Hansons Method

ThebitterLemon · 12-06-2021 08:32PM

Hanson newbie question.

I’m doing the hm plan

Race is on the end of August.

The plan has no tune up races and I was considering doing the Kilbeggan 10 miler @ HMP, it’s 3 weeks before goal race.

Any advice/pointers from more experienced Hansoners would be appreciated

Thanks

TbL

Murph_D · 12-06-2021 09:24PM

ThebitterLemon wrote: »

Hanson newbie question.

I’m doing the hm plan

Race is on the end of August.

The plan has no tune up races and I was considering doing the Kilbeggan 10 miler @ HMP, it’s 3 weeks before goal race.

Any advice/pointers from more experienced Hansoners would be appreciated

Thanks

TbL

I wouldn’t be against it in theory, swapping it out for the 7m HMP tempo that’s on the plan but 10m at goal HMP is a big swing at it - would you have the discipline to treat the first 3 m as a warmup at easy pace? If so, I think it would be an excellent session and not too different to what’s actually on the plan that week. Plus you’ll feel great ramping it up in the middle of the race as the rest of the field is starting to settle.

It all depends on how much powder you want to keep dry for the last 3 weeks. You’ll be feeling pretty fatigued at this stage of the plan anyway.

Just my 2c.

ThebitterLemon · 12-06-2021 09:30PM

Murph_D wrote: »

I wouldn’t be against it in theory, swapping it out for the 7m HMP tempo that’s on the plan but 10m at goal HMP is a big swing at it - would you have the discipline to treat the first 3 m as a warmup at easy pace? If so, I think it would be an excellent session and not too different to what’s actually on the plan that week. Plus you’ll feel great ramping it up in the middle of the race as the rest of the field is starting to settle.

It all depends on how much powder you want to keep dry for the last 3 weeks. You’ll be feeling pretty fatigued at this stage of the plan anyway.

Just my 2c.

Thanks D

Discipline and me don’t make great bedfellows, so I might struggle with the 1st three miles easy in a race environment

Makes sense though and maybe it’s time for the old dog to learn new tricks!!!

TbL

Itziger · 13-06-2021 06:05AM

ThebitterLemon wrote: »

Hanson newbie question.

I’m doing the hm plan

Race is on the end of August.

The plan has no tune up races and I was considering doing the Kilbeggan 10 miler @ HMP, it’s 3 weeks before goal race.

Any advice/pointers from more experienced Hansoners would be appreciated

Thanks

TbL

10 miles at goal HM pace? Seems like too much to me. What's the max distance at that pace in the plan? Personally, I'd do a split pace or a progressive run. Either 3*4k @ HM or invent a progression run.

Murph_D · 13-06-2021 01:52PM

ThebitterLemon wrote: »

Thanks D

Discipline and me don’t make great bedfellows, so I might struggle with the 1st three miles easy in a race environment

Makes sense though and maybe it’s time for the old dog to learn new tricks!!!

TbL

Well you won't make that sub-3 breakthrough later in the year without learning a few new tricks first.

And of course if you have no discipline you run the risk of running the event at true 10-mile pace and completely blowing your wad. :eek: Seriously, if you doubt your discipline you are better off not doing it.

I've run a couple of races progressively like this and you really feel great in the second half, striding through the field like a colossus. It is difficult to hold back at the start, alright, but just remind yourself at the start that a lot of those people going past will be seeing you again later in the race. If you decide to run it this way, just be sure to stick to HM pace when you ramp it up, and no more than that.

Unthought Known · 14-06-2021 10:26PM

Planning to be in Spain for 3 weeks in August which will be weeks 9-11 on my plan. I generally run pretty early over there, but it will still be hot so I'm wondering what peoples thoughts are on the SOS runs? Luckily I only have one long run as I fly back the day before the next. SOS runs are:

Week 9: Speed 6x800, 8 Tempo, Long 15
Week 10: Speed 3x1600, 8 Tempo
Week 11: Strength 6x1 mile, 8 Tempo

Go for it at plan paces? Dial back pace? Or dial back reps/distance?

Murph_D · 15-06-2021 06:53AM

Unthought Known wrote: »

Planning to be in Spain for 3 weeks in August which will be weeks 9-11 on my plan. I generally run pretty early over there, but it will still be hot so I'm wondering what peoples thoughts are on the SOS runs? Luckily I only have one long run as I fly back the day before the next. SOS runs are:

Week 9: Speed 6x800, 8 Tempo, Long 15
Week 10: Speed 3x1600, 8 Tempo
Week 11: Strength 6x1 mile, 8 Tempo

Go for it at plan paces? Dial back pace? Or dial back reps/distance?

Have never been away for three weeks but above done SOS sessions in Greece and France and I think Fuerteventura without any issues. The trick is to do them at the crack of dawn. And yes, running by effort rather than pace is advisable (at any time or in any place). Good luck!

