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Cork developments

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,737 ✭✭✭ opus




  • Registered Users Posts: 8,660 ✭✭✭ Shedite27


    Yeah tend to agree. Should have been a lovely little village feel to it with nice cafe's restaurants and shops, it's getting more and more like Mahon point.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,955 ✭✭✭ CorkRed93


    the council(s) have ruined douglas. cannot believe they are letting that lidl in there.



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,201 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    The council refused permission for it, it was An Bord Pleanala that overturned that decision.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,849 ✭✭✭✭ namloc1980


    In fairness it seems the City Council is trying to change things and refused permission for this. However appeal to ABP was successful which the Council challenged. Unfortunately the damage has been done by years of mismanagement and bad development by the County Council.

    I grew up in Douglas but don't live there anymore. When I do go there it still strikes me each time what a horribly developed traffic hole it has become.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,815 ✭✭✭✭ the beer revolu


    I'm not sure that another supermarket will increase traffic - I suspect that there will be much the same traffic, now spread over an extra area.

    I think Douglas has been a soulless shlthole with notions for decades, now. I don't see what one more supermarket will do,anymore than one new fast food outlet would do. It's been an outdoor mall for years now.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,660 ✭✭✭ Shedite27


    It started off with good intentions. When I grew up there in the 80's we had the big shopping centre (Quinnsworth) and both sides of the village seemed to co-exist alongside it, even over to Dailys and the video shop next door. The relief road was great at the start to take traffic away from it, and the cinema was the first I remember outside of town.

    Since then though, one by one all the little butchers, bakeries etc on east and west village stopped being used as the locals went to Tesco/Dunnes, and there's been nothing really to take their place on the high streets. Eco's is nice, as is 12 tables, and South County is decent for pints. It's just a pity there's always so much traffic coming through Douglas to get to Douglas Court, Tesco etc.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,498 ✭✭✭ Timing belt


    The small shops and butchers all disappeared because there was no where to park. Go back 30/40 years and you had cars parked along the west village… once that was removed the post office and shops were to difficult to get to. That’s why Daily’s became popular at the time you could easily get parking outside the door.

    Even in the east village you could easily find parking and pop into centra, butchers or KC’s. But with the increase in housing and population in Douglas suburbs it was always going to change.



  • Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭ iColdFusion


    Douglas really got screwed over with its connections to the South ring and large commercial developments allowed, just look at how well Wilton works to see how bad Douglas is, Carrigaline isn't far off with all the traffic funneled down its main street too.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,972 ✭✭✭ TheChizler


    Wilton is fine if you're driving, really unfriendly if you're trying to get there by foot or bike. You take your life in your hands trying to cross the dual carriageway by the roundabout, and have to go a good distance out of your way to use a pedestrian crossing. At least Douglas has controlled crossings in a direct path from the city across (slightly) narrower roads, and traffic slows cars down so you're able to get through relatively easily on a bike.

    I wonder was the problem the council refusing permission on the basis of it being visually big, which is subjective and easily dismissable by pointing out the shopping centre(s). ABP just needed to determine that wasn't a good reason, rather than counter any of the other points that could be made against the development.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,054 ✭✭✭ snotboogie


    Commercial dereliction in Douglas is massively overstated. It was brutal about 5 years ago but the main street has only 3 vacant units out of 25 total, one of which is the subject of an ongoing planning permission and another was recently knocked and seems to be under construction?

    There are dozens of small business around Douglas, they just tend to be restaurants, pubs, hairdressers and cosmetic rather than butchers and grocers but that’s the situation everywhere, even in the city centre.

    There is kind of a ridiculous nostalgia around “the village” too, according to Wikipedia Douglas has a population of nearly 30k people, that’s a considerably larger population than Kilkenny. It’s in no way a village and expecting it to develop like one is unrealistic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 345 ✭✭ theboringfox


    Douglas is a thoroughfare, not a village.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,660 ✭✭✭ Shedite27


    Call it what you want, there was a lovely centre to it not so long ago, I was very envious of Douglas back in the 90's, but since then, development in Douglas has been all about the car, and now it's far easier to drive to DC than it is to walk into one of the other stores. Plenty of other suburbs have nice shops, up my way in Mayfield there's nicer butchers (O'Connors), pubs (Cotton Ball) while still having Lidl, Aldi, SuperValu all within striking distance.

    Meanwhile the Douglas main street is Subway, Paddy Power, and Boylesports. The parking is probably a big bit of it, people want too drive to get their groceries, and that's easier in Douglas Court or Douglas SC



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭ Mav11


    With hindsight, I think that Douglas began to lose its soul as a village, with the development of Douglas Court and the access road / bypass in the 80's. It then became a shopping destination which, in reality can only be accessed by car.

