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All Covid-19 measures are permanent, don't be a boiling frog!

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  • Registered Users Posts: 382 ✭✭Unicorn Milk Latte


    No.

    When we talk about conspiracists, we mean exactly what you find when you go to an actual conspiracy video site:


    ---

    Shocking Numbers For Deaths and Miscarriages Among the Vaccinated

    The Vaccine Causes The Virus To Be More Dangerous

    YOU CANNOT CATCH A VIRUS!

    Flat Earth Universe - A Short Documentary Film

    OUR VULNERABLE SENIORS ARE BEING MURDERED!

    Humans are a Genetically ENGINEERED SPECIES

    EXPLAINS HOW THE DEPOPULATION mRNA VACCINES WILL START WORKING IN 3-6 MONTHS - DR. TENPENNY

    BILL GATES - THE SYRINGES HAVE TRACKERS

    WHY PEOPLE WILL START DYING AFTER RECEIVING mRNA VACCINATIONS

    UPDATED COMPILATION OF MAGNETS STICKING TO PEOPLE'S ARMS - NANOTECHNOLOGY DEPLOYED

    MURDER BY INJECTION (COVID-19 VACCINES)

    ADOLF HITLER WARNED HUMANITY BUT WE DIDN'T LISTEN! (DOCUMENTARY VIDEO)

    THE COVID mRNA JAB IS NOT A VACCINE

    THE BEST FLAT EARTH DOCUMENTARY

    DISCLOSURE: WHY THE W.H.O. FAKED A PANDEMIC

    ADOLF HITLER: THE MAN WHO FOUGHT AGAINST THE NEW WORLD ORDER TAKEOVER

    Ex CIA interview on celebrities eating children 


    ---



  • Registered Users Posts: 777 ✭✭✭machaseh


    All the things you listed are in fact reasons for me to not take the vaccine. They are not valid reasons for a VULNERABLE person not to take the vaccine; after all, it has been well established that the vaccine does prevent the majority of hospitalizations and deaths in that group.


    Big pharma not putting saving lives as the first priority, and exploiting the pandemic for their own gain, is a valid reason not to take the vaccine.


    Governments being in the pockets of the interests of Big Pharma is a valid reason not to take the vaccine.


    The vaccine not being supplied to those who need it most, namely vulnerable people in Africa and other poor regions, is a valid reason not to take the vaccine.


    I am not saying that nobody who is healthy should take the vaccine. Clearly, for some people, the benefits outweigh the drawbacks. For me, they don't. You can only respect that. If you keep calling people like that dumb, then those people will only become less and less likely to take the vaccine.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,483 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    None of those are valid reasons. If you are in Ireland, we the tax payer have bought you the vaccine. If not used it gets dumped. What benefit is that to people in Africa?

    what about other poor nations, or is only the continent of Africa that is poor in your eyes?

    Show the evidence you have that the people making the decisions in Ireland, elected representatives are benefiting from pharmaceutical companies, or else retract your claim.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,362 ✭✭✭dePeatrick


    You might have a small problem booking a flight without a Covid vaccination cert! 😂



  • Registered Users Posts: 777 ✭✭✭machaseh


    Give an argument why these are not valid reasons not to take the vaccine.


    No, my vaccine will not get dumped, simply as I have never registered to get the vaccine.


    Strange that you are suddenly saying that I need to produce evidence of Irish politicians specifically benefiting from pharmaceutical companies. As far as I am aware, no vaccines are being produced in Ireland. Any corruption scandals would probably be at a much higher level, such as the EU, and would probably not come out until much later.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,483 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    You said “Governments being in the pockets of the interests of Big Pharma is a valid reason not to take the vaccine.” So how are members of the Irish government benefiting. Even if you change it to EU, the Irish government are involved. So no more bullshit. Show the evidence.



  • Registered Users Posts: 109 ✭✭Art Fonzarelli


    "Big pharma not putting saving lives as the first priority, and exploiting the pandemic for their own gain, is a valid reason not to take the vaccine."

    Please explain how that works. How does BP not prioritising saving lives validate you not caring about other people's lives?

