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LUAS Network + Future Expansion

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,116 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    It would add some redundancy/operational flexibility and allow fairly painless weekend closures on metrolink south of Ballymun for maintenance. I am quite sure it will be extended to meet some day because it's a complete no brainer.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,304 ✭✭✭Daith


    Agreed, I think even the response of only mentioning a Finglas to Ballymun link was carefully chosen. I'm crediting the NTA too much though!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,217 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,304 ✭✭✭Daith


    Only if the 24 was extended to cover more of Finglas West and South? Otherwise probably not unless it was extended. Anybody over Finglas East/Glasnevin would have the 19/24 but the Luas would be a bit of a distance for them outside people in Charlestown.

    But sure there's lots of potenial adjustments to bus routes once Metrolink is active and even more once Luas Finglas is there too.

    Post edited by Daith on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 245 ✭✭Heartbreak Hank


    Just build Metro West and, hey presto, they are all connected



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 978 ✭✭✭MICKEYG


    My hope is that once Metrolink is under construction the NTA will start speaking aloud about the next projects.

    • Metrolink extension to interchange with the line to Drogehda, Dundalk and Belfast
    • DART underground. The next game changer in my opinion.
    • LUAS extension form Finglas to Northwood.

    I feel they are frightened to mention any other project until they get the big one under construction but I am sure they have some idea of what they will do next.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,516 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    Thr NTA’s response is a pretty crazy denial of their own projects. As recently as July they put out a report of their upcoming Luas projects (which I covered on the rail section of my site) in which they indicated that Luas Charlestown - Northwood would be starting construction as soon as 2029. They must have had a big change of heart on this in the meantime. I agree it’s almost certainly motivated by not wanting to jeopardise Metrolink’s support.

    http://irishmotorwayinfo.com/inex/rail/index.html



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,816 ✭✭✭jd


    That wasn't NTA, that was TII. TII is the designated agent for delivering light rail and metro projects, working under the NTA's direction and with the NTA as the approving authority. So I guess the TII guys were talking about what they'd like to deliver, but it's not on the NTA's list of projects. That's my take.



  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 11,058 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    Three months to demolish and replace this bridge, which is about what I expected, to be honest. At least they're cracking on with it.

    End of November by the time it's finished.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,196 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    3 months isn’t that bad all things considering, imo.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,304 ✭✭✭Daith


    I'm surprised they even committed to a three month timeline. They could have just said end of the year. Must be optimistic which hopefully is a good sign



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,677 ✭✭✭daymobrew


    Why stop services at Smithfield? There seems to be switchover outside Peacock Theatre. Or could they go to Connolly as I think that has a switchover too.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,249 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Will be down to power segments and what can be properly isolated to let them remove the OHLE over the bridge. Its two evenings only.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,044 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    I assume it's down to how the electrical circuits are built.

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 148 ✭✭The Mathematician


    I suspect it is to do with the overhead power supply rather than the rails.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,116 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    I think 3 months is far too long for such a small bridge. The Malahide viaduct was repaired in about that time frame.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,249 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    The length of time it takes to make a bridge deck (or any other engineered structure) does not scale down linearly.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,116 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    That's as may be but I still think 3 months is too long for a critical public transport bridge of such simple construction. If they genuinely can't speed up fabrication (by throwing money, manpower and overtime at it) then perhaps they could have investigated the possibility of shoring up the damaged bridge for the duration by building a steelwork lattice around and under it to brace it while a replacement is fabricated. Was this possibility investigated I wonder? The Malahide viaduct repair was much more involved than simply replacing a deck, which is all that appears to need to happen here.

    I would be interested to know if the fabrication will actually take place around the clock or only during a traditional 8 hour work day. If it's not taking place around the clock, why not? By way of example, the Berlin to Hamburg main line is currently completely closed. It will remain closed for 9 months in total in which time it will be completely rebuilt from the ground up, all new track, sleepers, points, signals, platform works, new station buildings, some new bridge structures etc. The works are taking place 7 days a week, 24 hours a day to get the line reopened as soon as possible. We do have some night time noise to put up with but ho-hum, it's for the greater good. I'd like to know if the same impetus in getting the red line reopened is present. If the works had not been scheduled to take place 24 hours a day, they would have taken 3 times longer.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,044 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    that German work, they're just closing the line for 9 months without having done any sort of preparation or planning in advance? They made the decision and then immediately closed the line that day? Because if not that's a bogus comparison.

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  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 11,058 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    Shore up a metal bridge hit with a 6 hour long fire that reached 1000 degrees? And then run a 60 ton vehicle with potentially hundreds of passengers over it? Yeah, that's not going to happen.

    You'd be longer "shoring up" the bridge than replacing it, to be honest.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,966 ✭✭✭Poxyshamrock


    Were there any trams beyond Connolly when the fire took hold and how did they manage to get those trams back to the depot? I assume they're not still parked up at The Point?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,249 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Three. They were hauled back at low speed with hydraulic rams holding up the bridge deck according to what I've seen written, on here somewhere I believe.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,677 ✭✭✭daymobrew


    It would have been great if they were left beyond Connolly and went back and forth while the bridge is being replaced.

    It's a good 20min walk from Connolly to The Point stop. Some might like the opportunity to walk to/from Connolly but for others it might be too much or might mess up the timing of their commute.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,959 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Are there turnback options to permit this?

    Would the running of the trams delay the repair of the bridge due to electrical considerations?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,249 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Temporary turnbacks exist; but there wouldn't be space to install them between Georges Dock station and the bridge works site.

    The extension is powered from a substation underground at Spencer Dock - but significant work might have been needed regardless to isolate it; and create a singallng island also.

    Anyway, the killer problem is the lack of servicing facilities.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,116 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Sooo, the bridge was shored up in a couple of days and three 60 tonne vehicles rolled over it. With a bit more shoring up the bridge could have been kept in service at slow speeds until the replacement deck was ready to be slotted in over a weekend closure. Where there's a will, there's a way (as seen by the efforts made to return the stranded trams to their depot). If there was any doubt about the integrity of the shored up bridge they would have used low loaders to take those trams back to the Red Cow and not risked it. Sure, the passengers add some weight, but the bridge could have been shored up some more.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭cgcsb


    No way is anyone signing off on that. They would in Japan for sure as another poster said but that's a totally different culture with a more lax attitude to health and safety.



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 23,707 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    There is a world of difference between crossing with likely just the driver on board and probably a dozen engineers outside watching the bridge and on the radio to the driver likely directing them, versus a Luas full of passengers!

    No way would that ever pass a safety review.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 51 ✭✭eoin91


    slotted in over a weekend closure

    If it only requires a weekend closure to replace the bridge, then I guess they must just be sitting on their hands for 3 months the new deck is fabricated and then they’ll slot it in ?

    The reality and scale of the operation on the ground required to fix the bridge is a lot bigger than your message implies. The length of the road is full with engineers from multiple agencies working on the overhead wires, gas piplelines, bridge, etc. From a passer-by's perspective it certainly looks like they’ve thrown everything they can at the problem to fix it asap. I should have taken another photo closer to the bridge, but the area was full with workers and machinery.

    IMG_4889.jpeg


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,503 ✭✭✭JohnC.


    Has anyone seen them pull the trams back? I imagine it was such a low speed, likely starting-stopping constantly, that if it did have passengers, they would be screaming out to use a bus replacement, or walk.



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