Gordon Elliott

kowloonkev · 06-03-2021 2:41am

NaiveMelodies wrote: »

Not surprised by the outcome because of the need to protect the image of the sport in todays world.
However, the biggest names in the sport are on record making comments that pretty much affirm how desensitized people in racing are when horses die.
These names include Willie Mullins, Ted Walsh, and Nicky Henderson.

Make no mistake about it, had this photo been leaked in June, this thread would be at most 5 pages long. Gordon Elliot would probably have been 5/1 to get any sort of a ban.
We are conditioned to react to incidents like these based on how mainstream social media reacts.

I like horses. They are amazing animals to witness up close and spend time with.
But, I know the real thrill comes from the racing of horses, the storylines these races bring, and of course gambling on them. The existence of horse racing is because of these factors.

Gordon Elliott is someone who could have existed in any decade in the last century and still followed the same successful path as a horse trainer. He could of sat on a dead horse in most of those decades and got away with it. He simply existed in the wrong decade and the photo was published at the wrong time, and as a result has paid for it.
I never actually have had much time for him and have heard plenty of bad reports from him in terms of small owner-trainer interaction, but I firmly believe most of those large scale owners who see through bullsh*t will support him and he'll be back banging out the winners under his own name in 6 months time.

Good post. You just know that those crying loudest are self-proclaimed animal lovers and almost certain participants in the pet industry which is responsible for more cruelty to animals than pretty much any other industry.

YFlyer · 06-03-2021 3:01am

The Rooster wrote: »

No! Beware of what you read on the internet!

It was a bloke who released the pic and other damaging rumours. Someone with an axe to grind with GE. He used a Twitter account with ‘scorned’ in the title saying it was a scorned ex of GE. Only a moron would think that it was the actual gf who set up a Twitter account called scorned gf!
But some did and are spreading it around solid, including a few on here.

Is it known who the bloke is, and reason why he released the photo?

Labaik · 06-03-2021 7:08am

odyssey06 wrote: »

People seem to be living in some parallel universe where horse racing isn't dependent on sponsorship and patronage.

GE made himself toxic to the sectors that provide that funding.

Inevitable consequences have followed.

For what the government funds racing in ireland it gets back about 50 times more, its worth a few billion to the economy and employs about 30 thousand people.

The Rooster · 06-03-2021 7:50am

Surprised that people are still going on about the punishment being too lenient or too severe. Both are equally deluded IMO.

The case wasn’t heard by shady officials in a dark room. It was three judges. So as close to a courtroom as you can get, without the excess drama. They have published their findings in clear and concise language. I urge anyone with doubts to read this.

The ‘whatabouterry’ brigade might have good points that others have been treated too harshly or too leniently. But that’s for other threads. What’s important for this thread is Elliott got a punishment that fits the crime. No more and no less. Any reasonable person who reads the judgement objectively can see the punishment was not unreasonable.

I’m presuming and hoping the BHA also consider it reasonable, as I’m sure there’ll be noises from some quarters across the water looking for something more severe.

Only 8 horses out of 200+ have left Cullentra so far (as far as we know). Some big losses in those of course. Be interesting to see if that number moves.

The Rooster · 06-03-2021 8:01am

nsnoefc1878 wrote: »

I've seen a video of the bar from a very good source.

Why does the source matter? It’s been all over social media. Looks to be people having a good time in the Don Cossack bar. Not a shred of the footage suggests it was taken during lockdown. Red herring.

Itziger · 06-03-2021 8:11am

zimmermania wrote: »

Sweeping statements with no evidence to support them!,how do you know that" no-one other than a few mug punters gives (sic) a flying fook about some loser stopping horses in a 4000 euro handicap in Clonmel"?

Then in typical arrogant fashion you suggest maybe i don't understand what this is all about but you do!!!.

Whether one believes Elliot's punishment was too severe or too lenient,you should get it into your head that is simply an opinion and we all have a right to hold an opinion and to put it simply my opinion is that Elliot's childish behaviour did not hurt any animal,did not cause any punter (mug or otherwise) to lose money and the punishment did not fit the crime.

I remain convinced that if the case was tried in a court of law Elliot would be given a slap on the wrist.

You may not agree with that view and that is your right,but i won't insult you by saying you do not understand what this is all about even if i believe that is the case.

You've confirmed my suspicions.

