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Cork developments

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,972 ✭✭✭ TheChizler


    Gives a very jagged impression IMO, some of the other buildings could be taller



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,851 ✭✭✭✭ namloc1980


    Details of the 12 BusConnects corridors will be published later today.




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭ Pen Rua




  • Registered Users Posts: 8,661 ✭✭✭ Shedite27


    Great help to Public Transport. It really is the city of cars



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,441 ✭✭✭✭ whisky_galore


    "...car spaces and bus parking will be replaced by cycle lanes."

    City of cars? By taking out car spaces?

    In any case, clearly planned by a dumbass who never had to use a bus to connect with another bus.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,549 ✭✭✭ Apogee


    Iconic taking up a floor in NSQ2 while Clarendon hint that appartments at Horgan's quay may not go ahead due to rising costs:




  • Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭ iColdFusion


    Clarendon probably hoping some social housing body will write them a very large cheque 🙄



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,207 ✭✭✭ sprucemoose


    not really a great idea, those are still public transport just not government owned. stupid to move them from where they were



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,586 ✭✭✭ Markcheese


    As far as I know thats gone legal - the bus operators aren't happy - don't know if they have a leg to stand on though ..

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,441 ✭✭✭✭ whisky_galore


    All for a cycle lane?

    I wonder however did I manage without cycle lane on that street for years? Maybe I'm due a payment for all the trauma involved.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 109 ✭✭ Ceramic


    Why aren’t private bus operators operating from a bus station? Seems a bit anti competitive that only CIE seems to use those facilities. That isn’t how it works anywhere else I’ve ever been.

    Turning a quay into an ad hoc bus station is not a good use of public space and scattering the busses is absolutely ridiculous. They should be using the new bus station at Kent Station.



  • Registered Users Posts: 315 ✭✭ Frostybrew


    Bus station would be a better option. Patricks Quay was a terrible location for a coach stop. Narrow footpath, no shelter, waiting passengers blocking the footpath with luggage, danger of falling into the river etc. Not to mention the fact that buses would immediately get stuck in traffic trying to get through Maccurtain Street.



  • Registered Users Posts: 109 ✭✭ Ceramic


    In most cities I’ve lived elsewhere the bus station is owned by the city council or a transit authority and long distance buses use it. Ireland seems to never have evolved past the notion of a CIE state monopoly operator so hasn’t opened bus stations, yet we’ve loads of private operators and it’s just a mess, especially in cities where you’ve loads of services terminating.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,441 ✭✭✭✭ whisky_galore


    Omg I've lost count of all the times I've fallen into the river while waiting for a bus on Patrick's Quay.

    I've never taken a BE Dublin bound bus but wouldnt they have to negotiate McCurtain street as well??



  • Registered Users Posts: 109 ✭✭ Ceramic


    The fact that there isn’t a proper bus station for all operators in 2022 is crazy and just having some kind of mess evolve on a quay is just bad planning and damaging to the area as it turns it into effectively an ad hoc bus station without proper shelter or facilities. It’s also probably impinging on evolution of that quayside as a public space, with better retail, dining etc as the whole area gets more focus on it with the MacCurtain St revamp etc.

    Cork needs to make much more use of quaysides as leisure / green spaces as it has almost no public spaces at all in the city centre. Using them to park buses is not appropriate at all.

    That use of Patrick’s Quay seems to have just happened as the bus market grew and it’s gone from being a minor thing to being almost bus depot.

    The facility at the rear of Kent Station should be where they come in and should be a major transit mode interchange and not just CIE/Bus Éireann.

    It also avoids city centre traffic and doesn’t add to it by being able to route the buses back out onto the Lower Glanmire Road, yet is just on the edge of the city centre.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,441 ✭✭✭✭ whisky_galore


    The constituents of CIE can barely coordinate with each other, let alone with private operators. Welcome to Ireland, enjoy your stay.



  • Registered Users Posts: 763 ✭✭✭ airy fairy


    One of the locations mentioned that they should move to is Coburg street? Lower Glanimre road? Are they having a laugh or did some transition year student do a project on bus stops, and pull these names out of a bag?



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,972 ✭✭✭ TheChizler


    Equally to maintain a second regular lane, and a continuous lane of parking which doesn't seem to have been considered at all.



  • Registered Users Posts: 315 ✭✭ Frostybrew


    Easy for a young child to fall through the railings when an adult takes their eye off the ball. Which has happened on that quay. BE Dublin bound buses go via Michael Collins bridge. The main point is that Patrick's Quay was never suitable for a long distance coach stop for a multitude of reasons.

    The O'Callaghan's site on Andersons quay could be a potential site for a coach terminus. Similar to the private bus terminus in Galway. Across the road from the bus station and with in easy access of main routes.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭ Pen Rua


    Evening Echo has a little more information

    "The plans will see West Cork Connects move to Anderson Quay, Aircoach to Lower Glanmire Street while Cobh Connects is to remain at a single bus bay to be kept along Patrick’s Quay."

    No mention of where Citylink, M9 Express and other operators will end up.