    "Governments being in the pockets of the interests of Big Pharma is a valid reason not to take the vaccine."

    1) That doesn't make sense, please explain.

    2) You've ignored the fact that BP accounts for only a small amount of pressure on the government relative to the pressure wielded by the interests of the rest of the business world, most of whom require things to return to normal asap. Therefore, if you're suggesting that refusing the vaccine is in some way a protest against state-corporate corruption I think you're completely misguided. The vast majority of the corporate/industry pressure on the government is being applied in order to force the reopening without restriction, without strict vaccination rules, etc. Accidentally at least, BP is on the opposite side - if any - of that particular Big Business vs the welfare of the people argument. While it's motive is still profit, the byproduct is vaccinated people.

    "The vaccine not being supplied to those who need it most, namely vulnerable people in Africa and other poor regions, is a valid reason not to take the vaccine."

    Again, can you explain your reasoning?

    Lastly, you've ignored my suggestion that by not taking the vaccine you're contributing to further potential BP profits due to increased possibility of mutation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 382 ✭✭Unicorn Milk Latte


    Trusting politicians, or the government, is not required.

    Trusting Big Pharma is not required.


    The people to listen to are the ones with a comprehensive understanding of the situation - virologists and epidemiologists.

    These people make suggestions to contain the virus, to reduce deaths and hospitalisations.

    They suggested two methodologies: non-pharmaceutical (masks, distancing, lockdowns) and pharmaceutical (vaccines, medication for hospitalised patients).

    The only realistic option for global manufacturing and distribution of Covid vaccines right now is big Pharma. If you're aware of an alternative method, don't hesitate to let us know.

    This is pragmatism - a small Pharma company like Biontech, which developed one of the mRNA vaccines, needs a big Pharma company like Pfizer for manufacturing and distribution on a global scale.


    FWIW, the actual development of the first vaccines was very quick, they were already finished in March 2020. Everything that came afterwards was related to testing and certification - determining the efficacy, safety, etc.

    The difference to the same process when there is no pandemic was that several procedures, like testing with different groups, that are done sequentially (one after the other) in normal times were done in parallel during the pandemic. The objective was to have the exact same safety standards as with every other vaccine - everything else would be idiotic - but to go through the process faster, more efficiently, without compromise.



  • Registered Users Posts: 777 ✭✭✭machaseh


    False dichotomy. I can limit the spread of the virus by means other than getting vaccinated. For example I do not go to festivals or crowded nightclubs, rarely did even before covid hit. A vaccinated person going to superspreader events will spread more virus than I do, as we already know that the vaccine reduces but does not eliminate the spread of the virus. That said, ultimately I firmly believe that every human being has their own responsibility in this matter. I frequently have elderly people not taking social distancing or even mask wearing into account. I was already warned elsewhere on this forum for making a joke about that, the moderators do not have humour here so I will not comment on that further.


    It is true that many businesses want things to return to normal. Contrary to what you say, however, they do not care about mandating vaccines. If I were a retail CEO wanting to make as much money as possible, I'd lobby with the government to make vaccines OBLIGATORY for ALL, why? So I can reopen my stores and make loads of money, without being painted in a negative light in the media because people are dying from covid after visiting my stores.

    I do indeed protest against this by refusing to take a vaccine. It's also a way to protest against people being forced back into offices, whereas they can work just as effectively from home.

    If Big Pharma had the interest of the people in mind they'd distribute their vaccines across the global (including africa, and other poor regions of the world) VULNERABLe population first, before proceeding to make money off of the richer, less vulnerable population in first world countries. They did not do that and governments also facilitated them in not doing so.


    Me as a person living in a first world country with already a very high vaccination rate not taking the vaccine does not increase the risk of mutations. Very large amount of unvaccinated people do, such as perhaps in the most fundamentalist American states, or, you guessed it: in ALL POOR COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    Again you are making all of these statements in contradiction to the advice of doctors and experts.

    Why are these doctors and experts lying?

    Why should we believe your conclusions over the advice of trained experts?


    And again, what have you personally done to help improve health care in Africa?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,800 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Have you donated at least one jab to Africa? If not, why not?