Field east · 06-03-2021 9:00am

bubblypop wrote: »

I'm pretty sure he would be, and that would be while the investigation was taking place.

There is a HUGH difference. In GE case it affects his income / his whole business / his circa 80 employees and all the service com product suppliers to his business. In the garda situation only his ‘pride/. /integrity/etc. is impacted . He would probably suspended on FULL pay .

I fail to comprehend how sitting on a dead horse can command such a decision. He broke no law , did not threaten anyone, aim or injure anyone, did not steal money, no tax issue involved, etc, etc, etc , etc.
Why did the committee not give him a hearty fine and do something in the community around horses/ finance something in the community around horses.
The fine could be the equivalent around the average profit annual profit over the last five years. That would hurt his pocket but it would leave the business with its 80 employees intact
It’s illogical to think that suspending his license for 6 mts solves the problem and back he goes training again. Licenses are normally withdrawn when , be it a pub , bank or whatever, when core rule/s are broken and maybe frequently broken at that.
Talking about breaking a nut with a steam roller.
What is the same committee going to do when it has to adjudicate on something similar from another horse related video/photo showing another MINOR INDESCRETION
There are, as a general ‘’rule’ plenty of disgruntled staff/exstaff out there and all is needed is a few of them who might go the ‘extra mile’ to capture something that might be useful to them down the road to get ‘satisfaction.

Ashleigh1986 · 06-03-2021 9:01am

As with a lot of sports but especially horse racing ...image is everything .
Look at the obriens and Willie Mullins .
The most damning part of this for Elliot is having to look at fellow horse people and knowing how much he has " damaged " the game .
P. R . Is so important nowadays .
The horse racing game in Ireland evolves around a number of families , they are so into breeding , they marry into other horse people's families .
Elliot is a " blowin " into the horse game .
In their eyes that image of him sitting , smiling on a dead horse has put the sport back decades .
They will let him know in their own elite way of the damage it has caused them .

06-03-2021 9:16am

Field east wrote: »

There is a HUGH difference. In GE case it affects his income / his whole business / his circa 80 employees and all the service com product suppliers to his business. In the garda situation only his ‘pride/. /integrity/etc. is impacted . He would probably suspended on FULL pay .
.

Well, off topic, but no-one is suspended on FULL pay, they are automatically down a percentage. I would suggest the outrage would be such that it would impact more than his 'pride'

Point is, a dead horse, a working horse, no crime committed, but everyone knows it's distasteful and just brings unwanted attention on an industry that does not want it.
It's done now, he has received his penalty. That should be the end of it.

The Rooster · 06-03-2021 10:40am

BHA reciprocate IHRB punishment. That’s good and ends the episode (if not the discussion around the episode!)

realdanbreen · 06-03-2021 11:41am

Itziger wrote: »

You've confirmed my suspicions.

That's telling him!

The Tetrarch · 06-03-2021 12:06pm

Perhaps the IHRB and HRI could have more dialogue with trainers, reminding trainers of expected standards "rules for fools, guides for the wise".
There is no point in having a Rule Book of 316 pages if it is ignored.
It is great to catch rule breakers, better if they did not offend in the first place.

zimmermania · 06-03-2021 1:06pm

Itziger wrote: »

You've confirmed my suspicions.

And you have confirmed mine.

jakiah · 06-03-2021 1:19pm

Assume everyone will be looking closely at Elliott-trained 'Recent Revelations' at Navan today...

06-03-2021 1:39pm

Will the people going on about Davy's have anything further to add now?

JustAThought · 06-03-2021 1:40pm

jakiah wrote: »

Assume everyone will be looking closely at Elliott-trained 'Recent Revelations' at Navan today...

Recent Revelations and Burn the Evidence . What the poor dead horse called I wonder?

Good to see on front page news that the IHRB have banned him for a year and called out his behaviour as disgusting and showing an appalling lack of respect.

At least there are still standards and moral outrage at what he did within the industry.

Gives me hope.

realdanbreen · 06-03-2021 1:47pm

JustAThought wrote: »

Recent Revelations and Burn the Evidence . What the poor dead horse called I wonder?

Good to see on front page news that the IHRB have banned him for a year and called out his behaviour as disgusting and showing an appalling lack of respect.

At least there are still standards and moral outrage at what he did within the industry.

Gives me hope.

They did indeed and of course Elliott said the same thing.

lemush · 06-03-2021 2:28pm

nsnoefc1878 wrote: »

I've seen a video of the bar from a very good source.

