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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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  • #6092
    gozunda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    ingo1984 wrote: »
    The level of restrictions will depend on where you live I reckon. Some countries will have the molly coddling nature of policies whereas some other countries will just go back to normal. I've a friend who lives in Guernsey, on 22nd march they went back to normal. No masks or social distancing required. Now it has to be noted that its an island of 60k people. But still, if our politicians insist on restrictions etc as the new normal for the long term, I'll be packing my bags.

    Well yes thats true - and that the current level of restrictions in the UK is tied in with its Vaccination programme and its managing of the rate of infection. Atm they're ahead of us.

    And like the UK we will have a decreasing amount of restrictions over time as more vaccines are rolled out etc and again managing the rate of infection etc. I really don't get the constant wringing of hands thing just because we're not doing exactly what the UK or elsewhere is doing.


  • #6093
    PintOfView
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 857 ✭✭✭PintOfView


    Extra user. wrote: »
    You said heavy breathing but that wouldn't apply to all areas at all

    I think they would require SD around treadmills for the unvaccinated

    I'm not an expert in virus transmission in gyms, and I suspect you aren't either.
    What are the facts, as much as we know them?

    - Virus transmission indoors is much higher than outdoors
    - Virus transmission in smaller rooms is higher than bigger rooms
    - Virus transmission in unventilated rooms is higher than ventilated rooms
    - Virus transmission in a room with more people is higher than less people (assuming at least one is infected)
    - Virus transmission is higher if people are coughing, sneezing, breathing heavily, singing, shouting, speaking loudly.

    Given all that, gyms have to be higher risk than some other settings, and much higher than being at home?
    In the situation where the virus is present, and common, in the community,
    do you think it would be prudent to leave gyms open in a lockdown?


  • #6094
    gozunda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    Whatsisname wrote: »
    I saw a study yesterday on BMJ that showed physical inactivity is associated with a higher risk of a severe outcome if you contract covid. Consider me shocked. How ever could we have known such a thing.

    Bizarrely Covid has been highlighted to be a risk of serious illness to some top level team sport, power, and combat athletes because of genetic attributes which help aid athletic development

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7498656/

    But also the risk of developing some heart related conditions post a covid infection

    https://www.bvhealthsystem.org/expert-health-articles/covid-19-and-myocarditis-a-risk-for-athletes

    There's a thread on the forum about people who have become infected with covid - has had a number of posters who self reported as being fit / very fit but for some reason that they ended up with quite a severe illness.

    Sounds paradoxical but cytokine storms which are often seen in younger / fitter people has also been detailed as an associated issue.


  • #6095
    Penfailed
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,695 ✭✭✭Penfailed


    PTH2009 wrote: »
    'Sure Walkins good for ya'

    Irish leaders definition of exercise

    Walking is good exercise.

    Gigs '24 - Ben Ottewell and Ian Ball (Gomez), The Jesus & Mary Chain, The Smashing Pumpkins/Weezer, Pearl Jam, Green Day, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Electric Picnic, Pixies, Ride, Therapy?, Public Service Broadcasting, IDLES, And So I Watch You From Afar

    Gigs '25 - Spiritualized, Supergrass, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Queens of the Stone Age, Electric Picnic, Vantastival, Getdown Services, And So I Watch You From Afar



  • #6096
    PTH2009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,532 ✭✭✭✭PTH2009


    Penfailed wrote: »
    Walking is good exercise.

    It's great and one positive thing I take from this pandemic is challenging myself to long walks daily


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  • #6097
    Penfailed
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,695 ✭✭✭Penfailed


    PTH2009 wrote: »
    It's great and one positive thing I take from this pandemic is challenging myself to long walks daily

    Fair play. Good to get some natural Vitamin D too.

    Gigs '24 - Ben Ottewell and Ian Ball (Gomez), The Jesus & Mary Chain, The Smashing Pumpkins/Weezer, Pearl Jam, Green Day, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Electric Picnic, Pixies, Ride, Therapy?, Public Service Broadcasting, IDLES, And So I Watch You From Afar

    Gigs '25 - Spiritualized, Supergrass, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Queens of the Stone Age, Electric Picnic, Vantastival, Getdown Services, And So I Watch You From Afar



  • #6098
    peterc1991
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 89 ✭✭peterc1991


    Hạ Long Bay wrote: »
    When:

    In around 2-3 months once once we reach >60% of the population vaccinated.


    Why:

    Israel January 10000+ cases. Israel today 34 cases.


    [IMG]https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/attachment.php? attachmentid=550399&stc=1&d=1618612820[/IMG]

    Thats quite interesting. Although it has been lost completely in this pool of misery of a thread.