    Anybody remember the controversy over the blue clock tower, originally a feature of the new DC development and castigated locally as "garish"? Simpler times.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,815 ✭✭✭✭ the beer revolu


    I don't see the reality that Douglas can only be accessed by car. Douglas is not badly laid out for pedestrians.

    Why do you say it can only be accessed by car? I'd genuinely like to know your reasons for saying this. I walk to and from Douglas from both the town side and the Rochestown side. Pedestrian layout isn't bad.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,972 ✭✭✭ TheChizler


    I've recently been walking to Douglas 5 times a week from the town direction and it's a grand walk in terms of length, just entirely unpleasant. Half the time you have to go in single file on the narrow footpaths, footpaths end without warning, entrances to estates are too wide, you risk getting your head smacked by bus mirrors. I don't know how you could do it if you had any sort of mobility issue.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,054 ✭✭✭ snotboogie


    I think you’re being quite selective. It’s hardly just Boyle Sports and Subway; Okura, KC’s, Marcello’s, Ecos, Barrys and O’Driscolls are all popular. Aside from Okura, sure none of them are doing anything that ambitious but they are well run, pleasant small businesses. Haveli and Golden Elephant just off the Main Street do the some of the best Indian and Thai food in the country.

    I know I sound like a massive Douglas defender but so much of what is said is ridiculous, I mean there is a Boyle sports and Subway a minute walk from the Cotton Ball too :/



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭ Mav11


    I mentioned that DC has become a shopping destination and has the car parking spaces to accommodate it as such.

    The reality of it being accessible within a walking distance is dependent on a number of factors, primarily:

    1. Distance from the centre. Assuming the individual is able and not all are, I would argue that they will only walk if they are within a 1km round trip. Even accepting a 2km round trip radius will only place the catchment area for walking half ways up Maryborough hill, to the junction of Grange road and Donnybrook hill and similarly confined distances to Well rd. etc. The majority of the shopping catchment population lies outside this radius.
    2. What is being purchased. Unless it is very minor it will need to be transported home. So for example, somebody living in Broadford or Lissadell etc is hardly going to walk down to DC and carry the weeks shopping home on their back, up Maryborough hill when they have a car sitting outside the door?
    3. So to my mind the reality is that unless the individual is within a half kilometer of DC, wants little more than milk or bread, have a car sitting outside the door and ample car space in the shopping centre they are not going to walk.

    And that is without taking other variables into account such as kids in tow, weather etc. So when I said that "in reality can only be accessed by car." perhaps I should have said that "in reality it would only be accessed by car"?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,895 ✭✭✭ ofcork




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭ Mav11


    Interesting article on the whole car, pedestrian, walking to the shops, village discussion, Beer. Seems to reflect many of the comments here.

    https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/arid-40837592.html



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,955 ✭✭✭ CorkRed93




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,624 ✭✭✭ cantalach


    It depends on what you mean by bad - unsafe or uninteresting. Douglas increasingly resembles the hideous ‘strip malls’ that blight much of U.S. suburbia. Moving on foot between adjoining businesses often means walking through car parks instead of walking along streets. Sure, it’s doable but it’s not pleasant. People drive from one car park to another because even in good weather, doing it on foot is a bit soul-destroying (confession: I’ve driven from the Tesco car park to the Dunnes car park instead of walking).

    Almost a quarter century ago, Naomi Klein wrote at length about the evil of strip mall development in ‘No Logo’. Many American cities have since woken up to the folly, and strip mall developments from the 80s and 90s are increasingly being demolished in favour of more human-friendly developments focused on sustainable modes of transport. In many Irish suburbs though, we are still gangbusters for strip malls.



  • Registered Users Posts: 455 ✭✭ KieferFan69


    Visited cork today on work. The new building by the water looks totally crap



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,624 ✭✭✭ cantalach


    Seems to have been a big concrete pour there yesterday. I passed the site on foot on two occasions and had a very brief chat with one of the site engineers. I asked when it would be finished. “God only knows,” she said with a grin.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,624 ✭✭✭ cantalach


    Which one? There are numerous new buildings by the water. That said, some of the regulars in this forum think they all look crap so maybe you don’t need to be specific.



  • Registered Users Posts: 455 ✭✭ KieferFan69


    The one on the quay with like white frame , windows accounting for two levels , looks like bland set from robocop , I like the black Stuttgart industrial metal building though and the refurbished station house



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  • Registered Users Posts: 162 ✭✭ DylanQuestion


    Not that it really matters but there is no such thing as Main Street in Douglas, it's East Douglas Street (and the other 'main street' is West Douglas Street)



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