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Climate emergency - why is Dublin Airport expanding???

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  • Registered Users Posts: 24,824 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    Dublin airport are only reacting to the demand placed upon it.

    the population is skyrocketing in no small part due to the permanent arrival of people from other countries , therefore there is going to be greater demand for people to travel...leisure travel, business and indeed part of that is people returning home, basically supply and demand.

    if governments had a problem with climate change why are they facilitating the importing of thousands of people every year, one of the catalysts for climate change here ? Our ability to restrict is in turn restricted by the EU.. but the EU is in turn failing and has failed its member states.... on climate change as well as other aspects of our lives.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,542 ✭✭✭Dr. Bre


    It can’t be that serious if our leaders our back flying around. The climate worry more so than emergency



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    You might want to organise to so something before its too late about the sulphur hexafluoride (SF6) problem its 39,800 times as harmful as CO2 and it's presence in our local atmosphere has increased by ~250% as measured in Mace head since 1997. The Irish government target is 70% random energy by 2030, this is something that demands your attention as the power companies are trying to keep a low profile on SF6 as are the double glazing window makers.

    In the sane vein you might look into nitrogen trifluoride (NF3) which is 17,200 times as harmful as CO2.


    Thomas Sowell once said "There are no solutions. There are only trade-offs." Blind pursuit of feel good policies may actually be doing us more harm than good. All we have to show for all that money and sacrifice are higher energy bills in the places which spent the most money on green energy, and soaring global reliance on cheap fossil fuel.


    There is much more expense and taxation lined up in Irelands climate action plans:


    Warm clothes will be the future at home due to energy bills, we will need that second runway to get off the island once a year to find warm temperatures.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,780 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    "Ireland has become the second country in the world to declare a climate EMERGENCY."

    We can declare it, it doesnt follow we should do anything about it. Because Ireland.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    That act was passed by just 6 TDs, which shows the cowardice of the body politic in Ireland, not willing to put their name to not offend their constituencies and not willing to disobey the EU (and cut off the "free" money). It gets much worse, in the era of the Soviet Union they have 5 year plans (gosplan) as part of central economic planning, if you have been paying attention under the Climate action and low carbon development (amendment) act 2021 the climate change advisory council will submit five year carbon budgets which must be ratified by the oireachteas.

    It is entirely foreseeable we will face shortages of both energy and food over the course of this decade as a result of pursuing these policies. The plans will incentivise collecting subsidies over production, 70% random energy means massive grid balancing costs and the requirement to subsidise coal and natural gas as standby. None of these targets can be met at any reasonable economic cost which means there will be fraud to make up the numbers.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 81,263 ✭✭✭✭Atlantic Dawn
    M


    Is there a public list of those TD's those who voted for this? I'd like to scrutinise them and the investments of their friends and families "in the game" so to speak. Someone taking wind farm money or their mates shouldn't be voting for them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 231 ✭✭FazyLucker


    How do I delete a comment now?



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    I think the plan is flying windmills propellors at the front and a few digger batteries which will be used just for take-off...

    For me the bigger disaster is why Dublin Airport was not moved out around Kilcock and a train system to it 20 years ago. We did not have politicians with foresight then and for me not much has changed....



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    If you are looking for register of members interests you will be disappointed the climate legislation is coming from abroad via non-government organisations (NGOs).

    The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) was created in 1988. It was set up by the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) and the United Nations Environment Program (UNEP). Outside this the umbrella organisation for the NGOs is the Climate Action Network (CAN) formed in 1989, headquarters in Beirut, Lebanon and registered in Bonn, Germany. This is how the likes of World Wildlife Fund, Oxfam, Greenpeace and Friends of the earth (FOE) and others coordinate and why see the same push for protests, policies and climate emergencies and similar legislation worldwide.



    The local NGOs who are CAN members:

    • Trócaire  (Stop Climate Chaos provides their information)
    • Stop Climate Chaos
    • Friends of the Earth Ireland
    • An Taisce

    The main spokes people behind these organisations you will find Oisín Coghlan, Director of Friends of the Earth, Jerry Mac Evilly, Head of Policy at Friends of the Earth Ireland, From Stop Climate Chaos - Sadhbh O Neill a researcher of climate ethics and carbon markets at the School of Politics and International Relations at UCD, funded by the Irish Research Council. These are some of the people doing the lobbying.

    If you are looking for the commercial interests then look for Wind Energy Ireland, they put out the press releases when the wind is blowing, they are silent when it does not.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,394 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Why on earth would you want to move the airport? Its location is fantastic.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,290 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    It’s quite telling how many of the “aero sexual” daa cheerleaders are willing to promote fake news, brazen climate denial and sheer deception to hoodwink the Irish public.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,045 ✭✭✭silver2020


    At busy times in Dublin airport plane are circling overhead for up to 30 minutes awaiting a slot to land. Planes are also queuing up to 30 minutes for a takeoff slot.


    During this time the engines are running causing a lot of air pollution.


    So therefore the new runway is a very green initiative by Dublin Airport 🤑



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    You likely live in Swords... It is certainly in the wrong place and access is terrible... no rail transport..... one motorway servicing almost the whole country... Belfast Airport is 20 miles from the city...



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,394 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I live in Switzerland, though I used to live on the northside (not Swords). The lack of rail transport has nothing to do with its location though, if anything its incredibly well placed to be connected by the metro. Building a new airport beside a rail line would be a lot harder than building a rail line beside an airport.

