Climate emergency - why is Dublin Airport expanding???

tinytobe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117937653#Comment_117937653

The problem is that climate change takes a lot of international coordination. And as long as there is no real action on abolishing coal which is the real "climate killer" and deviating towards aviation, there won't be any results.

Not only coal and coal fired power stations but also that endless deforestation especially in Brazil but also in other countries is a big factor.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117936822#Comment_117936822

When you burn kerosene or petrol, by far the largest byproduct is water in the form of vapor. There are relativly tiny amounts of CO2 or what people commonly think of as pollutants. Burn a litre of these fuels and you get about a litre, of water. They are not a form of visible polution, they are long thin clouds comprising nothing more harmful than water.

Contrails form when the temperature of the air the plane is flying in is low and the water vapour produced condenses into long thin white clouds of ice crystals, rather than water vapour clouds. This is why the are more commonly visible in winter and are often so bright.

If you think conytrails are harmful, then I suggest you stop breathing for the rest of your life as you exhale water vapour with every breath.

[Deleted User]

I don't know why you are addressing me. I constructed my sentence to be as neutral as possible.

Strumms

Get serious about climate change, get tough about the causes of it.

also get smart about the fast ever expanding population here...

beachhead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058208330/climate-emergency-why-is-dublin-airport-expanding

People want to travel.dublin airport is a mishmash of shite.Ask the Russians,chinese or brazilians or african countries what they think of a 1st world climate emergency.Ireland's contribution to global warming is a piss in the worlds oceans.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117943558#Comment_117943558

Beacause you were implying that a contrail is a sign/form of pollution.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117943616#Comment_117943616

It’s true, our contribution is mega minute. So putting a gun to our heads to solve a problem we have fück all responsibility for is dickheadish.

We in this country are responsible for fractions of one percent of climate change.

mad how people are pissing and moaning about the main airport on a small island nation but have fûck all to say about China, US, India and Russia... all of whom as countries are the greatest catalysts and have the greatest negative impact on climate change.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117943632#Comment_117943632

No I wasn't. You incorrectly inferred that. It seems plausible cloud cover may cause localised warming. I used the word hydrocarbon rather than fuel for a reason.

beachhead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117943639#Comment_117943639

Forgot to add the US and India.Don't forget the free for all that will be the "exploration" and destruction of the Antarctic.A few loops on O'connell st or voting green won't stop that.But taxing everything and everyone that moves will certainly stop global warming.

Parachutes

It’s hilarious, how much does Ireland, as a tiny island country, contribute to global carbon?

yet where’s the outrage when China are building new coal and gas factories and who knows how many airports a year.

give me a feckin break…..

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117946677#Comment_117946677

Indeed... but the wonky wokies will probably bring the fûckin city to a standstill demanding we close the airports....

Beechwoodspark

Not denying for one second that huge changes have to happen in America, Russia, china, India etc

im Irish though. I’m concerned with Irish emissions and particularly dublin airport crazy scheme that it expands operations.

Nermal

https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/forestry-enviro/environment/we-cant-have-this-ongoing-growth-of-the-dairy-sector-laura-burke-40894479.html

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/data-centres-could-use-70-of-ireland-s-electricity-by-2030-committee-to-hear-1.4685589

The environmental agenda is the agenda of degrowth.

Degrowth is poverty.

Be honest. Drop the 'green new deal' twaddle. Tell people you will make them and their children poorer, and see how many of them vote for you.

[Deleted User]

it's an infrastructure project, if it gets put on the long finger any further, it won't get done, like everything else in Ireland...

Planes will and are becoming more environmentally friendly and there are numerous other climate aspects which need to be addressed in Ireland which have far more urgency than an airport expansion.... anyone who argues differently has some serious wool over their eyes

Beechwoodspark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117949382#Comment_117949382

Every one of the data centres should be slapped with a green levy with the money directly funnelled to a green R & D fund

MBE220d

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117950931#Comment_117950931

No chance, green levies are only for ordinary pheasants.

Pa ElGrande

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117950931#Comment_117950931

Datacenters are already one step ahead ahead of the game, buying up the random power generation and claiming the credits to offset against the gas and coal power they use.

