M8 - Cashel to Cullahill

BluntGuy

Furet wrote: »

Actually, here's a good example of what we're talking about (video commentary is...cryptic!): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhp9RlrfAn8

Yes... that sight is rather familiar. I've seen tractors on the M7, M9 and M8 before.

They seem to have this deluded notion that if they drive in the hard shoulder it's acceptable. They need to learn the rules of the road. You CANNOT drive in the hard shoulder on a clearway road. It's simple.

Our man in Havana

The Gardaí will do nothing. I have informed them before about tractors on the Cashel bypass and all they said was "Ah sure he must be going to his farm, we have to allow them to do that!" :eek:

Stark

Furet wrote: »

Actually, here's a good example of what we're talking about (video commentary is...cryptic!): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhp9RlrfAn8

"It's a motorway!". "The M1!". Though we could have guessed it was the M1 by the empty left-hand lane and all the cars cruising along in the overtaking lane.

BluntGuy

Bond-007 wrote: »

The Gardaí will do nothing. I have informed them before about tractors on the Cashel bypass and all they said was "Ah sure he must be going to his farm, we have to allow them to do that!" :eek:

"Ah sure he's only breaking the law, sure what's wrong with that?"

Cool Mo D

The real problem is that there is no law forbidding tractors from the motorway, as long as they can do 50 km/h, which most modern ones can.

bk

Here is what needs to happen.

- Law changed so that there is a minimum speed limit of 70km/h
- Tractors/JCB's specifically banned from Motorways.
- A dedicated Garda Motorway division, put in place and given the powers to enforce these laws.

Unregistered.

bk wrote: »

Here is what needs to happen.

- Law changed so that there is a minimum speed limit of 70km/h

Difficult when there's upper speed limits as low as 80kph on parts of our motorways. :rolleyes:

Irish and Proud

Bond-007 wrote: »

The Gardaí will do nothing. I have informed them before about tractors on the Cashel bypass and all they said was "Ah sure he must be going to his farm, we have to allow them to do that!" :eek:

What???

It's a M O T O R W A Y FFS!!! :mad:

Do people, who are supposed to be enforcing our laws, not know what a motorway is??? :mad:

Anyone driving a tractor on such roads should be regarded as a trespasser showing total disregard for safety! :mad:

...or are these farmers THICK, or are they really THICK??? :mad:

Regards!

Zuisse

There's no excuse for these slow vehicles using the motorways. The motorways run more or less parallel to the old 'N' roads so they wouldn't by going out of their way when using the N roads.
Agree with amending the minimum speed limit - I'd be in favour of 70-80km/h - if you want to drive less that that speed (or if your vehicle is incapable of reaching this speed), then you should be forced to use the R roads instead.

Rowley Birkin QC

Irish and Proud wrote: »

Do people, who are supposed to be enforcing our laws, not know what a motorway is??? :mad:

Quite obviously they know the law as it stands.

Irish and Proud wrote: »

...or are these farmers THICK, or are they really THICK???

Once again, there is no need for this kind of childish bs.

marmurr1916

Here's an RSA report into agricultural and construction vehicles in Ireland.

A high percentage of such vehicles don't meet legal safety standards and many aren't even registered properly, meaning they shouldn't be driven on any public road, let alone a motorway.

http://www.rsa.ie/Home/upload/File/Agri%20Report.pdf

Carawaystick

Unregistered. wrote: »

Difficult when there's upper speed limits as low as 80kph on parts of our motorways. :rolleyes:

I got a letter today telling me I'll be getting penalty points in January for exceeding 60kmh on a Motorway.....

Amtmann

Whether in some cases it is legal or not, there simply is no reason whatsoever for a tractor to use a motorway. It's the equivalent of a mother pushing a pram on Cork's South Ring Road - technically above board perhaps, but stupid in the extreme nonetheless. The law is an ass. There are excellent alternative routes for tractor drivers to use now - the ultra wide and now empty R639, for example.