    Its beside two motorways (M1/M50) and super close to the city. I despise airports that are far outside a city.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande



    Climate change projections are quite unreliable to begin with and the unreliability of the measurement magnifies as you move forward in time, obviously because the errors accumulate as you get out to 50 years the error bars around the projections are already so wide, that we won't be able to measure the positive or negative effects of anything we do right now. So how in the world are you going to solve a problem when you can't even measure the consequence of your actions? How is that even possible? and besides that what is the solution? What are we going to do?

    Here is one of our most pressing environmental problems that affects the population from September 2021 alone, water quality is the issue, in any one month there are several boil notices issued somewhere in the country. What makes you think we can control "the climate" when we have problems with comparatively simple issues like water quality?


    Per George Carlin "We haven’t learned how to care for one another, we’re gonna' save the . . . planet?!"



    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,824 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    It’s not in the wrong place or anything close to being.

    its close to the M50, M1. Almost 20 bus routes serve the airport between Dublin Bus and Bus Éireann and private operators.

    you can get from the airport to the center of the city in 20-30 minutes depending on traffic.

    when I lived in Paris it was about 90 minutes from leaving my front door in the 5th arrondisment ( central Paris ) and a pain in the hole bag drag of about 20 minutes from the train station to the checkin at the terminal.

    Moving an airport won’t give it rail access... getting the metro in there will be a start.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,290 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    There’s no metro and doubt there ever be in dublin



  • Registered Users Posts: 207 ✭✭Biscuitus


    "Warm clothes will be the future at home due to energy bills"


    Wait you guys don't wear a jacket and hat inside already?



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,040 ✭✭✭✭smurfjed


    As we were talking about demand, if MrBoeings projects are real, then China will have more air traffic than Europe beginning in 2030.

    [i]Boeing keeps faith in China market, forecasts 8,700 new aircraft by 2040

    By Alfred Chua 22 September 2021

    Boeing forecasts that Chinese carriers will need 8,700 new aircraft — valued at nearly $1.5 trillion — over the next two decades, with more than two-thirds supporting market growth, rather than fleet replacement. 

    The figure makes up nearly half the total amount of aircraft deliveries forecasted for the wider Asia-Pacific region, and underpins the importance of the market to the North American airframer. 

    Releasing its forecast as part of its commercial market outlook for 2021 through 2040, Boeing remains optimistic of “healthy air traffic increases” in the Chinese air travel market, with an expected average annual passenger traffic growth of 5.4%. 

    According to Boeing projections, the Chinese domestic passenger market is expected to overtake intra-European traffic by 2030, and exceed air travel within North America by 2040. 

    Of the 8,700 aircraft, around 75%, or more than 6,000 aircraft, are forecast to be narrowbodies, with widebody aircraft making up 19%. 

    It notes that two-thirds of the forecasted aircraft deliveries will be for growth purposes, with the remaining one-third of deliveries for fleet replacement.[\i]



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,040 ✭✭✭✭smurfjed


    This is also rather interesting.

    [Reducing the impact of non-CO₂ climate impact: EUROCONTROL MUAC and DLR partnering on contrail prevention]

    The idea is to basically have aircraft change flight levels in order to avoid producing CONTRAILS, it will be interesting to see the comparison between that aircraft burning more fuel and creating more CO2 emissions versus the benefits on reducing ground heating.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    A 737Max or a 320Neo or a 220 shouldn't be leaving massive contrails behind themselves as at cruise they are sipping small amounts of hydrocarbons.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    The Airport cannot be moved... the only thing that would help Dublin now is underground rail which will not ever happen.


    The other thing that would help is a motorway linking M4 and M7 directly to the Airport with new route via lucan/St Margrets...



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,445 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    what's the difference in the amount they'd use, compared to say a 20 year old plane of the same size?



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,215 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    The thing is that aviation and the whole air travel business is only 2 to 3% of the world's CO2 contribution. Restricting air travel, or imposing taxes will only hurt the economy, and that would be even more an issue on an island like Ireland. I actually see it positive for Ireland that the airport in Dublin is expanding, another parallel runway north of it.

    In relation to the climate emergency the real problem is coal. There are over 1300 coal fired power plants in construction or in planning phase, mostly in China and India. Humanity needs to stop burning coal permanently and at the earliest possible convenience.



  • Registered Users Posts: 689 ✭✭✭Oscar Madison


    Because it's all just horse sh* We have a large nuclear reactor a couple of million miles away from us that isn't constant!

    Our spin around the above isn't perfect either so there will be fluctuations in temperatures over the millenia!

    Focus should be on reducing plastics but no one will do anything about that due to the companies that produce

    more & more of it. Coca Cola for example but you can't be upsetting their share holders or profits!



  • Registered Users Posts: 493 ✭✭BobHopeless


    Just back from dropping the other half off at the airport she is headed off to Sorrento with some friends for a much deserved holiday. It was heart warming to see the airport so busy this morning queues of cars waiting to drop people off at departures. I had to fly out a few times during the lockdown and the place was deserted and a very sorry sight.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,394 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Yup, cause what we definitely need to help with the climate problem is more motorways.


    Its perfectly possible to reconcile the knowledge that climate change is real (as pretty much 99% of scientists who study it agree though seemingly plenty people here know better 🙄) with the understanding that Ireland should focus its efforts on increasing public transport, improving renewable electricity generation and other measures above cutting ourselves off from the world.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,824 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    unfortunately investing in and delivering public transport infrastructure has never been a strength of our political lot...

    look at the time it took to get the Luas going... light rail / tramways spoken about in 1981, first passengers ? 2004 !



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,394 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Nope, its an absolute mess. But if people want to take climate change seriously (and they should) that is where they should be devoting their efforts.



This discussion has been closed.
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