Unthought Known · 15-06-2021 03:06PM

Murph_D wrote: »

Have never been away for three weeks but above done SOS sessions in Greece and France and I think Fuerteventura without any issues. The trick is to do them at the crack of dawn. And yes, running by effort rather than pace is advisable (at any time or in any place). Good luck!

Thanks D. I'll play it by ear and see how comfortable (or slightly uncomfortable) I am.

Unknownability · 15-06-2021 03:43PM

First speed session of the plan was today 12*400, I've done this work out a number of times previously and I have to say with "tired legs" it felt a lot harder and I needed to work more to keep the pace.

It'll be interesting to see how that plays out through the rest of the plan.

Murph_D · 15-06-2021 03:45PM

Unknownability wrote: »

First speed session of the plan was today 12*400, I've done this work out a number of times previously and I have to say with "tired legs" it felt a lot harder and I needed to work more to keep the pace.

It'll be interesting to see how that plays out through the rest of the plan.

Your legs shouldn’t feel too tired at this early stage. The fatigue really starts setting in after a few weeks of three SOS sessions.

shotgunmcos · 15-06-2021 05:06PM

Exactly the fatigue doesn't or shouldn't really set in for a few weeks. The 12x400 is set on paces so its intense. However, it has generous 400m jogging recoveries. Method states that if you can't jog the recoveries you are doing them too fast. Its another way of building the fatigue, keeping you moving.

As for doing workouts in Spain? SIU Buttercup.. get them done! You can always regulate by heart rate/RPE if its unbearable but getting out and done early is a way to get them out of your way for the day.

Unthought Known · 15-06-2021 06:22PM

Murph_D wrote: »

Your legs shouldn’t feel too tired at this early stage. The fatigue really starts setting in after a few weeks of three SOS sessions.

Yes, I did my own 12x400 session today and found it pretty easy. I did remind myself though that there's no cumulative fatigue yet for me coming off a very easy couple of weeks.

Unthought Known · 15-06-2021 06:35PM

shotgunmcos wrote: »

As for doing workouts in Spain? SIU Buttercup.. get them done! You can always regulate by heart rate/RPE if its unbearable but getting out and done early is a way to get them out of your way for the day.

Oh I'll definitely plan to get them done early. I'll have some decent sessions done by August to get a feel of expected effort etc.

Unknownability · 15-06-2021 08:08PM

Thanks for the responses, there are two of us with very similar user names using the plans.

Have reflected on the run it was fine, they were all done between 1.25 - 1.32.

My initial feeling of doing it on tired legs was based on my legs just feeling tired, when I've done the 12*400 previously I'd usually try and do the last rep in under 1.15, I don't think I could've done that today for whatever reason.

thehairygrape · 16-06-2021 11:59AM

Thanks for all the helpful tips in this thread. Thinking of giving this a try for the next marathon, whenever that’ll be. I had the book for a while but never even opened it until I saw this thread. Only just starting it now.
A query re treadmills. Has anyone tried some of the SOS sessions on a treadmill? No mention of it in the book contents page. I was also thinking that a treadmill might be the answer to a previous poster re running in hot climates. Some countries have access/day access to gyms.These are usually air-conditioned so heat not too much of a factor (boredom is another matter). Or hotels as well.

Murph_D · 16-06-2021 01:48PM

I’d be avoiding the treadmill if at all possible. One of the points of the long tempo runs is to simulate race conditions - good to do them on surfaces and terrain (and weather) that are similar to what you’ll be racing on/in. Treadmills don’t simulate anything really, and do part of the work for you.

FinnC · 16-06-2021 07:20PM

thehairygrape wrote: »

Thanks for all the helpful tips in this thread. Thinking of giving this a try for the next marathon, whenever that’ll be. I had the book for a while but never even opened it until I saw this thread. Only just starting it now.
A query re treadmills. Has anyone tried some of the SOS sessions on a treadmill? No mention of it in the book contents page. I was also thinking that a treadmill might be the answer to a previous poster re running in hot climates. Some countries have access/day access to gyms.These are usually air-conditioned so heat not too much of a factor (boredom is another matter). Or hotels as well.

Treadmills can be a pretty useful machine at times. I use them mainly for interval sessions and find them great. I’d always set it at 2%.
Plenty of top level athletes use treadmills for a lot of their training. Lionel Sanders seems to be never off one for his running training! Nothing beats getting outside of course but treadmills certainly can be very useful for certain types of workouts.

Murph_D · 16-06-2021 07:30PM

I agree that treadmills have their place - have used them many times myself. Never for a session though, especially a long pace session. As you say nothing beats getting outside, which is why I suggested "avoiding if at all possible".

thehairygrape · 16-06-2021 08:18PM

Thanks again. I was thinking of interval sessions on a treadmill when needed. 2% sounds good. Not easy to get to a track.