I got a reply this morning from Garda HQ. They say they will take the matter seriously, and will contact the Garda chiefs of counties Kilkenny and Tipperary about it.
Time, I suppose, will tell.

johnbk

This is one of the issues I can’t stand about all our new motorways. Coming from an Ag background you might think I would have sympathy for tractors on motorways but no, it’s crazy! The argument about most modern tractors doing 50kph is weak at best. Put any sort of a load behind a tractor and it won’t do 50kph. Lorries are over 500hp twice as much power as the largest of tractors just to keep-up their speed with heavy loads. Then there is the issue of brakes, brake away devices weights, licensing, the age of drivers (16 min in a tractor), DOE tests.

The whole area is a minefield which in fairness the RSA is trying to sort out. We probably need information campaigns over the next 2 years to let people know the dos and don’ts of motorway driving and the Guards need to stop tractors on motorways now, not after we have a major accident with people driving into the back of one.

nordydan

Stark wrote: »

"It's a motorway!". "The M1!". Though we could have guessed it was the M1 by the empty left-hand lane and all the cars cruising along in the overtaking lane.

All you're missing is a yellow reg doing 140km/h on the inside lane overtaking everyone (e.g. me)...

Chris_533976

Not quite as bad, but I saw a HORSE AND CART pootling along in the hard shoulder of the Cork South Ring the other day. The horse looked terribly depressed.

BluntGuy

Furet wrote: »

It's the equivalent of a mother pushing a pram on Cork's South Ring Road - technically above board perhaps, but stupid in the extreme nonetheless.

A great analogy to describe the silliness that is driving a tractor on a motorway.

50 kilometers per hour people is NOT a safe speed to be going on a motorway. It doesn't matter what the law states. If you are going to trundle along at 50 km/h on a motorway then you are selfish and have no regard for other road-user's safety.

There is an empty regional road available, which in many places is of an excellent quality. Why slow-down (and in many cases endanger) long distance traffic? What possible reason? You aren't going to get anywhere any quicker on a motorway than you are on a regional road trundling at 50.

Yes, and I agree with previous posters that there should be a specific ban on tractors on the motorways, and a minimum speed limit raise to at least 70.

And let me repeat the main point again...

50 km/h in 120 km/h traffic is NOT SAFE.

(And no, not even if you drive in the hard shoulder )

rameire

Furet wrote: »

Actually, here's a good example of what we're talking about (video commentary is...cryptic!): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhp9RlrfAn8

id like to point out the idiot taking the video of the idiot driving the jcb was more than likely breaking the law himself, by holding a mobile device while driving.

BluntGuy

rameire wrote: »

id like to point out the idiot taking the video of the idiot driving the jcb was more than likely breaking the law himself, by holding a mobile device while driving.

No, the video refers to a "we", which suggests to me that somebody else is doing the recording (on a camcorder too, that footage looks far too high-quality to be a phone tbh.)

rameire

BluntGuy wrote: »

No, the video refers to a "we", which suggests to me that somebody else is doing the recording (on a camcorder too, that footage looks far too high-quality to be a phone tbh.)

doesnt have to be a phone, just a mobile device, also the video was taken from the right hand side of the cab, unless its a left hand drive truck.

murphaph

rameire wrote: »

doesnt have to be a phone, just a mobile device, also the video was taken from the right hand side of the cab, unless its a left hand drive truck.

Road sweepers are usually left hand drive or dual controls. Could be one of them I suppose!

rameire

true, scania do do road sweepers.

murphaph

The JCB might have been a motorway works vehicle, in which case he'd be permitted to do what he was doing.

G_R

bigkev49 wrote: »

Quite obviously they know the law as it stands.

not if they think that a tractor is going down the hard shoulder of an M-Way is OK, regardless of speed, you do not drive in the H-Shoulder of and M-Way or anyother road for that matter, simple as that. And plus if the tractor was doing less than 50km/h (and i think someone said that it was traveling at 40) it shouldn't be there.

bigkev49 wrote: »

Once again, there is no need for this kind of childish bs.

its not childish, someone endangering the lives of everyone else on the M-Way is thick, no question, not to mention selfish, I mean how much time is he really saving, he wont be going much faster than he would be going on the R-road.

marmurr1916

Carawaystick wrote: »

I got a letter today telling me I'll be getting penalty points in January for exceeding 60kmh on a Motorway.....