• Amazon’s first operational wind farm in Ireland delivers clean energy to the grid
• Microsoft, GE sign agreement on new wind project in Ireland
• Echelon Sees Green in Wind-Powered Irish Data Center Project

And being random energy, the wind does not blow consistently, neither is solar output consistent but we want more of it forgetting that multiplying output by zero generation is still zero generation.

• Ireland’s wind energy generation plummets during heatwave
• Energy parks tipped to emerge in Ireland

Remember Eirgrids goal is 70% random power generation, and the governments targeted ~ million electric cars and hundreds of thousands of heat pumps (with immersion heaters need heat greater than 60C) to add to electricity demand, the grid balancing costs for so much random energy are adding to our bills alone. In addition there has been a surge in demand for gas worldwide while in Europe many coal plants have been shutdown over the past decade leading to a supply crunch where there is not enough supply or storage capacity for gas to meet winter demand - we better hope for mild winter across Europe - recent years has been longer and colder Spring seasons which have depleted gas supplies.

The good land based sites for wind power generation have already been taken as more of turbines are built they are put in areas with less wind (i.e. less power generation) and more hostile natural environments (offshore) which increase installation and operating costs that us consumers must absorb. Meanwhile there is limited investment in fossil fuel generation and it will need to be subsidised to ensure the capital equipment is maintained and available.

The current production problems have been decades in the making and we can expect more problems with supply chains as much of the goods we consume are supplied just in time. Firms are already finding they have to order and stock in advance, those costs will be passed to end consumers.

• European forward gas prices become unanchored
• UK - More than a million customers now affected by energy crisis as another two suppliers collapse
• Record high prices trigger European gas demand destruction

It gets more interesting coal shortages in China.

• Apple and Tesla suppliers halt production as ‘unprecedented’ power crisis hits China

What has our government to say? They are doubling down on random energy.

Varadkar calls for ‘expansion’ in wind power to supply network.

Eamon Ryan says Ireland is facing a 'very tight' few years for energy supply

"It's both managing demand and supply and there has to be regulation of demand. One industry isn't just going to expand massively and make it impossible for us to meet our climate targets or risk energy security."

Renewable power supplies

He said the main "approach", both at a national and European level, was developing renewable power supplies.

Our sea area is 10 times our land area and probably the most energy-rich place. Wind power at sea is huge and there's real potential for us to tap into that and be able to power, not just industry, but transport, a whole range of different needs."

Mr Ryan said Ireland was heading for "a very tight situation for the next two to three, four years, while we build up some of those battery and gas-fired back-up systems".

Power issues could delay switch to electric vehicles, says Applegreen

In an interview with the Irish Independent, Applegreen chief operating officer Joe Barrett said that the group has submitted several applications to Eirgrid for power connections, but is being told it faces a long wait – even years – before they can be made.

BobHopeless

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117946677#Comment_117946677

People are too woke to blame the Chinese, afraid they'd be accused of Asian hate or some such sh1t.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117958319#Comment_117958319

sorry, don't know how to partial quote...

But I find the "not enough power to power electric vehicles" future paradox absolutely hilarious.... and people are complaining about a new runway

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117947057#Comment_117947057

Is building a new runway going to make that much of a difference to climate change? It will certainly aid our economy.

As for the data centres, drive on, the more employment and revenue we bring into the country, the better.

Pa ElGrande

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117961925#Comment_117961925

That's not all, last year there was too much wind (dispatch down), and this year there has not been enough wind across Western Europe which shows up the lie from the wind turbine operators that there is always wind blowing somewhere . . . . ESB are pursuing batteries, these are only good enough for balancing i.e. managing sudden dips in power caused by random generation, they are no good when we get several weeks fine weather which contrary to popular belief does sometimes happen in Ireland. Some of the wind operators get to double dip charging us directly for electricity consumed and picking up a subsidy for 15 years. Building an electricity system dependent on random energy is equivalent to playing Russian Roulette eventually the gamble fails and the grid will take a hit from that one bullet. What happens when we get prolonged cold snaps and periods of low wind, when power demand is greatest? The wind isn’t going to become more consistent or reliable just because we subsidised more turbines.