Swashbuckler · 16-06-2021 09:48PM

thehairygrape wrote: »

Thanks again. I was thinking of interval sessions on a treadmill when needed. 2% sounds good. Not easy to get to a track.

You don't necessarily need a track to run sessions.. I've never run in a track and I've probably done several hundreds sessions since 2017. Hit the road!

Unknownability · 18-08-2021 03:02PM

So how are people getting on who are using Hansin for an autumn marathon?

I'm using it for Manchester and am just over half way, had the first strength session this week which was a change from the speed.

I'm loving the plan, it's very straight forward to follow.

Jim Gazebo · 04-09-2021 07:55AM

Hi all, hope anyone using the plan is getting on well!

I was supposed to do a marathon in a couple of months but I won't be able to do it due to being away for work unfortunately. I was planning on using Hanson method. So to prepare me, I have a couple of weeks now with a base level of fitness, I started the beginner program on week 7, or whichever week just before the first week of tempo/sos. Been fine so far and just knocking out easy runs. I'm no sprinter, and a marathon is a big deal for me, so I'm trying for sub 4 hours as a conservative target. My best estimate is a 10 miler I ran in 1:17 so going sub 4 hours seems a gentle target. It is just the pace is gives for the easy runs, it's like 9:40 a mile or something. It's phenomenally slower than I'm used to running and I'm finding it hard to pull myself back to that. It's not critical now as I'm not going to complete the plan, it will be over Christmas before I get a good crack at it. But any tips on the easy running? Is it ok to run a touch faster? Or should I really try to slow.

Unknownability · 04-09-2021 09:19AM

@Jim Gazebo from reading the book and other posters here, I think that pace is irrelevant really and it's effort that is the real indicator. Do you monitor your heart rate during runs?

Jim Gazebo · 04-09-2021 10:25AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845461#Comment_117845461

Yeah I would keep an eye. Thanks, yeah I suppose if the effort is at an easy pace then that is all that matters!

Unknownability · 04-09-2021 10:36AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845642#Comment_117845642

If you track the heart rate, you should then have an idea of what your max is and then it's a case of seeing if 9:40 m/m matches up with your easy zone.

Saying that runnung a 1:17 10 miler suggests that a sub 4 target is quite achievable. Best of luck, I'm entering week 14 of teg advanced plan and really enjoying it.

I'm at the stage now of worrying that the 16 mile lsr's aren't long enough 🤣

Jim Gazebo · 04-09-2021 01:14PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845675#Comment_117845675

Looking forward to getting stuck in proper around Christmas. Yeah I lost a lot of fitness through injury in the summer but I think sub4 is very achievable. Best of luck to you too, thanks for the advice.

Murph_D · 05-09-2021 08:44PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845642#Comment_117845642

Do you know what the appropriate easy effort is though, in terms of HR?

What kind of pace are we taking about as a mater of interest? 9:40 should not feel slow at all to a 4 hour marathon runner - it's a good bit less than a minute slower than MP.

Be careful about this. I know a good few runners who struggle to run slowly and have disappointing marathon times.

Jim Gazebo · 05-09-2021 09:00PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117851198#Comment_117851198

Ok, probably not. I know it needs to be in a certain zone, not off top of my head though. Maybe I am aiming at too slow a marathon time? My race pace for all races 10km up would be 5mins/km, so 8/mile. 9.40 feels savage slow for some reason. And I think the upper slow pace in Hanson book is 9.51. maybe I will get used to it but it really really feels like pointless running. But I need longer spell doing the plan maybe. I have been called for work early anyway as well so my plan is screwed. No chance for me to do a week of it even now. Christmas it is.

Murph_D · 05-09-2021 09:11PM

Have you read the book? There is a very comprehensive explanation of the purpose of every type of run, and the adaptations they will bring about if done correctly.

What you say about race pace is interesting - you shouldn’t have the same pace for all races of 10k and up. Marathon finds you out quickly if you only have one gear, so to speak.

Definitely worth reading the book in depth - there’s no point doing the plan if you don’t understand it. Or at least, no point trying to change it if you don’t know exactly what it is trying to achieve.

ariana` · 06-09-2021 10:01AM

Interesting that you find that pace pointless. Out of interest what feels like an appropriate easy run pace to you?

I'm not currently or have I ever followed Hanson but I have a 1:16 10mile time (from a TT in March) and am aiming for a sub 4 marathon next month and I do all my easy runs around 9:40-10min/m. I don't look at my watch for easy runs but they mostly naturally fall into that bracket and they have my HR in the appropriate zone too (when I bother to wear my HRM). For example last week's 3 easy runs were done @ 9:51, 10:04 and 9:51.

Maybe when fatigue from the plan kicks in a slower easy pace will feel more natural to you!

Hansons Method

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