If you were driving through a section where there were roadworks, there might have been a temporary 60 km/h speed limit.

marmurr1916

It might not be a bad idea to put up VMS repeater signs (say every 2km) on motorways with the following messages alternating on a regular basis:

MINIMUM speed limit: 50 km/h.
DO NOT drive on hard shoulder.
DO NOT stop except in case of breakdown/emergency.
KEEP LEFT unless overtaking.
LEAVE motorway at next exit if tired.
SLOW DOWN in poor weather.

Rowley Birkin QC

@dannym08; FFS I never said tractors/JCBs/Tractor Lawnmowers driving in the hard shoulder was a good thing or within the law, READ POSTS BEFORE YOU RESPOND :mad::mad:

The point I am making, once again, is that the law currently permits vehicles capable of 50km/h to travel on motorways, I never passed comment on whether or not this was a good thing or a bad thing.

My main bugbear was the frankly ridiculous attitude here regarding farmers. Thick, ignorant, yokel etc. etc. I still want to know how a previous poster managed to accurately measure the speed of the tractor as he overtook.

marmurr1916

bigkev49 wrote: »

My main bugbear was the frankly ridiculous attitude here regarding farmers. Thick, ignorant, yokel etc. etc. I still want to know how a previous poster managed to accurately measure the speed of the tractor as he overtook.

It isn't just about farmers. It's about anybody who drives an unsuitable vehicle illegally on a motorway, especially on the hard shoulder.

Anybody who drives a vehicle unsafely and illegally on a motorway is either ignorant of the law or thick for endangering their safety and the safety of others.

BluntGuy

bigkev49 wrote: »

My main bugbear was the frankly ridiculous attitude here regarding farmers. Thick, ignorant, yokel etc. etc. I still want to know how a previous poster managed to accurately measure the speed of the tractor as he overtook.

We all know (or at least hope) that most farmers are sensible enough not to bring their slow agricultural vehicles onto a busy, long-distance, high-speed road.

Anyway, the law needs to be changed. Stop tractors going on the motorway full-stop. It is not a suitable place for them to drive. End of story.

Amtmann

More tractors (three) on the M8 between exits 7 and 9 today. This time one was drawing a load of silage bales, again half on the hard shoulder.

And by the way, I'm not some urbanite spouting anti-rural vitriol here: I come from a farming background in south Tipperary. I hail from a few miles outside a small village; I grew up in a wholly rural area; and uncles of mine on both sides of the family are farmers.

They're not yokels though.
It wouldn't cross their minds to drive their tractors on motorways, because they're not thick.

I phoned Cashel Gardai today about it to complain and they admitted that there is a big problem on parts of the M8. They said they'd clamp down on it.

BluntGuy

Furet wrote: »

More tractors (three) on the M8 between exits 7 and 9 today. This time one was drawing a load of silage bales, again half on the hard shoulder.

Well isn't that just grand!

Again, we see the ridiculous logic of "ah sure if I drive in the hard shoulder, 'twill be fine".

Selfish, stupid and unsafe...

warrenstown

Furet wrote: »

More tractors (three) on the M8 between exits 7 and 9 today. This time one was drawing a load of silage bales, again half on the hard shoulder.

I phoned Cashel Gardai today about it to complain and they admitted that there is a big problem on parts of the M8. They've promised to clamp down on it.

Well that could explain the 3 squad cars I saw driving on the motorway between Urlingford and Two-Mile-Borris on Saturday afternoon.

Bond-007 wrote: »

Are they going to reduce the speedlimit on the R639 (the old N8) to 80km/h?

They seem to have done that around Urlingford and Johnstown anyway. Coming along the old N8 towards Johnstown on Friday night it was 80 kph but the speed signs closer to the village were for 100kph. However by Monday afternoon they were all 80kph.

Why the drop in the speed limit, apart from (I'm guessing) legal designations? It's still a good quality stretch of road and it's now safer because of the lack of traffic. The Johnstown to Kilkenny road is atrocious, narrow with bad bends and bumps, and that's 80kph. Is there no leeway? Is it a case that once a road goes from being called N* to R***, it's straight away 80kph?

Also, how come there's cement barriers between the lanes on the new stretch of motorway? I thought with a speed limit of 120kph, they would have those thick wire barriers (I don't know the name of them) and that the cement barriers were for 100kph stretches of dual carriageway? I know motorcyclists don't like the wire ones, is that the reason? Or is it because it was originally meant to be a 100kph stretch, according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M8_motorway_(Ireland)

Thanks.