  • #6099
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,295 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    Israel unlocked around the start of March when they had about 52% people with one dose and 40% with two. They also had about 3.5x our current case rate, and although they opened bars and restaurants those were restricted to the vaccinated and had capacity limits. Source, although others put the first dose % at more like 56%

    Worth bearing in mind that until early Feb their restrictions were tougher than ours. 1km travel restriction, many non public businesses closed and not even takeaway food. Source

    In any case, we need about another 2m/40% pop to get their first dose to get to the point where Israel was in early March, but as we will be vaccinating more slowly, perversely we don't quite have to wait for those percentages because more of the people we've vaccinated will have full protection from the delay, and we have a lower level of infection out there to suppress.

    Plus we have the UK experiment of unlocking gradually in a similar climate with only 47% partially dosed but only 12% fully and less sophisticated restrictions (restaurants and bars serving the unvaccinated).

    All that points to June being the magic month for major easing, although probably late June, and then only if the programme goes well and first doses are heavily prioritised. There's so much in the air right now with AZ and JJ, but that should settle shortly and I hope that May will be much less moany as we see the end in sight.


  • #6100
    11521323
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 304 ✭✭11521323


    gozunda wrote: »
    Well yes thats true - and that the current level of restrictions in the UK is tied in with its Vaccination programme and its managing of the rate of infection. Atm they're ahead of us.

    And like the UK we will have a decreasing amount of restrictions over time as more vaccines are rolled out etc and again managing the rate of infection etc. I really don't get the constant wringing of hands thing just because we're not doing exactly what the UK or elsewhere is doing.

    You don't get it? Well that's easy, because you seem to have trouble utilizing various forms of reasoning to arrive at a conclusion.

    People are angry because we're leading Europe in incidence rates and hospitalizations per capita, yet trailing Europe in how far along this reopening path we are. That's very simple to understand.

    Restrictions need to be commensurate with the level of virus in our community and at present, they're wildly over-cautious for no reason at all. We have 1 in 5 with the first dose which makes up a large portion of the vulnerable, and we're still in this mess while the economic fallout worsens each week they keep us in this "just to be safe"

    They also keep telling us it's going to be "six weeks" and then when we perform unbelievably well as a population for those six weeks, our reward is another six weeks. It's laughable and it's the people like you who continuously buy into it that's allowing them to get away with it and it's making me ashamed to be Irish. They would not get away with it in any other EU nation.

    They literally said that the current numbers are "better than they could have hoped for" and do they accelerate the reopening of our economy? No. It's beyond incomprehensible and because of people like you, our country which was, on balance, great before all of this stuff, is now going to be a ****hole for the next 10 years while we deal with the remnants of the economy. I for one will be gone from Ireland for that period because I cannot stand the citizens that make that possible.


  • #6101
    FintanMcluskey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,646 ✭✭✭FintanMcluskey


    PintOfView wrote: »
    I'm not an expert in virus transmission in gyms, and I suspect you aren't either.
    What are the facts, as much as we know them?

    - Virus transmission indoors is much higher than outdoors
    - Virus transmission in smaller rooms is higher than bigger rooms
    - Virus transmission in unventilated rooms is higher than ventilated rooms
    - Virus transmission in a room with more people is higher than less people (assuming at least one is infected)
    - Virus transmission is higher if people are coughing, sneezing, breathing heavily, singing, shouting, speaking loudly.

    Given all that, gyms have to be higher risk than some other settings, and much higher than being at home?
    In the situation where the virus is present, and common, in the community,
    do you think it would be prudent to leave gyms open in a lockdown?

    Certainly not prudent to leave gyms open, definitely if you only concern the nation with 0 Covid at all costs and ignore all lockdown related health issues

    Make sure and shut outdoor amenities too, we know that
    -Virus transmission outdoors is much higher up the Wicklow mountains so luckily we fine those who go for a walk(cheer-leaded by many on here)
    -Virus transmission is much higher on Irish building sites than other countries building sites
    -Virus transmission beyond 5km of Irish homes has been much higher for the past 6 months than beyond 5km of homes in every other country


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  • #6102
    FintanMcluskey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,646 ✭✭✭FintanMcluskey


    11521323 wrote: »
    They literally said that the current numbers are "better than they could have hoped for" and do they accelerate the reopening of our economy? No. It's beyond incomprehensible and because of people like you, our country which was, on balance, great before all of this stuff, is now going to be a ****hole for the next 10 years while we deal with the remnants of the economy. I for one will be gone from Ireland for that period because I cannot stand the citizens that make that possible.

    Will it recover in 10 years?

    I don’t think so, it been over a year and no sign of this ending.

