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Future of Micheal Martin



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,240 ✭✭✭ Pussyhands

    I expect between March and June 2023 there'll be an announcement of a leadership contest.

    I don't think MM will step back right away but once he steps away from Taoiseachs office he has nothing else to go for in politics.

  • Registered Users Posts: 14,485 ✭✭✭✭ Loafing Oaf

    But he'll be pressed hard for absolute clarity on his intentions in the run-up to the handover. If he is planning to step down as FF leader before the GE why not announce it then? If he is still insisting he is staying on at the point his enemies in the party might very well take him at his word and launch a heave.

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,240 ✭✭✭ Pussyhands

    He'll say what he's saying now regarding that, that he won't be stepping down when he transfers office. Even if he's asked will he lead them into the GE he'll say yes. And then when he announces he's stepping down he'll say it like "on reflection, I have decided to step down to give a chance to someone else to lead with a fresh approach" yada yada

    Here he is in January 2020 saying he won't go into coalition with FG.

  • Registered Users Posts: 14,485 ✭✭✭✭ Loafing Oaf

    I don't understand why he would do it that way and run the risk of getting dragged kicking and screaming out of the FF leadership if as you say he has already decided in his own mind he won't be leading FF into the next GE and being tanaiste means little to him.

    If he is planning to announce in say May next year that he is stepping down as FF leader, well why not do it six months earlier and put to bed any strife within the party over the issue.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 383 ✭✭ CarProblem

    Possibly will take the reigns of Tanaiste but he doesn't care - all he wanted was the big seat and he got it. Mission accomplished

    Btw was it ever comprehensively established how that money ended up to be resting in the bank account of the wife of this "decent" man (who was also a minister when FF crashed the country AGAIN)

  • Registered Users Posts: 18,693 ✭✭✭✭ road_high

    I’d have gladly had all ruled from London throughout this. Ireland was ran by hysterical bedwetters. Totally clueless

  • Registered Users Posts: 18,693 ✭✭✭✭ road_high

    M Martin has zero pedigree whatsoever. A teacher from a working class background (he was quick to abandon his roots, you never hear reference to it). Basically he imagines money falls from the sky rather than people having to work hard to generate the wealth for him to blow on Covid bedwetting

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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,240 ✭✭✭ Pussyhands

    It's funny listening him harp on about climate change so much. You'd think he's a real eco guy. Reality is FF don't have any other policies that stand out so trying to go so hard on an issue supported so much by the people is an easy vote getter.

    Go Google Micheal Martin Climate Change and search for results pre 2015 and post 2015. You can see basically 0 relevant results pre 2015.

    From 2015 there's lots of quotes "we must act on climate change" etc.

    Climate change has been known for decades. Politicians have been warned for decades about it.

  • Registered Users Posts: 18,693 ✭✭✭✭ road_high

    Woke authoritarian bandwagons are his stock n trade

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,442 ✭✭✭ brainboru1104

    "the most spineless and gutless politician to ever lead this country"

    Have you ever noticed how every political leader is called this? Such a redundant statement.

  • Registered Users Posts: 15,777 ✭✭✭✭ fritzelly

    He is a very bland leader - reminds of John Major, achieved his goal of being Taoiseach tho but not sure if it was deserved

    Done nothing the whole time he has been leading the country bar the odd stuttering speech to buck up the country instilling zero confidence in his leadership - I mean jaysus soon after he took over his own party was falling apart with the scandals

    Compare him to any other (for better or worse) leaders around the world and he pales into insignificance

    (actually Eamon Ryan is probably more insipid than him but thank god not leading and probably not having much say in anything at present)

  • Registered Users Posts: 21,871 ✭✭✭✭ Strumms

    Martin replaced the actual worst Taoiseach ever… That was borne out to a good extent pre covid but once the crisis hit…. and when a gun was put to his head, Leo’s legacy will be indelibly borne out as during the biggest modern post war crises of the state and planet, he backed business interests over that of the wellbeing and health of the citizens…unforgivable…

    really showed a lack of backbone, bravery, intelligence, responsibility and gravitas..

    Varadkar I recall when asked admitted that although he has been ‘right a lot of the time’, and…’the Government has made mistakes during the COVID-19 pandemic….’ Yes… the government fûcked up but HE was mostly right….

    that single statement tells you everything you want to know about Leo…

    martin won’t last post pandemic… I just think as a result of the ordeal… him being 61… he’ll walk away

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭ maestroamado

    This was mentioned earlier comparing MM to Boris.... there is no comparison between politics here in the UK... I see Boris getting a roasting for attending a gig in the UK and he is getting a roasting... the exact same thing happens here and we get waffle...