    West Cork Connects director says their schedule is designed so that their buses come in to sync up with the Aircoach to Dublin. Now with their buses landing on Anderson Quay, and Aircoach departing from Lower Glanmire Street (Road?), he asserts it will be a nuisance for passengers and is suggesting they won't launch their planned Kinsale route as a result.

    Frequent user of the Citylink to head back to Galway. St Patrick's Quay was always annoying to navigate through, especially when you had a bunch of luggage, particularly when there's a group trying to board a bus and they decide to take up the entire width of the foot path.

    On the return, it was generally ok as it has been walking distance from where I have lived in Cork over the years. Moving buses out to Lower Glanmire Road or similar will probably mean we would need a taxi to get out there and back (especially with luggage) which just adds cost.

    The actual pavement is lethal, too. The amount of times I've almost tripped is uncountable. A friend visited in Cork, tripped and face planted onto the pavement within minutes of arrival.

    Galway's private bus station seemed to work well, until the operators jacked up prices and now there's a dispute with the bus operators and they're not using the station (not sure if this has since been resolved).

    I know when works were being done on St Patrick's Quay, the buses were relocated to Alfred Street. Google Maps suggests a bunch of bus bays still there, plus car parking spaces.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,972 ✭✭✭ TheChizler


    Is the planned Lower Glanmire Road stop not the plaza across from Leisureplex/Alfred Street?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,817 ✭✭✭ thomil


    Exactly. It's the plaza with the TFI Bikes docking station, next to Moody's and the Leisureplex.

    Honestly, I can't understand any of the caterwauling about this change. Patrick's Quay is a dump of a bus stop, unsafe, and a traffic nightmare. All of the new alternative locations at least have a dedicated bus bay and a shelter, so passengers at least have a chance of staying dry while waiting in inclement weather.

    As for transfer passengers, seriously? How many people actually transfer between bus services? I can't imagine it being that many. Most of these services are point-to-point operators who never once before bothered about connecting passengers. To wheel out that excuse now is just lazy in my eyes.

    Good luck trying to figure me out. I haven't managed that myself yet!



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,586 ✭✭✭ Markcheese


    I'd agree that Patrick's quay as it currently is isn't ideal - but just getting rid of one of the busiest public transport hubs in cork without a decent alternative is a bit crap really -

    The bus operators know Alfred street ,- they were there when Patrick's quay was dug up about 3 ago -that was the original proposal to go there ...

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,249 ✭✭✭ hans aus dtschl


    Problem is that BÉ own the bus station and pay for its upkeep and receive no subsidy explicitly for that purpose. If you allow private operators to use the bus station (a fine idea) then somebody needs to be responsible for the station. BÉ would have no incentive to facilitate their direct competitors. The correct solution of course is the same solution for privatisation everywhere: the government should own the network (stations, stops, timetable, potentially the buses), the private operator should own the supplied asset (drivers, potentially the buses).

    It's the same reason the bus and train aren't integrated in Cork: bus competes with train. It's terrible for the end user.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,249 ✭✭✭ hans aus dtschl


    They're directed to compete. What looks like incompetence is actually bad design on the part of the government. You'll find the people in the constituent parts of CIE have been very frustrated by this, down through the years. Many of the most recent retirees worked together in the original CIE and were prised apart and told by the government to directly compete against each other.



  • Registered Users Posts: 109 ✭✭ Ceramic


    The problem is you can’t half open a public transit system. The bus stations should be transferred to the NTA / TFI as national infrastructure. The long distance bus network isn’t focused on CIE anymore, a high % of it is private operators. The result of that is dumping bus stop issues onto the City Councils and into public spaces.

    It’s another example of inability to foresee consequences and poor planning.

    This is very much a Department of Transport and TFI issue.

    You should be able to go to a bus station and find all the long distance bus routes. It also opens up commercial opportunities, better facilities, interchange with other modes, parking, traffic optimisation, accessible infrastructure for people with mobility issues etc etc etc



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,249 ✭✭✭ hans aus dtschl


    That's exactly what it is.

    It's not incompetence on the part of CIE at all, rather it's incompetence on the part of the Department and TFI/NTA.

    It's an example of privatisation done poorly. Likely because public transport wasn't a priority for many governments until more recently.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,817 ✭✭✭ thomil


    Just on that note. Yes a central hub is a good idea in principle. However, such a central coach station should not just keep all coach operators in aone single location, but also provide safe drop-off areas, waiting areas, and in an ideal world, even some ticket counters and maybe a concession or two. Patrick's Quay offers nothing of that sort. At least with the new distributed scheme, there'll be some semblance of infrastructure.

    To be brutally honest, I think most of those complaining, outside of this thread af least, are doing so because A) they don't like change and B) because they now can't drive onto the sidewalk anymore to drop people off, something I witnessed more than once when l was still catching buses to Dublin there myself.

    Good luck trying to figure me out. I haven't managed that myself yet!



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,166 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly


    The bus stations should be transferred to the NTA / TFI as national infrastructure. 

    This x1000

    This way it is the NTA who is responsible for the upkeep and BE and other private operators can use it, once they pay a reasonable small fee.

    That makes sense, so it will never happen LOL



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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,166 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly


    Patricks Quay was always a temporary location as far as I recall. Anyone who thinks it was a good location needs their heads examined.



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