looking 'better' (with more blue on it) on the map book...

ipodrocker · 12-11-2008 1:15pm

can you guys stop going off the the topic! what is the status of the temp roundabout?

FIRE · 12-11-2008 10:10pm

Stark wrote: »

There'll be access from that roundabout in Urlingford and access to the beginning of the scheme will be at a temporary roundabout near Cullahill (which they'll be getting rid of when they connect it up to the M8 Portlaoise-Cullahill).

ipodrocker wrote: »

can you guys stop going off the the topic! what is the status of the temp roundabout?

Ive been travelling every weekend to cork, and have been waiting for this stretch to open, as It's the 1 bit of road I hate. I can see where the urlingford roundabout, but cant make out where the roundabout at cullahill wil be, whereabouts is this going to be?

Amtmann · 12-11-2008 10:15pm

ipodrocker wrote: »

what is the status of the temp roundabout?

Unfortunately I don't know. I haven't been up that far in almost two months, and I don't plan on heading up there again before the road opens. I am very curious to find out what the situation is up there though.

My feeling overall is that the pavement is now 98% ready for traffic.

- The junctions at Cashel north (7) and Horse and Jockey (6) are layed out now; all that needs to be done there is some signing and landscaping.

- From junction 5 to the terminus is done pavementwise, except possibly for a very short stretch (perhaps no more than 250m) at the Urlingford junction itself (4). I could be wrong and this might actually be done already, however.

December 8 remains the target date, though I haven't heard this mentioned locally. I got that date from the Roadbridge Sisk site office in Kilkenny.

Amtmann · 12-11-2008 10:17pm

FIRE wrote: »

Ive been travelling every weekend to cork, and have been waiting for this stretch to open, as It's the 1 bit of road I hate. I can see where the urlingford roundabout, but cant make out where the roundabout at cullahill wil be, whereabouts is this going to be?

It's just about 1.5km south of Cullahill on your right as you head towards Cork, slightly uphill. Look for a big Transport 21 sign on your left and the roundabout, which is NOT on the existing N8, is opposite.

FIRE · 12-11-2008 10:31pm

Furet wrote: »

It's just about 1.5km south of Cullahill on your right as you head towards Cork, slightly uphill. Look for a big Transport 21 sign on your left and the roundabout, which is NOT on the existing N8, is opposite.

This may seen a stupid question, but how are they going to work that? I knew I hadnt seen any signs of a roundabout coming onto the existing road.

I'll have a look on friday. Thanks Furet. Havent posted in here but have been checking this thread for weeks and the Mitchelstown thread aswell and some great pics.

Im excited about the Dec 8th if it happens.

cml387 · 12-11-2008 10:38pm

On average, every 3 weeks for the past 22 years I have been doing this route. I got to really hate the sction between Cullahill and Johnstown for some strange reason, maybe because it's straight but full of hills and dangerous to overtake.

As another poster has said, convoys of vehicles behind a slowcoach could reduce your speed to 50 - 60 kph (40 miles an hour in real money).

Anyway I never thought I'd see the day...but it's coming near tg.

marmurr1916 · 12-11-2008 11:58pm

ipodrocker wrote: »

can you guys stop going off the the topic! what is the status of the temp roundabout?

Sorry dad.

Thank God this stretch is going to be finished soon. It's a pain in the butt - almost impossible to overtake from Horse & Jockey all the way to Durrow.

M8 - Cashel to Cullahill

Comments