M6 - Galway City Ring Road [planning decision pending]

And I don't even think that people who are in favour of the Ring Road are opposed to some of the public transport/active travel schemes that are being put on the never-never. It's possible to be in favour of both.

Bus Lanes on the Dublin Road and the WDR are not to be done at the expense of the Ring Road, but rather as well as.

The problem is that the council are putting the Ring Road first, and seemingly refusing to do (almost) anything else in the meantime.

But not flying 40 foot lorries and tipper trucks, eh boss?

That also sounds intuitive and logical until you look at the Councils' own submission where it is made very clear that journeys between Connemara and points east of Galway city account for only 3% of journeys. The other 97% of journeys have a departure point, destination, or both, within Galway City.

So, while I feel for those taking part in those 3% of journeys, in the overall scheme of things those journeys are necessarily quite far down on the list of problems that need to be solved. Even the headline 3% makes no distinction between those who can time their journeys to avoid peak times, and thus aren't seriously inconvenienced by the status quo, and those who have no choice, which will be only a fraction of the 3%.

well fair play for changing your mind over the years, Id imagine some are in the same boat as well. But I still get the impression that those in favour of the road tend to shout the loudest and are heard more. Im also thinking back to the Salthlll cycleway where local businesses scuppered that despite Salthill looking like one giant car park. There are a lot of powerful voices in support of the ring road and my impression is they are heard the most.

I think its because whatever way the Ring Road goes it is a barometer nationally on how seriously or not the government are willing to take hard decisions to reduce carbon emissions. That environment didnt exist when the M3 and M50 were built, it wasnt a concern back then. Now we are locked into global agreements to reduce emissions which eventually have huge fines attached. Proceeding with the ring road effectively locks in even more carbon emissions for decades compared to building sustainable mass transport.

The other side of it as well is probably many living and commuting in Leinster have now lived through the induced demand of the M50 for close on two decades now and it is still a car park. Its gone through widenings, free flow junctions introduced and toll barriers removed and is now over capacity with no more space for improvements and it wlll now remain a car park until viable public transport is introduced. Induced demand is a real thing and new roads quickly become over capacity with it. There are paraellels between the M50 and the ring road in that back then huge numbers of people were shouting for it to be upgraded, that happened and then within a year it was back to being a car park again. Its not hard to see the ring road go the same way, it will probably be fine for a few years but then induced demand will kick in and turn it into a car park. People who have commuted the M50 for years have lived this and can see the same mistakes becoming very likely in Galway with this ring road.

What's the outlook for car usage in 20/30/40 years?

I remember watching a TedTalk a few years ago, and the whole car ownership was being questioned. The slant was vehicles would be used to when required, similar to a Uber, but the cars were self driving.

Seems pie in the sky for Ireland as it would require vast investment etc. Interesting all the same.

Anyway, when a tiny city can't even sort out a traffic problem it doesn't fill me with hope.

The GRR was first discussed nearly 25 years ago. The climate change action plan is the best excuse the government main party's could ever have been given. It's a easy way to duck out of it and not be blamed, the greens will take the hit.

It'll never be built imo. I could accept that if they started proper alternative measures.

Increase bus frequency from all commuters towns as well as city buses.

The most important one. Have massive discounts on bus/train tickets.

If they want to get people to use public transport you need to have a top service, and also make it very financially appealing. The climate debate will not make the majority of people choose public transport. That's the reality.

All cars even electrics pollute.

Tyre pollution from driving (where do you think the tyre goes when it wears?) is much bigger than you think for starters.

People would rather sit in traffic in their car than on a bus - thats the issue.

That and the fact all buses from west to east need to transit through Eyre Square. Orbital routes and bus lanes badly needed.

@Sam Russell "Making city centre parking hard to find, and expensive would increase the use of free PT, particularly if it introduced gradually over a number of years."

Indeed, it's already happening. The area I live in isn't served by any bus routes but there is a small area of free parking next to a bus stop on the route that does come the closest to our area. Quite a few of my older neighbours drive there, park their cars, and hop on the bus to get into the city centre. The combination of free parking and free travel is a compelling alternative to driving into the centre and paying €6.50 for parking.  

Free public transport attracts people who would otherwise walk or cycle but rarely people who would otherwise drive. The price of bus fare is too small to be a factor. Stopping cars crossing the corrib other than by qcb, removing parking and taking space from cars and giving it to sustainable modes is what will result in modal shift. Park and ride is also of little value. Parking is already abundant and mostly free outside the city, once you're in your car there's very little in the way of incentives that can get you out of it to complete your journey.

I remember back in 2010 that a Bus Lane and Cycle facilities length of Western Distributor Road WDR costed at €10 million (similar to the Seamus Quirke / Bishop O Donnell Road -> Galway City Council document for a Smarter Regional City bid; 13 years later the suburb with the densest Square km of people living in Galway City (a 500meter radius around Knockknacarra chuch) is still is without any dedicated public transport infrastructure.

Galway City Council and Galway County continue with all there might to manufacturer the car traffic problem when the sit on simple / very cheap solutions like putting in Bus Lanes and Cycle Paths the length of Western Distributor Road WDR

Also for a country that rains so fuking always the lack of shelters is appalling. Don't know what it's like in Galway but in Limerick most stops don't even have signs throughout the city and in the county your stop will be "outside Johnnys shed" or some shte.

I know it's a bigger city but Cork also has a green leap zone for the commuter towns which could very easily be done for Limerick and Galway.

As for free PT Tallinn tried that and as mentioned above it reduced walking not cars.

The big problem isn't held up buses it's the fully cancelled ones which there is no system to advise customers of the cancellation.

Its all the answer lads, but if you think it will all be enabled without the Ring Road too, you're mistaken.

I used to cycle BnT twice a day when I worked that side of town. The scary part was the roundabout at the Menlo Park Hotel. The raised separated path on the stretch from there to the entrance to Glenburren Park was fine. But then you'd get gob$h!te$ who think they'll be able to get to the left turn on the Tuam Road more quickly if they move across to the curb and completely block the bike lane, while also still blocking the lane they should be in because more than half the width of their car is still in that lane. It's selfish and achieves absolutely nothing except antagonising fellow road users.

There were people walking BnT every day and it would be very wrong to try to prevent that. If someone lives in Tirellan Heights and works in Ballybane they can walk it in a little over 20 minutes. You'd be making their journey take at least 50% longer if you prevented them from walking BnT. Then there are those who work in the Mervue direction who actually cross BnT in the middle (near the river crossing). It's dangerous but I can understand why they do it. It's 800m from Ballinfoyle Church to the Mervue industrial estate as the crow flies. If you follow paths and cross BnT you can do it in 1.4km. But if you avoid BnT it will be more than 2km. There really should be an underpass or overpass there to facilitate that crossing and open up the route to everyone, not just the brave/foolish.

All roundabouts are hostile to walking and cycling.

For good or ill, the DMURS retrofit of roundabouts to signal junctions with narrow radii and bus priority is going to continue apace in urban areas, make no mistake. Which will slow up general traffic and make more of a case for a ring road than anything else!