State’s power grid ‘urgently needs strengthening’

Renewable electricity is lost when wind farms are instructed to reduce the power they generate, because the transmission system is unable to cope with the large volumes of clean power available. This is known as “dispatch down” and for the first half of 2020 almost an eighth of available wind energy was lost.

This increased fossil fuel dependency, generating an additional 47,000 tonnes of CO2 every month.

The Saving Power report commissioned by the energy storage industry and wind energy developers outlines how a stronger grid is essential to achieving the Government’s 70 per cent renewable electricity target by 2030.

Its recommends that :

1. The Commission for the Regulation of Utilities (CRU) give EirGrid and ESB Networks adequate resources to build new grid infrastructure to connect rising numbers of renewable energy projects;

2. Replace fossil fuel back-up used on the system with zero-carbon solutions like energy storage and “demand response” where major users reduce or delay electricity usage when required;

3. Interconnectors to Britain and France must be delivered on time. Planning should start for new interconnections in the 2030s;

4. Redesign and reinforce the transmission system focussing on where large volumes of renewable energy are expected to be developed.

European Commission approves scheme to support electricity production from renewable sources in Ireland

Estimate Total Budget

€7.2 billion - €12.5 billion

Duration

2020 - 2025.

How it operates

1. Aid for the production of electricity from renewable sources granted under the RESS will be allocated through auctions.

2. All eligible technologies will compete for subsidies in these auctions. This is to ensure the cost-effective achievement of renewable electricity targets by encouraging competition. (However, Ireland has justified preferential treatment for a small quantity of energy from solar, as well as from offshore wind on the basis of the longer term potential of these technologies for the country.)

3. Successful applicants of the RESS will receive support over 15 years in the form of a premium on top of the market price.

4. The competitive auctions through which the aid is granted will set a ‘strike price'. When the market price is below this ‘strike price', beneficiaries will be entitled to receive payments equal to the difference between the two prices. However, when the market price is above the ‘strike price‘, beneficiaries will have to make payments equal to the difference between the two prices. These payments will be returned to Irish consumers in the form of reduced electricity bills.

Varadkar 'confident' there'll be no winter blackouts 'but nobody can guarantee it'

He added: ”There is a short-term immediate risk to the supply of electricity and that has been caused by a number of factors including those two power stations that are closed, wind not blowing as much as was anticipated and also problems with the interconnector between the UK and Ireland.”

Pa ElGrande

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117964377#Comment_117964377

Back in 2017 - Intel goes 100% renewable to power 360-acre Leixlip campus

Now in 2021 - The greenwashing MNCs are singing a different tune that no doubt has the ministers attention.

This is not idle scaremongering. It has been reported that Ireland may lose out on an €80 billion investment by Intel because of concerns about the capacity of our energy infrastructure. Meanwhile, IDA Ireland has already warned that our energy supply crisis could “inflict serious reputational damage on the country”. After all, it’s hard to market the country as a prime location for thrusting captains of industry when you can’t even guarantee that you can keep the lights on.

The datacenters enable jobs that are spread across the country and worldwide as system administrators or developer operations (Devops) who remotely manage these systems and the services (such as boards) that depend on them.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117947057#Comment_117947057

How can it be deemed crazy ?

• The current population of Ireland in 2021 is 4,982,907, a 0.91% increase from 2020.
• The population of Ireland in 2020 was 4,937,786, a 1.13% increase from 2019.
• The population of Ireland in 2019 was 4,882,495, a 1.32% increase from 2018.
• The population of Ireland in 2018 was 4,818,690, a 1.38% increase from 2017.

the population is growing, fast too, sooo the more people here, the more people wanting and requiring to travel. The more goods will be imported and exported via air too... the driver of the expansion is not €€€€, it’s the sheer numbers of people here... when the last terminal was completed 11 years ago in 2010...there were about 400,000 people less here then now, so it’s been a rapid population rise and the transport of people, and goods needs to be facilitated..

Aviation accounts for around 2.5% of global CO2 emissions. There are many more industry that require the ire of people then aviation... who are an industry actively try to spend billions on reducing co2 emissions..through greener planes,smarter and greener flight planning ie. Aircraft less time airborne...