Stark

warrenstown wrote:

Is there no leeway? Is it a case that once a road goes from being called N* to R***, it's straight away 80kph?

That is indeed the situation. It's up to the council then to put a special speed limit on the road to bring it back to 100km/hr if they feel so inclined.

warrenstown wrote:

Also, how come there's cement barriers between the lanes on the new stretch of motorway? I thought with a speed limit of 120kph, they would have those thick wire barriers (I don't know the name of them) and that the cement barriers were for 100kph stretches of dual carriageway? I know motorcyclists don't like the wire ones, is that the reason? Or is it because it was originally meant to be a 100kph stretch, according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M8_motorway_(Ireland)

Cement barriers are the new standard for Irish motorways. They're much safer than the old style barriers, which won't stop something like a truck from crossing over into the other carriageway.

L1011

warrenstown wrote: »

Also, how come there's cement barriers between the lanes on the new stretch of motorway? I thought with a speed limit of 120kph, they would have those thick wire barriers (I don't know the name of them) and that the cement barriers were for 100kph stretches of dual carriageway? I know motorcyclists don't like the wire ones, is that the reason? Or is it because it was originally meant to be a 100kph stretch, according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M8_motorway_(Ireland)

Thanks.

The concerete "jersey barriers" are far safer than the wire barriers for cars; incalculably safer for bikers and require virtually no maintainence...

BluntGuy

warrenstown wrote: »

Why the drop in the speed limit, apart from (I'm guessing) legal designations? It's still a good quality stretch of road and it's now safer because of the lack of traffic. The Johnstown to Kilkenny road is atrocious, narrow with bad bends and bumps, and that's 80kph. Is there no leeway? Is it a case that once a road goes from being called N* to R***, it's straight away 80kph?

What really annoys me (apart from the ridiculous infexibility in our speed limit system), is the fact they can find the money to buy new signs to unnecessarily (in many cases) lower speed limits, yet they can't find the cash to shove simple "M8" patches on local roads so as to confirm to local drivers that the new road is M8 (i.e a motorway) not N8.

warrenstown wrote: »

Also, how come there's cement barriers between the lanes on the new stretch of motorway? I thought with a speed limit of 120kph, they would have those thick wire barriers (I don't know the name of them) and that the cement barriers were for 100kph stretches of dual carriageway? I know motorcyclists don't like the wire ones, is that the reason? Or is it because it was originally meant to be a 100kph stretch, according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M8_motorway_(Ireland)

I think other people have already explained this point well enough, but I might as well too. Concrete step barriers are the barriers that are used on all new motorway schemes both in Ireland and the UK. Old motorways undergoing upgrades such as the M50 here and the M1 and M4 in the UK will have their old barriers replaced with this.

Heroditas

Travelled down to Cork and back today - the new stretches open in the last couple of months make such a massive difference! 2hrs 34mins from Blackpool to Lucan this afternoon. :eek:

murphaph

MYOB wrote: »

The concerete "jersey barriers" are far safer than the wire barriers for cars; incalculably safer for bikers and require virtually no maintainence...

....and consequently are also much safer for road maintenance crews. Better solution all round and don't look so 'urban' once they've weathered a little bit.

Steviemak

Heroditas wrote: »

Travelled down to Cork and back today - the new stretches open in the last couple of months make such a massive difference! 2hrs 34mins from Blackpool to Lucan this afternoon. :eek:

Yeah, travelled up on Sunday and it took 2hr 25mins from Bishopstown to Red Cow. When the entire stretch is done it'll be 2hrs from Dunkettle to Red Cow without breaking the speed limit.

warrenstown

BluntGuy wrote: »

I think other people have already explained this point well enough, but I might as well too. Concrete step barriers are the barriers that are used on all new motorway schemes both in Ireland and the UK. Old motorways undergoing upgrades such as the M50 here and the M1 and M4 in the UK will have their old barriers replaced with this.

Thanks for the responses. I had always thought that the wire barrier, being more flexible, dissipated the energy of a crash better than the concrete barrier (for a car at least). It's good to see 'best practise' being used on these new roads.

Victor

Moved from Commuting & Transport.