That was last year for **** sake.

jakiah · 06-03-2021 2:37pm

realdanbreen wrote: »

They did indeed and of course Elliott said the same thing.

MOD edit

evillive · 06-03-2021 4:03pm

I think the punishment is fair enough I was thinking 6 months with 3 suspended and a fine myself. A horse racing fan not really of Gordon elliott nor his bigges owner Michael O'Leary but the performances of some of their horses such as tiger roll from his first Cheltenham win through the years do reflect a serious training talent with massive backing.

While doing nothing illegal he acted irresponsibly, not a chance Aidan o Brien, Willie Mullins, would do this nor a jockey like Tony McCoy or Richard Johnson so the act dies reflect a poor attitude which does require some form of treatment by the authorities

The nature and source of the leak is immaterial to me as some people are blaming this as something that shouldn't have happened he carried out the act posed for the photo and I wouldn't doubt it was circulated at the time and went nowhere.

A bigger concern is the rumours of the bar being open to numbers of people in breach of covid rules, not cool and definitely illegal if true when the most of the country are pinned down to our 5k, out of work, shops bars restaurants etc closed.

The ban no doubt will give him time to reflect and some of his staff may have to leave but if the owners who say they are going to stand by him do so then there will be work for some in the yard and I can see him recovering albeit with this history which will generally be forgotten.

I know I've fcuked up in the past, nothing illegal for sure but still poor judgement and action at times, I stood up, took the slap on the wrist and walk of shame at the time and nothing to do but get on with it. Once Cheltenham is over this story will be fading away and the media will be onto the next scandal. Gordon wasn't the first to do this but he got caught and to be fair his response to the suspension and fine is a lot more mature and respectful than the crock that came out when the picture leaked.

I hope his return is without too much drama the case is done and dusted

akelly02 · 06-03-2021 5:19pm

Denise foster is the ladys name all Gordon's horses will be running under at Cheltenham

masterK · 06-03-2021 5:51pm

Maybe I'm being sceptical but if the Denise Foster name goes above the door at the stables with Gordon on hand to help out where needed is this just a paper exercise to allow the stable to continue to operate as normal?

Itziger · 06-03-2021 5:57pm

masterK wrote: »

Maybe I'm being sceptical but if the Denise Foster name goes above the door at the stables with Gordon on hand to help out where needed is this just a paper exercise to allow the stable to continue to operate as normal?

I saw a report saying Gordon would be on hand to assist in the training IF NEEDED. Hehe, yeah. So, I guess it is a paper exercise probably.

Plasandrunt · 06-03-2021 6:06pm

Win for the Gordon Elliot trained old boy Kruzhlinn at Navan. 14 years old

Great to see

The White Wolf · 06-03-2021 6:50pm

Itziger wrote: »

I saw a report saying Gordon would be on hand to assist in the training IF NEEDED. Hehe, yeah. So, I guess it is a paper exercise probably.

He'd be on hand to advise is what I read in an article. Not exactly the same as being involved in training.

Labaik · 06-03-2021 7:03pm

Plasandrunt wrote: »

Win for the Gordon Elliot trained old boy Kruzhlinn at Navan. 14 years old

Great to see

Must look after them well at home to have them winning at 14

Dr. Bre · 06-03-2021 8:05pm

Slattsy wrote: »

Very harsh that. Thought a fine would be sufficient. I'll certainly think twice about sitting on a dead horse again that's for sure.

Anyway, I'm off elephant hunting in South Africa in a few months. Can't wait. Anyone want anything back from duty free?

I’m outraged reading this as I took into a steak ..

frank8211 · 07-03-2021 12:09am

Labaik wrote: »

For what the government funds racing in ireland it gets back about 50 times more, its worth a few billion to the economy and employs about 30 thousand people.

all paid less than the minimum wage excpt half dozen millionaires

realdanbreen · 07-03-2021 11:33am

frank8211 wrote: »

all paid less than the minimum wage excpt half dozen millionaires

Yeah Ruby was saying he found it hard getting by on a tenner an hour!

Itziger · 07-03-2021 12:10pm

realdanbreen wrote: »

Yeah Ruby was saying he found it hard getting by on a tenner an hour!

Ah, but that was BEFORE he threw the mare at the last hurdle and took his Paddy Power 10% bonus. Jeez, Dan.

Gordon Elliott

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