Is Elon Musk hurting Tesla? (Mod Note Post #1)

A bit OT, but the Community Notes 'system' on Twitter was abysmally bad. I was a contributor at one time, more to see how it worked than anything. It didn't work. It was just as polarised as Twitter itself. And you'd set up a note on some bit of misinformation (usually a video from an unrelated event), only to find that twenty more of the exact same had appeared. It was like a game of whack-a-mole that you could never win.

And the misinfo was glaringly obvious and allowed stay there. To call it a cesspit is to give cesspits a bad name. I'm almost certain that this was by design. There was no interest in curbing misinformation, the plan was to pollute the information space so much that objective truth would be lost.

Can I presume you don't watch anything on Amazon Prime Video or buy Chinese goods either as part of this boycott?

I'd argue that given our countries very weak public transport and public car charging infrastructure it's easier to boycott an online marketplace than a car company with its own charging network but each to their own.

Worst case scenario the Tesla boycott takes off, supply of Tesla's drops and second hand values increase. Musk will likely be given the boot by the shareholders if that happens

Okay, let's actually interrogate your logic a bit more. Historical boycotts are all pointless cause they're not boycotting everything. So Apartheid South Africa, there were other war crimes occurring at the time so the boycott shouldn't have happened. Nestle is also subject to boycott but people really shouldn't. The reality is you don't get to decide whether or not people's reasons for boycotting companies are acceptable. I think there is pretty legitimate reasons to have issues with Musk's companies by virtue of him being a CEO. Plenty of people agree. I also tend to be of the view that his interference in politics is currently greater than that of other billionaires, they're doing it but nowhere near his level which I hope eventually backfires on him.

Also sidenote, boycotting Bezos companies is far from straight forward. A large proportion of the websites you visit are on aws infrastructure.

There are a couple of interesting elements to those accounts. Of the $5.5 billion net profit, $2.8 billion came from carbon credits. But the really interesting one was a $600 million 'profit' from unrealised cryptocurrency gains.

That's a good trick. Dangerous to play that game if the unrealised gains become losses when cashed out.

I haven't seen anything about government subsidies either. Pretty sure they're still getting them.

the thing I look for in the results is the auto margins.

It dropped to 13% in 2024 from 18/19% in 2023, and we all remember those 30-40% margins in the early 3/Y years.

This tells us what room they have for price reductions.

They’re still saying last night that they’re prepared to cut margins to drive volumes.

I think you’re completely missing the point

If we had issues with all those other products, you’re correct, we wouldn’t be able to get out of bed in the morning -

However none of those brands are spending hundreds of millions to destabilise democratic countries around the world and use their own megaphone to promote the furthest right of rightwing ideology.

Musk uses his vast wealth to wield that power over everyone (including the most powerful office on the planet it seems) - and buying a Tesla directly enables that. 

If bezos was doing the same, the reaction would be the same, likewise Zuckerberg/Meta - but they won’t touch it cause they fear the backlash - musk has SO much wealth and power that he doesn’t fear the backlash

There's a movement or notion amongst those circles (Putin is a fan too) which is referred to as the multi-polar world. Basically the idea is to replace the old order of a one polar or two polar world where in the past the two poles were occupied by the US/West and the USSR. Now it's probably the US, China and to a lesser extent the EU.

The tech bros and others don't like the idea of being subservient to national or supra-national entities that tell then what to do. So the idea is to undermine those structures, split them into their component parts and eventually these multi-billion global companies will call the shots.

That's a potted version of it. Putin's a fan because he sees himself as being dominant in such a multi-polar world, because of his influence in various parts of the world and his pet oligarchs of course.

The reality starting to set in, in earnest.

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/28/tesla-shareholders-want-answers-about-musk-salute-role-in-trump-wh.html?fbclid=IwY2xjawILQXpleHRuA2FlbQIxMAABHdMDMGie3s-mZl9UbSqVzKdHIPOYbVbbIQT4UVttgLLW2b_GXqXuQGsJWQ_aem_3M2TZGnQLrTLoHah7a0lHQ

there’s no shareholder going to question anything while the share price keeps rising.
No matter what musk has done or said, the share price is near record highs.

The guy literally fabricated a 66% jump in the SP since the Nov 5th election day, which on the face of it is based on nothing but vibes and momentum, by ‘investing’ $150m into backing the right horse in the US election.

If it all drops into the sh1t, shareholders will start to complain!

imagine just how little he cares about maybe 100,000 people deciding to not buy a Tesla? The power his wealth had given him now is phenomenal

bear in mind he can’t actually spend his wealth in his entire life even if he tried to. There’s an amount of money beyond which it’s not actually not possible to spend, even if you spent your life trying to.

(exhibit A: the sultan of Brunei’s brother jefferi 😀)

Therefore leveraging the assets he owns to aid his power-plays makes perfect sense.

If Twitter went to zero in the morning, musks personal loss would be maybe $5bn of his $250bn. Chicken feed versus the possibility of the Twitter purchase succeeding in its real aim, which isn’t just to be some profit machine for him.

Your assumption is people like that are interested in spending. The accumulation and power is the only goal. It's what provides the basis for who they are.

As I said it seems to be built on a house of cards.