    The economic & psychological damage indoctrinated into young children is irreversible, this could take generations to recover from


  • #6103
    prunudo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,170 ✭✭✭prunudo


    PTH2009 wrote: »
    Sure Gyms are bad places in Ireland

    Its crazy when you think about it, its a place to help people stay fit/healthy and the gombeens here close them down

    Its one of the more puzzling aspects of the governments reactions to covid throughout the last year. So many restrictions favoured things that are detrimental to a healthy lifestyle. Don't leave the house, work from home and only leave to do a food shop or a short walk, takeaways allowed but shops selling sportswear closed etc etc.
    While the 5km allowed for more options than last years 2km, it still precludes so many people from taking part in the activities that usually keep them fit and healthy. Its great to see people out walking, but walking the block doesn't cut it for everyone. Some people need more strenuous exercise than others.


  • #6104
    the kelt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,893 ✭✭✭the kelt


    PintOfView wrote: »
    They might not be as high as pubs or some other places, but they are considered a risk area.
    https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-54540188

    What do you think?

    So effectively no data!


  • #6105
    arccosh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 624 ✭✭✭arccosh


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I see. I read this article and thought they were: https://metro.co.uk/2021/02/05/people-who-refuse-covid-vaccine-may-be-visited-by-council-staff-14029055/

    you need to read a lot of the stuff you post before you post them...

    "The Government is considering sending council staff to visit people who have refused an offer to get vaccinated" edit: article is from 5th Feb

    so no..... isn't happening....

    might it happen in low uptake areas, possibly.. how else do you expect to get feedback as to why people aren't taking it.... still can't make you take it though, sure you don't even have to answer the door to them... but uptake has been good, so no need

    I live in the UK and know a few who haven't taken their offer... no knocks, nothing

    If you weren't registered to vote, would you get as offended if someone knocked around suggesting you register to vote (like what happens in nearly every democratic country), being registered to vote means you go on a government list and usually allows you some perks such as lower credit offers etc...


  • #6106
    arccosh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 624 ✭✭✭arccosh


    I think earlier in the pandemic when there were still a lot of unknowns, gym's were right to be closed...

    but weighing up everything now, and especially with the social distance measures demonstrated in the UK, electronic booking etc... it's actually made for a much better gym experience... knowing I have a 1 hour slot in the actual gym, knowing I won't be waiting for weights or a machine... it's been great .... probably not so great for the gym's revenue though...

    The crux of the issue in Ireland is some of your regular gyms didn't have these measures in place, and with everything else closed, everyone started going to the gym .... meaning statistically there was a higher risk....

    This is easily mitigated, but a lot of gyms don't have the funds to implement this, resulting in some gyms being covid secure, some not, and it's too much hassle to inspect each one, so hence the blanket ban...

    it's a shame really, its an example of another sector getting the sledge hammer approach due to lack of funds


  • #6107
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,295 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    FintanMcluskey wrote: »
    Will it recover in 10 years?

    I don’t think so, it been over a year and no sign of this ending.

    The economic & psychological damage indoctrinated into young children is irreversible, this could take generations to recover from

    The first part of that is myopic. There are lots of signs of this ending, just look at Israel and the UK.

    The second part is snowflakey nonsense. Previous generations dealt with far more horrific pandemics and went on to lead happy lives. You think this is bad? Try polio. Wards full of paralysed children.


  • #6108
    darem93
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 200 ✭✭darem93


    It's the same with hairdressers, even the majority of non-essential retail. I always felt very safe in them and the majority of those businesses went above and beyond to be Covid compliant, and still the government went ahead and shut them for half the year anyway.


  • #6109
    hynesie08
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,318 ✭✭✭✭hynesie08


    PTH2009 wrote: »
    Sure Gyms are bad places in Ireland

    Its crazy when you think about it, its a place to help people stay fit/healthy and the gombeens here close them down

    You realise they were closed all over the world right?


  • #6110
    FintanMcluskey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,646 ✭✭✭FintanMcluskey


    Lumen wrote: »
    The first part of that is myopic. There are lots of signs of this ending, just look at Israel and the UK.

    The second part is snowflakey nonsense. Previous generations dealt with far more horrific pandemics and went on to lead happy lives. You think this is bad? Try polio. Wards full of paralysed children.

    Make no mistake, the snowflakes are the ones who want lockdown to feel safe.

    You mention a time when polio was prevalent, nobody sat at home then, nobody stopped socialising. Life was much cheaper then, no one cared who they gave TB to

    Back then, people were stronger and would not have tolerated lockdown for 1 minute

    This is different, the country is full of weak people with no coping skills


  • #6111
    Quantum Erasure
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,702 ✭✭✭Quantum Erasure


    FintanMcluskey wrote: »
    Make no mistake, the snowflakes are the ones who want lockdown to feel safe.

    You mention a time when polio was prevalent, nobody sat at home then, nobody stopped socialising. Life was much cheaper then, no one cared who they gave TB to

    Back then, people were stronger and would not have tolerated lockdown for 1 minute

    This is different, the country is full of weak people with no coping skills

    Et tu?