  • Registered Users Posts: 777 ✭✭✭machaseh


    Cheers buddy, paypalled them a tenner just there.


    Now this is actually something productive and helpful for a change on this forum. Thanks.


    https://i.imgur.com/H8JTwLO.png



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,800 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe



    The first constructive thing to come out of this forum



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Fair play



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    An interesting article about vaccine passports and digital identities by In Truth We Trust: ‘This Isn’t About Vaccine Passports; It Is a Means to Create Everyone’s Digital Identities.’ - Truth Talk UK


    "We are living day to day, in some form of shock doctrine: Where the public messaging is to overwhelm the desperate public who just want some sense of normality to return. But we have announcement after announcement of proposed digital controls and vaccine passport measures while they constantly shift the goalposts."


    He explains why he believes there's such a push to get everyone vaccinated. I've never heard of hamburgers and money as a reward for getting vaccinated.



  • Registered Users Posts: 857 ✭✭✭PintOfView


    I don't have time to pick all that apart now. However, how do you know that it is not all just misinformation put out there by someone who wants to disrupt things in the UK? Do you know who is behind that site (they don't say who they are)?

    I've checked out the EU Covid passports and can't see they are a threat of any kind. They are simply a QR code (barcode) with your information on it, but with a verification signature that you can't fake, so it can be trusted by airports, restaurants, etc. And your information is not in any centralised EU database, etc.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,483 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    You missed the incentives occurring in the US that have been going on for months?

    COVID vaccine incentives: The states offering rewards to get vaccinated - Axios

    Now really, did you really not know, or were you just ignoring it?

    The goal is to encourage 100% of eligible people to get themselves vaccinated, incentives (beyond the EU passport) will be in Ireland soon as well (just so you're not shocked when it happens). There will be some hold outs, but they'll be in the tiniest minority soon.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,800 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Why do you think you unquestioningly seem to lap up anything conspiracy related to Covid and the WEF?



  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 15,230 Mod ✭✭✭✭FutureGuy


    Surprised to see this thread is still going. They've reversed 95% of the measures, more in vaccinated people.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,800 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Vague conspiracies can easily be modified and goalposts moved. It's why they are deliberately vague.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    95%? Masks still required everywhere, social distancing still required by law. No nightclubs, no concerts, no summer camps for children. The only thing a person who has been vaccinated can do is eat indoors as long as they bring their ID with them and show their vaccine passport.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I don't think I missed that. I know they've been offering incentives for months. I've just never heard of hamburgers and doughnuts being offered as a reward for getting vaccinated. And it's surprising that it's not fruit that's being offered since hamburgers and doughnuts aren't good for a person.


    InTruthWeTrust reckons the goal is to vaccinate everyone so that digital IDs can be rolled out.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,800 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    And when these are all lifted in Ireland, what then? Will you admit that your ideas were full of nonsense? Or will you just modify them?

    The majority of conspiracy posters seem to disappear when their predictions/ideas turn out to be false. There's a high turnover here.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    It's full of quotes and references that can be checked. He did a lot of research.


    But what about when to do previously normal everyday activities requires scanning a QR code? It's naïve to believe that its use couldn't be extended to shops, banks etc.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I will.


    A lot of things that were dismissed as conspiracy theories have come to pass.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    Such as?

    You guys were also predicting that this was going to be the start of global communism and the biblical apocalypse.you yourself have claimed that this is the start of a plot to turn people into cyborgs.

    What have you yourself done to verify any of the claims in your latest link dump? Or did you just see they did some links to random stuff and assume that then everything they claim is true?



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    OK. Why do they want to get rid of nightclubs and summer camps permanently. What's the benefit for them?

    You never seem to be able to explain this. Why? Why do you always ignore this question?



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,800 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    No. This is yet another trope perpetuated by the conspiracy community. Online conspiracy theorists make a thousand random vague predictions a day, casting the widest net possible, and then claim victory is anything remotely related is taken under the slightest consideration.

    Take a look at this forum, how many predictions from 13 years of posts turned out to be true?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,589 ✭✭✭✭The Nal




This discussion has been closed.
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