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,140 ✭✭✭✭ is_that_so

    Most leadership changes here are not heaves. As others have said, sometime in 2023 the party will begin to look at that. There should be an agreed orderly changing of the guard but it's not their biggest problem anyway. That problem is persuading people to vote for the party and there is every chance they will become the third biggest party on a new election. If people want an alternative SF are setting themselves up to be that option so FF have their work cut out to change minds on that.

  • Registered Users Posts: 14,485 ✭✭✭✭ Loafing Oaf

    MM's critics within FF will be worried if the taoiseachship handover passes with MM still saying he is going to carry on things will just drift on like that till the GE. What may happen is that the anti-Martin figurehead (O'Callaghan?) will lay down an ultimatum at that point: "if he hasn't vacated the leadership in a year's time, I'm going to challenge him."

  • Registered Users Posts: 11,567 ✭✭✭✭ Faugheen

    O'Callaghan's stock is gone to shite since the by-election loss on his own patch, of which he was Director of Elections of.

    MM knew full well what he was doing making that appointment.

  • Registered Users Posts: 14,485 ✭✭✭✭ Loafing Oaf

    Well doesn't that maneuvering in intself suggest MM is intending to keep on keeping on? Or maybe he just doesn't want Big Jim to succeed him.

    If Martin is planning to fight on, I wonder does the party have the will to face him down, in the absence of a strong alternative candidate. Now that he has signalled that he may be kinda sorta willing to consider a deal with SF, does that not take the edge off a lot opposition to him? If they continue to do okay in the polls, i.e. not massively worse than FG, is there really an overwhelming case for taking him out?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,567 ✭✭✭✭ Faugheen

    Not necessarily. Certainly a political move to keep Jim in line. You've barely heard a word from him since.

    The Marc MacSharry's of this world were relying on Jim being the successor I think, and he got the hump because he knows he's not seen a legitimate successor and when Jim was put back in his box, MacSharry and co were stuck with MM as leader with no viable challenger to him.

    Michael McGrath is really the only one you could see as a successor, but he's happy enough to wait it out because anything else would damage him politically if he's unsuccessful.

  • Registered Users Posts: 21,316 ✭✭✭✭ Podge_irl

    Yeah, the UK govt is a beacon of accountability...

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,317 ✭✭✭ Brussels Sprout

    My Predictions:

    • Easiest one is that he won't be leader of FF for the next General Election. They're itching to get rid of him even though there is no obvious replacement
    • Therefore he won't stand again for election (as is the tradition with ex-Taoiseagh when they step down as party leaders) - great news for Michael McGrath as he hung on for the final seat in CSC in 2020 and there likely won't be 2 FF seats there next time.
    • As for when he'll be ousted as leader - I think the drumbeat for that will start in earnest when the Dail resumes after its Summer recess. He'll basically be a lame duck Taoiseach between September and December. He might even step down as leader of FF while staying on as Taoiseach in order to allow them to run the election for his successor (similar to Brian Cowen in 2011) before he leaves office.
    • Martin's successor will become the first FF leader never to become Taoiseach

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭ Finty Lemon

    Any man who can make the call to close the pubs at Christmas in Ireland, cannot be accused of being gutless.

    Martin is some man. Country first.

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,442 ✭✭✭ brainboru1104

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭ maestroamado

    your right... Boris stood up live on tele and tried to explain... It seems our Simon should do the same... that's accountability...

  • Registered Users Posts: 11,567 ✭✭✭✭ Faugheen

    He stood up live on tele and deflected everything, despite his 'apology'.

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭ maestroamado

    But he did it... you mentioned "accountability" being able to defect is politics... i think a politician should have balls... remember Hogan he did a runner and got caught in Brussels where he didn't have the protection of politics as we do here....

  • Registered Users Posts: 11,567 ✭✭✭✭ Faugheen

    He said that he didn’t know the rules as an excuse to go to a party.

    The rules HE set. After previously lying about whether it was a party at all.

    Genuinely can’t believe there are people here thinking that is acceptable.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭ maestroamado

    What did Simon say... that's my point... i really don't give a sith about the rules... he will meet his cronies for a chat....