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  • #6112
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    PintOfView wrote: »
    They might not be as high as pubs or some other places, but they are considered a risk area.
    https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-54540188

    What do you think?

    I think no cost benefit analysis was done on closing gyms because of a virus which is more dangerous to those who are overweight.


  • #6113
    arccosh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 624 ✭✭✭arccosh


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    I think no cost benefit analysis was done on closing gyms because of a virus which is more dangerous to those who are overweight.

    yeah, doors are a certain size so they can't fit in


  • #6114
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    I think no cost benefit analysis was done on closing gyms because of a virus which is more dangerous to those who are overweight.

    So gyms are the key to maintaining a healthy weight?


  • #6115
    Zebra3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,114 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    FintanMcluskey wrote: »
    -Virus transmission is much higher on Irish building sites than other countries building sites

    Except for building sites involving critical national infrastructure and the semi-conductor industry. Who knows, maybe the workers there are getting fed the €9 magic meal.

    How many people out there are aware of the fact that while construction for housing was shut down (I'd have thought it was critical national infrastructure) that construction on an extension to the car park at Maynooth train station has continued?

    An utter shambles.


  • #6116
    11521323
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 304 ✭✭11521323


    Lumen wrote: »
    The first part of that is myopic. There are lots of signs of this ending, just look at Israel and the UK.

    The second part is snowflakey nonsense. Previous generations dealt with far more horrific pandemics and went on to lead happy lives. You think this is bad? Try polio. Wards full of paralysed children.

    Ahh the good aul 'sure there's someone in Africa dying, you don't have it so bad' rationalization.

    If you want to compare absolute realities, why aren't you a self-made billionaire and providing so that your whole family don't have to work and have zero concerns in the world? If comparing absolute realities is a suitable way to rationalize things, wouldn't you call yourself a complete failure in every area of your life because you're not the best in the world at it? No, you wouldn't do that because that would be a moronic way to conduct an analysis of your life. Use the same logic when comparing adversity please. It's all relative. That statement is completely and utterly ridiculous.

    And regarding your first point, there certainly are signs of this ending in other nations all over the world, our point is that there is no sign of it ending here. Jesus Christ.


  • #6117
    pjohnson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,226 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    Zebra3 wrote: »
    Except for building sites involving critical national infrastructure and the semi-conductor industry. Who knows, maybe the workers there are getting fed the €9 magic meal.

    How many people out there are aware of the fact that while construction for housing was shut down (I'd have thought it was critical national infrastructure) that construction on an extension to the car park at Maynooth train station has continued?

    An utter shambles.

    This thread does not acknowledge that. It insists on absolutely no building taking place for a year. Reality be damned.



    Still people bang on about "magic meals".

    The whole reaction to having to have a meal with your pint really did show how poor some peoples coping skills are :pac:


  • #6118
    11521323
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 304 ✭✭11521323


    Deleted User wrote: »
    So gyms are the key to maintaining a healthy weight?

    One of the major keys, yes. If people don't have a set place to go to get exercise in, studies show they are much more likely to blow it off, which then triggers a chain reaction of bad lifestyle choices.

    Telling people to work out in their sitting room is all fine and dandy but the motivation to do so wains very quickly for most people.


  • #6119
    arccosh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 624 ✭✭✭arccosh


    Zebra3 wrote: »
    Except for building sites involving critical national infrastructure and the semi-conductor industry. Who knows, maybe the workers there are getting fed the €9 magic meal.

    How many people out there are aware of the fact that while construction for housing was shut down (I'd have thought it was critical national infrastructure) that construction on an extension to the car park at Maynooth train station has continued?

    An utter shambles.

    like I said here or some other thread..

    I have friends in construction who hadn't stopped working all through lockdown... with legit companies, not claiming pup..


  • #6120
    Zebra3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,114 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    11521323 wrote: »
    One of the major keys, yes. If people don't have a set place to go to get exercise in, studies show they are much more likely to blow it off, which then triggers a chain reaction of bad lifestyle choices.

    Telling people to work out in their sitting room is all fine and dandy but the motivation to do so wains very quickly for most people.

    Even though I don't use a gym, I find that totally understandable.

    I train for marathons and follow four month training plans. Between doing a marathon and starting training for my next one, my ability to get out the door and run drops drastically.

    Some people badly need structure. I'm one of them.


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  • #6121
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    11521323 wrote: »
    One of the major keys, yes. If people don't have a set place to go to get exercise in, studies show they are much more likely to blow it off, which then triggers a chain reaction of bad lifestyle choices.

    Telling people to work out in their sitting room is all fine and dandy but the motivation to do so wains very quickly for most people.

    There is a location you can go for regular exercise. It’s called outside. Regular walking running cycling etc and a reasonable diet are all that is needed to maintain a healthy weight


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